Madara Uchiha vs Yhwach

@gilateen: that's never actually been proven outside of the storm games.

@hoelantaicho: looking back he could change the future back then too, like removing ichibei's ink.

@kalebmcshaw: i thought he just absorbed it with his BVA but i thought it was just limitedback then to seeing any future

@kalebmcshaw: @hoelantaicho: I don’t see yhwach winning. Senjutsu And seal works on madara. Madara just uses limbo to attack him from behind just like Uryū did, and then seal him. Yhwach’s almighty has a limit. Madara can fly into space and look at the moon or just blow up the Planet

@gilateen: and the only thing that works on yhwach is the silver arrowhead. And Madara doesn't have any sealing jutsu. Uryu is literally the only exception to the almighty and even yhwach said so not directly but he said that there's something uryu has which can surpass him. Yhwachs almighty has no limit he can change and see the future no matter what the only time it was limited was pre SK and even if he does that yhwach can just open a portal and leave

@hoelantaicho: So yhwach can beat goku in a fight?

@gilateen: beat him probably not but Goku can't kill him either.he'd run into a zamasu situation he can beat him till he can't move but yhwach can't die without that arrowhead

@hoelantaicho: If madara has six paths power then he does have Sealing Jutsus

@hoelantaicho: wow, u really know alot about bleach.

@gilateen: madara is not a planet buster

@theemperor95: Toneri wanted to destroy the planet and there is no doubt he can do that since he has the tenseigan and Madara is stronger than toneri, so madara should be able to planet bust

@gilateen: kakashi and Obito had 6paths chakra and they didn't have any sealing techniques. The sealing techniques came from the chakra they got DIRECTLY from hagoromo and the seals on their hands

@gilateen: having the tensaigain didn't mean he could destroy the planet? He was using a machine that was powered by the tensaigain to slowly move the moon in Earth's orbit and make it crash into earth... that is not planet busting

@coolguy18: finished re reading it not too long ago, it's one of my favorites and i don't get into debates without researching characters thoroughly sooo...

@gilateen: Where did you get this? fan calcs? powerscalling? lmao. pls show me some scans about madara destroying the planet.

@hoelantaicho: You should try CAV.

@coolguy18: Idk what that is

@hoelantaicho: challenge a viner. One on one debate or what so ever.

@coolguy18: Six path characters should be able to destroy a planet

@coolguy18: OH! I thought you just brought up points and let everyone else debate though

@gilateen: but it wasn't shown in the manga that he can. Featwise no. hypewise? dunno.

@hoelantaicho: lol

@coolguy18: @gilateen: he could life wipe but actually destroy the planet i don't think so. He could drop CTs and bijuudamas a but whether or not that'd actually destroy the planet i don't think so

Madara kills ywhach, better stats in everyway, kubo messed up too much on ywhach's power. Dude could see the future but lost to yamamoto in the past?? And still lost again, he is not as invincible as bleach fans are making him out to be.

@uchihaghost: Exactly

@uchihaghost: better than being one shot by fodder zetsu

@theemperor95: That’s because Kishimoto couldn’t kill madara off

@gilateen: same with yhwach. They were both stupidly OP and got killed in dumb ways

Yhwach picks a future where his hand has already pierced Madara's body or he's devoured him

Literally nothing Madara can do here, he's fighting an idiot who overwrites time lines to prevent his death.

@codevein: that first sentence you just said didn’t make sense.

Yhwach picking a future and devours him?

Not how the almighty works

@codevein: Ok but Only senjutsu And taijutsu can work on madara.

Don’t see yhwach winning this and if they were to fight in space, yhwach would lose since bleach characters don’t have the feats to survive in space

@gilateen: except Yhwach picking said timeline where they aren't in space???

Or alternatively devouring him like he was doing to soul society.

Madara could only win against Bach if like Goku he had an attack that erased Bach from every timeline.

He does not.

Awesome what I get for trying to edit on mobile accidentally hit the damn delete post.

Anyway case and point.

Madara can't do anything here.

Yhwach was only put under KS due to his meeting Aizen before his fight with Ichibe and opening his "Eyes"

Quite literally clear cut while Both of these chars were defeated due to plot.

Yhwach required massive amounts of BS to get screwed over.

Almighty is already active here, Genjutsu will not help Madara.

@codevein: Infinite tsukuyomi will help him, the almighty won’t help yhwach from that, his almighty was activated during the final fight and he still couldn’t see KS coming

@gilateen: Except it wasn't?

To clarify, Yhwach went and paid Aizen a visit and offered him to join him

Aizen declined.

During this time Yhwach who didn't have Almighty because his eyes had not opened was put in KS by Aizen.

Yhwach explicitly stated he lost sense of time while he was there.

This is while Yamato was fighting Royd Loyd who was pretending to be Yhwach.

Yhwach appears then oneshots Yama.

Before later going to the royal palace and facing off against Ichibe.

During THIS FIGHT.

Jugram remarks Yhwach has not opened his eyes.

As soon as he does he awakens to Almighty.

Infinite Tsukyomi he won't get off because Yhwach will already see that he was planning on trying it before remarking he sees everything.

Trolling Madara before telling him he's now blind or something and then Madara loses his eyes etc.

@codevein: True but I Don’t see yhwach hurting madara cause of his immortality and regeneration

@gilateen: Regeneration is the only thing he has going for him.

Madara stated Guy almost killed him so unless he is Edo he can die.

Yhwach could kill him by devouring him like he was doing to Soul society.

Alternatively his Blut field would rip Madara to pieces like it was doing to Ichibe.

Among whatever the heck else he might think of.

He could take Madara apart at his leisure.

@gilateen: I should also mention had Aizen tried KS release when Yhwach had Almighty rather when he didn't have it. It would not have worked.

The only reason KS worked was because he was already under it before awakening Almighty.

Which sees all futures but not past.

So he never saw KS.

@codevein: Yhwach couldn't break out of KS like he did to ichibei's ink because KS was specifically said to fk with his future sight powers: "Aizen: And then... / I was able to confirm that my Kyouka Suigetsu could alter even The Almighty’s vision of the future." Genjutsu can't fk with that.

@kalebmcshaw: Why are you telling me lol.

I already know it can't.

Only reason KS worked was because he was under it before he awakened Almighty.

@codevein: I'm Saying KS can also alter future vision, not just the senses. So those saying genjutsu would beat yhwach is wrong since genjutsu can't affect his almighty like KS did. Yhwach was inked by ichibei before he got the almighty but he still beat it, couldn't beat KS due to reasons above.

@kalebmcshaw: which you're right Because it did mess with Almighty to the point he thought he was fighting Renji and Ichigo alongside Aizen.

Putting his present self in Genjutsu would do nothing to the fact he sees all possible futures and would be like nah.

Its just silly.

@gilateen: the senjutsu part is irrelevant outside the naruto verse since it doesn't exist

@uchihaghost: so he has better stats in every way and yet zetsu punched a hole through his body and he couldn't move? That's some great stats he has

@theemperor95: @codevein: So what?

If he can see everything before it happens, then Can he see everything goku can do before it happens cause everybody(except one) is saying goku can beat him.

@theemperor95: Black Zetsu used Kamui the same way Obito did to penetrate Madara's body.

@gilateen: correct he can see it

@kayc: it never showed Kamui activated

@theemperor95: so your saying he can beat goku then