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kaoscrystals

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#1  Edited By kaoscrystals

@lilgodperv said:

@kaoscrystals: What the hell is going on here??!! God reinhard erases dragon ball and all the HST just by existing.

Oh is it pre atziluth Reinhard thrn its hsrd to say.

You do know jiren can survive hakai which erases soul and body.

As for mind, people far weaker than jiren has resisted mind manipulation like vegeta was able to overcome mind manipulation.

Ki shield should be enough to do it.

At best if its pre atziluth thrn its stalemate.

And if its post atziluth/god then reinhard erases dragon ball verse

I do not see how Jiren survives conceptual erasure though.

Reinhard's spear ignores the opponent's speed and their distance as a concept and he destroys them on a level that erases them as a concept, which is completely different to Hakai, because it ignores all forms of durability. So for example the Spear can kill Tiamat from FGO that has no concept of death, it applies the concept of death, and then erasing you on a conceptual level.

Machina (one of the abilities that the spear is based on) could destroy Valerian Trifa that was stated to have anti-physical, anti-magical and even other Holy Relics (that directly attacks the souls and are magic) cannot even dent/scratch Valerian Trifa and Machina one-shots him despite Valerian Trifa having anti-magic and anti-physical. Means that Machina's conceptual erasure ignores things that are supposed to nullify what his erasure is based on. Because Machina's Holy Relic is magic and it ignored the nullification that supposed to render Machina's fists useless because of "anti-magic".

Thus it ignores durability and also nullification.

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kaoscrystals

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@kingxix: Lets say your right, how does Jiren kill Reinhard when as long Mercurius is alive, he can't die. how does Jiren survive Reinhard's soul hax, mind hax, durability hax, immortality nullification??

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#3  Edited By kaoscrystals

@kingxix:I guess all the fighters have infinite speed and above change when they are clearly moving in a space explicitly stated that there's no concept space and time.

Oh and apparently Jiren is above time in a space where there's no time at all and is that is why when Android 17, Frieza survived at the end of the battle Jiren was frustrated that he cannot defeat Goku, Android 17 and Frieza right before the Tournament ended, oh okay.

Jiren is above time when he was affected by gravity itself, okay makes sense.

@ecoblitz@lmaolmaolmao OMG Jiren above time but couldn't defeat 3 people in a couple of minutes kek 100/10 logic right there

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@kingxix said:

@kaoscrystals:

"As Gods of Destruction, they possess the power to destroy almost anything with little effort, even intangible beings such as souls. People destroyed by Hakai do not go to Other World and simply CEASE TO EXIST"

"CEASE TO EXIST" Are you blind or what? It clearly says that they cease to exist. What does that mean? It means that the concept of that person or being is erased. Is it so hard to understand. It's just that we don't get a proper explanation doesn't mean that it is weaker.

And people weaker than jiren can resist it fine. What makes you believe that jiren can't survive it?

I dare you to give me one time when Hakai has destroyed a concept like Methuselah?

Beerus literally said that Hakai doesn't work on IMMORTAL BEINGS meaning it doesn't erase them on a conceptual level. Erasing someone on a conceptual level means that it ignores all forms of durability, including immortality.
I already sent how Machina's fists has destroyed plenty of beings that are immortal, I dare you to send one-time Hakai destroyed an immortal being despite he said that it doesn't work on immortal beings.

The Hakai only erases the souls and their body, it doesn't destroy them as an idea and concept.

Give me one time it worked on a pure conceptual being?? I dare you.

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#5  Edited By kaoscrystals

@kingxix said:

@kaoscrystals: OMG Dude did you not see my other posts. I am not talking about the hadou gods. I know hadou gods can erase dragon ball verse. I talking about before he ascended to Godhood.

His base is nowhere close to universe level.

His base form is universal as the author stated the Pre-Atziluth is onpar with a character called Amakasu Masahiko from Ragnarok and Methuselah is equal to the 7 Demon Kings and they are multi-galaxy.

His base form spear and Hadou God form has no difference whatsoever. Do you even read Dies Irae or are you being here pretending to read it?

I dare you to send feats of Jiren tanking something similar to Reinhard's Spear as his Spear even before Pre-Atziluth is always faster than its target, never misses, and kills whatever it hits on a physical, mental, spiritual and conceptual level before dragging their soul to Valhalla to become part of Reinhard's legion whenever Reinhard throws the spear at his foe. Reinhard can also instantly curse the target with a Stigma with the Longinus should he choose to at anytime, making them a part of his Legion the moment they die. Additionally, the spear can also ignore the concept of distance, as Rindou Koga (his Holy Relic's successor in Kajiri Kamui Kagura) was able to do this through her use of it against the Tenma's and Valeria was able to use this to get close to Wolfgang and attack him in surprise while the latter had his True Briah active; this aspect allows Reinhard to have the spear fired at his enemies in an instant without having to cross any distance at all.

Jiren cannot dodge the lance, he cannot transport to another realm because it ignores the concept of space and distance and can cross dimensions.

He cannot resist as it not only destroy his soul and body, but the Longinuslanze Testament Lance can erase them on a level that makes all forms of durability useless.

Machina's fists were able to destroy Valerian Trifa and his body was stated to have anti-physical, anti-magic (which Machina's fists are based on), anti-time (meaning he's not affected by any forms of time manipulation)

I dare you to send me once when Jiren has survived getting erased as an idea and concept that ignores concepts like durability and immortality and Machina's fists can inflict death even upon beings that cannot even die.

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@kingxix: omfg has jiren ever tanked something strong as conceptual erasure

do you have proof that jiren has survived not just getting his soul erased but himself as a idea???? That bypasses concepts like immortality and durability

Hakai is literally nothing compared to Michael's fists that can negate all forms of durability. the only way you can resist his fist is to reset your history, which the protag did by constantly resetting his history to 0.

When activated, his arms are covered in a pair of black-armored guards that cover his entire arms. In this state, all of Machina’s punches now have the effect of erasing the existence of their target as long as they have a history (Which can include every single second of one's life, and works on material and immaterial beings, and even inanimate objects). This even applies to concepts (As they have existed since the Big Bang), allowing him to destroy Methuselah and the concept of darkness he embodies had Machina landed a direct hit. The only possible ways to bypass this ability are to be higher-dimensional (As it is impossible for Machina to actually hit them), have no time of history (as even as little as a millisecond of existence can count as having history), or to simply avoid all contact with his fists.

his fists doesn't just erase souls and bodies, it erases abstract concepts like luck, fire, darkness, distance and also it erases the opponents on a level as a concept and idea. Meaning it bypasses concepts and the idea of immortality and durability.

Machina's fists could shatter the body of Kristoff Lohengrin that has anti-physical, anti-accident, anti-magic, anti-time. Kristoff was also immortal. Meaning Machina's fists bypasses durability all these anti durability

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hakai is nothing compared to Hadou God's where the mere blood lust can erase the bodies and souls

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#8  Edited By kaoscrystals
@kingxix said:

@kaoscrystals: No Reinhard before atziluth isn't universal. His castle which exists outside of time and space is due to his son being part of it.

He himself is only continent to multi continent level.

"As Gods of Destruction, they possess the power to destroy almost anything with little effort, even intangible beings such as souls. People destroyed by Hakai do not go to Other World and simply cease to exist."

It pretty clear states that a person will cease to exist. And I don't believe that pre atziluth Reinhard can erase zamasu who is the multimeter itself and was even effecting the timelines.

The beast's best feat is erasing Methuselah who is at best planet level. He has never destroyed universe level beings before atziluth.

bullshit you never read Dies Irae

each darkness that Methuselah holds is worth half a planet of Earth, it was said in Ikabey that he has accumulated millions of night and adding that with Suigin's Eigo-Kaiki where he resets the world and he collect more nights because of his world reset.

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Masada Takashi say that Methuselah is onpar with the 7 demon kings that are multi-galaxy tier

⑦神格クラス : 覇道神・求道神

⑥神の眷属クラス : メトシェラ・夜都賀波岐・天使・悪魔・七大魔王

⑤人間最強クラス : 三騎士・ロト・龍明

④人間上位クラス : ヴィルヘルム・ベアトリス・トリファ・東征軍の主力

③人間中堅クラス : 螢・ルサルカ・ノウ・龍水

②個人ではそれほど武力のないクラス : リザ・咲耶

①人間下位クラス :シュピーネさん

it says here that Reinhard hand has a universe compressed into a spear

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its very very very clear how you not read dies irae cause his spear was stated that he could destroy anyone that has no soul resistance damage by just pointing at them.

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Kemonodono's spear has properties of three of his commanders

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this means that beastly companion's spear can literally one-shot everyone in Dragon Ball as stated here.

oh hol' up theres more

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Beerus conceded that he cant destroy immortal beings and hakai only destroys people's physical and their souls.

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Ougon's spear destroy people as concepts, it bypasses immortality as his spear blast literally one shotted an immortal dark divinity

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Transcending the very concept of space and distance, crossing even dimensional borders. No realm is safe, for there are no place where this lance can't reach.

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#9  Edited By kaoscrystals

@ecoblitz: @kingxix: Quite a few misconceptions, Pre-Atziluth Reinhard is universal level and Reinhard's spear doesn't just erase your existence, it erases thoughts, concepts and everything that's abstract and Hakai only erases your entire soul and body, it doesn't work on immortal beings, I can guarantee you that Ougon's spear can easily one shot Zamasu, all forms of him no matter how immortal he is.

Furthermore, The Golden Beasts' spear was stated to ignore the concept of speed and distance, no matter how fast you are, you can always get tagged no matter what.

Atziluth Reinhard Heydrich erases people on a metaphysical level if you scale him to his owner Suigin.

Ougon Shishi as a full fledged God can use all of his Legion's power that can metaphysically drain you, it can paralyze you and also his Law destroys everything and anything passively and binds their souls to him.

Kemonodono, also has nigh omniscience and is also nigh omnipresent and is a walking multiverse and his existence crushes all reality easily. Hadou God's can do anything, as simple as having bloodlust can erase the soul of everyone that existed.

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