To make a more fair fight the Diamonds individual abilities works can affect the Arrancar
The diamonds easily win then. Blue's empathy power would cripple all the espada and White can mind control them and make them fight amongst themselves.
@cpt_nice: Would empathy even work against Ulquiorra? In addition to this, are they fast enough to not get instantly blitzed by someone like Starrk? If a few of the rather strong Espada start Cero spamming, it could be problematic for them as well.
@sleepingslaves: Ulquiorra is blasé but he isn't emotionless.
Gems have hypersonic++ reaction feats. Garnet blocked lightning, all the crystal gems aimdodged lasers and Pearl navigated a space ship through a field of asteroids coming from the opposite direction. The Diamonds are above them. Yellow blitzed them with her destabilising wave and no one could react to White's mind control eye beam. Also their combined beam attack on the earth was calculated as ftl.
He is, though. It's the entire point of his character. If he ever showed emotion, it's because he developed those emotions after meeting and fighting humans like Ichigo Kurosaki. If we use the versions pictured, he doesn't have any.
Gems have hypersonic++ reaction feats.
That's very iffy.
Garnet blocked lightning
From the clouds? If not, it means nothing.
all the crystal gems aimdodged lasers
Unimpressive. It's possible for even humans to aim-dodge like that.
Pearl navigated a space ship through a field of asteroids coming from the opposite direction
That doesn't lend credence to her having massively hypersonic reactions either.
The Diamonds are above them. Yellow blitzed them with her destabilising wave and no one could react to White's mind control eye beam.
Very cool, but still unquantifiable and not on the level of any relevant Espada.
Also their combined beam attack on the earth was calculated as ftl.
He is, though. It's the entire point of his character. If he ever showed emotion, it's because he developed those emotions after meeting and fighting humans like Ichigo Kurosaki. If we use the versions pictured, he doesn't have any.
It isn't even certain him being emotionless will make him immune to Blue's power. But I am willing to let this point go because having 1/10 of the Espeda being immune to Blue doesn't exactly increase their odds, with White and Yellow being here.
That's very iffy.
Why? I give examples later.
From the clouds? If not, it means nothing.
Unimpressive. It's possible for even humans to aim-dodge like that.
Yeah, possible, but also near impossible to do consistently.
That doesn't lend credence to her having massively hypersonic reactions either.
What sense does that make? Asteroids fly through space at hypersonic+ speeds, Pearl navigated a spaceship through an asteroid field and evaded asteroids at point blank range. Pure logic.
Very cool, but still unquantifiable
Starting to think you are trolling. If the diamonds can blitz characters who work in the hypersonic range, they are hypersonic too.
not on the level of any relevant Espada.
Citation needed.
That seems very inconsistent.
Why, because you say so? The gems are literally physical manifestations of light, their attacks are energy based.
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The diamonds shoot their energy beam from far out into space, yet it reached the earth in a matter of seconds and the attack is so huge it is significantly larger than the earth.
So how about you make some arguments of your own, instead of going "that can't be right cause I am uncomfortable with it". What are the espada doing against instant, unblockable mind control or empathy related powers?
It isn't even certain him being emotionless will make him immune to Blue's power. But I am willing to let this point go because having 1/10 of the Espeda being immune to Blue doesn't exactly increase their odds, with White and Yellow being here.
It definitely means something, as he's arguably the strongest when using Segunda Etapa.
Why? I give examples later.
Bad and inconsistent examples.
What sense does that make? Asteroids fly through space at hypersonic+ speeds, Pearl navigated a spaceship through an asteroid field and evaded asteroids at point blank range. Pure logic.
No, meteors fly through space at massively hypersonic speeds. In an asteroid field, they aren't moving nearly as fast.
Starting to think you are trolling.
Good for you I guess?
If the diamonds can blitz characters who work in the hypersonic range, they are hypersonic too.
You'd be right if any character from the series had consistently hypersonic feats.
Why, because you say so?
No, because they haven't shown to operate at that level ever before.
The gems are literally physical manifestations of light, their attacks are energy based.
Yeah, energy based. If they were light based, every energy attack that they fired would be light speed and combining them together would make no difference in how fast they were (as that makes no sense at all). If you're going to try and use a semi-scientific explanation for why they're fast, you've got to acknowledge all of the inaccuracies that brings along as well.
The diamonds shoot their energy beam from far out into space, yet it reached the earth in a matter of seconds and the attack is so huge it is significantly larger than the earth.
I'm not doubting the feat itself, I'm doubting its consistency.
So how about you make some arguments of your own, instead of going "that can't be right cause I am uncomfortable with it".
I never once said anything like that, nor is there any reason for you to get your panties in a bunch because someone disagreed with you about your favorite cartoon.
What are the espada doing against instant, unblockable mind control or empathy related powers?
Blitz and rip them to pieces before they use their powers? The OP never even gave the Diamonds the ability to see or touch beings made of Reishi, so that idea is out already.
Asteroids in the asteroid belt between Mars and Jupiter move at speeds between 17 - 25 km/s. Or mach 51 - 75.
Good for you I guess?
Relevant because you are spouting incorrect nonsense and have a clear bias, so if you continue to contribute nothing to this conversation, I will just ignore you because I don't really spend time on people who can't debate.
You'd be right if any character from the series had consistently hypersonic feats.
So I am right then.
No, because they haven't shown to operate at that level ever before.
They have for everything I have already clearly shown. Also, very nice that you ignored my gif where Garnet clearly blocked actual lightning. Guess that didn't fit your little fantasy.
If they were light based, every energy attack that they fired would be light speed
That is their only energy attack tho. And it is either light speed or above, due to the distance. So whether it is made of light or not, it is faster than any of the espada.
combining them together would make no difference in how fast they were
Who said anything about combining them and that having to do with its speed? They clearly combined their attack to make it as powerful as possible cause they wanted to completely wipe out every gem on planet earth.
If you're going to try and use a semi-scientific explanation for why they're fast, you've got to acknowledge all of the inaccuracies that brings along as well.
Maybe you are also light-based, since you are projecting really hard.
I'm not doubting the feat itself, I'm doubting its consistency.
Because...?
I never once said anything like that, nor is there any reason for you to get your panties in a bunch because someone disagreed with you about your favorite cartoon.
It is clear the diamonds being hypersonic makes you uncomfortable, because you have made a point about calling it "inconsistent" multiple times without providing a counter argument, nor have you posted any scans to show me how the side you are backing stands any chance against the attacks they have in their arsenal. Again, how are the espada dealing with instant-mindcontrol that Garnet, Pearl, Yellow and Blue couldnt dodge?
Blitz and rip them to pieces before they use their powers?
I proved already the diamonds have powers the espada can't deal with. Also, rip them to pieces? Proof they have the physical abilities to hurt them? Especially before they get incapped by hax. And post proof pls.
The OP never even gave the Diamonds the ability to see or touch beings made of Reishi
Getting nervous? That's a reach if I ever saw one. @joviolma Pretty sure you intended to make this a straight up fight and not make one side intangible?
You have one more shot to post actual scans and argue factually with proof, because otherwise you will just be ignored.
Asteroids in the asteroid belt between Mars and Jupiter move at speeds between 17 - 25 km/s. Or mach 51 - 75.
I never disagreed with that. I was using "massively hypersonic" as a metric for the speed of the Espada (they're lightning timers, which would make them above Mach 200).
Relevant because you are spouting incorrect nonsense and have a clear bias
Nothing I've said has been incorrect or biased in any way.
so if you continue to contribute nothing to this conversation, I will just ignore you because I don't really spend time on people who can't debate.
I would honestly expect someone with over 10,000 posts on this site to be a little bit less of a child, but I guess my hopes were too high. If you want to whine due to my different opinion and insult my debating skills for no reason, feel free to ignore me and exit the argument.
So I am right then.
You're very wrong.
They have for everything I have already clearly shown. Also, very nice that you ignored my gif where Garnet clearly blocked actual lightning. Guess that didn't fit your little fantasy.
I mentioned this grand idea called "consistency" later in my post. I apologize if that doesn't fit into your fantasy.
That is their only energy attack tho.
Not the point of what I was saying.
Who said anything about combining them and that having to do with its speed?
You. If you'll look back, you said that their combined beam was calculated at FTL speeds, which suggests that their combined power had something to do with it since we were discussing speed in the first place.
It is clear the diamonds being hypersonic makes you uncomfortable, because you have made a point about calling it "inconsistent" multiple times without providing a counter argument
Yeah, I'm done after this. If you are unaware of what "inconsistent" means, then this is a waste of my time.
nor have you posted any scans to show me how the side you are backing stands any chance against the attacks they have in their arsenal.
Why would I need to? Bleach is a popular verse with well-known and consistent feats, whereas Steven Universe needs a lot of reaching to suggest that they can compete at all. It's like asking me to provide evidence for Goku defeating Jason Todd.
Again, how are the espada dealing with instant-mindcontrol that Garnet, Pearl, Yellow and Blue couldnt dodge?
By either dodging it or letting it pass through them? I'm pretty sure I've already said that.
I proved already the diamonds have powers the espada can't deal with.
True, but you haven't proven that they could hit any Espada with these abilities.
Also, rip them to pieces? Proof they have the physical abilities to hurt them? Especially before they get incapped by hacks. And post proof pls.
Even fodder Espada like Grimmjow have displayed physical feats far above any Gem:
Bleach Chapter 281
Here, he smacks Ichigo and destroys a skyscraper sized pillar completely made of stone (inside and out, since it's not really a building).
Getting nervous?
No?
That's a reach if I ever saw one. @joviolma Pretty sure you intended to make this a straight up fight?
What he intended and what he put in the OP aren't the same thing. If you weren't aware, we base the match off of the latter rather than the former.
You have one more shot to post actual scans and argue factually with proof, because otherwise you will just be ignored.
You've already been ignoring everything I've said that counters your arguments, so I suppose the logical next step would be to ignore my entire post. If you want to be childish as you have been thus far, don't expect respect or patience from anyone else in a debate setting, least of all from me.
@sleepingslaves: The Diamonds's physicals by scale can put them at least at Small Mountain Level should be enough to trade blows with the Espadas don't ?
@sleepingslaves: I believe his point is you haven't posted a single anti feat proving their not consistent in their speed, you just keep saying their inconsistent without any evidence, making you come off, obviously, as a troll, until you actually provide said evidence
Bruhhhhhh I could care less about this garbage CN showwwwwwwwwwwww
Anyways, characters below Espada have displayed lightning timing and Hypersonic++ (I guess..?) feats. If we're seriously using "Gems have actual manifestations of light" type of claim then Aaroniero had dodged natural light in his fight with Rukia, and he's the slowest Espada probably so gg.
But yeah, no idea why I'm keep getting tagged in SU threads.
I think the diamonds should win this quite easily in fact, they are far superior to Gems who can destroy mountains and are even superior to Lapis Lazuli who is easily a Multi Continental gem as she was able to build a tower of all the earth’s water in a single night, and that alone is a planet surface level feat. So I think.....I don’t wanna say the diamonds “stomp” but they take this pretty easily
@joviolma: I’m pretty sure the diamonds’ Feats put them way higher than small mountain level. As far as I know stomping a handful of mountain level characters level should make them much higher
@sleepingslaves: so you’re saying that destroying a skyscraper sized pillar is a higher feat than any gem? Don’t make me laugh, Garnet herself made a mountainside collapse in a single hit and pearl cut a giant slug monster in half that was bigger than beach city itself in the SU comic, so no, That feat isn’t better than anyone’s in SU. Stop making statements that make no sense
@perfectperson21: I just point out that Lapis didn't use that much water against any of the Diamond and it took her some time to get all of the water on earth so she isn't multicontinental all the time. My other point aren't specifically towards you
The corruption beam use by the Diamond only works on Gem so it's not touching the Espada.
I have some issues with the Gem Scaling. I can buy Garnet being lightning timer in reaction speed (although she did use future sight) but I don't remember her moving constantly at those in pure combat, Garnet destroying a mountain also seems like an outlier compare to her usual strength feat she seems more like Large building to city block level. I also have a problem with pearl being hypersonic while she piloted a spaceship plenty of characters without super speed can pilot a spaceship. (Mcu Starlord, Han Solo). To come back towards the diamond blue, white and yellow are a lot stronger than any other gem I don't remember them being able to Blitz Garnet Steven or even Connie.
Towards the Espada Now. First thing first in bleach every character use reiatsu/ spiritual pressure it's with this that they fight, if a reiatsu is two weak an attack won't have any effect, it's important to know that spiritual pressure does translate into offensive power. Now Chad a character to weak to defeat any of the Espada, who didn't use his strongest move can do stuff like this
The little dots on the right are human target, So any Espada can minimum do this in base, if they use they're resurrection they could do 5 to 10 time the damage and you would need an attack on this level if you hope to hurt them this is for the weaker Espada, depending on the size of Las Noches the other Espada could destroy town or country.
In terms of speed Bankai ichigo is described considered as fast as lightning it's seems consistent, Grimmjow the Six Espada was toying with this Ichigo didn't have to use his sword, all the other Espada even below grimmjow should scale from this at least by using their resurrection. Grimmjow vs ichigo 1
@funguy31: yes yes, sorry I didn’t point that out, I’m aware that lapis isn’t always multi continental. She’s probably a usual island level but when surrounded by great bodies of water and when she has her time she could potentially be multi continental, so her tier can vary. Yeah thanks for pointing that out
And about the corruption blast, the prompt said that to make it more fair the diamonds’ abilities would be allowed to work in the Espada. Also they have other powers that can hurt them,
...... garnet? Only building level?......seriously? I can agree with you on the rest but building level Garnet is the worst low ball I’ve ever seen. Ok first off, let me tell you her feats, she spiked amethyst hard enough to turn sand to glass...do you know how much force it would take to do this task?....let’s just say far far higher than building level. The amount of force required to turn sand to glass is 1 kiloton of force, in other word TOWN level, meaning Garnet did a town level feat, casually. And she also caused a massive crater in the ground by simply trading blows with her clone, she also tanked that gem warship explosion which I estimate to be town to city level. And she is also comparable to Opal whose arrows are stronger than 4 laser light canons, And guess what? A single laser light canon is enough to destroy the red eye, which is bigger than the temple which is comparable to the size of the city itself. Whoa all these feats should at least make her mountain level. Have you watched Steven universe lol
For your second point I didn’t say pearl is hypersonic, I said she’s city to mountain level since she was able to cut a massive corrupted gem slug in half that was bigger than the city. Besides actually hypersonic seems like a low ball to her, and no no no no it’s not that she pilots the ship, it’s that the ship itself was moving at 33% THE SPEED OF LIGHT, and she dodged incoming asteroids and that’s at least relativistic reaction speed. Also she’s comparable to garnet.
And for you last point....quite valid. The fight can go either way, the Espada can blitz them tho I doubt they have the strength to beat the diamonds since they have immense durability, especially blue diamond. So yeah, I’m still rooting for the diamonds to win this fight tho.
@funguy31: also you can clearly see Garnet’s hand moving, she reacts to it in frame. You can see yourself how fast her hand was moving, meaning even if she knew it was coming she’d have to be fast enough to catch the bolt. So she’s still a lightning timer in terms of speed
Since the rules on top say that the diamonds powers are allowed to work on them, then is quite possible that in this case their best feat, the Corrupting light, might be able to work on them.
I'm not very knowledgeable on the Arrancars capabilities, so I don't know if there is someone in the team who can survive that planetary range attack.
@sleepingslaves: You’re not making any sense. He keeps giving you feats but you keep saying “not consistent” “not consistent” without making any counterargument. You haven’t shown any anti-feats. Shown a blast fired from another galaxy by all three diamonds reaching the earth in a few seconds, what more do you want to prove it’s mftl?
If I do that for every character than what’s the point of vs battle or debate in the first place? You can’t call all of those feats outliers unless presented with clear anti feats that outweigh them. Otherwise I can say Frieza is not a planet buster because his fight with Nail didn’t cause the planet to blow up.
Also
Even fodder Espada like Grimmjow have displayed physical feats far above any Gem:
Lol! how’s that above any gem? You clearly don’t know anything about the show then. Even fodder crystal gems like Pearl and Garnet have better feats. Garnet has mountain level+ feats and Pearl has small town level feats from the comics
Whoops forgot to address the post. The diamonds should stomp. Yellow alone can probably take them. The other diamonds are not as combat capable. Yellow punched through her ship, which is durable enough to tank island level destruction. She also broke Steven’s shield, which is stronger than his bubble, which can block the weight of the entire ocean falling.
Blue defeated all the gems, and garnet amethyst and Pearl together destroyed an island. While lapis controlled the entire planet’s oceans.
Homeworld was destroyed when the diamonds emerged. And White can illuminate the entire universe.
Pink? Not much. But she blocked the Diamond corruption blast. And her defenses are really good.
Whoops forgot to address the post. The diamonds should stomp. Yellow alone can probably take them. The other diamonds are not as combat capable. Yellow punched through her ship, which is durable enough to tank island level destruction. She also broke Steven’s shield, which is stronger than his bubble, which can block the weight of the entire ocean falling.
Blue defeated all the gems, and garnet amethyst and Pearl together destroyed an island. While lapis controlled the entire planet’s oceans.
Homeworld was destroyed when the diamonds emerged. And White can illuminate the entire universe.
Pink? Not much. But she blocked the Diamond corruption blast. And her defenses are really good.
Island level attacks won't get you past even the weakest Espada.
OT: Idk, seems like a mismatch with these comments saying that Team SU is planetary+++. The only wincon I see for the Espada is to take advantage of invisibility and hax the opponents to death with Szayel, Zommari and Barragan. Everyone else is useless, but again, I know nothing about SU and don't know if they have resistance to the haxes of these 3 or if they could see/sense the Espada.
Whoops forgot to address the post. The diamonds should stomp. Yellow alone can probably take them. The other diamonds are not as combat capable. Yellow punched through her ship, which is durable enough to tank island level destruction. She also broke Steven’s shield, which is stronger than his bubble, which can block the weight of the entire ocean falling.
Blue defeated all the gems, and garnet amethyst and Pearl together destroyed an island. While lapis controlled the entire planet’s oceans.
Homeworld was destroyed when the diamonds emerged. And White can illuminate the entire universe.
Pink? Not much. But she blocked the Diamond corruption blast. And her defenses are really good.
Island level attacks won't get you past even the weakest Espada.
OT: Idk, seems like a mismatch with these comments saying that Team SU is planetary+++. The only wincon I see for the Espada is to take advantage of invisibility and hax the opponents to death with Szayel, Zommari and Barragan. Everyone else is useless, but again, I know nothing about SU and don't know if they have resistance to the haxes of these 3 or if they could see/sense the Espada.
Hmm put it this way: The crystal gems are mountain level to island level, and no matter how many of them there are a single Diamond can one shot all of them.
Lapis lazuli is continent level and Yellow one shotted her.
Steven tanked the weight of the planet’s ocean with his shield, and Yellow one shotted his shield. Blue‘s energy blasts also almost went past his shield.
Yellow’s warship can tank island level attacks (opal’s arrows and laser light cannons) unharmed, and she broke through it with one punch.
Additionally it was shown in the artsbook that the planet homeworld was destroyed after the diamonds emerged from the crust.
I don't know how much knowledge you have about Bleach, so I'll start by giving a general overview of the Espadas. They are numbered from 1-10 (or 0-9, as the Tenth Espada becomes Espada number zero later on), and this ranking is based on power.
So, basically:
9th Espada < 8th Espada < 7th Espada and so on.
This is only broken once with Ulquiorra using the second stage of his power, making him stronger than his rank suggests.
About their overral scaling:
In the HuecoMundo arc we are informed of how powerful the Espada are, without the need for powerscaling with previous feats. Gran Rey Cero is said to be capable of destroying Las Noches, a place the size of a country. The Espadas can use GRC, and we've seen throughout the series that it's a technique that can be used both in base and at full power (Resurreccion).
What do we get from this information? Even the weakest Espada is country level in base form with GRC.
Now, how much stronger is GRC compared to the physical abilities of the Espada? Well, we have a very good example in the Grimmjow vs. Luppi fight in CFYOW. These characters are somehow relative in strength, and Luppi, with Resurreccion released, took a GRC from Base Grimmjow and still suffered significant damage. The Resurreccion boost is compared to that of the bankai (5-10x), so GRC should be a bit more than 10 times stronger than the normal physical capabilities of the Espada.
With all that being said, I scale the Espada as follows:
Weaker ones (Aaroniero, Grantz, Zommari): between island-small country level in physical strength and large country level with their strongest attacks (although they don't use these attacks in-character, so whatever).
Stronger ones (top 6) - between country-multicontinental in physical strength, and all of them are multicontinental with their strongest attacks.
There's a lot more I could talk about, but I'm too lazy to grab all the scans.
@kisukez: That’s very impressive actually. I wasn’t expecting them to be this strong because people keep saying they get soloed by Kaido from one piece or lose to Akatsuki from Naruto. It’s good to be educated. Now I know these statements aren’t true.
So with everything you said I think they could pose a threat or at least be able battle for a while against Yellow Diamond. I don’t know about Blue or White because they’re not fighters. Yellow is the only fighter. Pink I guess can just protect herself with her shield and heal or even resurrect her teammates if one of them gets shattered (killed) by the Espada.
About the hax. Szayelaporro’s hax may not work on the diamonds. Because they’re just rocks, their bodies are only illusions of light. They don’t have organs and they don’t eat breathe sleep or anything. So there are no organs to suck.
And Zommari’s, how does the mind control work? if it’s anything to do with nervous system or anything biological then I don’t think it would work. Because gems are not organic beings. Pink has a similar technique where she transfers her mind to people’s bodies. White has an even better beam that would control you completely.
Baraggan’s im not sure. Gems don’t age. All the diamonds have lived for hundreds of thousands of years. But slowing down time should be something. Pink can do that too Btw.
and she has a scream that can break down buildings and even make a crater in the Diamond warship.
And can easily react to White diamond’s light beams.
Hollows’s should be fine. It’s also quite impressive and would be useful. flight is good as well, none of the other diamonds can fly except for Pink I think.
I’m sure White has some more magic up her sleeves that we haven’t seen. Pink has a scream that can destroy buildings and crack walls and she can slow down time around her. She also has a lot of hax like giving life with her tears. Turning inanimate objects to living things. Healing and resurrecting the dead. Controlling plants and also contstruts.
They each also have a unique aura and can attack people on the astral level. The aura can be used offensively or can be used as a barrier against powerful attacks.
overall I’m putting my money on the diamonds pretty easily at the moment. Yellow can possibly take many on by herself. Blue I’m not sure but she’s very durable. But I don’t know if she can fight. Pink can fight too, and White I don’t know. But if the diamonds individual abilities like crying and mind control are allowed to work on humans (they usually only work on gems) then they should stomp.
Hollows’s hax will be a problem though. by your description I don’t think they can even control him or reach him by telepathy.
@powerscaling: well, Kaido has the stats to face the Espada, it depends more on the battle rules. The Akatsuki might also secure a victory depending on the battle setup, but it would be through hax (like Genjutsu) because they do have significantly lower stats.
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With everything you've said, I think the Espadas would win quite easily. First of all, the issue of invisibility has never been addressed, which is a huge advantage for the Bleach team. Adding that to everything you've mentioned already prevents me from delving deeper into analysis because it's not necessary.
Regarding strenght, only Pink and Yellow seem to be in the tier of the stronger Espadas, and you're still unsure if Yellow's durability matches his ap.
As for speed, how fast are the diamonds? Honestly, it's hard to tell from the images you posted. Are these beams LS? In Bleach, Hollows have an ability called Cero that is LB, but not LS.
The Espadas are, on average, MHS+ in combat/reaction speed, with Starrk, Baraggan, and SE Ulquiorra being Rela-FTL, Halibel and Grimmjow being relativistic, and Zommari being Rela-FTL with Sonido (he is said to have the fastest Sonido among the Espada).
Regarding hax, yeah, Szayel and Baraggan might be useless against them, but Zommari's should work. It's not mind control or anything like that; it's more like body puppetry. Revisit the scans I posted; Zommari hits Byakuya's leg > he has control over Byakuya's leg. It's just control over the physical body. If the entire body is controlled, the person should still be able to maintain consciousness, they just lose control of the body.
I'll add one more hax that I think would be very relevant, which is Yammy's Gozui. It's an ability that allows him to suck souls. I had forgotten because I read that soul crush had been restricted, and I took it as if all soul shenanigans had been restricted as well.
So, yeah, I think the Espada win quite easily. The diamonds can't see the arrancars, so they are tremendously more susceptible to their attacks and will have immense difficulty landing their own attacks.
Additionally, there are only 2 diamonds that are on the same level as the Espada in terms of strength, so a 2 vs. 6 heavy hitters scenario seems disproportionate.
On top of that, Zommari's hax should work, and I don't know about Gozui, I'll wait for your response to see if they have resistance.
Pink's ability could be a problem, but again, without being able to see the Espadas, Pink would have to use it forever, and I can assume he wouldn't have the energy for that, right? But anyway, Baraggan's ability and Pink's should cancel each other out, so at least he could do something against Pink, which would already be enough.
The Espada have the advantage in numbers, strength, mobility, and hax.
With everything you've said, I think the Espadas would win quite easily. First of all, the issue of invisibility has never been addressed, which is a huge advantage for the Bleach team. Adding that to everything you've mentioned already prevents me from delving deeper into analysis because it's not necessary.
Regarding strenght, only Pink and Yellow seem to be in the tier of the stronger Espadas, and you're still unsure if Yellow's durability matches his ap.
Yeah invisibility is an issue. But all Diamond shave telepathic abilities and can communicate on the astral level. Pink can transfer her mind to their bodies and take control of them, she can do it as many times as she needs to as gems have infinite stamina.
You’re really underestimating Yellow. Keep in mind she never tried in the entire show (except against Blue Diamond). Every single fight she had was just immediate one shot. She one shotted Garnet, Opal, peridot, and even Lapis. One can even argue that she solos.
Blue and White I agree useless. Blue’s crying powers and White’s mind control only work on gems (I know OP said they’re allowed to work on them but it’s not fair so I will ignore it). Blue still has her energy projection though and White has her aura and destructive powers. But they don’t have battle experience and are not combat capable like Yellow and Pink.
Yellow is so strong she can carry her team. Add that to Pink’s long list of hax and abilities.
Yellow’s physical stats alone far outweighs anything I’ve seen from the espada. She easily punched through her warship with just her physical strength. it’s this durable:
That may not sound impressive until you hear how durable the shield is.
Steven’s shield is much more durable than his bubble. Steven’s bubble tanks the weight of the entire ocean after Lapis lazuli drops a tower made up of the entire planet‘s oceans. So his shield can easily rank continent level+ attacks, and Yellow one shotted it.
(Lapis lazuli’s water tower made of all the planet’s water)
About durability, we’ve never seen a Diamond even scratched or fazed from an attack. They dont even poof. Plus even if they do they can regenerate, they don’t die unless their gems are shattered and the Espada have no knowledge of that.
Blue Diamond tanked two warships falling over her head and she was completely unharmed, and Yellow scales above her. Each ship is this size
I'll add one more hax that I think would be very relevant, which is Yammy's Gozui.It's an ability that allows him to suck souls. I had forgotten because I read that soul crush had been restricted, and I took it as if all soul shenanigans had been restricted as well
Yeeaah that probably won’t work..gems don’t have souls. Again gems are rocks. Their bodies are just holograms with mass. They’re just robots. Their bodies are illusions and the only real part of them is their gemstone. That explains why they can shapeshift and manipulate their sizes.
As for speed, how fast are the diamonds? Honestly, it's hard to tell from the images you posted. Are these beams LS? In Bleach, Hollows have an ability called Cero that is LB, but not LS.
The Espadas are, on average, MHS+ in combat/reaction speed, with Starrk, Baraggan, and SE Ulquiorra being Rela-FTL, Halibel and Grimmjow being relativistic, and Zommari being Rela-FTL with Sonido (he is said to have the fastest Sonido among the Espada).
The diamonds (except Pink) launched an attack on earth from Homeworld. Homeworld is in another galaxy and it reached earth in a few seconds that was calculated in vs battles to be 48 trillion times the speed of light…
Additionally, there are only 2 diamonds that are on the same level as the Espada in terms of strength, so a 2 vs. 6 heavy hitters scenario seems disproportionate.
On top of that, Zommari's hax should work, and I don't know about Gozui, I'll wait for your response to see if they have resistance.
Yeah but Yellow is just so far ahead in physical strength it can make up for it. Pink has too much hax. Plant manipulation, resurrection, mind control, healing, destructive screams, shields, shapeshifting, slowing down time, etc.
Yeah they’re likely immune to Gozui’s hax.
Pink's ability could be a problem, but again, without being able to see the Espadas, Pink would have to use it forever, and I can assume he wouldn't have the energy for that, right? But anyway, Baraggan's ability and Pink's should cancel each other out, so at least he could do something against Pink, which would already be enough.
The Espada have the advantage in numbers, strength, mobility, and hax.
No. Gems have infinite stamina so she doesn’t run out of energy. Yeah I agree they would cancel each other out, but she’s still superior in strength.
Hax not really, most of it won’t work. And Pink has a lot more hax than them. Numbers true. Mobility is also true. Strength I wouldn’t say so..when Yellow is around.
Soo yeah. Overall I think the diamonds should win easily. Yellow has shown multi continent+ level attack potency and Pink can block the Diamond blast with her shield. They also cracked the planet Homeworld after emerging (which was recently confirmed in an artsbook by the creator). I just don’t see how they will be able to poof them, and even if they do theyll regenerate. Not to mention a lot of their hax is useless.
which Vs battles wiki has put at moon level+. But even if we ignore that, Yellow still was able to break through a defense that can tank the weight of an entire ocean.
EDIT: Oh and by the way I forgot to mention that all gems have an infinite pocket dimension inside their gems where they cam store stuff and their own memories too. So they can just BFR them
well, Kaido has the stats to face the Espada, it depends more on the battle rules. The Akatsuki might also secure a victory depending on the battle setup, but it would be through hax (like Genjutsu) because they do have significantly lower stats.
He still can’t solo though. They will eventually overwhelm him. Akatsuki are fodder, most of them are at mountain level with the top tiers at island level. But yeah as you said genjutsu could prove troublesome against them.
@powerscaling: I'm not underestimating the Diamonds, on the contrary, I'm taking Yellow as mc based on your comment about him one-shotting a continental character. I'm assuming his durability is equal to his attack potency, which is a big assumption based on what you're saying. However, the Espada are invisible. How are the diamonds going to hit the arrancars? They are invisible, making it very unlikely to be hit by any attack. It's as simple as that.
Some of your links ain't working, but even if they are faster than the Espada, even if this attack can blitz any Espada, it still doesn't solve the problem of how you're going to target the Espada or dodge something you don't even know is coming.
Pink seems haxed, but unfortunately, it's not the right hax here, and as I mentioned, Baraggan is enough to take him down.
BFR is nice, but again, it falls into the problem of invisibility. How are they going to BFR something they don't know where it is? Besides, Espadas can dimensional travel, so w'd be pretty useless anyway. Btw, the Espada have a BFRgear, I didn't mention anything about it because OP didn't specify anything about gears, and I didn't find it necessary.
I don't know about VS Battle, I'm drawing these conclusions based on what you've said so far.
@kisukez: Yeah I guess they can’t see them so they can’t hurt them. And I didn’t know about dimensional travel. I was probably wrong by saying it’s an easy win. I don’t have a lot of knowledge on Bleach so I guess I need to do some more research before coming to another conclusion. Oh sorry the links didn’t work for some reason but I’ll post them here
I still think Espada are faster. Because these could be outliers as we haven’t seen that speed in battle a lot of the time.
And I agree Pink would possibly lose to Baraggan, he’s probably faster and more durable too. But he needs to be able to get through her defense somehow.
Kaido soloing? Hell nah, Kaido loses to Baraggan in a1v1, even with Soul Crush being restricted. He simply can't touch the Arrancar.
Baraggan is a terrible matchup for cqc fighters,
Yea I agree there’s no way he can solo. One piece fans really be putting Kaido at planet level 🥲
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