VictorGnome

@tomlas:

1. Goku knows Dragon Fist in DBGT. This movie was introduced in Movie 13, and no other place.

2. Goku and Vegeta know fusion instinctively in DBGT. This was introduced in Movie 12, and no other place.

3. Cooler is in DBGT in Super 17 Arc when villains escape hell. This is LITERALLY a MOVIE-only character and nothing more:

4. GT Trunks has Tapion's sword. In case you can't recall, Tapion is the character from Wrath of the Dragon (Movie 13) -- this isn't speculation, you can google it and find it this information in two seconds. Here's a brief snapshot that encapsulates this point:

As a said note, in this website, if you provide statements and documents, people say "no, that isn't evidence; provide concrete FEATS," and if you provide concrete feats, people say "provide statements and documents." People are completely incapable of taking an L. Let's see if you're not one more.

Keep in mind, not only are GT characters part of the movie verse, as I already clearly proved (and literally no one can dispute anything of what I just stated, but I can already see contrarian dorks ignoring the points and living in their head-canon, since no one ever says "you're right" in this website), but base GT Goku literally blew up a dimension containing an entire universe within with his Kamehameha. Super Goku has never even come close to anything like that. Beerus and him together shook the universe, but shaking is nothing. Japan has 1,500 earthquakes every year, yet it is still around.

The only other impressive feat is Zeno blowing up a universe. Guess what, it took so much effort and he was so slow that Goku and Vegeta literally had time to walk to the time machine, boot it up, AND leave unscathed.

By feats,

1. Zeno (destroyed universe).

2. Base GT Goku (blew up dimension, which is a universe).

3. Beerus and Goku (shaking a universe, which is still nothing compared to actually destroying it).

By scaling:

1. Zeno (since he is the "Omni King")

2. SSJ4 Gogeta (millions of times stronger than Base GT Goku, who blew up a dimension)

3. Everyone else

I remember there was a little dork called Darkpaladin that called me a troll, despite not refuting anything of what I proved in GT character vs Super character thread, but I happened to come across his other posts in similar topics, and he said something like "GT automatically loses because it sucks."

Lots of trolls in this website that say something wins because they like it more. Both Super and GT are garbage -- don't troll, and don't be biased.

I am forever gone from this website because of the trolls, but I wanted to refute a last post, one more time.

@takenstew22:I didn't have a winner in mind; I merely commented on the lack of feats for current Goku. SSJ Blue Goku from the Black Arc gave Fused Zamasu a decent fight. As I said, I don't think Goku has gotten that much stronger, but it's not a big gap to close. Me pointing out that current Goku has bad feats doesn't imply "a winner in mind" when we already saw that Black Arc Goku did decent.

You're just pissed how it's been pointed out in other threads how weak your arguments have been. You ranted like a little bish with the following quote somewhere else in response to my rebuttal. Don't talk about rules when you rampantly break the rules by insulting the site and its users.

Why are people getting salty over me for posting a low showing for GT in response to someone posting a low showing for DBS? (It's not even a low showing as Goku didn't even get hurt by that train)

It's not my fucking fault this site is a joke and people can't debate seriously anymore.

Base Baby Vegeta humiliated a SSJ3 Goku that was thousands of times stronger than the SSJ3 Goku that Beerus embarrassed. He embarrassed Goku just as badly as Beerus did, but everyone overlooks that scene. Then, Baby Vegeta transformed, and he transformed again, making him at least 200 times stronger than his base form (since his second form is similar to SSJ2 in multiplier).

i don't know who Oren Vegeta is, but if he loses to Beerus, then it's a no-brainer that he loses to 2nd Form Baby Vegeta.

Base GT Goku destroyed a dimension.

DBS Base Goku doesn't really have good feats.

As for transformations, Perfect Files states SSJ4 gives same multiplier as a SSJ1 Fusion. In DBS: Broly, the SSJ1 Fusion did better than individual SSJ Blue, so SSJ4 is better than SSJ Blue. If DBS Goku turned SSJ4, it would have been the same as becoming Vegito SSJ1 (in terms of multiplier, as Perfect Files makes it clear). SSJ1 Vegito is about equal to SSJ1 Gogeta.

Personally, I don't think Goku has improved that much. Even the weak version of Superman (from 1998 For All Seasons) has better feats.

This isn't a Goku vs Superman thread, but everyone is familiar with that version of Superman, so I provide the picture purely for scaling purposes. I find current Goku's feats to be insufficient to take on Fused Zamasu. I don't think he has improved much from the RoF Arc. Remember, Frieza died in RoF, didn't train for years, and he fought against ToP SSJ Blue Goku just as well as he did back in RoF. Goku doesn't get stronger, he just gains transformations.

Current SSJ Blue Kaioken x20 Goku vs Fused Zamasu. Has Goku closed the gap between him and Fused Zamasu?

Goku's current feats are lacking, but has he improved enough to defeat Fused Zamasu? Remember, this character was on the level of Vegito Blue, but with more hax and higher endurance.

Notes: Battle ends if Goku is killed, or if Goku is able to separate Fused Zamasu (like Trunks did). If Goku can kill Fused Zamasu, even better.

Exactly, well said. Minato is top tier with just a discount version of IT. You also brought up a good point with flying and energy blast. Goku just has too many powers.

He is much better than Minato at teleporting, he's much better than Deidara at flying and causing explosions, he's much better than any Uchiha at dodging and reacting to moves, he's much better than Jiraiya at sealing/disappearing an opponent (Evil Containment Wave and Hakai), and he's much better than Guy at Taijutsu. He's much better than the top tiers at their specialties.

From my understanding, Janemba is supposed to be the strongest movie villain. That means he's above Hirudegarn, who one-shotted Mystic Gohan and SSJ3 Gotenks. Mystic Gohan is above Super Buu, so if Hirudegarn one-shotted him, he's probably around Buuhan level of power, since not even Buutenks could one-shot Mystic Gohan. This means that Janemba is above Buuhan. If you believe Kid Buu is above Buuhan (and I completely understand if you do), then Janemba wins with medium difficulty.

If we take into consideration the fact that SSJ3 Goku shook the afterlife just by transforming, and that Broly destroyed a galaxy, then Janemba defeats Kid Buu and Super Vegito (canon) at the same time.

Toei

It's possible. If we take consistency into consideration, then Kirby is consistently weak, and he'd die to Goku. With his best feats, he might be able to pull out a Majin Buu (in terms of surviving heavy punches), since he supposedly "survived the awakening of Dark Nebula" which apparently was above planetary resistance (but I haven't seen that for myself).