SDCC 2014: Evangeline Lilly & Corey Stoll on Ant-Man

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capcoolcat

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Interesting that Hope's last name is Van Dyne.. I am still excited for this film. I just hope we see young Hank and young Janet in flashbacks.. I need Jan!

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HexThis

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One thing I absolutely hate on these boards is the horrible fanboyism of the comic 'purists'. If it means that the final product functions better as a film, then by all means change the source material around, different mediums have different ways to succeed.

I don't know if it's puritanical fanboyism, I more associate that with people who complain about how Heath Ledger's Joker didn't have Joker venom or whether or not Spider-man's webshooters should be natural or invention. Petty crap like that is fanboyism to me. But, in this case, the legacy of this character they're now deciding to capitalize on is being tampered with in a way that does the intellectual property an injustice. There would be no Ant-Man movie to make if Hank Pym and Janet Van Dyne weren't imagined in the early 60's and really helped to carry that character through the last half-century and beyond. So to drastically change/eliminate them feels like a s--ty thing to do. Do you know what I mean? In a weird way, it's like Janet and Hank get Marvel money as characters, they're a commodity and Marvel is treating that valuable commodity too frivolously.

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marvel_dc_heroes_villains

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@hexthis: I do get that somewhat. However, the MCU is still an entirely separate universe to the 616 in the same way that the Ultimate universe (for example) is, so the changing up/elimination/introduction of characters is bound to happen. You're right in saying the complaints here are less puritanical than for some other movies (my god Batfans, shut up about how much you hate Nolan), but I don't think Hope van Dyne necessarily detracts from the movie or from the comics which are bound to be affected by the film. She's the daughter of Pym so Janet probably still exists and I think the conceit of having a 60s character be from the 60s (Douglas as Pym) whilst a more modern character is younger (Rudd as Lang) is actually pretty smart, continuity-wise.

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marvel_dc_heroes_villains

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Also, and I've posted this in another thread, the least important aspect of an adapted film, especially when the source material is so loose and with so many stories as a long running comic, is its faithfulness. If the script, acting and action are good, then the film is good.

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Night_Raven

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@teerack said:
@avenging_x_bolt said:

@teerack: but when was the the last time was Ant-man long term and not just when Marvel was casually referring to him as such while not using him and actually using the Scott ever since his rebirth. And notice how Hank bops between Ant-Man and Giant-man (the latter if which he had been calling himself since his last "re-inspiration" in the late Heroic Age) has Hank ever definitively been Ant-man? Or is his main attraction just being Hank?

I understand how Hank being aged can piss people off though. Even though I'm fine with it as long as they're okay in the comics.

I would be fine with Hank being Hank in this movie if Hank was the right age and could become Giant Man in a marvel moving down the line like Avengers 3. To me it just comes off as a big "f*** you, you're irrelevant now." to the character.

The real issue that stems form this movie is marvel is obsessed with synergy. This will without a doubt lead to Scott being more prominent in the comics and Hank becoming less relevant.

Hank as it is, is already f**ked out of the universe.

  • House of M - Was a Skrull
  • Civil War - Was a Skrull
  • World War Hulk - His Skrull had pretty much no role
  • Secret Invasion - Fianlly the real Hank is back
  • Dark Reign - He got to make Norman Osborn annoyed in one issue, but didn't really contribute much to the event.
  • Siege - No role
  • Fear Itself - Shows up at the end too late to help. Did have a really cool fight with Adsorbing Man though.
  • Spider-Island - Wasn't in it.
  • Avengers vx X-Men - He got to be a back ground character
  • Age of Ultron - The Hank Pym from the past had a bigger role then the current Hank Pym. :|
  • Infinity - Wasn't even mentioned.
  • Original Sin - Wasn't even mentioned and Scott Lang is a big part of it.

You see how Hank is already hardly around? And at the end you can already see that Marvel is starting to Slide Scott into the world and have him replace him all together. :/

Literally voicing all my worries for Hank :( Really annoying me how Marvel are deciding to force any movie adaptations into the comics.

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Fallschirmjager

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They announced more people left this film including Patrick Wilson lol.

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Teerack

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They announced more people left this film including Patrick Wilson lol.

I'm crossing my fingers that the current plan for this movie will just be scrapped and they can try it all over again.

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Fallschirmjager

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@teerack: This is turn into a pretty epic train wreck. I'm kind of more interested to see it on that premise alone.

Though I feel bad for Pym fans.

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COBRAMORPH

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#60  Edited By COBRAMORPH

Not a fan how Hank is not the main character mainly because IronMan1, Hulk-reboot, Thor1, Avengers1, its one thing having weird super-stuff happen in WW2, cause it was so long ago, but in the movie universe Hank can not have done anything on a major scale because to me the feeling was the Heroic age started in 2008. Have Hank working on his particles & Ultron on his own as a result of the invasion, just like how Tony created IronMan on his own, we dont need him as part of SHIELD or anything before then.

Its just like how XMen DOFP had tons of video footage of mutants, yet Xmen1 gave the appearance the general public didnt know about mutants.

Continuity errors. Shame they came in this early, letalone at all, its not like they havent had 7 years to work out how to adapt pre-existing stories to fix their stupid litle comic book mistakes & to make any changes needed to adapt the film medium.

& instead of Janet as Wasp, we get Hope? As for Yellowjacket, why not just remove Ant-Man entirely, have the movie be about Wasp & make Rita her evil (half-)sister. Rita takes over the father's research, makes a company rivaling Stark, & absorbs that guy's company from IronMan2, but is evil,& eventually Janet, a Paris Hilton type famous for being Hot, or a airhead model bimbo, creates a costume to stop her sister.

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BeholdtheVison

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@hexthis:

@hexthis said:

@marvel_dc_heroes_villains said:

One thing I absolutely hate on these boards is the horrible fanboyism of the comic 'purists'. If it means that the final product functions better as a film, then by all means change the source material around, different mediums have different ways to succeed.

I don't know if it's puritanical fanboyism, I more associate that with people who complain about how Heath Ledger's Joker didn't have Joker venom or whether or not Spider-man's webshooters should be natural or invention. Petty crap like that is fanboyism to me. But, in this case, the legacy of this character they're now deciding to capitalize on is being tampered with in a way that does the intellectual property an injustice. There would be no Ant-Man movie to make if Hank Pym and Janet Van Dyne weren't imagined in the early 60's and really helped to carry that character through the last half-century and beyond. So to drastically change/eliminate them feels like a s--ty thing to do. Do you know what I mean? In a weird way, it's like Janet and Hank get Marvel money as characters, they're a commodity and Marvel is treating that valuable commodity too frivolously.

^This.

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TheManInTheShoe

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Considering not to waste my money anymore

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Teerack

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@teerack: This is turn into a pretty epic train wreck. I'm kind of more interested to see it on that premise alone.

Though I feel bad for Pym fans.

It's a shame to because I feel like it's just going to build resentment for Scott Lang who actually is a really cool dude.

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Sulika

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#64  Edited By Sulika

The Marvel produced movies had started out so well. Iron Man, Captain America, Thor, even the Hulk movies were pretty decent. The Avengers took everything that had been building up to that point and just made it better. They were comic book movies made by comic book fans FOR comic book fans, but they still didn't make people who were not fans feel like they were being left out.

...and then Iron Man 3 came out, and there was just so much that was wrong with it. I didn't even want to look at it, and when I did it was even worse then I imagined it (and I imagined it being pretty bad).

Thor 2 was better, and I hoped that they just slipped a little with IM3. Admittedly I haven't had the chance to watch the second Captain America, but from what I've seen it looks good and I'm eager for the opportunity. Guardians of the Galaxy also has me intrigued.

...but this... "Ant-Man" it's not what we love about Ant-Man. I hope the producers read what the fans are writing about what they've done so far and change it to better fit with the universe and characters that we love.

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goobot

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@teerack said:
@fallschirmjager said:

They announced more people left this film including Patrick Wilson lol.

I'm crossing my fingers that the current plan for this movie will just be scrapped and they can try it all over again.

Oh please!!! Though I doubt that will happen since they seem to far in for that :(

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Spideysense44

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So why are you people mad Edgar left again? isn't he the one who made Pym old?

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marvel_dc_heroes_villains

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@spideysense44: Because they're comic fans. They're always angry about something. And they assume that their personal opinions somehow hold some sway over a multi-billion dollar film franchise.

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Sulika

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@marvel_dc_heroes_villains: I don't think any of us actually believes that our opinions will be taken into consideration. Idiot producers are going to do whatever the hell they want to regardless of what we say. Fact of the matter is though that our opinions DO matter. WE are the fans. It's our hard earned cash that we're shelling out to watch these movies in the theaters and to purchase the dvd's. But if the movie sucks, then there's no way I'm going to bother. And this kind of mentality adds up.

Case in point- Batman/Batman Returns/Batman Forever/Batman and Robin, they started out VERY popular with the fans (though looking back there are problems that I've got story-wise with the first ones) but as they dragged it out they stopped caring about what the fans would think. They felt that so long as they put something out no matter how bad it was, the fans would keep coming back to eat it up. But we didn't. Each movie was worse then the last until the franchise just bombed out.

So no. I have no delusions that my words will actually be heard, but if the producers were smart they'd at least think about considering our opinions.

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vandinejd_1991

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Well I'm going to go against the grain here and say that I welcome this change. I never really liked Hank for the fact that he has as much psychological issues as some supervising. I prefer my superheroes to be sane and not be wife-beaters. Also in the comics I've read Janet has always been a jerk herself. So I'm looking forward to Scott as Antman and Hope as Yellowjacket.

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Sulika

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@vandinejd_1991: I agree that Hank's history isn't pretty. Spousal abuse is inexcusable, but it shows that for all his genius and powers- he's still human. He has problems like all the rest of us, and even now in the comics he's still struggling with his past actions. When most people think of Super Heroes they think of Superman or Captain America- stand up people who always save the day. People who stand for "Truth, Justice, and the American way." But life's not like that. As much as we'd all like to think we're good people, everyone has something they're not proud of. In a way Hank's spousal abuse storyline is similar to Iron Man's "Demon in a Bottle" storyline. It's a black mark on an otherwise wonderful character. And while external struggles and gigantic battles make for good short term entertainment, personal struggles make for better long term stories.

I'm not saying that they should build the whole movie based on his abuse of Janet right off the bat, but even the Iron Man movies and a little in the Avengers they touched on Tony's addiction to alcohol. If they based Antman on Pym then at some point down the line I'm sure they could do a movie with the spousal abuse as a plot point without it coming off like a Lifetime movie.

However you did misread one thing. Hope is not going to be Yellow Jacket in the movie. Hope Van Dyne is played by Evangeline Lilly and Yellow Jacket will be played by Corey Stoll.

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V_Scarlotte_Rose

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#71  Edited By V_Scarlotte_Rose

@beholdthevison: I have a bad feeling that if either of them are going to be removed, it might happen in April in the Rage Of Ultron story.

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vandinejd_1991

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@Sulika: But Superheroes are supposed to be someone that ordinary people in the comics and in the real world are supposed to look up to as both a mentor and moral compass. What kind of an example are Iron Man and Antman setting when they do stuff like that? Also while Tony may not drink alcohol, or Antman beat Janet anymore, they still have Ultron and the Superhuman Registration Act on top of it. All of those things make it hard for me to root for them as opposed to Batman or Captain America.

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Sulika

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@vandinejd_1991: That's just it though- Superheroes are people too. To try to put them on a pedestal where they don't ever have any personal problems is unrealistic. At that point they might as well not even be human. And a Superhero doesn't need to be someone that is looked up to. That's not what makes them a hero.

Example 1- Spider-man fights crime everyday, both super-villains and common crooks. He does the best he can to save people despite the fact that J. Jonah Jameson thinks he's just a crook out to cause the people harm and a majority of the population believe him.

Example 2- The X-Men are an entire team of people who are despised just for being born the way they are. They never chose this life, but still they try to good and save everyone they can, even if the people they save would rather see them dead.

Being a superhero isn't having a moral compass so squeaky clean that that you can eat off of it, it's doing the right thing in spite of the problems that they face.

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kingmezidor7

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#74  Edited By kingmezidor7

Now If They Add Cassie Lang And The Young Avengers To The Movie Then Maybe I'll Be Even Remotely Fascinated!

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Avenging-X-Bolt

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@vandinejd_1991: Yellowjacket is the villain. I doubt Hope is just gonna pick up a villains identity

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deactivated-097092725

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@beholdthevison: I have a bad feeling that if either of them are going to be removed, it might happen in April in the Rage Of Ultron story.

I'm dreading that event. I think you're right.

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V_Scarlotte_Rose

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@ms-lola said:

@v_scarlotte_rose said:

@beholdthevison: I have a bad feeling that if either of them are going to be removed, it might happen in April in the Rage Of Ultron story.

I'm dreading that event. I think you're right.

It sucks that a Hank Pym versus Ultron(with other people) book has me more worried than excited. He's my second favourite(very close to joint favourite) Marvel character.

Let's hope for the best. He doesn't have to die for Scott to be Ant-Man, as he's already in that role, so we could be O.K. I hope Hope Wasp and Darren Cross Yellowjacket don't show up though.

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MartianManhunterIsBetterThanCyborg

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I hope Marvel doesn't phase out Hank and Janet like they are doing with OG Nick Fury.

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