Back in 2011 in good faith I bought many New52 titles. The one that excited me the most was the relaunch of Action Comics, and Superman titles. It felt big, bold, and new! I was all in for a younger, more modern version of Superman. I loved what Grant Morrison did with him in Action Comics. Not so much the sloppy start given to him in the Superman book.

Fast forward to Rebirth and DC decided to effectively give the finger to all those fans that stuck with them and the New 52 relaunch. Especially those that loved the Superman universe. They decided to kill the New 52 Superman and bring back the guy from the preFlashpoint universe, and with an annoying ass kid at that! Yep, the same Superman that had decided to take a walk around earth not too long before Flashpoint.

To add insult to injury, right now (the way I see it and feel), we gotta watch how Dan Jurgens and other writers have to dumb down and kill the New52 version of Lois Lane, Lana Lang, Steel, Perry White, Jimmy Olsen and all those left overs from the New52 version of things, in order fit in the preFlashpoint Superman, his plucky wife and annoying ass son.

I've yet to see Aquaman, Flash, Cyborg, Batman, Wonder Woman (who is now back with Steve T.) and many others, properly MOURN and feel the death of their one true team mate. You know, the guy that was key for them to form the JL!! Instead they have all just casually brushed off the death of New 52 Superman and conveniently accepted that there's a new Superman around, from another alternate universe.

It's a fine mess and DC is making a lot of money off of it! Surely I'm not alone in this.

I can't count myself as a fan of Rebirth, but we just need to wait and see because at some point sales will decrease and Dc get more money hunger so the New52 Supes come back for the guys who liked him.

Ah I do love seeing EW52 fans drown in their unmanly tears spewing the most closed-minded nonsense under the assumption they speak for everybody when the truth is they don't and never will.

Superdad isn't from an alternate reality...if you'd read any page of Rebirth, you would know it's the same universe as Pre-Flashpoint only with ten years stolen, and that N52 Lois and Clark were not who they appeared to be.

Diana doesn't mourn the guy all that much because she's become aware of these changes to reality and they're slowly driving her insane (she's going to be in a mental ward in future issues of her own comic), also the JL have not always been embracing of him, Batman has been slightly untrustworthy of Clark since day one of the Rebirth era and that is steadily influencing Jon's relationship with Damien as well.

If the N52 Superman ever made any money, they wouldn't have gotten rid of him.

Superdad's where it's at, he's finally being written well, and the fans have embraced him. The sales success cannot be dismissed just because he isn't what you want from the character.

@zariusii: Don't you think that's kind of a harsh retort. The guy's allowed to love a character and be peeved when that said character is no longer around. I myself and warming up to the returning Superman, but I was a big fan of the new 52 myself and was super bummed when he died. I loved his relationship with Diana and felt it was cut way too short. Not to mention, I find Rebirth both confusing and a severe lack of connection between the characters at times. I understand this will progress as the stories come out, but you got to admit the DC Universe is a bit all over the place right now, and not making a whole lot of sense although the new stories are still entertaining.

All in all there were some good qualities about the N52 Superman, which I and may who were a fan of him will miss, and not everyone has to jump for joy because Superdad is back.

So let the man have his rant.

Wait New 52 Jimmy and Perry are dead?

If you loved Morrisons Action you should love the current Superman book, Tomasi and Gleason have been Morrisonists for years. If you loved that Superman because he was edgy,dated WW, didn't have a relationship with Lois etc then suffice to say you'll never get anything like that ever again and therefore you should stop reading Superman and hoping for a direction like that as that thing was never Superman, that's NOT Superman.

The New-52 was an editorial driven experiment, he was created precisely to pander to the crowd that hates Superman. Think it's coincidence that the same Tomasi who wrote the terrible Superman/Wonder Woman series is knocking it out of the park with Superman? why? what changed? I'll tell you, it's because he has a direction, however in the entire Nu-52 era the only direction came from the editorial and it was something like "make him edge, make him not boring, shake up everything", for a writer these instructions are a nightmare and I wouldn't at all be surprised if New-52 Superman was offed for the writers benefit.

@entropy_aegis said:

Man, I don't think I've ever seen a post on the vine with so much 100% truth from beginning to end. Thank you sir for saying the things I've been wanting to say to every person whining about the garbage that was the Nu52 Superman.

It doesn't matter. There's going to be another reboot years from now. There's ALWAYS a reboot and there always will be one. That's never going to end.

@enzo991: Haha thanks.

You guys wanna blame anybody, blame DC for making N52 Supes unlikeable and crapping on his powerset. He was also an artificial creation. I would not be surprised if he was Superboy Prime related

@blackdog2009 said:

Isn't Superman basically selling average right now, as per usual? What is this stuff about Superman comics being good again? Action Comics is trash, Chinese Superman & Friends was irredeemable garbage, and Superman is the only one that doesn't seem to outright suck.

What exactly, is the difference to early New 52?

Mistaking your opinion and subjective tastes for gospel truth again? How droll..

No, he still sells better than the New 52 titles. From the whole of n52's history, only Morrison's run sold better. Currently the Rebirth SUPERMAN title is around 70K, and ACTION around 60K. 8 issues in! While also being amazing digital sellers based on comixology rankings.

But success isn't only about sales, critical reception matters even more. RED SON sold only 30K when it came out, now it is Superman's best selling hardcover. Considering the lines good critical reception its safe to estimate that they will be good hardcover sellers in the future, and lasting weapons in Superman's repertoire.

While you many not like NEW SUPERMAN. Its very well reviewed, with an average of 7.9/10, same as SUPERGIRL. SUPERWOMAN and AC have a 7.5/10. And SUPERMAN has an average of....8.6/10. Which no other title even get near, even All STAR SUPERMAN.

And we have to give to REBIRTH that they took a risky and admirable approach with the line. They decided to strengthen it with new titles and new characters, rather than deconstruct and play safe.

New 52 has in its back only four titles, two of them that got cancelled due to low sales and bad reception (Supergirl and Superboy), the later one even created so much damage to the character, that they decided to drop him all-together. Superman was unsolvable since the beginning, Action Comics was the only title with its ups and downs, but even that at the end of the day was no-good.

Nope. They are fine and well :P

Seriously? Rebirth is one of the best things to happen to Superman in recent years.

I personally think Jurgens is a dated writer, and i'm not the biggest fan of his current Action run. However, Tomasi is killing it on Superman. It's honestly the best post-crisis Superman run in years, as well as being the best Superman title in general since Morrison tackled n52 Superman.

I miss the days of watching the new 52 Superman fans squabble among each other trying to figure out why SuperEdgelord was failing so hard on every level (typically blaming it on Batmans popularity)

those were some hilarious days

Further proof of great interest in Superman and Son

• 1. Batman #10
• 2. Superman #10
• 3. Justice League #8
• 4. Avengers #1
• 5. Unworthy Thor #1
• 6. The Walking Dead #160
• 7. Green Lanterns #10
• 8. Nightwing #8
• 9. Green Arrow #10
• 10. Animosity #3

Comment From Comic Store Owners:

DC takes seven of our store’s top ten, with Superman topping Batman this week (fan interest in Jonathan Kent & Damian Wayne is extremely high, apparently!).

Drink it in Man ^_^

@zariusii: there's gonna be a lot of salt soon

Plz note though that BC store sample isn't particularly large and cant really be considered representative. However the appearence of Batman and Robin plus the Super Sons prologue factor may well have given Supes a boost. In contrast Batman is getting a meh response and the writer pissed off a large fanbase,so taking these factors in to account Supes may really have come close to beating Bats this week.

Sales are holding steady at good numbers, critical reception is consistently good, the fan praise on forums and social media especially for the Superman title has never been higher with any Superman comics. That's positive proof that the Superman Rebirth status quo is working. New 52 Superman was in turn a middle finger to the fans who had been reading Superman comics for years. It didn't help that editorial interference, repetitive crossover events and inconsistent characterisation ruined any chance of New 52 Superman settling into the role. Convergence was the testing ground for DC to see whether fans wanted the old Superman back and the high sales for the Convergence Superman tie in led to the Pre Flashpoint Superman coming back and regaining his title. If there weren't problems we wouldn't be where we are right now.

@entropy_aegis: Of course the age old comic business principle of putting Batman in anything increases sales numbers. Still, it's heartening that we may get to see a Superman comic come close to beating the Batman comics.

you know what screw your "opinion"

Not taking sides here, but I've seen more than a few of your comments, and what you posted is exactly what you yourself do in practically every post where you trash-talk the New-52.

I disagre, Rebirth made superman likeable again for the first time in over a decade.

@lvenger: Now if only King could get the memo.

@zariusii said:

Again? Have we met before? I don't think so, because I usually remember resident a**holes on these forums.

@squalleon: OK, thank you.

Sorry Rebirth era Superman was the best thing that happened to the Superman franchise in years. New 52 Superman franchise was filled with pointless mediocre crossovers. The only time I liked New 52 Superman stuff was Geoff Johns run and the last arc in new 52 Superman. The Superdad approach is my favorite version of Superman because I love when Superheroes get this feeling of teaching young ones and passing down their mantle to their successor which it feels like. Jon is really likable and shows why youngsters are a cool thing in comics.

Superwoman got me liking new 52 Lois Lane than her many appearances in the new 52 and she only appeared in 1 Superwoman issue.

@handofprometheus: Lois getting killed in the 1st issue of Superwoman was very much predictable and on point with the current systematic deletion of everything New52 . Quite a slap to the face to all the fans that liked that Lois. Lana is next, so is Steel. I'm surprised New52 Jimmy and Perry are still around. Don't get me started on the blank-Clark Kent running around. Like I said. It's a fine mess!

They do seem stuck with Lex Luthor though. It's a shame that Geoff Johns handled New52 Superman and Lex so well in the pages of JL . Now Lex is stuck dealing with a guy that is not his Superman. That's the next story arc though. Like I said, very systematic.

@blackdog2009: Lois is one thing (cuz there was two and now Superman's wife gets the spot back), but it's doubtful that Lana would get killed too. She's been showing up in other comics and her story really just started. The comic saying she's slowly dying now kinda gives it away that she'll more than likely survive

i just find it hilarious how they are going about things. the new 52 was supposed to get new readers to jump in, clean up the whole multiverse confusion and get everyone back on the same page. They didn't make it very far before introducing the multiverse, and as you can see now they realized their mistakes, "this wally doesn't seem very likable, lets bring the other one back

and the superman was the icing on the cake. It reminded me of beerfest where Landfill's identical twin brother shows up after he dies, takes his place, and requests to be called the same name to carry on his honor lol.

they don't have a handle on their sh*t

earth 2 green lantern brought up the Oan's even though his ring wasn't created by them.

Krypto who i thought was the original one that came with superman is apparently the new 52 one, he just happens to be drawn like the classic one now, just because.

dc is in this weird phase right now where they keep making randon changes that stand out and you just have to sit back and enjoy the ride.

1. I love how you still don't get it. Hell, you probably CHOOSE not to "get it". That IS his Superman. PF-Clark is not from an alternate reality, he's the real deal. Let go of your man-crush on the objective failure that was N52 Superman and realise that's where the story is leading. Rebirth DC is Pre-Flashpoint with ten years taken and reality, relationships and characters all bent out of shape at the whim of a god-like force in the form of Doctor Manhattan. Lois and Clark were outside of time when N52 was created (see Convergence), so doubles of them were produced instead. That's N52 Superman and Lois whether you care to admit it or not.

2. Nobody liked N52 Lois. She was routinely criticised for minimal development and likeability even well before Truth made her outright loathed. Don't pretend she had a majority of fans just to feed your contrarian agenda.

3. Lana is not getting killed off, because chances are she's the real Lana, as is Steel.

What you ignorantly see as a "fine mess", I see as a fine story being told with twists and unpredictable turns, but no, all you see is your edgelord lore being ruined, when Superman should never have been about that.

@zariusii: is there a way to see digital sales? Really interested to see how they look.

I wouldn't know where to look for them. Marvel guys have always said nobody factors those sales in with their books either.

Anyone who's mad about the death of the New52 Superman is in the minority. New 52 Superman is boring and his character is pretty stale. But PreFlashpoint Superman is better but still kinda bland and he seems different. Especially with the fact that he was able to concieve a child with Lois Lane when that was said to be impossible in the preFlashpoint continunity

Whether you're a fan of the switch or not, I'll agree that it's bothersome how comic book deaths barely register a blip now.

N52 superman and Lois were garbage, I remember dropping action comics and superman quickly. I never knew n52 Lois had a fan base either.As far I'm concern , she was annoying, stupidly unlikable , and boring.

It's nice to see rebirth superman doing amazing in sales and quality stories.

I appreciate you cry baby, you being disgruntled is heartwarming. Mate, you're on the losing end....

I'm struggling to remember much support for New 52 Lois. When her fanbase did talk about that version, it was usually to complain that she was being written poorly or that she was underdeveloped and not doing enough. Now at least we have a Lois Lane who is a prominent part of the Superman cast and is involved more in the story.

There wasn't any.

Fans of N52 Superman hated her, because a. Shipped Superman with Wonder Woman or b. Shipped Superman with someone else. And the Pre-52 fans hated her portrayal too. No one liked N52 Lois Lane.

I'd say they were more disappointed rather than hated New 52 Lois but otherwise agreed. Making the Pre Flashpoint Lois the only Lois Lane was a much better move even if it creates continuity problems for uninitiated new fans. This Lois is more appealing to both Superman and Lois Lane fans, at least most of them except for those who don't seem to like Lois period.

Meantime I see the desperate minority S/WW 'shippers are still trying to keep their respect thread going, even if Diana has long since admitted her crush on Supes was just an easy fling and is actually working on a real relationship with Steve.

i actually liked the new 52 superman. however, i agree with you on one point. that editorial meddling was just dumb. it helped kill superman.

@christianrapper: Editorial was the biggest problem with New 52 Superman, they made too many events and didn't know what the hell to do with this version of Superman. Hell New 52 Superman's death was kinda meta if the Kryptonite poisoning resembles Superman's event fatigue.

@blackdog2009:

DC was obviously thinking about the numbers, nothing else. Instead of fixing things they went the easy way, and went back to what already in the past lead to the reboot.

But then again if we go by the numbers, then as you can see at Comichron data base of montly sales, and you'll see that in the 5 months since the start of Rebirth the numbers have been going down consistently. Superman related comics aren't currently even at the top 10.

Let's look at the sales numbers and position of the comics in the top 50, in August:

Superman position 20. And Action Comics position 32.

This in August. DC was only 5.13% ahead of Marvel.

Now let's take a look at September.

Superman position 18. Action Comics position 36.

So still with a 5% difference but already going down.

This in only 5 months. The official numbers of October aren't available yet, but I wouldn't be surprised if things went down again.

Also we got to take into attention that Marvel is going through a tough time, seeing that this Civil War move, but more the fact that they've been messing around a lot with the main titles, as been helping DC, a lot. Once they get their sh*t together, DC lead will most likely disappear in a heartbeat.

So in June Marvel ahead of DC in about 9% sales, in July DC took the lead in about 1%, so there was a obvious increase in sales, but that increase after the third month is already going down.

But selling numbers aside if we look at just DC and the position Superman related titles are in, they've consistently dropped. Even in DC, Superman related titles aren't the one's selling the most.

I guess the question, the real question is... How long before the hype totally goes away and DC gives the middle finger to current Rebirth fans and reboots the entire thing all over again?

If Marvel gets its house in order, and DC continues to deliver the past sold as new, then Rebirth lifespan will be short indeed.

I'm with you bro. Supes bratty son is a annoyance, and Lois is her typical big mouth in your face a$$.

Hopefully one of his can put down his son and Lois die in an accident.

So far, Marvel's new "Now" early relaunch books have been a bust, but that may change with the new titles this week, in particular the ones with the new Iron Man and their own answer to Superdad, as they have now made Spider-Man's marriage a priority again. Even if it is just an alternate reality book currently, it may become actual canon next year, the dire Dan Slott seems to be bringing his own plot threads to a close in the main ASM book (which Superman still does much better than), and they've teased reverting the OMD storyline all year.

How mature of you. Stay "classy" Edgelord, I'm glad people like you don't currently have your way.