good question, but the hammer gives the bearer the abilities of THOR not odin, and since hes GOT the odin force, yes he could

In all the comics I have seen, I have never seen Thor without his Hammer. Without his hammer could he still fight his enemies and win as he did with his hammer? Also another question is now that Thor has the Odinforce, can he fly, shoot energy beams, manipulate matter and energy, transmute and do many more things WITHOUT his hammer? Thanks

Like Warlock said the hammer gives someone the Powers of Thor. I've discussed this over at the Marvel site with some people there are a number of instances where he uses his powers without the hammer.

In one issue he even states that he has used the hammer as a crutch of the last decades. Relying on it too much to channel his powers. With that said look at the hammer two ways.

1) Anyone other than Thor who is worthy to lift/use Mjolnir gains the powers of Thor.

2) Thor useing the hammer is like a conductor. He channels his power through it, notfrom it.

Porter says:

"In all the comics I have seen, I have never seen Thor without his Hammer. Without his hammer could he still fight his enemies and win as he did with his hammer? Also another question is now that Thor has the Odinforce, can he fly, shoot energy beams, manipulate matter and energy, transmute and do many more things WITHOUT his hammer? Thanks"

Thor with out his hammer doesn't make to much of a difference. When he fought captain america and he had no powers what so ever he beat him in a fight. Thor can use all of his orginal powers but now on a higher level. The odin force could basically do anything he wishes like even create his own galaxy if need be. The transmuting thing and matter manipulation he can't with out his hammer but control weather he still can. He also fought loki with out his hammer and beat him pretty bad lol.

There was a series of comics about Thor, I believe it was called blood oath. Anyway he had to complete tasks with the warriors three. One condition of this contest was that Thor could not use his hammer. He was still able to complete the tasks, and even caused lightening to strike while he was fighting Herculues. He is still the all powerful God of Thunder, the hammer just makes him more powerful.

Well when Donald Blake first started using the hammer to become Thor he would turn back after 60 seconds if the hammer couldn't get back to him.

Andferne says:

"Mid-Knighter says:

"Well when Donald Blake first started using the hammer to become Thor he would turn back after 60 seconds if the hammer couldn't get back to him."

That enchantment was removed and placed on Stormbreaker. Beta Ray Bills hammer."

I'm trying to say that people feel that the weapon is his strength and it's been that way for a long time, but we really don't know to much about any current limits Thor may have after his return.

Mid-Knighter says:

"Well when Donald Blake first started using the hammer to become Thor he would turn back after 60 seconds if the hammer couldn't get back to him."

That enchantment was removed and placed on Stormbreaker. Beta Ray Bills hammer.

In my opinion the hammer is his weakness. He has relied too much on it.

Andferne says:

"Like Warlock said the hammer gives someone the Powers of Thor. I've discussed this over at the Marvel site with some people there are a number of instances where he uses his powers without the hammer. In one issue he even states that he has used the hammer as a crutch of the last decades. Relying on it too much to channel his powers. With that said look at the hammer two ways. 1) Anyone other than Thor who is worthy to lift/use Mjolnir gains the powers of Thor. 2) Thor useing the hammer is like a conductor. He channels his power through it, notfrom it."

As stated, Thor's power comes from himself, not the hammer, the hammer just channels his powers, that's all! The only think he can't do without his hammer that i can think of is fly! I don't really agree with that, I think he should have the ability to do that on his own, but it's been stated and shown that the hammer is used to carry him when he flies! not sure if this is still the case!

Those were the old days, when Odin put alot of restrictions on thor, to teach him humility and not get ahead of himself with his powers! he has no such restrictions these days! I think it's safe to say he's grown alot in both terms of power, wisdom and ability to use them both effeciently! Hell, he's the lord of asgard, he's basically taken over Odin's roll!

zee crusher says:

"Porter says:

"In all the comics I have seen, I have never seen Thor without his Hammer. Without his hammer could he still fight his enemies and win as he did with his hammer? Also another question is now that Thor has the Odinforce, can he fly, shoot energy beams, manipulate matter and energy, transmute and do many more things WITHOUT his hammer? Thanks"

Thor with out his hammer doesn't make to much of a difference. When he fought captain america and he had no powers what so ever he beat him in a fight. Thor can use all of his orginal powers but now on a higher level. The odin force could basically do anything he wishes like even create his own galaxy if need be. The transmuting thing and matter manipulation he can't with out his hammer but control weather he still can. He also fought loki with out his hammer and beat him pretty bad lol."

Can you show me where Odin actually created a galaxy ?

Thats a big feat, beyond even the Celestials or Galactus so I doubt thet the power has that scope.

if it did then Odin would not have been fearful of the Celestials ruling that humanity did not deserve to live during the visitation of the Celestial 4th host.

In most instances from modern comics (1980's onward)with Odin in, his power has been pretty consistently shown to be less than Galactus or a Celestial.

zee crusher says:

"The_Creator says:

"zee crusher says:

"Porter says:

"In all the comics I have seen, I have never seen Thor without his Hammer. Without his hammer could he still fight his enemies and win as he did with his hammer? Also another question is now that Thor has the Odinforce, can he fly, shoot energy beams, manipulate matter and energy, transmute and do many more things WITHOUT his hammer? Thanks"

Thor with out his hammer doesn't make to much of a difference. When he fought captain america and he had no powers what so ever he beat him in a fight. Thor can use all of his orginal powers but now on a higher level. The odin force could basically do anything he wishes like even create his own galaxy if need be. The transmuting thing and matter manipulation he can't with out his hammer but control weather he still can. He also fought loki with out his hammer and beat him pretty bad lol."

Can you show me where Odin actually created a galaxy ? Thats a big feat, beyond even the Celestials or Galactus so I doubt thet the power has that scope. if it did then Odin would not have been fearful of the Celestials ruling that humanity did not deserve to live during the visitation of the Celestial 4th host. In most instances from modern comics (1980's onward)with Odin in, his power has been pretty consistently shown to be less than Galactus or a Celestial."

I'm not gonna go on my computer get the ragnaork issue and post it for you. I don't see a point if i did whats gonna happen?? Your gonna say its probably fan art or you don't believe me. And just because those others haven't done it doesn't mean there not stronger. You just don't know anything about odin is all. When odin fought infinity(his evil counter part) they fought so hard galaxies got destroyed. Odin is called a galaxy buster for a reason. Surtur galaxy buster for a reason. If some one else like methos maybe even gambler asked i would post the whole issue over here or atleast the whole scene cause they would believe me but for you i shall let you go to google and look for it your self. Also how can odin not create a galaxy when he banished and entire galaxy?? How do you think mangog was created?? Odins even been seen teleporting every single being on earth to a limbo dimension."

Destroying is not the same as creating.

You stated creating a Galaxy - so let's see it.

I don't care about the rest of the info presented.

Show us the creation event please.

The_Creator says:

"zee crusher says:

"Porter says:

"In all the comics I have seen, I have never seen Thor without his Hammer. Without his hammer could he still fight his enemies and win as he did with his hammer? Also another question is now that Thor has the Odinforce, can he fly, shoot energy beams, manipulate matter and energy, transmute and do many more things WITHOUT his hammer? Thanks"

Thor with out his hammer doesn't make to much of a difference. When he fought captain america and he had no powers what so ever he beat him in a fight. Thor can use all of his orginal powers but now on a higher level. The odin force could basically do anything he wishes like even create his own galaxy if need be. The transmuting thing and matter manipulation he can't with out his hammer but control weather he still can. He also fought loki with out his hammer and beat him pretty bad lol."

Can you show me where Odin actually created a galaxy ?

Thats a big feat, beyond even the Celestials or Galactus so I doubt thet the power has that scope.

if it did then Odin would not have been fearful of the Celestials ruling that humanity did not deserve to live during the visitation of the Celestial 4th host.

In most instances from modern comics (1980's onward)with Odin in, his power has been pretty consistently shown to be less than Galactus or a Celestial."

I'm not gonna go on my computer get the ragnaork issue and post it for you. I don't see a point if i did whats gonna happen?? Your gonna say its probably fan art or you don't believe me. And just because those others haven't done it doesn't mean there not stronger. You just don't know anything about odin is all. When odin fought infinity(his evil counter part) they fought so hard galaxies got destroyed. Odin is called a galaxy buster for a reason. Surtur galaxy buster for a reason. If some one else like methos maybe even gambler asked i would post the whole issue over here or atleast the whole scene cause they would believe me but for you i shall let you go to google and look for it your self. Also how can odin not create a galaxy when he banished and entire galaxy?? How do you think mangog was created?? Odins even been seen teleporting every single being on earth to a limbo dimension.

zee crusher says:

"The_Creator says:

"zee crusher says:

"The_Creator says:

"zee crusher says:

"Porter says:

"In all the comics I have seen, I have never seen Thor without his Hammer. Without his hammer could he still fight his enemies and win as he did with his hammer? Also another question is now that Thor has the Odinforce, can he fly, shoot energy beams, manipulate matter and energy, transmute and do many more things WITHOUT his hammer? Thanks"

Thor with out his hammer doesn't make to much of a difference. When he fought captain america and he had no powers what so ever he beat him in a fight. Thor can use all of his orginal powers but now on a higher level. The odin force could basically do anything he wishes like even create his own galaxy if need be. The transmuting thing and matter manipulation he can't with out his hammer but control weather he still can. He also fought loki with out his hammer and beat him pretty bad lol."

Can you show me where Odin actually created a galaxy ? Thats a big feat, beyond even the Celestials or Galactus so I doubt thet the power has that scope. if it did then Odin would not have been fearful of the Celestials ruling that humanity did not deserve to live during the visitation of the Celestial 4th host. In most instances from modern comics (1980's onward)with Odin in, his power has been pretty consistently shown to be less than Galactus or a Celestial."

I'm not gonna go on my computer get the ragnaork issue and post it for you. I don't see a point if i did whats gonna happen?? Your gonna say its probably fan art or you don't believe me. And just because those others haven't done it doesn't mean there not stronger. You just don't know anything about odin is all. When odin fought infinity(his evil counter part) they fought so hard galaxies got destroyed. Odin is called a galaxy buster for a reason. Surtur galaxy buster for a reason. If some one else like methos maybe even gambler asked i would post the whole issue over here or atleast the whole scene cause they would believe me but for you i shall let you go to google and look for it your self. Also how can odin not create a galaxy when he banished and entire galaxy?? How do you think mangog was created?? Odins even been seen teleporting every single being on earth to a limbo dimension."

Destroying is not the same as creating. You stated creating a Galaxy - so let's see it. I don't care about the rest of the info presented. Show us the creation event please. "

I don't care if destroying isn't the same as creating. You wanna see him do this go ask anybody else on the site. They most likely read the issue to. Go to the odin force page as well it states it there as well. Trust me i won't show it to you. Why show it when you won't believe it???"

I will believe it but as usual you sat something and cannot back it up.

You offer no logical support for what you say and present as facts and lead others to believe what you say as correct.

Post the veidence and prove me wrong.

The_Creator says:

"zee crusher says:

"The_Creator says:

"zee crusher says:

"Porter says:

"In all the comics I have seen, I have never seen Thor without his Hammer. Without his hammer could he still fight his enemies and win as he did with his hammer? Also another question is now that Thor has the Odinforce, can he fly, shoot energy beams, manipulate matter and energy, transmute and do many more things WITHOUT his hammer? Thanks"

Thor with out his hammer doesn't make to much of a difference. When he fought captain america and he had no powers what so ever he beat him in a fight. Thor can use all of his orginal powers but now on a higher level. The odin force could basically do anything he wishes like even create his own galaxy if need be. The transmuting thing and matter manipulation he can't with out his hammer but control weather he still can. He also fought loki with out his hammer and beat him pretty bad lol."

Can you show me where Odin actually created a galaxy ? Thats a big feat, beyond even the Celestials or Galactus so I doubt thet the power has that scope. if it did then Odin would not have been fearful of the Celestials ruling that humanity did not deserve to live during the visitation of the Celestial 4th host. In most instances from modern comics (1980's onward)with Odin in, his power has been pretty consistently shown to be less than Galactus or a Celestial."

I'm not gonna go on my computer get the ragnaork issue and post it for you. I don't see a point if i did whats gonna happen?? Your gonna say its probably fan art or you don't believe me. And just because those others haven't done it doesn't mean there not stronger. You just don't know anything about odin is all. When odin fought infinity(his evil counter part) they fought so hard galaxies got destroyed. Odin is called a galaxy buster for a reason. Surtur galaxy buster for a reason. If some one else like methos maybe even gambler asked i would post the whole issue over here or atleast the whole scene cause they would believe me but for you i shall let you go to google and look for it your self. Also how can odin not create a galaxy when he banished and entire galaxy?? How do you think mangog was created?? Odins even been seen teleporting every single being on earth to a limbo dimension."

Destroying is not the same as creating.

You stated creating a Galaxy - so let's see it.

I don't care about the rest of the info presented.

Show us the creation event please.

"

I don't care if destroying isn't the same as creating.

You wanna see him do this go ask anybody else on the site. They most likely read the issue to. Go to the odin force page as well it states it there as well. Trust me i won't show it to you. Why show it when you won't believe it???

zee crusher says:

"The_Creator says:

"zee crusher says:

"The_Creator says:

"zee crusher says:

"The_Creator says:

"zee crusher says:

"Porter says:

"In all the comics I have seen, I have never seen Thor without his Hammer. Without his hammer could he still fight his enemies and win as he did with his hammer? Also another question is now that Thor has the Odinforce, can he fly, shoot energy beams, manipulate matter and energy, transmute and do many more things WITHOUT his hammer? Thanks"

Thor with out his hammer doesn't make to much of a difference. When he fought captain america and he had no powers what so ever he beat him in a fight. Thor can use all of his orginal powers but now on a higher level. The odin force could basically do anything he wishes like even create his own galaxy if need be. The transmuting thing and matter manipulation he can't with out his hammer but control weather he still can. He also fought loki with out his hammer and beat him pretty bad lol."

Can you show me where Odin actually created a galaxy ? Thats a big feat, beyond even the Celestials or Galactus so I doubt thet the power has that scope. if it did then Odin would not have been fearful of the Celestials ruling that humanity did not deserve to live during the visitation of the Celestial 4th host. In most instances from modern comics (1980's onward)with Odin in, his power has been pretty consistently shown to be less than Galactus or a Celestial."

I'm not gonna go on my computer get the ragnaork issue and post it for you. I don't see a point if i did whats gonna happen?? Your gonna say its probably fan art or you don't believe me. And just because those others haven't done it doesn't mean there not stronger. You just don't know anything about odin is all. When odin fought infinity(his evil counter part) they fought so hard galaxies got destroyed. Odin is called a galaxy buster for a reason. Surtur galaxy buster for a reason. If some one else like methos maybe even gambler asked i would post the whole issue over here or atleast the whole scene cause they would believe me but for you i shall let you go to google and look for it your self. Also how can odin not create a galaxy when he banished and entire galaxy?? How do you think mangog was created?? Odins even been seen teleporting every single being on earth to a limbo dimension."

Destroying is not the same as creating. You stated creating a Galaxy - so let's see it. I don't care about the rest of the info presented. Show us the creation event please. "

I don't care if destroying isn't the same as creating. You wanna see him do this go ask anybody else on the site. They most likely read the issue to. Go to the odin force page as well it states it there as well. Trust me i won't show it to you. Why show it when you won't believe it???"

I will believe it but as usual you sat something and cannot back it up. You offer no logical support for what you say and present as facts and lead others to believe what you say as correct. Post the veidence and prove me wrong. "

How about this i already proved you wrong. One being you don't show evidence and haven't shown evidence yet i have said mine. Two you don't know anything about odin, his feats, as well as the force. I happen to probably know it better then most people on this site. When some one else asks for it i shall show it till then i won't bother to show it to you. Did you see what you said on the other thread?? Don't go by what dc says?? That just gives me more reason. Every one here knows that if i says something like that i can at least if not provide a pic provide the comic book or the issue. You just go by what you want to believe. Either way its not gonna get posted for you."

You cannot show it so admit it.

You put that statement in to you posting about creating a universe and have not evidence to back it up.

Oh no, post it for the other vine members, not for me.

The_Creator says:

"zee crusher says:

"The_Creator says:

"zee crusher says:

"The_Creator says:

"zee crusher says:

"Porter says:

"In all the comics I have seen, I have never seen Thor without his Hammer. Without his hammer could he still fight his enemies and win as he did with his hammer? Also another question is now that Thor has the Odinforce, can he fly, shoot energy beams, manipulate matter and energy, transmute and do many more things WITHOUT his hammer? Thanks"

Thor with out his hammer doesn't make to much of a difference. When he fought captain america and he had no powers what so ever he beat him in a fight. Thor can use all of his orginal powers but now on a higher level. The odin force could basically do anything he wishes like even create his own galaxy if need be. The transmuting thing and matter manipulation he can't with out his hammer but control weather he still can. He also fought loki with out his hammer and beat him pretty bad lol."

Can you show me where Odin actually created a galaxy ? Thats a big feat, beyond even the Celestials or Galactus so I doubt thet the power has that scope. if it did then Odin would not have been fearful of the Celestials ruling that humanity did not deserve to live during the visitation of the Celestial 4th host. In most instances from modern comics (1980's onward)with Odin in, his power has been pretty consistently shown to be less than Galactus or a Celestial."

I'm not gonna go on my computer get the ragnaork issue and post it for you. I don't see a point if i did whats gonna happen?? Your gonna say its probably fan art or you don't believe me. And just because those others haven't done it doesn't mean there not stronger. You just don't know anything about odin is all. When odin fought infinity(his evil counter part) they fought so hard galaxies got destroyed. Odin is called a galaxy buster for a reason. Surtur galaxy buster for a reason. If some one else like methos maybe even gambler asked i would post the whole issue over here or atleast the whole scene cause they would believe me but for you i shall let you go to google and look for it your self. Also how can odin not create a galaxy when he banished and entire galaxy?? How do you think mangog was created?? Odins even been seen teleporting every single being on earth to a limbo dimension."

Destroying is not the same as creating. You stated creating a Galaxy - so let's see it. I don't care about the rest of the info presented. Show us the creation event please. "

I don't care if destroying isn't the same as creating. You wanna see him do this go ask anybody else on the site. They most likely read the issue to. Go to the odin force page as well it states it there as well. Trust me i won't show it to you. Why show it when you won't believe it???"

I will believe it but as usual you sat something and cannot back it up.

You offer no logical support for what you say and present as facts and lead others to believe what you say as correct.

Post the veidence and prove me wrong.

"

How about this i already proved you wrong. One being you don't show evidence and haven't shown evidence yet i have said mine. Two you don't know anything about odin, his feats, as well as the force. I happen to probably know it better then most people on this site. When some one else asks for it i shall show it till then i won't bother to show it to you. Did you see what you said on the other thread?? Don't go by what dc says?? That just gives me more reason. Every one here knows that if i says something like that i can at least if not provide a pic provide the comic book or the issue. You just go by what you want to believe. Either way its not gonna get posted for you.

According to to the Official Handbook of the Marvel Universe (Deluxe Edition) "Odin is not omniscient, nor can he create life from nothingness, travel through time unaided, read thoughts, teleport himself (except interdimensionally), or move worlds." As for Thor, he has been known to battle the Hulk on more than one occasion even without his hammer or the Odinforce. Although Thor has been shown "summoning lighting" without his hammer, I don't know if this is an actually ability of Thor. Certainly Thor never displayed this power in the first decades after his creation as a character. All references to Thor's hammer state that the hammer gives any wielder the power to control lighting & storms. It does not state that it allows Thor to focus any powers inherent in him. (unless I missed another source)

The_Creator says:

"zee crusher says:

"The_Creator says:

"zee crusher says:

"The_Creator says:

"zee crusher says:

"The_Creator says:

"zee crusher says:

"Porter says:

"In all the comics I have seen, I have never seen Thor without his Hammer. Without his hammer could he still fight his enemies and win as he did with his hammer? Also another question is now that Thor has the Odinforce, can he fly, shoot energy beams, manipulate matter and energy, transmute and do many more things WITHOUT his hammer? Thanks"

Thor with out his hammer doesn't make to much of a difference. When he fought captain america and he had no powers what so ever he beat him in a fight. Thor can use all of his orginal powers but now on a higher level. The odin force could basically do anything he wishes like even create his own galaxy if need be. The transmuting thing and matter manipulation he can't with out his hammer but control weather he still can. He also fought loki with out his hammer and beat him pretty bad lol."

Can you show me where Odin actually created a galaxy ? Thats a big feat, beyond even the Celestials or Galactus so I doubt thet the power has that scope. if it did then Odin would not have been fearful of the Celestials ruling that humanity did not deserve to live during the visitation of the Celestial 4th host. In most instances from modern comics (1980's onward)with Odin in, his power has been pretty consistently shown to be less than Galactus or a Celestial."

I'm not gonna go on my computer get the ragnaork issue and post it for you. I don't see a point if i did whats gonna happen?? Your gonna say its probably fan art or you don't believe me. And just because those others haven't done it doesn't mean there not stronger. You just don't know anything about odin is all. When odin fought infinity(his evil counter part) they fought so hard galaxies got destroyed. Odin is called a galaxy buster for a reason. Surtur galaxy buster for a reason. If some one else like methos maybe even gambler asked i would post the whole issue over here or atleast the whole scene cause they would believe me but for you i shall let you go to google and look for it your self. Also how can odin not create a galaxy when he banished and entire galaxy?? How do you think mangog was created?? Odins even been seen teleporting every single being on earth to a limbo dimension."

Destroying is not the same as creating. You stated creating a Galaxy - so let's see it. I don't care about the rest of the info presented. Show us the creation event please. "

I don't care if destroying isn't the same as creating. You wanna see him do this go ask anybody else on the site. They most likely read the issue to. Go to the odin force page as well it states it there as well. Trust me i won't show it to you. Why show it when you won't believe it???"

I will believe it but as usual you sat something and cannot back it up. You offer no logical support for what you say and present as facts and lead others to believe what you say as correct. Post the veidence and prove me wrong. "

How about this i already proved you wrong. One being you don't show evidence and haven't shown evidence yet i have said mine. Two you don't know anything about odin, his feats, as well as the force. I happen to probably know it better then most people on this site. When some one else asks for it i shall show it till then i won't bother to show it to you. Did you see what you said on the other thread?? Don't go by what dc says?? That just gives me more reason. Every one here knows that if i says something like that i can at least if not provide a pic provide the comic book or the issue. You just go by what you want to believe. Either way its not gonna get posted for you."

You cannot show it so admit it.

You put that statement in to you posting about creating a universe and have not evidence to back it up.

Oh no, post it for the other vine members, not for me.

"

Wow you try so hard to prove nothing. First of all i said galaxy not universe. Odin can banish entire galaxys and create or destroy them but only the ones he created he can destroy. Also if its not on marvel.com then you won't believe it i won't bother to post the pic up for you reason being you won't believe me. Please you thinking i can't show it is gonna make me post it please your so eager at home thinking you will make me post it. Your not worthy the time of me finding it i have over 600 thor pics on photobucket. I won't bother with looking for them for you.

Zee is pwned again.

And WTF is this?

zee crusher says:

When odin fought infinity(his evil counter part) "

Infinity is not evil or a counterpart of Odin. And in the handbook Odin's powerlevel is described as a tiny sliver compared to Infinity's.

You just make up sh*t constantly.

Shaper says:

"fesak says:

"Zee is pwned again. And WTF is this? zee crusher says:

When odin fought infinity(his evil counter part) "

Infinity is not evil or a counterpart of Odin. And in the handbook Odin's powerlevel is described as a tiny sliver compared to Infinity's. You just make up sh*t constantly. "

Didn't odin get his odinforce power from inifinity? Like he absorbed some of her power and he gained odin force. Right?"

Yes. And it's described as a tiny sliver of Infinity's powers in the Infinity entry in the handbook.

Please stop the quote wars.

LMAO! Whats even funnier about that last post, is Zee has no idea how foolish he sounds.

Thank you. Oh and do you know what issue it was?
Post Edited:2008-03-13 08:29:54

fesak says:

"Zee is pwned again. And WTF is this? zee crusher says:

When odin fought infinity(his evil counter part) "

Infinity is not evil or a counterpart of Odin. And in the handbook Odin's powerlevel is described as a tiny sliver compared to Infinity's. You just make up sh*t constantly. "

Didn't odin get his odinforce power from inifinity? Like he absorbed some of her power and he gained odin force. Right?

POHOCOM says:

"According to to the Official Handbook of the Marvel Universe (Deluxe Edition) "Odin is not omniscient, nor can he create life from nothingness, travel through time unaided, read thoughts, teleport himself (except interdimensionally), or move worlds." As for Thor, he has been known to battle the Hulk on more than one occasion even without his hammer or the Odinforce. Although Thor has been shown "summoning lighting" without his hammer, I don't know if this is an actually ability of Thor. Certainly Thor never displayed this power in the first decades after his creation as a character. All references to Thor's hammer state that the hammer gives any wielder the power to control lighting & storms. It does not state that it allows Thor to focus any powers inherent in him. (unless I missed another source)"

zee crusher says:

"The_Creator says:

"zee crusher says:

"The_Creator says:

"zee crusher says:

"The_Creator says:

"zee crusher says:

"The_Creator says:

"zee crusher says:

"Porter says:

"In all the comics I have seen, I have never seen Thor without his Hammer. Without his hammer could he still fight his enemies and win as he did with his hammer? Also another question is now that Thor has the Odinforce, can he fly, shoot energy beams, manipulate matter and energy, transmute and do many more things WITHOUT his hammer? Thanks"

Thor with out his hammer doesn't make to much of a difference. When he fought captain america and he had no powers what so ever he beat him in a fight. Thor can use all of his orginal powers but now on a higher level. The odin force could basically do anything he wishes like even create his own galaxy if need be. The transmuting thing and matter manipulation he can't with out his hammer but control weather he still can. He also fought loki with out his hammer and beat him pretty bad lol."

Can you show me where Odin actually created a galaxy ? Thats a big feat, beyond even the Celestials or Galactus so I doubt thet the power has that scope. if it did then Odin would not have been fearful of the Celestials ruling that humanity did not deserve to live during the visitation of the Celestial 4th host. In most instances from modern comics (1980's onward)with Odin in, his power has been pretty consistently shown to be less than Galactus or a Celestial."

I'm not gonna go on my computer get the ragnaork issue and post it for you. I don't see a point if i did whats gonna happen?? Your gonna say its probably fan art or you don't believe me. And just because those others haven't done it doesn't mean there not stronger. You just don't know anything about odin is all. When odin fought infinity(his evil counter part) they fought so hard galaxies got destroyed. Odin is called a galaxy buster for a reason. Surtur galaxy buster for a reason. If some one else like methos maybe even gambler asked i would post the whole issue over here or atleast the whole scene cause they would believe me but for you i shall let you go to google and look for it your self. Also how can odin not create a galaxy when he banished and entire galaxy?? How do you think mangog was created?? Odins even been seen teleporting every single being on earth to a limbo dimension."

Destroying is not the same as creating. You stated creating a Galaxy - so let's see it. I don't care about the rest of the info presented. Show us the creation event please. "

I don't care if destroying isn't the same as creating. You wanna see him do this go ask anybody else on the site. They most likely read the issue to. Go to the odin force page as well it states it there as well. Trust me i won't show it to you. Why show it when you won't believe it???"

I will believe it but as usual you sat something and cannot back it up. You offer no logical support for what you say and present as facts and lead others to believe what you say as correct. Post the veidence and prove me wrong. "

How about this i already proved you wrong. One being you don't show evidence and haven't shown evidence yet i have said mine. Two you don't know anything about odin, his feats, as well as the force. I happen to probably know it better then most people on this site. When some one else asks for it i shall show it till then i won't bother to show it to you. Did you see what you said on the other thread?? Don't go by what dc says?? That just gives me more reason. Every one here knows that if i says something like that i can at least if not provide a pic provide the comic book or the issue. You just go by what you want to believe. Either way its not gonna get posted for you."

You cannot show it so admit it. You put that statement in to you posting about creating a universe and have not evidence to back it up. Oh no, post it for the other vine members, not for me. "

Wow you try so hard to prove nothing. First of all i said galaxy not universe. Odin can banish entire galaxys and create or destroy them but only the ones he created he can destroy. Also if its not on marvel.com then you won't believe it i won't bother to post the pic up for you reason being you won't believe me. Please you thinking i can't show it is gonna make me post it please your so eager at home thinking you will make me post it. Your not worthy the time of me finding it i have over 600 thor pics on photobucket. I won't bother with looking for them for you."

I would believe virtually any source at this point but your lack of ability to show any leads to 1 conclusion - it was a lie.

As for making a mistake and saying Universe in place of Galaxy - that's my mistake but then I was running last to a meeting.

So I'll ask 1 final time for you to show the vine community that what you said was not a lie - post the god damn evidence to back up your statement.

zee crusher says:

"I'm not gonna go on my computer get the ragnaork issue and post it for you. I don't see a point if i did whats gonna happen?? Your gonna say its probably fan art or you don't believe me. And just because those others haven't done it doesn't mean there not stronger. You just don't know anything about odin is all. When odin fought infinity(his evil counter part) they fought so hard galaxies got destroyed. Odin is called a galaxy buster for a reason. Surtur galaxy buster for a reason. If some one else like methos maybe even gambler asked i would post the whole issue over here or atleast the whole scene cause they would believe me but for you i shall let you go to google and look for it your self. Also how can odin not create a galaxy when he banished and entire galaxy?? How do you think mangog was created?? Odins even been seen teleporting every single being on earth to a limbo dimension."

I dont remember seeing that issue. Can you post those images for me? Just where it stated that he created a galaxy.

@the_creator: He never destroy one