Exaggerating and overreacting pretty much sums up this thread.

Well I could argue that he is not 'another cosmic entity', because he was pretty close to being the first one. If you go through Wolfman's description of him, you would find that when he came up with him, characters like that hadn't really come into prominence yet (which only really started happening after COIE).

They have, more than once actually, it's part of the reason stories with Trigon in it are normally centered around trying to stop him from ever getting to Earth because he is nearly unstoppable if he makes it. Regarding how he's been defeated... their ages isn't a worthy argument, like how many times has Darkseid been defeated by people who are a tiny fraction of his own age of approx 250.000 years? As for powers... let me point out that they are basically using the same setup as the Justice League, so knocking the Titans for that is knocking the League for theirs. And again, the only reason Trigon was defeated once he made it to Earth, was because he wandered into a trap that had been a thousand years in the making, he didn't just get punched in the head before retreating.

Well that might be true, but down to personal tastes. He fills the slot of the Devil invading with a demon army in DC adequately.

Meh ... it's not about how long he's been around relative to others, I just don't like most of the cosmic/god/devil/etc ... characters particularly worth reading about. In the end they are all "limitless" or something and can only be defeated by some thousand year old trap blah blah blah ... even with really well done art and writing it's a story I've never found dynamic. I prefer villains that are more personal. Joker, Cheetah, Circe, Catwoman, Lex Luthor, Riddler, Sinestro etc.... all of these villains are compelling to me because they in some way reflect our favorite heroes. There might be a chance to redeem them or perhaps they will eventually convert a hero. I enjoy this type of storytelling far more than the unstoppable cosmic force.

I like the Titans. I like the New Titans. I just find it silly that they get set up in situations like these. Give them situations more relevant to who they are instead of making them Justice League Jr. edition. I liked the 1980's NTT more when they had personal dramas going on, themes like coming out of the shadow of a mentor (yes I can see the link with Trigon here), or facing divorce and drug addiction and issues of trusting each other etc ... they could do a lot with a group of young heroes, this storyline feels rather bland IMO. I'm sure I'll be entertained by it, and I can hope that they make this more than a "Damian Wayne is a badass" story. BatJr is a great character, but I'd like to see development of others.

Thats all fair. Though it has to be said Trigon probably couldn't get any more personal for Raven, since he is her dad and is constantly trying to sway her to his side.

The problem with that is that a personal story like those you are suggesting most likely wouldn't work (due to time constraints) or sell with an audience that expects superhero fights. As for the story, true enough, it's not a reinvention of the wheel or going to blow anyone's mind philosophically... but I could ask if any of DC's animated projects have actually done that?

Well I'm talking more personal to the viewer/reader too ... i.e. I can put myself in their shoes and understand their motivations a little bit.

Your second point is why I am certain I'll be entertained by the movie. It'll be action packed and visually exciting which is really the main focus for an animated film of this nature. I think DC tried to do a little more with a few DCAU things like the WW film and the SM/BM features and to a smaller degree Crisis on Two Earths. How well they succeeded is whole other point!

Ah well I could say that this happening is rather rare, it happened a few times in the old TT cartoon, once or twice in BTAS but otherwise it's rare.

Hmm, I am not sure I see the same.... I get Owlman and his rather demented logic about choice, but not the others I've watched.

fair enough ... it's not like it's award winning stuff :)

Whining about a character losing in an adaptation is just stupid. Maybe people here should watch previous DC cartoons or in fact any cartoon with any comic character. I have seen Galactus get stomped by Ghost Rider,I have seen a normal bomb almost kill a Green Lantern,I have seen electricity fell Superman,I have seen Joker own Grundy and a lot more. No one gives a crap about comic power levels and no one in unbeatable,there is no defined hierarchy in adaptations.

People these days get waay too worked over who wins fight, this is mostly true for DC fans especially. Wonder Woman's problem is that she HAS to be there for the sake of it and same goes for Superman,they even removed GL and Shazam as if to prove my point.If she did skip this film her fans would have still thrown a fit over her not being included. If every member of the League is gonna lose and get mind controlled then you betcha WW will as well,Batman too has already lost to Damian,why should she be the exception?

Either way this film has the best creative team out of all the movies that have been produced in the last few years. I wish they just pump out Batman flicks all the time so that we'd be done with this non sense. DC fans are their own worst enemies.

Except we dont know who fights who,Damian dodging a simple sword swipe=nothing special on his part. It's how it is,its how it always has been,so why complain?

@entropy_aegis: Says you, from a place of privilege, Batman's got his own separate line of movies, gets an extra special treatment within the Justice League, happy days. What's in it for me though, can't say I'm looking forward to seeing this redneck Wonder Woman canoodle with Superman some more, possessed by a demon, beaten by children...if they're not gonna put the teeniest, weeniest bit of thought towards Wonder Woman, they might as well leave her out next time as far as I'm concerned

The last 2 JL movies barely had Batman,his own flicks have turned in to Damian movies while the last one was about Nightwing and Batwoman. Assault on Arkham was about Suicide Squad. In case you haven't noticed the Trinity has taken a back seat for the last few years. These new projects have been about pushing other characters.

@entropy_aegis: Yeah? But Batman was still portrayed with a lot of dignity in those movies, in the ones I saw anyway. He didn't show up in Assault on Arkham just to job, did he

except that he dodges a simple sword swipe from an individual who supposedly moves faster than SM and is one of the greatest fighters in the DCU. The fact that WW is capable of tagging the Flash, yet a peak human can dodge her blows is and always has been ridiculous. For the record I'd call this nitpicking not complaining ... it's just one more example of DC/WB making Batboy look good by nerfing other characters. The same promo talks about Damian being able to take down SM.

@entropy_aegis: you should seriously just abandon this thread like I am. We've tried being reasonable and it's obviously not going to work. I had just poked my head in to see if things had improved and sadly they haven't.

bye Felicia

One of my favorite lines to use :)

Just remember, we must be happy campers no matter how much Wonder Woman is mistreated :) it is totally illegal to express our 1st amendment right

@agent41: blah blah blah. Diana hasn't lost to Robin. In fact they didn't fight at all. He blocked ONE swing before she kicked him in the gut and knocked him away. It's obvious she's being controlled and it's reasonable to assume she's resisting. How much of her effectiveness does she lose under those circumstances? Half? 90% 99%? You have nearly zero context since they're still making the movie yet you are b!ching in overdrive.

@csg_cl: that might have hurt it this thread wasn't so pathetic. You and the other cry babies can have a good time.

Kill them with kindness. It will work everytime. Acting hostile won't help anything.

@agent41: and now you're putting words in my mouth. I didn't mention the n52 at all. All in all I don't like much of the n52 at all.

How do you know she is swinging full speed. Maybe it was to make him lose balance or something, or maybe it's a cartoon andshe would know he would be fine?

Idk spiderman doesn't punch full speed, but the idea of wonder-woman pulling her punches and attacks is far fetched?

how come the starro episode of mind control didn't have this level of hate? Maybe it did I don't remember though.

The obvious real problem here is Jamie/Blue beetle hasa mohawk.

WTF is that all about :S

oh come on! one complaint you have is she appears to be going all and could hurt robing...out against robin, which is just speculation, not like you can ask her.

and then your next complaint is she throws the fish people safely back into the water!

@csg_cl

" The same promo talks about Damian being able to take down SM."

They said he knows how to do it. Lots of people know how because his weakness is well known. Can he pull it off? We don't even know what it is he is going to use to do this.

What about Wonder Woman vs Darkseid in War? now maybe I should go make a thread about the way they disrespected him by not having him kill Diana or by not having his beams just arc around Diana's bracelets and blasting her in the face instead. How about I further add that Darkseid's power can be channelled from any part of his body so Diana's eye busting plan was dumb and unfaithful to his character to begin with.

In fact I should also make a thread about Trigon because he will get his a$$ kicked by everyone in the end.

If someone wants to whine they can pull a thousand excuses out of thin air.

Yeah and the Omega Effect can be channelled from any part of Darkseid's body and his eyes rapidly heal,did we see any of that when they were busy making Diana look good by having her bust his eye balls? if we're gonna argue faithfulness then Darkseid should regrown his eyes and then proceeded to blast her in to oblivion. Darkseid is also an incredibly skilled character,why didn't he block her sword? he's also capable of moving at "unthinkable" speeds.

You're just assuming things that aren't there,this WW has never showed any skill or speed worth mentioning and even if she did then so what? Grundy isn't even alive and he was owned by that Fury Amazon in DCAU via virus attack. A virus that only worked on men,a virus so sexist it didn't even spare a dead man.

No more mistreated than Darkseid and Grundy.

@entropy_aegis: Wonder Woman is one of the most powerful, arguably the second most powerful superhero in the DCU, if she can't bring it to Darkseid, who else is going to, of what use is Darkseid to the dcu if he's untouchable to the world's mightiest superheroes? He's a Justice League Villain, losing to the Justice League is was he does and what they bring him in for, it's his job I guess you can say. Now it's not Wonder Woman's job to job to Damien, furthermore the gap between them is chasmic, it should be insurmountable, like watching a yorkshire terrier fell a dinosaur. You didn't think this through, did you

seriously people need to understand the concept of sarcasm. It's a friggin cartoon, even the most rabid fans are going to understand that it's not real life. But I do find it ridiculously amusing that batfans get so worked up about pretty legit complaints from other fanbases. Take a deep breath and realize how stupid the concept of a demon-mind-controlled WW "pulling her punches" sounds ... you are all so used to James Bond-esque villains in batbooks that you forget that WW is willing to end a threat when she deems it necessary. Honestly I'm more bothered by her being susceptible to the mind control of a 3rd tier demon villain! But in the end I'll be entertained by the action-oriented animation. I promise all of you that if the roles had been Cassie or Donna as the bad ass Teen Titan rather than Damian who takes down the Bat or SM you would all be crying about the insanity.

http://www.picgifs.com/baby-graphics/crying/

@csg_cl: I didn't ask for a family photo album

Entropy_Aegis voiced his indignation once over what transpired in Hiketeia, all these years and that wound's still fresh. For Wonder Woman, a win over Batman is nothing to write home about but they, however, didn't take it well, the hypocrites.

@csg_cl: yes, when I talk to you that's pretty much how I feel. Thank you for helping me express my feelings.

When all's said and done, the whining was actually not that loud before these foreign aggressors came to this territory pick a flame war with the locals. Yet another case in point of self-designated anti-haters being the worst sh!t-stirrers on the internet

Probably that it is a poorly made film.

@brunnhilde: right, everyone else is at fault and you and your friends are totally innocent. I'm on this site and this "territory" of yours nearly everyday when I have some down time at work. I don't appreciate you claiming this forum as your own and neither did I come here for a flame war. I really can't stand the new Robin but nothing in that video is worth the crapstorm this has turned into.

@kiba: I'm glad we understand each other. I did my best to put it in simple enough terms for you to grasp

@csg_cl: that you're an immature little girl that I'm tired of? Oh yeah. I got it. Next time try using your words like a big girl. I think you can do it.

The hell are you talking about? I dont go around complaining about that story. Whatever indignation I felt was over Rucka's depiction of Batman. I dislike Rucka's Batman no matter where he goes,I disliked his Batman when he was writing Detective,I still dont like how he got rid of Bullock and Gordon to make way for his pets Montoya and Allen,I dont like that Sasha Bordeaux story at all. His Batman was just an unlikeable prick,those years he was on the Batman books were irritating for the conceptual and story directions.My dislike for Rucka's Batman has nothing to do with him being humiliated,this guy actually shipped both these characters. Didn't think this one through did you?

HAHAHAHA,she aint even in the top 12 most powerful heroes on Earth much less the universe.

Damian aint alone either,or did you just miss it's JL vs TT?

WW IS the villain,along with the rest of the JL or did you miss that too?

Didn't think about this one either did you?

I wouldn't even put Superman in the top 5.

Of course but someone needs to get that through to Brunnhilde.