Hovant1

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Hovant1

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@mike_fowler:

Thank you for the thoughtful reply and well constructed counter point.

While watching the film I understood why Killmonger intended to play the long game, but I felt ultimately his plan had too many glaring flaws for me to ultimately believe that it went off so perfectly without any issue. Especially when it all hinged on whether or not Tchalla said anything to the rest of the court. His plan literally could of been undone by saying you helped Klaw escape and now you are attempting to threaten the integrity of this nation by coming here and challenging me. I'm sure the court who are already distrustful of outsiders would have taken Tchallas word over his and had him executed or at least exiled from the nation. But for some reason Tchalla doesn't even tell his best mate Wakabi about this and allows him to believe he failed.

To me from a story perspective the conflict could have literally started at the beginning of the film with Killmonger just dragging Klaws body to Wakanda and demanding a challenge. But the plan laid out in the film would have literally had him fail if not for the fact Tchalla did not talk.

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Hovant1

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Probably have to agree with most people saying Thanos, Magneto and Zod having the best motivations as Villians. This isn't saying anything about there plans and how well executed they were.

I always thought Thanos plan was stupid and doomed to failure. However, saw that as a manner for him to justify his bloodlust or his own delusions of being a god.

Magneto despite having the most poignant motivation for why he does what he does I always felt was doing things conterproductive to his own goals. Especially young Magneto in Days of Future past, where he is literally told they only make sentinals if you try and kill the world leaders, and what does he do? He trys to kill even more powerful people with more attention. Surely he would see that he only further exemplifies the fear of mutants and the need for the sentinals.

Zod probably has the most sound plan to reach his goals and fit his motivations more then any other Villian on the list. He felt as an indivdual that his only choice to preserve his people and his culture was to wipe out humanity so that his people have a chance at a future. Even though his goals were probably the most evil in terms of complete death of a people, his motivations are understood and his plan is straight forward in achieving his goal.

Despite all this I see a few people saying Killmonger is one of the best and I don't understand how you can logically think so? When you break down his motivation and his plan this is where I run into the most issue with the Black Panther film outside of the horrible CGI action. We as an audience are suppossed to believe his complete disdain for white people and desire to then want to opress them comes from a childhood where he was opressed by the system, despite the film only showing us that any tangible reason for his suffering comes from other indivduals of African descent (AKA, Tchaka killing his father). I would have preffered if his motivation was just hating Wakanda for leaving him an orphan, and his desire is to rip down the kingdom which took everything from him. Are we suppossed to believe that not a single white person showed him any kindness in his life that is why he has such strong convictions against them despite not being shown why he feels like so.

Throughout the X-men films we are shown why Magneto hates humanity, mostly due to the fact he experienced the worst of humans by being in concentration camps. (His Motivation is tangible and believable and we see the horror he faced from humans).

Thanos Shows us his homeworld and what his peoples negligence caused, they literally stand in the aftermath of it.

Zod we clearly see that his people are destroyed and his one driving goal now is to try and preserve his people and culture by any means necessary.

With Killmonger the only reason we see for his suffering and motivation is directly caused by an African indivdual. And then we are suppossed to believe without any tangible proof that in a world filled with monsters and Aliens that he is oppressed due to his skin colour. And this opression drives his motivation despite never being shown it any where in this film.

Outside of his motivation, Killmongers plan makes little to no sense to me as he literally conspires with an Evil (white) person to then help him infiltrate Wakanda. At no point in the film does it even explain why he couldn't have killed Klaw at the beggining of the film dragged his body to Wakanda and fought Tchalla when everyone else literally did. He instead helps Klaw steal Vibranium, Hop around the world, attempt to sell that Vibranium, get caught by Tchalla (this is where his plan could have fallen apart), rescue Klaw and then finally kill him and drag him off to Wakanda, where in the film for some reason Tchalla doesn't deny his request for a right to combat by simply telling everyone in the royal court that this individual is a co-conspirator of Wakandas greatest enemy Klaw and was the one that helped him escape after Tchalla had already captured him.

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Hovant1

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I feel as though Zod wins this fight.

Carol blowing up those ships is something we have seen other characters do in Marvel films repeatedly such as Thor flying through those drop ships and destroying them casually in Infinty War. The Ships I'm sure were exploding due to a combination of her strength and her energy projection, not becasue her punches were creating shockwaves. Same probably with Thor and his lightning.

However, Zod was creating Shockwaves almost repeatedly against superman in their fight and not looking worse for wear throughout it. almost every punch thrown in that fight was creating some form of shockwave not by any additional power but just by their strength.

Zod and Carol I would say have comprable Speed in battle with Zod being a little faster in a fight. Carol defintley has Travel Speed won.

Carol is powerful but all her best feats I believe are not necessarily strength but energy projection and energy amped strikes. And I feel comfortable with Zod being able to avoide her best energy attacks and just lay into her with his superior striking strength.

And finally people saying Carol no sold Thanos headbutt forget about the context of that entire exchange. Thanos has fought a huge battle just prior to this against 3 powerful heroes, he is most likley a little worse for wear just from that and exhausted. Carol just came into this fight fresh. And most importantley Thanos was wearing the Gauntlet when that headbutt occured i.e. a weapon that is literally killing the user even before they actually use it. Do people forget that Hulks arm was basically burning before he even did the snap. The fact that Thanos could wear the Gauntlet and not have his body fall apart just by wearing it shows how powerful he is, but that doesn't mean it wasn't having an adverse effect on him. You even see Thanos Brace himself for the energy. The gauntlet doesn't make the user physically stronger. It gives them god like power at a cost to themselves. Prior to to the headbutt Thanos actually tosses Carol aside pretty easily. She wasn't hurt from it but it's still impressive considering that she is so powerful.

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Hovant1

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I'd say she stops at 6 or 7 depending on if her sword can hurt either Colossus and Megatron. I actually think Colossus has better durability then Megatron, though can't be sure. If Alita's blade cuts them she wins easily. If not she hasn't shown significant enough strength to be able to put them down. If the sword is out as a viable option then Colossus or Megatron will eventually grab her and tear her apart.

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Rest in Peace Stan Lee

He will be missed. Personally no man in the comics industry has affected me more then the legend himself. I know this might sound foolish but the characters he created and the messages they conveyed helped to shape a part of the person I have become today.

I hope he finds peace

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I see Venom pulling a majority in a pure H2H fight, but the Ultimate Predator wasn't put down by anything less then his own weaponry and a huge bit of luck. And while Venom stands at about 8ft tall Ultimate Predator was stated as being 11ft tall in the movie, so he does have the size advantage in this fight.

If weapons were allowed in the fight then I'm sure predator could take a majority especially with the plasma canon.

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@dajhonmccloud: You don't think there is a chance at all for Luke Cage?

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#9  Edited By Hovant1
Ultimate Predator
Ultimate Predator
Luke Cage
Luke Cage

  • Round 1: H2H no weapons
  • Round 2: Ultimate predator gets his wrist blades
  • Round 3: H2H Luke Cage gets help from Bushmaster and Ultimate predator gets help from the smaller predator from the film.
No Caption Provided
No Caption Provided

Rules:

  • No cloaking for the predators
  • starting 200 meters apart
Battle Takes place here
Battle Takes place here

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#10  Edited By Hovant1
No Caption Provided
No Caption Provided

  • Cap has his Wakanda Shields
  • And Knowledge of their abilities NOT their weakness
  • He has 5 minutes to prep for them before they arrive
  • Fight takes place in and around the house where the movies was held

Round 1: Cap Vs One Monster

Round 2: Cap Vs Two Monsters

Round 3: Cap & Bucky (he has his infinity war gun) Vs 3 Monsters