Storm Calling

The new update is a hot mess and caused more bugs with the site. All of the respect threads were affected since the spoiler blocks no longer showed up. But they seemed to have fixed that issue for now. I wasn't even going to bother at this point.

Sorry for the delay. I didn't get a notification for this post.

It's complicated, especially if we're talking about the survivability factor vs simply manipulating the forces there. I would start by sending you to my section in the OP in Update 2 for Mediums/Atmospheres/Biospheres. For one thing, she currently needs oxygen to survive, so if she dies from anything on those planets it would be from the lack of air there. If there's toxic air on this planet, then I think she could survive. She already showed in New X-men #132 that a toxic atmosphere is no issue for her.

I don't think she would die from any sort of radiation, pressure differential or extreme temperatures from these atmospheres. Her body would typically compensate to these conditions automatically or she can actively use her powers to combat the situation like she did on the Hill in her first mini series by Warren Ellis. And this was before her powers fully adapted to that planet.

It's been theorized that at full potential Storm would eventually evolve/adapt in an atmosphere with conditions too extreme for even her to survive to a level where she would become one with the elemental forces of that planet/medium(as an elemental being) to survive. So yeah, the adaption could scale up to the extreme levels too especially if we account for her unaided space travel in Black Vortex and what her elemental form would mean.

There's been numerous examples of her adapting to new planets/dimensions/realities.

Polemachus World/Dimension (UXM Annual #3)

The Hill(Storm's first mini series. Issue 2-3 I believe)

Margali's Hell Dimension (UXM Annual #4)

M'Rin's World/Dimension (Classic X-men #22)

Limbo Dimension (UXM #160)

Trion Dimension (UXM #369 and X-men Vol 2 #88)

The Avatar's World/dimension (UXM #286)

Nina's tidal wave of skewed realities (X-men Vol 2 #82)

There are more, but these should give you an idea.

Nice review, SoS!

I know there were some concerns about Storm being too aggressive and too militant under Hickman's pen, but all of that should be laid to rest after this issue. I think it's just been awhile since we've seen this side of her show up, and as I described awhile back in the thermodynamics thread, she tends to get much darker and more aggressive when she's pushed to that degree. So this very much should be her reaction to what been happening to mutants as of late.

But yeah, Hickman really has been doing a fantastic job revitalizing the core aspects of the X-men again. Like you mentioned in another post, it no longer feels like a chore where you have to weave through all these boring mediocre stories with poorly developed mandates and continuity in order to find one good moment that would remind you of the glory days when the X-men were great and cared for.

@son_of_storm said:

Oh and one more thing about the issue. I'm starting to think that perhaps Storm needs to pull Magneto to the side for a little talk. Goddess to lowercase god.

And people used to laugh at Storm when she was proclaiming herself a Goddess. Yet when Magneto does it it's just par for the course.

You know how it is... Everything else is accepted as gospel until Storm comes into the picture.

Agreed. It's been a long time since we've seen these two get along so well. So it was a welcome occurrence and I hope we see more of that in the future.

I agree about the Claremont and Pak comparison, and think it's even more important to see this type of stuff in the flagship titles so it will have a greater chance of carrying over to the other people that will write her.

I think it feels so much like an AU due to the fact of how little we've seen the X-men be pushed in the flagship titles for so long. It doesn't feel like it will stick because for so long nothing really has, but I think the circumstances are very different now. Marvel has much more of a reason to push the X-men now that they own the full rights to them. We should expect to see lots of changes coming for them within the next few years. It's one of the main reasons I didn't write off HoX/PoX when I first heard about it. It may have not meant great things for Storm, but for the X-men as a whole, I knew it would be gamechanging.

I would recommend going over the OP again, as there's no mention or claim to Storm becoming a star in any of those post. The context for that could be purely hyperbolic and my point would still hold. None that refutes what the feat implies in explicit detail. Exhibiting new powers in a unique situation(a powerup), interpreting the core(which housed millions of stars and planets, in which each she acquired energy from) as an elemental medium no different from the liquid atmosphere, other planets, realities or dimensions she's been to, to draw power from it in the same fashion as she does on earth to control the weather. This was all interpreted in the feat itself and cannot be refuted.

Was gravity manipulation or any other factors that she hasn't exhibited yet involved? Possibly. But that doesn't take away the consistency she's shown since this feat that fully implies all of those forces fall under her command. Black Vortex quite literally shows her becoming a star when it shows her full potential for example. Has she been back to the core to perform the feat? No, but she's been to other mediums, planets, dimensions and atmospheres and has consistently shown that her powers adapt to all of these spaces(Jason Aaron's Amazing X-men not withstanding). She's channeled large amounts of energy through her body that is comparable to the core in the Trion dimension as well.

So again, there's a consistency to everything she's performed in the core. There is no consistency in her going absolute zero. One ambiguous instance is simply not enough proof for us, and that's just the bottomline.

@bbeeryan: The evidence for her galactic core feat is in the potential she's shown with her powers since it happened. The consistency in them like I described to you. We evaluated the core based on all of her feats, not just the feat itself.

Can the same evidence be found for the absolute zero argument? One other instance showing she went absolute zero? That's the issue here. Not in the fact that one could interpret it that way. No other evidence to support it could be found in our debate, so it wasn't acceptable.

When an instance more credible comes up showing her going absolute zero, it can be used as a reference for consistency. But until that happens my mind is made up and you're free to see me anyway you please.

Ah, gotcha. I think the damage can be compared even if she used Stardust's own electrons to hit her with that attack to disperse her energy form. Mcduffie mentioned that her form was starting to fall apart at this point, but Stardust has control over her energy form. So it's an impressive feat either way given the attack she tanked from Johnny and Beta Ray Bill IIRC, and what she is.

@stormcell: I'll go over all of it tomorrow to make sure. If not, I'll add it in. I remember us discussing it in the old thread, but I'm not 100% sure it was added to the OP when I did update #2.

@stormcell: I understand now. So we agree about the core being a powerup but not the Trion. I'll have to go back to read the story, but you could be right on Trion.

On a side note, maybe this belongs in the respect thread:

Here, Storm blows up Stardust with her assault: https://2.bp.blogspot.com/Sz1uHALLWV4__vy0L2mJXETOgd9oE-iNtpuEjIJNZg9E7xaENrJuQ6CCXj0r1iYGt-Qlb-KDRpOh=s0

Later, in the same issue, Torch, who was wielded Silver Surfer's powers as well as his own, couldn't come anywhere near the same damage Storm did to Stardust: https://2.bp.blogspot.com/-OxW5lqEWMlniQ0o95UDGrTgwtGzFQHeC6uxCU0hloaWqLKZylP7UFHixAN8cpkMYGIzSaj9kU_I=s0

Notice that not only did his attack NOT blow up Stardust, but she was about to break free of his attack.

This isn't in the OP? I could've swore we covered this along with getting screenshot proof from Mcduffie stating it's what she did?

@stormcell: So you disagree that she can't amplify her control by tapping into the energy of her mediums? Because it's flat out described that way in the galactic core instance and when she quelled Shamen's blizzard.

Can she tap into the energy of other worlds and star systems while she's on earth? Possibly.

Can she channel the same quantity of energies through her body as she did in the Trion dimension in her home reality? Possibly.

Can she manipulate the elemental forces of her home reality in the same fashion as she did the elemental forces in the Trion reality? Unlikely but possible. The physics here were all different so we have no way of knowing if what she did here can be done in her home reality. At least not at the moment.

@stormcell: It's a powerup. Even if that powerup came under her own power. Her powers changed because they allow her to adapt to any situation involving natural elemental forces. She flat out describes it as a "unique" situation in the scan you provided. Unique implies that this is something that is not normally the case all the time, and it's the same truth for the galactic core.

@bbeeryansaid:

For the record I've personally never witnessed any conversation amongst Storm fans where her potential to manipulate gravity is brought up. And certainly not as it pertains to the galactic core. That's beside the point. I brought it up because it only made sense imo. Another reason I brought it up because it goes to a greater point that I've also never witnessed any discussion on the matter.

This forum is actually a whole lot older than it looks. There was a big wipe years ago that erased all of our old Storm threads where we had big discussions about this stuff. So it's not that we're avoiding discussing the core, we've just pretty much already covered these subjects numerous times. Whether it be here or on other forums like cbr years ago. I go way back to Superherohype days and can 100% confirm I've heard all of the arguments you brought up and considered them.

Absolute zero is hyperbolic in nature and easily dismissed, but many on here freely admit that the galactic core happened? That's got to be the most ass backwards analysis I've ever seen. Did Storm really become her own living star? Did she really? Or is that more of Claremont's hyperbole?

Has anyone really thought about what that entails? Absolute zero pales in comparison to Storm lightning herself on fire with millions of degrees cosmic fire, bombarding herself with massive gamma radiation levels or surviving gravitational fields that should have rightfully collapsed upon themselves and torn open a black hole.

If some of you can actually articulate arguments that Storm really became a star to rid herself of an alien embryo then I don't know where you get the stones to try and belittle another Storm fan over their claims that she realistically created absolute zero. You don't get to have your cake and eat it too.

She had a powerup here though. The spiritual and material sustenance of millions of stars and planets, which allowed her to reverse a physical brood transformation that likely would not have been possible under normal circumstances. We know that Storm's powers and body adapt to new environments and mediums. That's been proven time and time again, and without question. She's amplified her own powers on earth by tapping into the electric potential energy of it before to stop storms that were too great for her to deal with under normal circumstances. Not to mention it's been shown that her powers are generally more amplified in space. We haven't seen her play much with cosmic storms, but we know without question that she can. So again, there is nothing that can be refuted about the galactic core, especially considering she's shown great control over em energy and potentially gravity(if we include what she did in the Trion dimension) and accept what Claremont described about her powers in space. Immunity to high amounts of heat and radiation, etc..

So yeah, if we're talking an amped up Storm like she was in the Trion dimension, there's no telling what's possible, and I fully endorse it. If you consider it hypercritical, then that's your opinion and you're entitled to it. However, it is not going to change our stance on not accepting that she has achieved absolute zero based on the instance from UXM #149. We know absolute zero should be more than possible with her, but we'll need more evidence than that to claim it as a fact. Again, I'm certainly willing to add this under Possible Abilities as I expressed to you and to Kyss in our dispute.

The galactic core is so important because it illustrates that her powers CANNOT operate the way Scott Lobdell described. If Storm really became a star that burned white hot, does anyone know how much cold her body would have to produce to counterbalance it? The jokes right themselves.

Maybe it's time we as fans reexamine what we think we know.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gamma-ray_burst

Storm created a GRB. And to think people also make the claim that Johnny Storm could ever do anything with her. Smfh

She's been consistently burned on panel by fire under Claremont's pen though. It doesn't matter if it makes sense or isn't scientifically plausible. It's canon. I trust I don't need to bring up the instances proving my case? We've already discounted the Scott Lobdell instance in my discussion with Stormcell on the old thread, but it doesn't refute the canon that shows her vulnerable to heat based attacks that aren't under her direct control under Claremont Canon. She's generally immune to the elements that are under her control, and it's likely the same truth with the galactic core. The issues with her immunity to lightning and other elemental attacks are related to a mechanic that requires her to compensate first. This has been confirmed on panel. This is no longer the case with her lightning of course, but again it's still something that was consistent in the Claremont days.