novi_homines

Not only the general public, the small group of critics as well. I love the action in MoS, but it was so dry. There's nothing about it that gives it personality. It takes all of the fun out of the concept of "superheroes".

And the general public also likes TDK, and Daredevil, and Toy Story, etc. You get my point.

Lol this is absolutely hilarious. This thread had me worried, but no, it works extremely well. The dryness of dc films will always keep it a step behind in the eyes of the public. Get a sense of humor people. Dark and brooding is not something everyone enjoys. The critical reception of MoS proved that.

I think this might be the most logical answer yet.

This. Just bring quality and the rest will fall in line.

I think that a lot of this confusion derives from our extremely biased perception. I also think that it's safe to say that trying to put marvel in a box (whether it be an "action" film or any other box) would lead to disappointment. Many marvel comics are extremely funny, and have that same drop of humor (IM, Waid's Hawkeye, etc.). Also, there are many other marvel comics that are extremely serious (Miller's Daredevil, Brubaker's Captain America, etc.). I think one thing that marvel has done well is incorporate this balance of humor/ serious balance with their movies. Marvel has made 10 movies that have been released thus far, 4 of which have been serious (Cap 1, TWS, TIH, Iron Man), 3 of which have been more humorous (GOTG, IM3, Thor:TDW), and 3 which have walked the line between the two (Iron Man 2, Avengers, Thor). Not to mention daredevil project ( even though its tv), which is arguably one of the darkest comic book adaptations ever made.

On your point about credibility, I disagree. I think that the humor in GOTG doesn't make it less "credible" than the more serious MoS for example. Credibility and tone are not related, at least in my opinion.

@kfabz-23:

Can you cite me this research that you've done? I'd like to take a gander at it myself.

@saren:

Given the source material, I'm not sure how Jonah Hex is supposed to be pretentious. Poorly executed, sure, but that's not the same thing. BvS isn't even out yet. What is so pretentious about Man of Steel, and how do you imagine Nolan's trilogy avoided such shortfalls?

This is all subjective however it essentially comes down to execution, as you state. Pretentiousness is defined as "attempting to impress by affecting greater importance, talent, culture, etc., than is actually possessed." Without getting into analyzing Man of Steel, i'll just say that Man of Steel's pretentiousness comes at the hand of being unsuccessful in trying to evoke this high-minded, thought provoking film. And from this attempt, other aspects of it suffer as well. Nolan's trilogy avoids being pretentious because his execution was successful to the point that it does not attempt to impress by evoking things that isn't actually possessed. Because its actual possession of these high-minded and thought provoking themes are there, which results in leading it to impress. Not vice versa.

"Pretentious" is an inherently pejorative term and not really a description. You wouldn't call someone an idiot and pass it off as a description.

It depends on the connotation one gives it. Yes, most give it a negative connotation. I don't give it a negative connotation, so it becomes a description of a films actual makeup. At least from my subjective point of view.

So to note: you're not talking about MCU movies, which is what most people talk about when they say Marvel movies. You're talking about anything featuring a Marvel character, even when different studios and different creative teams have radically different visions.

Well the post does say "marvel movies", while also differentiating the marvel films by saying "raimi spiderman, xmen, MCU, etc". So I don't see your point of confusion, my point is pretty clear. But even if we were strictly talking MCU marvel movies, the point still stands. GOTG, has a radically different vision from The Incredible Hulk, and they're both very different from The Winter Soldier, etc.

Are you saying those that disagree are factually incorrect?

@_mongul:

Well again, I guess it depends on perception because there are many that disagree.

I can definitely understand this point of view. My issue with sentiment is that some then take the next step to say "since it has jokes, its not for adults". Which is preposterous considering the majority of films in hollywood that base themselves around making people laugh (comedies) appeal to adults just as much as every other genre.

Apologies, I was just going to get to you. I'm going by the dictionary definition. However I didn't say all fall under this umbrella. Nolan's trilogy avoids this. However movies such as Jonah Hex, Man of Steel and seemingly BvS (athough this remains to be seen) are pretentious. That's not an insult or a compliment by any means, just a description on DC's last few attempts.