By KrleAvenger 6 Comments
Two months ago, I posted a blog about nine most overrated characters on Vine per media. However, it wasn't made to really rant about something. It was mostly there for entertainment purposes given the fact that it did not focus on top 9 overrated characters in fiction, but nine characters from their own form of media who are more overrated than any other from the former's verse (i.e. Kratos for video games, Thor for MCU, Superboy Prime for DC...).
This time, I want to make a similar list, in sense that I will go with the same "one character per media/verse" rule (for further details, read the intro of the blog above), but instead of focusing on characters that are overrated, I will instead list characters who can not be used in VS battles match-ups. Either due to the fact that they are too obscured and almost featless, too broken, too inconsistent in some way or the other.
Now, again, keep in mind that these are not THE TOP 8 characters who can not be used, due to the fact that I am limiting only one per media/universe. Actual top 8 may include more Marvel characters. Or more video game characters. When it comes to what universes and forms of media I'll be mentioning, you can skim through the previous blog and see for yourself. Also, while the order of the previous list was based around what verses I was using, this order will be in correlation to the actual list. Meaning, I will actually rank these characters based on which one fits the category of "unusable" ones more than the previous one. It might be a flawed way to go with due to the fact that I am not making top 10 for one form of media, meaning this should not really be in order, but hey, it is my list and I can do what I want with it.
Note that I will not have a DCEU entry here, because I simply could not find a DCEU character that fits the category. I guess Zeus could work but he was never even shown on screen so no reason to bring him up. On the other hand, I could not find a Manga character for the previous blog, while this one will include a Manga character, so it evens it out. Well, mostly. This number is lower because I could not find a movie or video game character that fits the description either, but I was able to find another source for an entry to make it top 8 instead of top 7.
What all that out of the way, lets get into it. Enjoy.
Number #8 - Amon from Avatar: LoK (Cartoons)
Amon is a pretty abnormal entry on this list due to the fact that we actually know exactly what he is capable of. It is just that his abilities do not fit into the universe he is put in at all. Amon's blood bending, is broken. There is no way to counter it. It does not matter how strong you are, be it physically or as a bender. You will not be able to resist his blood bending. Not only did Amon master this technique (easily the most powerful form of bending in the verse) when he was a teenager, he also proved to be capable of easily controlling multiple targets at once, without even using hand gestures. This essentially allows him to either incapacitate an opponent with ease, tear them apart and move them around Darth Vader style, pummel them or, even take their bending abilities away, giving him instant win. And not even master water benders can counter this due to how powerful Amon is.
Amon is capable of using blood bending without the full Moon, and not only used it on other anomalies like his brother, but also resisted blood bending himself with no hand gestures. This is not even something Katara can do because she does require full Moon, and it is possible that Amon even surpassed his father, the same guy who while being handcuffed and without the aid of the full Moon, was able to incapacitate an entire court room with it, even Aang in his prime, meaning that even master level water bending won't be enough to counter this ability. The only way to have a proper match up against this guy is to restrict his blood bending, and even without it, Amon is still kinda absurd. Not only did he tank both a direct air burst from Korra and lightning from Mako (former launched him into the water and the latter is an attack that can completely incapacitate and even kill a target), but he was able to create a massive and thick water tornado with ease and contain it for several seconds. And he has done so on a whim after being hit with a powerful attack and temporarily knocked out in the water.
Meaning that even his water bending surpassed that of some of top tiers in the verse. In the realm of Martial Arts, Amon showed enough agility, dexterity, skill and proficiency with Chi Blocking (Avatar Verse's nerve strikes) to outright humiliate other benders in single combat despite the fact that they had distance advantage, and he did not even rely on his bending abilities. In other words, even if you restrict his most powerful asset, Amon is still more than capable of embarrassing some of the best fighters in the verse, and he can even cause hell based on water bending alone, something he never used in combat. And with blood bending, he is practically unbeatable. In other words, there is no proper match up for this guy unless you either increase the number of opponents by a huge margin, or you restrict his strongest asset, both of which are broken. And even then, he can deal with a lot of opponents without them. On the other hand, the only characters superior to him are also the ones who would stomp him in a fight, like Spirits or Avatar state.
At the end of the day, Amon is one of those extremely imbalanced fighters, where he will either absolutely dominate an opponent, or be dominated. The reason why he is so low on the list? That's because he is only unusable in the Avatar universe. If you pit him against a character from another verse who can have a set of abilities that would make an interesting discussion, it can be a good fight. It is minimal but it still exists. While being unusable in your own verse is absurd, it is still possible to find a match for this guy. However, same can not be said for other entries on this list.
Number #7 - The Beyonders (Marvel Comics)
The Beyonders are kinda paradoxical characters, in sense that we know what they can do both feat wise and hierarchy wise, but they are way too influenced by the plot to make any solid case for their actual status. They Beyonders are Omnipotent. In a way. It has been established that they are actually Omnipotent as a race. And given the fact that it took only 3 of them to kill all the Celestials, all the Abstract Entities and the Living Tribunal itself, all at the same time, with absolute ease at that, puts them at absolute top of the list of Marvel Hierarchy.
At least at first glance. While Beyonders were loosely mentioned here and there way back before Hickman's Time Runs Out was launched, the implication is that they should be in some way or the other, comparable to Pre-Retcon Beyonder and Owen Reece in some way or the other. And their feats as narrated by Hank Pym makes this pretty apparent. However, the Beyonders suffer from shit ton of inconsistency. Not only two of them were killed by pretty low tier characters such as Abyss and Ex Nihilo, but were also taken down by Star Brand.
While the latter is not necessarily a bad thing due to the fact that he had to commit suicide to do so, it kinda questions their ability to do, well, anything they want. On top of that, the Beyonders were effectively killed by the bomb created by Doctor Doom. While we can't technically use this against them because it is impossible to quantify the potency of every Owen Reece in the Multiverse, it is super weird that they got killed by something like that, due to the fact that the powers Owen Reece possesses comes from their own dimension.
We have no idea how to compare current Owen Reece to Pre-Retcon Owen Reece, and therefor, we have no idea how to compare the Beyonders to original Beyonder from original Secret Wars. Aside from that, it has been sort of hinted that the Beyonders are not capable of traveling through time. Which is dumb and weird for entities of such high status among the hierarchy and should be a crippling weakness that can be exploited by tons of characters they shit stomped on panel, as well as Cosmic Cubes themselves possessing time manipulating powers.
At least HOTU Thanos was overwhelmed by something completely unexplainable. One can argue that all of these inconsistencies are simply plot devices for Hickman to deal with such a powerful characters to move the plot forward, but again, these inconsistencies are way to drastic for us to have an objective view of Beyonders' power, making them almost unusable in versus match up, and even if one finds a way to use them, they will have an extremely hard time quantifying them.
Number #6 - Music Meister (Arrowverse)
Music Meister is on this list for a very different reason compared to other two entries. While he is far from inconsistent and far from broken, Music Meister's power set functions in a way where we don't know who he can be pitted against, and that is mostly due to the fact that this guy has zero combat related feats. CW's interpretation of Music Meister is not human. Instead, he is some sort of extra dimensional entity which apparently resides from a world beyond human comprehension.
This hints at the fact that he is some sort of Abstract level entity, but he has no showings or even clear cut accolades to back it up. At least Marvel Cosmic entities all have a Power Hierarchy and explanation of their purpose and function which helps us determine how they compare to other characters. This guy has none of it. All he has are few handy perks here and there, but when you look at them, they range from abilities that make no sense, to abilities without clear limit.
We know he can hypnotize you. But we don't know if he can do this to multiple people at once and if eye contact is necessary or not. We know he knows things he should not know. But we don't know if this is a byproduct of Cosmic Awareness, absurdly powerful senses, telepathy, some form of device or simply outside influence. We know he can react to the Flash, but we don't know how fast the speedster moved when he attacked him, making the feat unquantifiable.
We know he can kill people he hypnotized, but we don't know if he can choose whether this happens or not, or if it depends on the characters themselves being put in a scenario he created. The fact that he himself said he can not reverse his... "spell", could mean that his powers have some really weird limitations, and given he fact that both Iris and Mon-El were able to save Kara and Barry just because they <loved them>, makes the entire showing kinda useless.
We know he can steal powers, but we don't know how he does that, how much time it takes to do so, and what are the mechanics and limitations. We know he can be KO'd, but we don't know if he let himself be defeated by Wally, Cisco and J'onn or not. We know he can teleport. But we don't know if applications of that ability are useful or effective in combat.
All of his powers are extremely weird and lack real explanation and limits. Therefor, it is almost impossible to say what he can and can not do, especially because he never participated in a serious fight.
Number #5 - Indra & Ashura from Naruto (Manga)
Oh my God, where do I even begin with these guys. I was originally gonna put Hamura on this list, but due to more frequent use of these guys on the battle forum, I decided to replace their uncle with sons of Hagoromo. The main problem with Indra and Ashura is the fact that they have no appearances what so ever. They never had any story revolved around the two of them, and their canon appearances in the Manga are limited to 2-3 shots during the reference, mentions, and showcase of their spirit form next to Naruto and Sasuke. While these guys are connected to a huge chunk of material from Naruto that can be used to speculate how powerful they are, the level of power they have is still based on nothing but that. Speculation. Obito claims that Indra possessed powerful eyes and Yin Release.
Ok, fair enough. But we have no idea what applications related to Yin Release were used by Indra in a way that is effective in combat. We know he has the Mangekyo Sharingan and Perfect Susanoo, but we don't know how to compare it to regular Madara's Perfect Susanoo and Six Paths Sasuke's Perfect Susanoo. We know Ashura has incredibly powerful stamina and Yang Release. But again, we have no idea how that is relevant. Is his stamina and strength comparable to someone like Naruto before Six Paths? Or is it more like Hashirama's? While Madara, Hashirama, Naruto and Sasuke are mostly so powerful because they are the reincarnations of the two brothers, as you can see, I already compared them to the four and we have no idea how they compare.
Are they stronger than Six Paths duo? Are they weaker than non Six Paths Naruto and Sasuke? Are they comparable to Madara and Hashirama? Do they go in between some versions and the other ones? We honestly can't say. While Indra using the Perfect Susanoo without spare eyes is impressive, we don't know if this is a byproduct of superior chakra cost and stamina compared to other Uchiha without EMS, or if his eyes are simply more powerful. We know Ashura possesses Fox Kurama like Avatar similar to Naruto, but again, we can not compare it to Naruto because Naruto's Avatar is Kurama himself, and Ashura is not a host. And speculating that it is equal to or stronger than Naruto's Clone Combined Kurama who stalemated Indra's Arrow Sasuke is, again, just a speculation.
We know Ashura possesses multiple Truth Seeking Orb like balls around his avatar, but we can't say those are Truth Seeking Orbs because 1) the number does not match any other Six Paths Sage Mode user, 2) they are too large, and 3) even if they are, we do not know how they compare to Madara's and Naruto's, since other non Six Paths users like Toneri possessed TSOs and they were not as nearly as impressive as the ones Juubi Host has. Of course, Ashura and Indra do have feats in their filler arc, but again, we can not use them because filler is not canon. And even if we decide to use them, it won't solve anything because Ashura did not use his Fox Avatar like he was shown in canon appearance, and was overwhelmed until other Ninshu pupils amped him.
Either Ashura has gotten better, or Indra has gotten worse. We honestly can't say.
Number #4 - Golden Superman (DC Comics)
Not having any feats, but still having multiple sources to at least speculate in some form or the other over how powerful one character is, is one thing. However, not paying attention to the details or outright making stuff up is the other. And this leads us to our Number 4, that being Golden Superman, Superman Prime, Superman One Million, whatever you are gonna call him. While this guy could easily make it to my "overrated characters of the verse" list from 2 months ago, I think he fits into this category way better because he honestly has nothing.
This Superman... is featless. He is completely featless. Not only is he completely featless, but there is no bio or any hint over how powerful this guy is. The only thing this guy has ever done on panel is kill Solaris, and this only happened after Solaris fought and got overpowered and hurt by the likes of Kyle Rayner, Kal Kent and two JLA teams, which makes the feat completely unqauntifiable and completely useless. That is all this guy has, and everything else you will see on the internet is based on nothing but disinformation or confusion.
The ONLY reason why this guy is not higher on the list, is because we actually do know he is just Post-Crisis/New Earth version of Superman but still alive in the future. Not only does this mean that all of his feats apply to this Superman, but it also means that he is capable of surpassing his physical capabilities to absurd degree. However, this leads us to another problem. We have absolutely no idea how big of an amp 15.000 years in the Sun is. Did it amp him to Kal Kent's level? Is he strong enough to beat the likes of Thanos and Gog, or even Odin now?
We honestly don't know. And we can't scale him off of Post-Crisis Superman's Sundipp because it will be almost impossible to quantify new feats and compare them to regular ones, because actual limit and complete and objective level of feats he preformed while being sundipped, are also unknown. We can assumeon what level he should operate, but we will never be able to find a proper match for him.
Number #3 - Tulak Hord (Star Wars)
Ok, being broken, inconsistent, featless, impractical or just relying on speculation, is all fine and dandy if you at least have some feats (like Music Meister or the Beyonders), or possessing at least some source to draw from when it comes to your power (Golden Superman and Indra/Ashura). Tulak Hord on the other hand, is the embodiment of super obscured outright featless and completely unknown.
This Sith Lord suffers mostly from the same problems Indra and Ashura do. Tulak Hord is dead. There is not a single story that focuses on the time period when he was alive. And the funniest part is, we didn't even know what he looked like until years afterwards. And just like the Naruto brothers, all sources of info that hints at how powerful he is revolve around statements.
While statements are perfectly fine, claims supporting Tulak Hord are extremely vague and far from clear cut. At least Mace Windu was outright stated to be second only to Yoda and better than everyone in the order, during the period that was explored in a detailed way and Jedi of the time showcasing their skill and power, making such claims quantifiable.
Tulak Hord was stated to be the legendary lightsaber duelist and undefeated master of the blade superior to everyone in his era. And while that is all fine and dandy, reputation without a substance does not tell us anything. What I mean by that is, we have absolutely no idea how good the duelists of his era were, meaning it is impossible to compare him to characters with feats.
Even if swordsmen of his era were introduced, it does not matter because we still wouldn't know what fighting style Tulak Hord relied on. We wouldn't know how effective his tactics were, and what kind of approach he used. On top of that, both his force abilities and stats are also clouded in mystery, making the outcome of the fight still unknown even if we knew he would win in a sword fight.
While it is true that Darth Traya stated that skill and abilities of Tulak Hord were so great, that comparing him to fighters of the KOTOR era would be like comparing masters to children playing with toys, it once again does not matter because skill can be countered with superior stats, intelligence and tactical approach. Or even Force Abilities.
Besides that, Traya made rather inaccurate statements before, some of which were contradicted even by writers themselves, making her entire interpretation of this rather questionable. It also would not make a lot of sense because Tulak Hord lived before 5600 BBY, and lightsaber technique and combat went through massive development and changes since then.
Number #2 - Odin (Marvel Cinematic Universe)
This honestly makes me sad because I wanted to see Odin do something in MCU, but it all ended up being nothing. The reason why I put Odin above Tulak Hord, is because Tulak Hord has at least some statements that can lead you to believe that writers had high views on him. While same can be said for Odin, it would be based on facts presented in all the wrong ways. Odin's feats are limited to beating Laufey, depowering Thor, putting a spell on Mjolnir, resisting Loki's spell and trapping Hela. While all those feats sound cool and all, none of them are really practical.
Depowering Thor does not mean he is capable of depowering anyone else, due to the fact that Thor's powers come from the fact that he is Odin's son, so he should be a special case. Putting a "worthy" enchantment on Mjolnir can also attribute to the fact that Mjolnir is an Asgardian weapon, but even without assuming that's so, such ability has no combat applications. Resisting Loki's spell is irrelevant because we do not know how much time and effort it took to resist it, and on top of that, applications, use and actual abilities of the spell are completely unknown.
While he did defeat Laufey, the fact that the fight cost him his eye despite the fact that Gungnir showed the ability to turn Laufey into dust with a singe blast (while being used by weaker character, Loki), either means that Odin is not that great of a combatant, or he was sucker punched, which also means that his senses (ones that helped him sense Thor's death and things around him while being in Odinsleep) are not that effective in combat. While lack of context prevents us from using this against him, we can not use it to support him either.
Loki's, Thor's and Bor's use of Gungnir against Frost Giants, Hela's swords and Dark Elves does showcase the damage output and durability of the weapon, but again, we have no idea what tactics Odin himself employed in CQC encounters. In the realm of raw power and hax, while Odin's blast shattered Thor's armor, it is still unquantifiable because it did not damage Thor himself. Tapping into Dark Energies to create a pseudo Bifrost to teleport Thor while weakening him has barely any relevance in combat, and we can't use Odin Force feats from Thor game because it is not canon.
One-shotting fodder and preventing Thor and Loki from falling are useless feats, and we can't say Odin can replicate Loki's spell feats due to the fact that his knowledge and talent comes from Frigga. The only feat that remotely showcases Odin's power was his ability to trap Hela. While this kinda speaks of his power simply due to the fact that Hela could not escape until Odin died, meaning she is capable of teleportation and that Odin himself actively held here there, imprisoning someone and keeping them there and matching them in power and ability are two very different things.
Just because Odin somehow banished her and forced her to stay there does not mean he is more powerful or stronger than Hela, especially because we have no idea how such a feat was preformed. Did it happen mid combat? Was Hela unable to resist it? Did Odin rely on some artifacts? Was he required a lot of time to cast a spell? Was Hela taken by surprise? Did he struggle to hold her? Was she tricked or forced? We honestly can't say. While it was stated that Odin defeated Surtur, we have no idea if this was Surtur Thor easily killed, or if it was the one bonded with Eternal Flame.
The fact that Odin outright stated that fully powered Thor was more powerful than him, the same Thor who was still way weaker than Hela, makes the other two <feats> questionable. Even if this was just Odin motivating Thor and not actually stating facts, lack of information is still present. No on screen fights. No hand to hand combat feats. No known in character approach. No clear cut hax or resistance feats. No damage output feats. No context provided for existing feats. No abilities relevant in combat, and no clear limitations.
Number #1 - The Creator(s) (All of Fiction)
And yes, I know I am totally breaking my own rule here. Not only because I am listing multiple characters, but because I am including all of fiction, instead of one verse or form of media. However, I do not think there is a better example of unusable characters than this entry.
When I say creators, I am talking about Gods. And not any Gods or God like beings, but fictional representations of ultimate and supreme being in any reality and the source of everything and anything in existence and beyond. God/Creator who can do anything.
Not only are these characters barely used even in those instances when they are showcased, but all of them lack feats that make any sort of sense. Both the Presence and The One Above All appeared in person in their respective Universes, and they did not do anything.
This essentially means that the material used to gauge their power and performance is basically non existing. While lack of on panel/screen feats is not something debaters can not deal with, the actual problem is the nature of these characters itself and not their showings.
The so called "creators" are objectively and undoubtedly all knowing and power. They are established as possessing true and non hyperbolic Omnipotence, without actual God Like powers, but actual unlimited and unquestionable ability to do anything and everything they please. This essentially means that it is impossible for them to not win or lose 99.999999% of the fights.
Which is boring and completely pointless. The only argument one can make is how one's showcase of Omnipotence is better, which is why TOAA and the Presence are so frequently pitted against each other. But at that point, it is not even a battle discussion anymore, but one's overall perspective and concept of Omnipotence and how a stalemate translates to their powers.
The only arguments I have seen that hold at least some weight in discussions with these characters (aside from obvious "create a rock you can't lift" mental gymnastics bullshit you see everywhere), is using examples that hint that some of them are not actually Omnipotent. I.E. Presence's inferiority statement or TOAA's lack of knowledge and influence.
But again, those are just either extremely vague statements that do not mean anything, or obvious cherry picked instances that contradict the obvious outlook the writers and the lore has, and "beyond Omnipotent" argument reaches a new level of mental gymnastics and reaching. At the end of the day, God(s)/Creator(s) and beings with Omnipotence are truly unusable in VS battles.
That's my list. Hopefully you enjoyed, and let me know if I missed some characters.