There his best durable feats:

PC superman back the big bang before:

PC superman powering through the mass of entire creation and its gravity,in the dawn of creation,the gravity,mass,pressure,all was nearly-infinite(from wiki)

where is PC superman?he subjected big bang,they are even dont belive PC superman can take this,they are belive superman was death

so,PC superman death?no,he inside the big bang itself(this moment,universe was formed by dawn of creation)and destroy CENTRAL pyrimid

but when PC superman destroy pyrimid,he triggered a wave of energy that made him vanish from the universe and that made every hero disappear from the universe alongside with him,Superman still exist,PC superman not only took a Physical explosion, even immune to time manipulation

that best PC superman durable feats,even beyond skyfather levels

Makes you wonder how Lex Luthor was relevant.

@awesam: eh..what?

@awesam: Kryptonite.

If only K Nevermore occurred earlier during that age...

@ssejllenrad said:

@darkknightdetective said:

@awesam: Kryptonite.

If only K Nevermore occurred earlier during that age...

Again.

@awesam: Maybe he asked Batman for his Superman repellent bat-spray?

Pocket Verse Superboy,who far weaker than PC superman:

He channels the energies that could destroy his pocket earth or maybe his pocket Universe

Even on this dying condition He is still capable of time traveling against the manipulation force of TT

How powerful were this energies you might ask?

Well apparently The Time Trapper was actually capable of nullify the effects of the Anti-Monitor anti-matter destruction force of the Infinite Crisis. This means that Pocket Verse Superboy body was capable of channel those energies in order to save his world.

so,he take a energy enough destroy universe

haha gotta agree there :)

Makes you think that supes lost to AM because of PIS when he should be able to singlehandedly solo

2 Supermen did in fact held their own against Anti Monitor for a while and managed to crack their armor.

@killemall: the whole event is full of bull, Pariah survived Crisis (antimatter) but only to get shot by Alex with a regular pistol.

LOL

@powerwoman:These feats are awesome!

@neongamewave: Thanks!

Superboy-Prime did. So I guess PC Superman can too. I just hope they don't make New 52 Superman like SA Superman.

@sandman_: NOpe,SBP never took a big bang,my friend

earth-51 still exist,just without life,SBP not SA superman level,even not close Pocket Verse Superboy level,who far weaker than SA superman

@powerwoman: He did. It was revealed in Legion Of 3 Crisis or whatever the name was. That universe gets rebuilt by the moniter of that universe later on.

@sandman_: The scan clear tell us,is not a big bang,just kill all of the life in the universe ,you can see scan,"rebuilt"doesnt mean anything

we can see scan:

the universe still here,but not life,you can see,even here has shine

you dont need to guess SA superman,read my scan,SA superman take a real big bang,that much better than SBP

@powerwoman147: It doesn't state it was entropy, you are right about that. But its still a universal explosion. Can't we just leave it at that? :/

@sandman_: sure,that was still very powerful feats,sbp took a kill all of the life in the universe explosion

no problem

WTF,what entropy?big bang not entropy

I re-read Final crisis，the earth-51 was destroyed..so.. based on that comic you could argue that, the light shinning on the plant is just residual energy from the big bang.

I'm sorry.I'm wrong@sandman_:

here was rebuilt earth-51 by the moniter

so,I'M just wrong this,monarch really destroy earth-51,SBP durable was close to SA superman

Superman flies at light speed and faster by muscle alone, at trick that requires infinite physical strength, read Elliot Maggins’ two Superwoman Stories, starting with DCCP (DC Annual #2).

That mean,PC superman maybe has infinite muscle strength(well,just a point,for me,I agree)

and I found some scans:superman and supergirl can destroy galaxy without raising a sweat

superman and supergirl take 100 galaxies pound/quasar（a quasar energy more than 1000 galaxies)

Supergirl/Superman support galaxies weight (if he not,earth would be destroyed)and break hold the universe together blackstarr power:

so,blackstarr power is exaggerat ？

Nope,DC prove she power no exaggerate:she power enough control entire universe

PC supergirl fight with COIE AM Origin version,most weakest version and almost kill him,,but how powerful is he?

well.even this just most weakest version COIE AM,he still destroy universe with easily:

Gallery

suprema,PC supergirl another version,but same person:enough lift entire universe weight,scan prove superman/supergirl equal in muscle strength:

Gallery

Add some PC shazam feats:

take Invincible Man,who has BIG BANG itself power:

In the PC,shazam has true invulnerable too,just like PC superman,he was real powerful charater in the pre-crisis,not like PC DS or PC mon-el,shazam family even cant hurt each other,and equal to strength

here,shazam move a oversize star:

shazam family moved planets feats:

shazam family move galaxy and speed feats

mary marvel could exist in a plane where no matter could exist at all--A realm called Infinity, existing outside of the universe. It was completely pitch black, and they were assumed to have died when they went into it, and yet, when we see them were completely fine and conscious.

Well, Anti-Monitor is a multiversal being.

And he was fighting Bronze age Superman, not Silver age, which is the one in the picture.

@logy5000: kinda laughable when people say that SBP is silver age level

@nerx: He isn't, he's Bronze age level.

@logy5000: the nerfed down era where they enter more grit amirite?

@nerx: I wouldn't say nerfed down. It was still a powerful era, but nothing like the Silver ages.

nope,superboy-prime or superman-prime just bronze age level,he feats isnt match SA superman or SA supergirl,read my scan,you can see they are how powerful,Supergirl even can toe with toe fight with COIE AM(though most weakest verson)but still he can easily destroy universe

though,superman-prime could be match PC mon-el power level

The Anti-Monitor that Superboy Prime fought hadn't absorbed a single universe at all. Then one Supergirl fought had already absorbed hundreds of them so Superboy Prime would have died if he did what Supergirl did as Anti-Monitor was much more powerful because he had absorbed hundreds of universes while SCW Anti-Monitor hadn't absorbed even one.

also,Earth 2 Superman defeated an Anti-Monitor who was already severely weakened.earth-2 superman isnt as powerful as sa superman,but if story need,he would be equal to SA superman(DC downplay SA superman)

@logy5000: In fact,Anti Monitor could harm Superman and kill supergirl only because of the different laws in the Anti Matter universe

scan:Elsewhere he is all-powerful, unstoppable, and invulnerable. But here. . .

SA superman and SA supergirl was crazy powerful,I think here most people know it,but,SA superman true power level should be more and more crazy

http://www.comicvine.com/superman/4005-1807/forums/is-superman-s-build-a-result-of-earths-yellow-sun-1458066/#46

you can read my some research

Silver age:,any kryptonian was equal to superman on the earth,and superman no more experience than them,a female kryptonian also equal to male krytonian in strength,speed,etc,any kryptonian was true Invulnerability,they are cant hurt each other

Bronze Age level:superman has more experience than other kryptonians,and a superman could be stronger than superwoman just like man stronger than woman,any kryptonian no more true invunlnerability,yes,if you has enough power,you can hurt them

but even BA superman far weaker than SA superman,he still survives the Big Bang at point blank range, gets to light speed (or faster) by strength alone - a feat requiring infinite strength, btw - survives inside black holes, closes black holes, flies fast enough to break out of the multiverse into Heaven, and KO's Mxyptlyk's more powerful cousin with a casual backhand smack.I forgot he once yelled at several billion decibels. If you figure out how much energy that would require you'll see it's a lot more than is contained in a single universe.

superboy-prime best feats,I think he not as powerful as Pocket Verse Superboy,who can take energy enough destroy universe inside his body,moving-planet just Mr. majestic power level,when superboy-prime grow up superman-prime,I dont know，but sbp just move planet and take a galaxy buster,smp can take a big bang,a little too different power level for me

but if smp can take big bang,he would be BA superman power level,also,I dont belive kal kent can take a big bang,He is the biggest overestimated in comicvine

If I may say so, SBP was fighting the AM that had already absorbed almost every universe. But his amp was drained from him, and he was fighting BA Superman & SBP in an extremely weakened state.

@logy5000: he fight with sbp and earth-two old superman,BA superman already k.o by earth-two superman (HUGE downplay BA superman)

the earth-two superman even not close earth-one superman in power level,he just a little bit above pre-52 superman

@logy5000: And exact to say,silver age later period,not Bronze Age,DC creater a new idea,a superman would be stronger than superwoman just like man stronger than woman

and DC downplay invulnerabilitym,that why PC Validus and PC compound superman can ko SA superman in the silver age later period

you can see this,in my some research

http://www.comicvine.com/superman/4005-1807/forums/is-superman-s-build-a-result-of-earths-yellow-sun-1458066/#46

pre crisis superman was insanely powerful, i think the if he wanted he could simply sneeze galactus away! even so i prefer the modern superman to this one

100% right,the comcvine Seriously underestimated SA superman/SA supergirl,because they are never read pre-crisis superman comics,I read it,I never see a charater can just sneeze out solar system,even beyonder,no charater has this feats

SA superman can survives the Big Bang,can lift our entire universe weight,can crossing the distance of entire Universes nearly instantaneously,and true Invulnerability(nothing can hurt him,even other kryptonians)

galactus.... i dont know why a lot people say he was powerful,he best feats just out three solar system(full power)just superman poof three sneeze..if superman more evil,he use his super-breath,one concentrated blast from superman/supergirl mouth is capable of destroying a whole galaxy and if enough as long as hard,i'm sure universe would be end,this not my hyperbole，Just think of SA superman top feats,you would be agree this not kyperbole

Good thread.

I remember somebody on the old dcboards would always mention how Superman only lost to AM because of where they fought.

In physical power, pre-COIE Superman was above multiversal level, and, yes, COIE was a big piece of PIS. But I guess that's a question of execution, right? With the goal of a reboot in mind, to make the story make sense, they just could have made AM even more powerful.

I do not think Silver Age Superman is more powerful than BA Superman. BA Superman has more low showings, but BA Superman, at his best - flying into Heaven, only losing to AM due to location, closing a black hole by flying around it, going FTL and dimension hopping by physical strength alone - is at least as powerful as SA Superman. He lost some power in the "Sand Superman" saga, but, clearly, he got over it, just sometimes some writers forgot that he had.

What I have been wondering - why do so many people on the Internet, on this site, and on comicboards, and some other places, think pre-COIE Darkseid could beat, or has beaten, pre-COIE Superman? DS fought pre-COIE Superboy briefly under a red sun, when pre-COIE Superboy had only HighFather's borrowed power and DS had stolen power from TimeTrapper, Mordru, Excalibur, and a ton of artifacts. DS has nasty tech, like the tech that helped take out Anti Monitor, but in a fist fight with pre-COIE Superman, or pre-COIE Supergirl, he has no chance at all.

The PC superman/supergirl could be strong enough lift entire universe weight,tanking big bang for a long time,crossing the distance of entire Universes nearly instantaneously,i dont know he or she should be put what level,but " multiversal level"is just too much for them...above universe level is more reasonable

PC DS isnt powerful,when PC DS fight with PC orion both even not blow out a planet,Pulsar Stargrave power is just a sun.so he can beat superman is PIS,Vartox ,Omega Darkseid,Mongul four of them just fight with BA superman not SA superman,and when mongul beat superman,some issue a missile can kill superman.Validus,all power at once can destroy a city.i dont know why dc make he beat superman.

my point it is,in the PC,fight feats logic cant work,because PC superman has a lot of low feats,vartox or omega or mon-el or ultra boy they are not kryptonian ,so they are physical body is different,unless each other has feats to prove they are really equal to PC superman/supergirl,but if you read Pre-crisis comic book,they are not has such feats to match PC superman,What can I say,like Composite Superman says he was three time stronger than PC superman ,and mon-el/ultar boy best strength feats just moved a moon,which even pre-52 superman can do it

the BA superman has good feats i know,read my point,in fact i'm not says BA superman is "weak",i say BA is different.if you read SA comic book.you could be found they are not same thing,like

BA superman has more experience than other kryptonians,in the SA,he not

BA superman could be stronger than a superwoman just like a man stronger than woman.Throughout much, if not most, of the Silver Age (i.e. the 1960s) Kryptonians were accorded the same strength levels one to another.You'll find an exception or two, but they generally did NOT take into account gender or even size differences.

BA superman/kryptonians not true Invulnerability,back Silver age, they are cant hurt each other,that why i say BA superman is "weaker" than SA superman

at least BA supergirl is "weaker" than SA supergirl

@precrisisflea: I'm lose a charater,the PC shazam,you can see his feats,he best strength feat is moved a star,yes,that can put him on the superman medium power level

only shazam can match PC superman,even just medium level,other charater isnt has enough feats to prove each other,like PC Bizarro or Pc MON-el PC ultar boy

@powerwoman: I agree that Captain Marvel is at low/medium level Superman strength, pre-COIE. I don't think that Kara is weaker in BA than SA. Look what she did to Anti Monitor, in a universe where her powers don't really work.

I think that the low showings are best explained as PIS or as holding back.

@precrisisflea: I'm tell you in the before,my point is not"BA weaker than SA"

Nope,but,yes,i'm says BA is weaker than SA,

the BA superman can tanking big bang,but he not true Invulnerability,if you has enough power you can hurt him,but back the Silver age,nothing can hurt him,even other kryptonians,they are cant hurt each other

i dont says BA superman is "weaker"than Sa SUperman,i says they are different

1,BA superman not true invulnerability,SA superman it is

2,in the Silver age late/BA,dc creater a new idea,a man kryptonian could be stronger than woman kryptonian,in the before,silver age,no

3,superman has more skills/more experience than other kryptonians,in the before,he's not

4,BA superman isnt has PIS's power,in the silver age,he was overpowered,beat anyone,but in the BA,a lot of street charater beat him

you can see,only 1 and 4 is make BA superman weaker than SA superman,2 and 3 just highlight the uniqueness of Superman,superman has more experience than other kryptonians,so he could be beat other kryptonians,superman could be stronger than supergirl just like man stronger than woman,that weaken supergirl highlight the uniqueness of Superman too,that why in the infinite crisis ,dc kill supergirl,not just make supergirl weaken they are kill supergirl,highlight the uniqueness of Superman

@precrisisflea:

Fair to say，in the pre-crisis,shazam family each other is equal in strength,and cant hurt each other

they are is true invulnerability too

but they are never tanking big bang or something to prove they are invulnerability limit,i cant just because a charater is true invulnerability so he can tanking Multiverse explosion？!no

so,yes,by the feats,PC superman is more true invulnerability than shazam

BA supergirl is weaker than SA supergirl, at least since 1968s-1972s,DC make supergirl is weaker than superman(same time wonder woman no any super-power)

i dont know what happened in the 1968s-1972s.i'm also dont know what happened in the DC,but i know,this is male chauvinism,It is very bad to me.Even a comic, Ignoring the laws of physics, fantasy story still stressed male chauvinism in the 1968s-1972s

http://www.comicvine.com/wonder-woman/4050-18525/

1968s-1972s,wonder woman no any super-power

http://www.comicvine.com/adventure-comics/4050-3105/

http://www.comicvine.com/adventure-comics-368-the-mutiny-of-the-super-heroi/4000-114931/

since 1968s,supergirl is weaker than superman,untill 1972s

I swear to God, you don't like read adventure comics supergirl 1968s-1972s,is just disgusting pictures and boring story

@powerwoman: LOL you are claiming superman survived big bang by giving a scan which shows that he CAN'T

Superman was vanished / erased from existance. He was brough back by hope and beliefs of people like a story of fairy tales. These 2 things are stated in your scans.

However since big bang was destroyed as well thus i say superman = universsal but Not above universal.

Your reading into it. Superman started to appear before they began believing. the writer just made the ending seem as though it was a dire end but then they realized it wasn't so they all were in the moment with hope. the point being he was already coming back when they noticed, their belief was simply confirmed. the writer wrote from their perspective.

I think these writers are taking some ideas from the Pc days :)

He cant not because big bang too powerful,read it,its because time get change

@rago_beyblader: Also,Superman-prime withstand big bang too,he just only on the bronze age superman level

SA>>>>>>>>>>>BA

If sbp could do that,why superman cant?

However,i agree with that points,PC superman is universsal but Not above universal

@powerwoman: Thought Prime killed PC superman ?