@BigCimmerian: if he could beat hulk, they wouldn't have sent him into space

http://www.comicvine.com/what-if-world-war-hulk-the-heroes-lost-world-war-hulk-thor-entered-world-war-hulk-say-what/37-186920/

He would have lost too, unless we're forgetting that Greg Pak was writing that event.

@X35 said:

http://www.comicvine.com/what-if-world-war-hulk-the-heroes-lost-world-war-hulk-thor-entered-world-war-hulk-say-what/37-186920/

Doesn't count since that fight was inconclusive. It was a waste of my money.

He would have lost too.

@TDK_1997 said:

He would have lost too.

In character? Yes. Out of character? No.

He would have lost too, unless we're forgetting that Greg Pak was writing that event.

@darkazrael999 said:

@Caligula: That incident was PIS at it's best. You cannot lift Mjolnir unless you are worthy. And if you want to, you have to be a much more powerful being than Odin, and Hulk got his butt handed to him by Zeus. Thor has stalemated Hulk for and entire hour while the Hulk was getting stronger and Thor wasn't.

You want more examples of Thor's strength. Check thisthreadout. It has feats and scans of Thor's strength and powers that put him at a league far above Hulk. WWorldbreaker Hulk is close but still below. Thor withstood attacks from a Celestial and broke though the armor of a Celestial with a single strike. Want more? Check thisthreadout for his much recent showings. Hulk is uber strong. At the end of WWH, he created tremors throughout the Eastern Seaboard with his footsteps. That's impressive. But you are underestimating the Odinson.

You done did told them man, wouldn't it be right if it was rkt though? Since you know wwh is the one of the most powerful versions of hulk. Although rkt would disintegrate hulk so, i guess king thor would be a good match but wait..... Thor beat hulk and thing at the same time with one arm. Haha

@lanebad6: Yeah.

Thor would have lost because he always loses to hulk because hulk is stronger.

From the princes mouth himself.

@darkazrael999: he knocked him into orbit because if he didn't get the hulk away from him he would have lost. basically reverse running away.

@Teerack said:

Thor would have lost because he always loses to hulk because hulk is stronger.

From the princes mouth himself.

Yeah, but in next panel Hulk approaches Thor saying "I knew...", Thor stands up saying "Did you know?" and knocks him into orbit. I think he just baited Hulk into an easy BFR shot. He still fainted afterwards, so it wasn't an easy fight for the three of them.

@OmegaRed86: No he just knocked him into space to get away from him. Did you know really doesn't imply much other then it was good banter at the moment. It's not like hulk couldn't have knocked thor into space if that was his goal.

Were also talking about world war hulk meaning if thor was there all he would of done is push hulk into world breaker mode which would of just been game over for everyone.

@Teerack said:

@OmegaRed86: No he just knocked him into space to get away from him. Did you know really doesn't imply much other then it was good banter at the moment. It's not like hulk couldn't have knocked thor into space if that was his goal.

Were also talking about world war hulk meaning if thor was there all he would of done is push hulk into world breaker mode which would of just been game over for everyone.

I wouldn't say he BFR'd Hulk to get away from him, but fighting Hulk at this powered up stage would lead to massive collateral damage. He suckered Jade Jaws into approaching and then knocked him out of orbit. Now him walking away and then fainting was weird, but the battle wasn't easy.

I've only seen Hulk beat Thor once, but Thor was trying to reason with him so it wasn't a blood-lusted Thor(Hulk vs movie). Anytime they've fought in the past, Thor is trying to calm him down or sustain is going all out for the kill. I can't think of a time when one's totally destroyed each other in a fight. But I know that Thor is holding back more often than not.

I love how so many overzealous fans took Thor's words as literal when he fought Nul, that even the writer had to explain he was being sarcastic. Anyway according to Greg Pak's original script it would have been a stalemate, and according to the World War Hulk What If it would have been a stalemate. That's funny given that in almost every single on of their fights versus each other its been a stalemate or Hulk has run away or Thor has left Hulk unconscious or Hulk has managed to be mind controlled into making Thor drop his own hammer on his face. So I am guessing it would probably be a stalemate.   

@Robbari said:

I think this is a good example. Wasn't it already basically shown in a "what if type" situation? Thor appeared to get the better of Hulk throughout that fight, even down to the end before it was interrupted, it looked like Thor was getting ready to stop holding back and cut loose to deliver a punishing strike.

This has already been covered, but Defenders #10 should be definitive proof that no matter how angry Hulk gets, the best he can do is equal Thor in strength. Thor was locked in stance with the Hulk for an hour. That is PLENTY of time for Hulk to reach his pinnacle in strength. Don't think he was trying? Right, from the guy running around crying, "Hulk is strongest one there is!". And it's not like that was the first time those two had met.

@Teerack: Yeah. But he faced an overpowered Hulk and Thing at the same time. As Angrir, Thing was able to dominate Red Hulk. How powerful do you think Hulk would be? Besides Thor has stalemated Hulk for an entire Hour and he still has better feats. Smashing through the armor of a Celestial, withstanding blasts from a Celestial, standing in the center of the sun whilst confronting Atum. Just check out this thread.

@Malevolent1: with the way the hulks powers work he actually doesn't have a limit to his power. His body channels the power of the multiverse itself based on his emotional state, so literally there is no limit to hulks strength.

@darkazrael999: When hulk enters world breaker mode he can destroy planets by clapping his hands and ever grew 80 feet tall as he adsorbed in more gama and cosmic radiation making him ever stronger.

Classic hulk/thor I'm sure Thor was probably the stronger one, but I really don't think people realized just how much stronger hulk has gotten after/during world war hulk. You also need to take into account that ever sense World War Hulk banner has tried desperately to not let himself enter wold breaker mode again because it puts the whole planet at wrist. not to mention that in almost all of the hulk's fights Bruce is either subconsciously or consciously holding back the hulk drastically. A prime example of this would be the Onslaught saga back in the day. Thor wasn't able to do much more to him then anyone else and neither was the hulk, but then jean grey entered the mind of the hulk and shut down the Bruce banner part of the brain leaving just the hulk, the result was hulk pretty effortlessly beat Onslaught until he had no physical form left. And back in worth war hulk the Bruce part of the mind was almost completely dormant, so there wasn't much holding him back.

unforchantly because marvel likes fans to argue about hulk vs. thor even in the "What if? World War Hulk" where thor did get involved in world war hulk it was a stalemate.

@SC

I love how so many overzealous fans took Thor's words as literal when he fought Nul, that even the writer had to explain he was being sarcastic.   

That's not true. Matt Fraction has never really "explained" anything about the fight and at the time was been pretty adamant about leaving it up to the individual reader for their interpretation. In fact the closest he came to giving his own thoughts on what happened implied that Thor was telling the truth as he describes how closely matched they are and how Thor is giving his all to finally win:

"Marvel.com: How is Thor’s fight with Thing/Angrir different than his fight with Hulk/Nul? Why does he have so much more resentment toward the latter?

Matt Fraction: Thor vs Hulk is, like, that classic, no-win, endless, drive-your-friends-nuts-arguing-until-four-in-the-morning Marvel fight. I mean, at the end of the Avengers/Defenders War they just stood there silently grappling each other and not moving. That was the fight! They just—stood there—grappling.

So I think if it comes down to it? You're damn right Thor's gonna hold a grudge. And look at all the problems Hulk has caused just by his very nature of being The Hulk! It just felt like the right note, dramatically, to play. That Nul would be this sort of cold, cruel, relentless force of nature and, for Thor, it was One Last Chance to come out on top."

Anyway according to Greg Pak's original script it would have been a stalemate, and according to the World War Hulk What If it would have been a stalemate. That's funny given that in almost every single on of their fights versus each other its been a stalemate or Hulk has run away or Thor has left Hulk unconscious or Hulk has managed to be mind controlled into making Thor drop his own hammer on his face. So I am guessing it would probably be a stalemate.  

@Fifthchild:  So its not true based on what you have read and not what I have read? I am not sure thats sound reasoning, so what you should or could be saying is that I am lying? Since I stand by what I wrote, since what I read from Matt Fraction, he explained that Thor was not being literal and he gave Thor from a odds perspective the best if all three (Thor Hulk and Thing were to fight each other) Unless I suppose Matt Fraction has only given one interview ever?    

I am not really sure what you are talking about either? **smiles** You don't think Hulk leaving a fight equates to an inconclusive end to their encounter? Or you don't know of instances Hulk just left of his own accord? Or you don't recall the time Thor knocked out Hulk?

I'm not calling you a liar but based on the astounding amount of misinformation that gets posted in these forums I pretty much assumed that it was just some piece of hearsay. Still if you do know of an interview where Fraction said this would you mind providing a link? I would find it very surprising given that a lot of people were asking him and Brevoort what it all meant at the time and he refused to spell it out for anyone. 

I'm saying that those are hardly typical endings to their fights. Going through them all I can think of a lot of inconclusive endings, one KO for Thor, one KO for Hulk, Hulk leaving Thor battered but hardly "running away" etc.  Your description gave a different impression IMO. And I'm still not sure what you meant with the comment about Hulk mind controlling Thor into dropping his hammer on his face. 

@SC said:

@Fifthchild said:

I'm not calling you a liar but based on the astounding amount of misinformation that gets posted in these forums I pretty much assumed that it was just some piece of hearsay. Still if you do know of an interview where Fraction said this would you mind providing a link? I would find it very surprising given that a lot of people were asking him and Brevoort what it all meant at the time and he refused to spell it out for anyone.

This though perhaps is a better lead in though asking for a source or a link that dismissing a persons words as not true?

True. I was replying on an iPad which involves a lot of do-it-yourself-formatting with this site because the usual response box requies Flash so my actual message was probably more curt than it should have been. Apologies for that.

I can empathize with your sentiment. I actually tried looking for a link after I posted but Google came up with page after page to various Fraction Fear Itself related interviews and even a few podcasts, where I might have actually heard him, so I can't help sorry, only to say that I do know that it wasn't a Marvel.com interview, and probably wasn't CBR interview either.

@Fifthchild said:

I'm saying that those are hardly typical endings to their fights. Going through them all I can think of a lot of inconclusive endings, one KO for Thor, one KO for Hulk, Hulk leaving Thor battered but hardly "running away" etc. Your description gave a different impression IMO. And I'm still not sure what you meant with the comment about Hulk mind controlling Thor into dropping his hammer on his face.

I never said they were typical endings to their fights?

Thats how i took it although looking back it could be read in another way. I suppose i got the impression that you were saying that their fights are usually a tie or Hulk loses but i can see why that could be a misinterpretation on my part. Again, apologies if that was the case.

In fact I state those particular outcomes after I state stalemates as the first, making them the exceptions. You mean to infer running away as a negative? Nothing wrong with running away, running away does not mean that Hulk was scared and needed to run away, and I suppose if one wanted to be literal, Hulk leaped away lol, but describing Hulk as running or leaping away to create an inconclusive end is not to insult the Hulk. The thing about descriptions is people can always clarify. What I mean with my comment about mind controlled Hulk (not Hulk mind controlling Thor) is that in a recent Avengers book, Thanos psychically forced Hulk to attack Thor and seeing as Hulk can't lift Thor's hammer but can overpower Thor, the result was Thor's hammer falling on to his face. Essentially Hulk made Thor drop his hammer on his face. Its kind of daft that Thor would let that happen, again, and daft that Thanos so easily used telepathy against Hulk, but its Bendis and its for really really casual fans.

No worries. Seems like we are more or less on the same page.

Thor would win....out of character of course.

@Caligula: thor is simply far more versatile and has shown better feats. we have seen hulk beat a thor that holds back and limits himself to physical brawling, but what happens if thor steps it up a notch? heres my argument:

god blast- has been show to hurt a weak galactus

winds from a 1000 worlds- has been shown to injure a powerful sky father named glory

speedblitz- thor has been shown to travel faster than light, so this is a big advantage

strength- thors strength feats put him a good bit above hulks base strength, another advantage

hammer control- thors +lightspeed reactions and control over mjolnir with his mind allow him to direct it at speeds strong and fast enough to destroy small plantoids

skill- thor has 1000s of years in combat

durability- hulk is more durable to blunt force, but thor is more to energy/magic type attacks

just my thoughts to maybe prove you wrong

If Thor ever stopped being honorable and tried killing folks, he'd win.

THOR can take him easily when not holding back

Thor always holds back against Hulk because they're friends and Thor wants a good challenge. The one time Thor didn't hold back was as King Thor though at the point of the fight, had lost the Odinpower. Thor with one arm killed both Hulk and Thor so if Thor went all out against Hulk in any of those fights, he would win. We are talking about the Thunder God who summoned the power of 1000 storms vs Glory, Thermoblasted Ego and shattered a planet with one strike against BRB.

The most obvious answer is there would've been some sort of reason for a stalemate, especially if Thor had been brought back specifically to deal with Hulk. Depends on who would've handled the fight as well. It would have definitely been interesting.

It would have ruined the comic, as it would have ended too soon.

the comic was done...thor had the advantage throughout

...

It's Odniforce Thor, of course he would win... Without it, we would probably see something similar to Hulk vs Sentry except on a slightly bigger scale since Hulk was holding back there which he can't really afford against Thor who would do anything to try and stop the Hulk from destroying Earth.

Anyway can we sign some kind of petition to give Thor fans honorary badges that say "Thor is always holding back" and "Hulk fights are PIS, Thors are not". Seriously poor old Thor if only he was not holding back in every single fight of his even TOAA would be no match... Damn those Marvel writers...

THOR could take the gamma out of the hulk if he wants to

Of course, he could take the cosmic power out of Galactus too if he wanted to.

If Thor had the Odin force, he'd win.

But regular Thor would get stomped by the WWH, regular Thor struggles enough against a Savage Hulk.

Btw, I've said this before, but all the BS about Thor always holding back wasn't until recently. Classically, neither one held back at any time against the other. They always went full bore at each other and at times Thor would win and at others the Hulk would win. Because Hulk is superior to him physically, while Thor has Mjolnir ti make up the difference. Neither one is clearly more powerful than the other, and that's the WAY IT IS IN THE COMICS. Just get over that, fanboys for both characters struggle with this, you all make excuses and constantly try to discredit the other character.

Those who say Thor > Hulk are completely delusional.

Those who say Hulk > Thor are the same.

it has been done before in a what if comic, thor had the upper hand the whole time....in that short fight

google the scans

the fact that hulk was more powerful and seemed to have pretty solid head on him (mental stability wise/ more human than usual) I don't think thor would have done what he had done in earlier matchups. would have been sweet to see though.

If Sentry could only beat him to a draw then Thor would have gone down faster than a white girl on a nba star

I remember now that in the World War Hulk arc, Thor was gone. ( Can't remember what happened ) I also remember the heroes ranking the top 3 superheroes on earth. It was Black Bolt as 3rd, Hulk 2nd, and Sentry 1st. If anyone has the scans, it would be greatly appreciated. Although Thor wasn't there at the time to be ranked. I would think Sentry or Thor would be ranked number 1. Marvel writers have also shown many times that Hulk is physically superior to Thor, but Thor is more powerful.

As for if Thor would win. I think it depends. One reason is because it's quite obvious at the time that Sentry was suppose to get the most attention, and what better to do than send him up against Hulk? Especially a more stronger version. Black Bolt also had the opportunity and power to put down Hulk, but what did they do? They made it a Skrull. Same with Ghost Rider/Zarathos leaving the battle, and ZOM Doctor Strange. Marvel writers have also shown that a lot of heroes have held back, because of the love of their dear friend Bruce Banner. Iron Man has stated it, Captain America has, and so has Thor. Although I don't have all the instances. I do have the one of Iron Man saying it. I hold this too a high regard. Not to mention Thor holds back on virtually anyone who cannot take his punishment. Much like Superman.

Here is Iron Man telling, and showing Rulk that he holds back on Hulk.

Also at the time, did Thor not have the Odin Force? That would even further Thor's victory against Hulk. There was a what-if of Thor fighting World War Hulk with the Odin Force. Thor had the upper hand and was going to deliver the killing blow, but was interrupted.

I do believe that without the Odin Force, and if the writer knew just how powerful Thor was, than he would defeat the Hulk.

Are you trying to say Sentry is more powerful than Thor? The Dark Avengers were afraid to fight Thor. Sentry was one of them.

Hulk always wins.

@thundergodswrath:

About as solid as the time Thor told Hulk he could never beat him. Thor is more powerful than the Hulk, Hulk is stronger. However that does not mean Thor has a 10 out of 10 winning chance. But anyway it all depends on the writer and i wish i could see modern Thor(without Miljonir) against WWB Hulk because that would be hilarious to me especially with a writer that knows both of these characters.

Fair enough.

Hulk would've won had they been fighting during WWH. Thor would beat him outside of it though.

i dislike hulk fanboys .. they are just the worst....

Thor doesn't hold back against Hulk, never did til recently. Back since the 60's they always went full bore. Not until recently came the fanboy bs that Thor is always holding back. Which translated into the writers.

Thor fanboys are idiots, so all Hulk feats are PIS but Thor feats are aren't.