Galactus616

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Galactus616

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@thejdg: Super 13 was nowhere near as strong as second form Cell.

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Galactus616

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@thoromdil: Yeah MUI Goku was clearly better because he beat a weaker character from a previous arc who had various impressive showings against other weaker characters from a previous arc lol. Great logic

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@jonathancarlton: Yeah MUI Goku is definitely Angel-level. That's why he got embarrassed by Whis, lost to Granolah (who was stated to still be weaker than Beerus), and was outright stated by Toyotaro to still be weaker than Beerus. 😂

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@elenwood: Yeah that was an error. It was confirmed to be MUI Goku that he was referring to and besides, that was already debunked anyway because it's been recently confirmed that Beerus > MUI Goku which puts that whole Jiren being stronger than Beerus nonsense to rest.

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#5  Edited By Galactus616

@vydeos: "There are many things wrong here"

Funny you should say that considering that you haven’t done a great job of proving it.

"Literally no. Jiren overpowered MUI Goku's full power Kamehameha with one hand. MUI Goku was slammed on to the ground. Normally he wouldn't be able to get up. But he got up again after Krillin's encouragement. This time he was a lot faster. This was literally stated. Soon, Jiren was the one who got knocked down. This caused him to rage, since he didn't believe in trust. He broke his own limits again, and tried to attack Goku's friends. Goku blocked the attack, and raged. This caused him to beat Jiren. Normal MUI could not beat Jiren."

Literally yes, and the proof is in the episode itself. That’s the worst part about it. I like how you said he overpowered Goku's full-powered Kamehameha “with one hand” as if that’s supposed to mean anything. As if Jiren was holding back or something, or he just casually overpowered the blast. He clearly used his full power as well. He doesn’t need to use two hands to use his full power whenever he can simply channel his power into one of them. Frieza’s most powerful attacks are one-handed moves, it doesn’t mean that he’s holding back. “Normally he wouldn’t be able to get up.” Lol based on what? He’s gotten up from a lot worse whenever he was at much more of a power disadvantage. In that very same arc as a matter of fact. Where’s your evidence that he was “a lot” faster after Krillin's encouragement? All that was said was that he increased his speed and was even faster than before. Nothing suggests that he got way faster, especially considering that he was already fighting on par with Jiren and landed damaging blows to him even before. Jiren got the upper hand in the beam struggles, but Goku still hung in there and practically no-sold the first one and then still got up from the second one and was able to continue fighting just fine and even power up more soon after. You literally just proved my point here – which was simply that MUI Goku was already above Jiren even before his “rage boost" – so good job on that. Like I said and like you even confirmed yourself, he already gained the upper hand before that whenever he got the better of Jiren in their last clash and dropped him. This led to Jiren raging and trying to attack his friends, which is what caused the “rage boost.” I’m curious as to what you consider to be “Normal MUI Goku.” Because from the way it looked to me, that was Normal MUI Goku. It was very much his own power after all, he didn’t have any amps or anything. Or are you specifically referring to before he was stated to have increased his speed, when he was still getting used to the new power and (as I already mentioned) was still fighting toe-to-toe with Jiren and withstanding two of his full-powered blasts moments apart from one another (even no-selling the first one)? He straight-up shook Jiren even before powering up more as Jiren couldn’t believe that he was able to continue fighting after he blasted him to the ground. Either way, Goku even before his rage boost was superior to Jiren and it was proven.

"What are you even on? Base Gogeta > SSB Goku and SSB Vegeta? Are you sure you aren't high right now? Base Gogeta literally ran away from Broly in the movie, and deflected a few blasts. That makes him stronger? And since when did a Base fusion have a higher multiplier than SSB? You mean to tell me Vegito base from the zamasu arc is stronger than Goku and Vegeta SSB? This is the stupidest thing I have read all day."

Lmao, I’m high? That’s cute. Are you sure you’re not high right now? Are you sure you even seen the movie? Base Gogeta casually dodged and deflected SSJ Broly's blasts while SSB Goku and Vegeta got stomped. Base Gogeta literally ran away? Lol oh you mean like how SSB Goku and Vegeta did? Fail. Gogeta did better in his base form than either of them did in their SSB forms. Oh, and by the way, I actually did get to rewatch the movie and Broly actually got hits in and fought toe-to-toe with SSB Goku before he even went SSJ himself. Meanwhile, Base Gogeta never even got touched by a much stronger Broly who was also still rapidly growing in strength. So yeah, I rest my case, Base Gogeta > SSB Goku/SSB Vegeta. Since when? Since forever. Base fusions have always had a higher power level than either of the two users individually, even in their strongest forms. This has literally always been the case in Dragon Ball ever since fusion was introduced and it has never been shown to be the other way around. Lol well you clearly don’t read a lot then.

"If anything, the battle royale between the GODs in the manga proved how even the GODs were not, who was strongest. Beerus with UI was able to dodge for a little while. Then was caught by Mosco. We also see Beerus land his full power attack only for it to be blocked completely by Sidra. Then Belmod knocked everyone down with an attack, and Helles tried to shoot Liquir, but he reacted fast enough to block. Then Rumsshi roared, which instant KO'd all the kais, and shook everyone up. Each GOD has their own special moves. Beerus wasn't the strongest one there. And saying Beerus and Quitela are the strongest GODs because they were the last one standing is like saying Android 17 is the strongest in the TOP."

LOL no, definitely not. The Gods all teamed up on Beerus and still couldn’t take him down. Yeah, he was eventually caught by a sneak attack, which he broke free from and proceeded to win. I don’t even know where you got your bs claim that Beerus used his full power for that attack, but it doesn’t matter because you’re wrong anyway. Especially considering that Sidra is one of the weaker Gods. Belmod literally went down and pretended like he was KO'd, then he caught the other Gods with his sneak attack which was how he knocked them down. There was nothing impressive about that so don’t even try to use that nonsense. Beerus was the only one fighting the rest of them head on and still maintaining the upper hand. Belmod relied on tricks and trying to catch the others by surprise to do damage, which he wouldn’t have had to do if he really was that strong compared to the rest of them. No lmao, it really isn’t, because unlike 17, Beerus was actually fighting all of the other Gods at once head-on. 17 hid under the rocks while Goku beat Jiren up, and then finally emerged with Frieza after Jiren had already been severely weakened from Goku and was tired. The two then began teaming up on him while Goku recovered, then once Goku got back in the fight, it became Goku and Frieza vs. Jiren while 17 watched in the background. Goku and Frieza double-eliminated themselves along with Jiren and 17 ended up winning by default since he was the last person standing. This is absolutely nothing like Beerus and Quitela being the last two standing, especially not Beerus, who as I already mentioned actually fought all of the other Gods head-on and at the same time on top of that. 17 never fought Jiren head-on and did anything, let alone Jiren plus numerous others at the same time. He hid under some rocks pretending to be out while someone else did all the work. Gee, I wonder who that reminds me of. 😂 Saying that Beerus is the strongest because he was one of the last ones standing after being teamed up on by numerous other participants is actually more like saying that Jiren was the strongest because he was also one of the last ones standing after being teamed up on by numerous other participants, which is basically true. 🤷‍♂️ It's a known fact that the Gods are not all equal in power. This has been proven on numerous occasions. Like for example, Beerus being flat-out stated to be stronger than Champa. Another one is the simple fact certain universes weren’t even allowed to compete in the ToP because it was said that their mortals were too strong, which also basically sh*ts all over the notion that Jiren was stronger than all of the Gods by the way. Not to mention the best one of all, which is the simple fact that Beerus was literally stated on panel to be the strongest God of Destruction. So yeah, you tried. Lol

"This statement is correct. Frieza only fought Jiren after he was beaten, and the first time Jiren was shown to increase his power at all was the first time Goku got Ultra Instinct omen. He obviously powered down after that, since he was blocking base Vegeta's punches."

It’s actually not correct at all. Jiren was flat-out stated to be at full power numerous times in the episode descriptions. And besides, even if Frieza never fought full-powered Jiren, he was still present whenever Jiren powered up to his max and even broke his limits, so logically he would’ve been able to sense his ki. Regardless, he still said what he did about Broly even after witnessing Jiren’s absolute best, and Broly was still only SSJ at the time.

"Again, this is true. Even if we assume that Whis somehow calculated Full Power Jiren's power from pushing back a spirit bomb, and we assume FP Jiren > Belmod, then LB Jiren is still a great deal stronger than that."

Which would still mean little considering that it’s already been established that Beerus > Belmod and MUI Goku > LB Jiren, and the former was only stated to be possibly > Beerus. A statement which was ultimately left out of the show for the record, because clearly the writers didn’t want to go that route. And that’s still leaving out the best part about this all which I’ll get into later. All I can say is that comments like yours really haven’t aged well. 😂

"Let's look at the facts shall we? Golden Frieza was able to remain in his Golden from against SSJ Broly, despite getting beat up. Frieza got completely annihilated and punched out of his Golden form by Toppo GOD. He was KO'd for a while until he was able to get back on his feet. I don't care how you wanna twist this, but SSJ Broly failed to KO Frieza, while Toppo GOD knocked him out of his Golden form."

Yeah, let’s look at the facts. A stronger version of Frieza said that no being in existence could beat Broly despite having witnessed LB Jiren and MUI Goku in the past, and that was only SSJ Broly he was referring to. The fact that Toppo knocked a weaker version of Frieza out of his Golden Form means little given that it was just that, a weaker version of Frieza. SSB Vegeta also managed to knock Frieza out of his Golden form during their fight in RoF, but no one compares those two fights because again, it was a weaker version of Frieza. I don’t have to twist it any kind of way whenever the facts are already on my side.

"This is basically a bunch of BS. Beerus is a God of Destruction. His job is to destroy worlds. Even Piccolo could sense Broly's Ki, so obviously Beerus could too. So you don't think Beerus was concerned that Broly was destroying Earth? Sure you might say he doesn't care, but you don't think he was concerned or at least intrigued there is another guy that strong? I mean his whole thing with SSG Goku is that he wanted a worthy opponent. You don't think he would show up just to see what's going on? Keep in mind that Beerus has no idea who Broly is. It would be wise to at least check him out. The only reason he didn't show up, is because he had complete faith in Goku and Vegeta that they would defeat Broly. This is also why he said that "everything turned out alright" after Broly was defeated. Clearly Broly is nowhere near Beerus level if Beerus wasn't concerned about him"

Sure, it’s a bunch of BS even though you’ve failed miserably to debunk any of it lmao. It’s funny how you called that portion a bunch of BS and then proceeded to debunk your own argument a few sentences later. The fact that he didn’t even bother going to checkout Broly whenever he had (in the past) gotten excited about the far weaker SSG Goku just goes to show that his reaction (or lack thereof) towards Broly proved nothing. Unless you’re trying to say that SSG Goku was > Broly, which we obviously know is not the case. The only thing that does is reinforce my point that reactions aren’t exactly reliable all the time. Like I said before, Zeno was getting all excited throughout the whole ToP over characters who couldn’t even hold a candle to him. And your point about Beerus not being concerned about Broly doesn’t debunk what I said about his reaction towards Jiren either, which you completely dodged, by the way. As I have said numerous times in the past, the only reason why Beerus ever seemed worried about Jiren was because Jiren was a huge threat to Goku and the rest of Universe 7 and Beerus’s survival depended on them winning. Broly wasn’t even trying to destroy Earth, he never wanted to destroy it, he just wanted revenge against Vegeta. Which was his father’s doings more than anything. Plus Beerus never gets involved anyway so that’s a pretty pointless thing to bring up. He didn’t get involved whenever Moro was wrecking everybody on Earth and he hasn’t gotten involved so far in the Granolah arc either. He’s not a hero, he’s a God of Destruction. Even though he does fall more on the good guy side, he’s a neutral character overall. He’s not necessarily against good or evil. He actually said “It looks like everything turned out alright” and no, that’s actually not why he said that. Lol you're literally just using head canon to draw your own conclusions on things that happened and trying to pass them off as facts. 😂 Sorry, that doesn’t work here. Beerus saying “it looks like everything turned out alright” doesn’t prove that he was stronger than Broly or much less that he knew Goku and Vegeta would be able to handle it. Wtf? How do you even come up with that nonsense. 😂 Again, if anything, him saying that and then relaxing immediately afterwards seemed to imply more that he wasn’t sure that they’d be able to do it. Also, you seem to pretty much be saying that Beerus would’ve only gotten involved if he didn’t think Goku and Vegeta could handle Broly. Which is funny because Beerus had already witnessed MUI Goku by that point. So if (by your logic) Beerus would’ve only gotten involved if he didn’t believe Goku could win and he obviously knew that Goku was capable of achieving MUI, then guess what that means? Beerus > MUI Goku, like I said. Lastly, even if we concluded that Beerus > Broly, it still wouldn’t help Jiren’s case since we already know Beerus > Jiren.

"No. Just no. We could clearly see the power difference between Goku and Vegeta SSB and Vegito SSB. The power gap wasn't nearly as great as between SSB kaioken x20 and Ultra Instinct Omen. And if we use Super Vegito as reference, then SSB Vegito should only be stronger than a theoretical SSB3, which should be 8 times stronger than normal SSB. I would say Super Vegito was around 3-4 times stronger than SSJ3 Goku, which means SSB Vegito should be 3-4 times stronger than 8xSSB, or 32 times stronger than SSB. Even if we highball Super Vegito, and say he is 10 times stronger than SSJ3 Goku, Vegito SSB would only be 80 times stronger than normal SSB, which is around Goku (SSB kaioken x20 + Vegeta SSBE) x 2. Still far from Jiren. And I assume Gogeta SSB is equal to Vegito SSB. Also, training only increases base power, not the form mmultiplier."

Just more BS and head canon with no credibility or substance whatsoever. Where is your evidence that SSB Goku and Vegeta are closer to SSB Vegito in power than SSBKKx20 is to Omen? You don’t have any and you couldn’t even hope to back up such a ridiculous claim. I mean really, ordinary SSB Goku and Vegeta individually were closer in power to a fused version of them in SSB form than the much stronger SSBKKx20 was to an incomplete Ultra Instinct? Lmfao so you’re basically telling me that Omen was stronger than SSB Gogeta. 😂😂😂 Speaking of dumbest things we’ve read all day lol. Base Gogeta was stronger than SSB Goku/SSB Vegeta and that’s a fact. SSJ is a confirmed 50x multiplier of the user’s base form. Ultra Instinct Omen was not 50x stronger than SSBKKx20/SSBE lmao, nor was Jiren for that matter considering that he had trouble with Goku and Vegeta whenever he was fighting them in those forms. Yeah that’s 100% nonsense considering that Base Vegito already was already stronger than normal SSB and SSJ Vegito alone would be 50x stronger than Base Vegito, let alone SSB Vegito. Cool, and you would be wrong about it that too considering that BASE Vegito was already stronger than SSJ3 and like I’ve mentioned numerous times now, SSJ Vegito is 50x stronger than Base Vegito. Honestly, you claiming that Base Gogeta/Vegito isn’t stronger than normal SSB is ridiculous in itself and no knowledgeable DB fans would agree with you on that. Base Gogeta/Vegito being stronger than SSJ3 though?? That’s not even debatable lmao. Saying that SSB Gogeta would only be 3-4x stronger than SSB3 is also pretty moronic considering that even SSBKKx20 would be over 2x stronger than SSB3 and SSB Gogeta was clearly a lot stronger than SSBKKx20. 🤦‍♂️ Like seriously, SSJ Gogeta was stronger than SSBKKx20. Forget SSB Gogeta. You’re desperately trying to lowball Gogeta and it’s embarrassingly obvious. No, Jiren was not far stronger than 2x SSBE + SSBKKx20 otherwise he would’ve never had any trouble with them whenever they teamed up on him. 🤦‍♂️ Well first of all, I never claimed that the multiplier increases. Secondly, that’s a very nonsensical argument because if the user’s base power increases, then logically they’re only going to be that much stronger after the multiplier regardless on if it stays the same or not. You’re also basing these comparisons between Gogeta/SSB and Jiren/SSB on the logic that Goku and Vegeta haven’t gotten any stronger since the ToP, which is completely false. This whole portion of your post is a mess in general to be honest. You’re pretty much saying that Jiren > SSB Gogeta, which is laughable, to say the least.

"No. I don't know why you'd think in your twisted mind that Base Gogeta is stronger than two SSBs, but SSJ Gogeta is definitely NOT "2-2.5x stronger than SSBE and SSBKKx20". Winning a fight isn't all about raw power. For all we know, SSJ Gogeta could've been weaker than SSJ Broly, but had full stamina, plus speed and skill on his side, which allowed him to fight evenly. I'm tired of correcting people who say "Base Gogeta = SSB"."

Nothing twisted about it. It’s a fact, as I already explained. It was proven in the movie. SSB Goku was struggling with Broly in his Wrathful state. Once Broly went SSJ, even together in their SSB forms Goku and Vegeta were completely overwhelmed and ran for their lives out of there as soon as possible. Base Gogeta casually dodged and deflected ki blasts from SSJ Broly after he had been rapidly increasing in strength. Nothing shown or even stated supports SSB Goku or Vegeta being stronger than Base Gogeta. Actually he is. SSJ is a 50x multiplier and KKx20 is obviously a 20x multiplier. Mathematically speaking, that places SSJ at 2.5x stronger than KKx20 because 50 is 2.5x 20. Therefore, if Base Gogeta is stronger than SSB Goku (which he is), then logically SSJ Gogeta would be at least 2.5x than SSB KKx20 Goku. Sure, winning a fight isn’t only about raw power, but let’s be real here, most of the time, that is what it comes down to in Dragon Ball. Additionally, being more skilled doesn’t help if the difference in raw power is too great. It’s also interesting of you to say that because it seems to me like you specifically use arguments like this only whenever it’s convenient for you. For example, even though Gogeta clearly had the edge throughout their fight, you credited that to Gogeta simply having more skill and not necessarily being stronger. However, when it comes to Jiren and Goku’s battles, you just sum it up to Jiren being stronger by some ridiculous amount and not Jiren simply having a possible edge in skill in addition to the raw power advantage. You should be tired of it, because you’re completely wrong, and you’re just wasting your time trying to correct people on that. Base Gogeta > SSB. It’s obvious and all of the evidence supports it. SSB Goku struggled with Wrathful Broly while Base Gogeta never even got touched by SSJ Broly. There’s no way you can argue that SSB was stronger than Base Gogeta no matter which way you look at things.

"Don't make me laugh. You are either trolling or trying to be funny here. There is literally no way you can "prove" any of this. There is only speculation. We don't know if it was 50% 60% or 80%. Even Belmod has never seen Jiren at full power before. The only way we can tell that Jiren is near his max is if Jiren was struggling, which shows he is unable to go beyond. However he was not struggling at all against SSBE Vegeta SSB kaioken x20 Goku and Android 17."

Please, laugh lol. You might as well since it’s the only thing you really can do anymore after taking such a big L and posting such a ridiculous comment. I swear each line is even more ignorant than the last. The proof is in the description of the episode. Like literally it was flat-out stated. That’s all the proof we need. What are you talking about? We do know because it was straight-up stated, in both the description of the episode and in the episode itself by the narrator. Where do you get that Belmod has never seen Jiren at full power before? That was never said anywhere. Besides it wouldn’t matter anyway since again, it was stated in the episode that Jiren was at full power. What? Did you even watch the episode? Sure, he eventually overpowered them, but they had him on the defense for most of the fight, landed hits on him, and even damaged him, and you don’t consider that to be struggling? I’m starting to think that you have a different perception of reality than what the rest of the world does.

"If a fused SSB would be stronger than Jiren, don't you think Beerus would have allowed that in the TOP? Potara earrings were allowed by Zeno himself. Beerus only didn't let this happen, because he didn't want to lose two fighters at once, or in other words, he knew a fused SSB wouldn't be enough to take down Jiren. If a fused SSB is indeed stronger than Jiren, then relying on that is a whole lot better than relying on Goku to master ultra instinct."

Here you go with the head canon again. They didn’t want to fuse because if they by some chance got eliminated, their universe would be down two warriors instead of just one. This decision was made before they ever even met Jiren so that’s a moot point. The fact that you seriously think Jiren is stronger than SSB Gogeta is a joke. If Jiren was stronger than a fused SSB, he would’ve never had any trouble with a couple of amped individual SSBs. Also, if Beerus didn’t think that SSB Gogeta would be enough to beat Jiren – which is completely false because as I already mentioned, they made the decision to not use Potara before they even met Jiren – then he sure as hell wouldn’t have had any faith in either of them beating Jiren individually whenever he didn’t even know that Goku was capable of UI at the time. So once again, you fail. 😂😂😂

"It's also laughable how you claim you were "lowballing" Gogeta when you said base Gogeta is beyond SSB Goku and Vegeta. Literally watch the movie. All Base Gogeta did was run from Broly and deflect a few blasts. Half your argument was BS in your own scaling, and the other half was ranting about how other people with right statements are wrong."

It’s laughable how you claimed that SSB Goku was stronger than Base Gogeta, it’s laughable how claimed that Base Vegito was weaker than SSJ3 and Super Vegito was only 3-4x stronger than SSJ3 Goku (even though Super Vegito completely stomped Buuhan who was at bare minimum 16x > SSJ3 Goku seeing as how SSJ3 Goku < SSJ Gotenks < SSJ3 Gotenks/8x SSJ Gotenks < Gohan < Buuhan/Super Buu + Gohan, not to mention that even Base Vegito gave Buuhan a lot of trouble), it’s laughable how you claimed that SSB Gogeta was only a little bit stronger than SSBKKx20 Goku, it’s laughable how you claimed that SSB Gogeta was weaker than UI Omen, and it’s laughable how you claimed that SSB Gogeta was weaker than Jiren. Honestly your whole argument has been a joke and a complete cakewalk to debunk. I did watch the movie, thoroughly in fact. You should take your own advice and watch it because clearly your knowledge is lacking. I was lowballing Gogeta, all things considered. I mean I wasn’t lowballing him so much that I had him under UI Omen and only just above SSBKKx20 and SSBE 😂💀 but I definitely did lowball him a lot seeing as how logically he would be astronomically stronger than where I put him. He was stronger than SSB Goku/SSB Vegeta. It was proven in the movie and nothing contradicts it. Yeah, he casually dodged and deflected ki blasts from SSJ Broly while a combined Kamehameha/Galick Gun attack from SSB Goku and SSB Vegeta was easily overpowered by Broly and SSB Goku even struggled with Wrathful Broly. Plus like I said, this was when Broly was still rapidly growing in strength. So even the SSJ Broly who Base Gogeta fought was stronger than the SSJ Broly who sent SSB Goku running away. Actually it was very accurate scaling considering that it was going off of what was shown and was using the multipliers that was given in the Daizenshu, which is, y'know, just the canon source material. Nothing special or anything. 😂 And clearly they weren’t right, far from it in fact. Hence why they had nothing backing up their arguments aside from head canon (just like you), and it was so easy for me to debunk them (again, just like you). Like I said last time, plenty of evidence in the show and even direct statements support my case. It was stated or at the very least implied multiple times that Broly was stronger than Jiren. The description of the movie stating that Broly was the strongest foe they had ever faced, Frieza saying that no being in existence would beat him, Goku saying that he was probably stronger than Beerus (which he never said about Jiren), the description of the movie saying that his power was greater than Beerus’s (which again, was never said about Jiren), and the fact that Broly came after Jiren and it’s a well-known fact that every main antagonist from the current arc is always stronger than the one from the previous arc with Beerus being the only exception that there’s ever been to that rule in Dragon Ball history, and that was at the very beginning of Super on top of that. Last but certainly not least, that leaves me to my final point, which brings me back to Beerus, and boy do I tell you, comments like yours truly have aged badly. Because it was recently confirmed that Beerus > MUI Goku by seemingly a lot, which is current MUI Goku, by the way, not ToP MUI Goku who Jiren fought, current MUI Goku. Therefore, Beerus > Jiren. So with that being said, I rest my case. You tried though, kid. 😂😂😂

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Galactus616

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#6  Edited By Galactus616

Next up: "Why The Flash isn't FTL" 😂😂😂

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#7  Edited By Galactus616

What I mean by this is characters who get wanked the most with people either highballing them and making them out to be much more powerful than they are, or people saying that they would beat/stomp characters who they would either almost certainly lose to or they would have a solid chance of losing to.

In my personal opinion it's the characters below:

Superman

Thor

Jiren

One Punch Man

Jason Voorhees

Zoom

I've seen too many debates involving these characters where they were just outright wanked to be at a level that they weren't and were said to be able to do things that they simply cannot do.

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Galactus616

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@gokuisthebest: Lmfao you're a comedian. Post crisis Supes would get stomped by Thanos no questions asked. Supes isn't even on his level.

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@mrsportsguy13: Lmao yeah, no. Tobey even beating MCU Cap is doubtful. He's definitely not one-shotting him. Not by a long shot.

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Tony wins easily regardless of if it's Infinity War or Civil War. I don't even understand this nonsense of thinking that Civil War Tony was weak or something. He beat both Captain America and Bucky in a small confined space while his suit was heavily damaged and failing, and the only reason why Cap was able to damage it so much was because Tony was focused on going after Bucky the whole time while Cap was just getting free shots. At 100% Tony isn't losing regardless of whether it's Civil War or Infinity War.