This is really a great Idea, To celebrate her life,things that she was passionate about is a great way to pay her respect.
deactivated-5b9a7b52ce5df's forum posts
@galactic_1000 said:
@fat_hobo389 said:
@galactic_1000: no it isn't ben's fault it's serena and bellicus's fault. they literally agreed with ben then they were the ones who copied the universe. look at the episode.
Ben state he failed to do that.Ben is the voice of reason.They created it from their thought Ben`s thought making some difference in the universe
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not only that take a look at the episode "the forge of creation" here's the link both serena and bellicus agreed upon punishing paradox but before even they could do anything paradox escaped with ben. if serena and bellicus upon agreeing were omnipotent they would have punished paradox before he could even react. paradox would never get the chance to escape. Not to mention they say that the Celestialsepiens made a treaty with paradox about paradox not going 500 lightyears near the celestialsepiens. Omnipotent beings don't need any treaty with non omnipotent beings.
I said they can do anything only if they agree paradox escape from them before they agree.Alien X is omnipotent not omniscience.X punished him because paradox has disturbed their arguing.
Look I agree with you Ben stomps both rounds but calling Alien X Omnipotent is asinine. as their are so many things contradicts with that omnipotence.
If u don`t mix Omnipotent,omnipresent and omniscience then u wouldn`t have a problem.
I have given much more proof about their non omnipotence in this very thread look at them if you will.
and as I said before the term omnipotent is used by characters very losely, usually it is used to refer to someone who is immensely powerful.
In ben 10 it means can do anything.
galactus, darksied, odin, zeus, etc all has been called omnipotent by characters, even authors. But we know that is not true.
You know that because comic book itself debunked it.In X case Both show AND creator not only show or creator but both of them state they are omnipotent and can do anything.
DC/Marvel used omnipotent,omniscience and omnipresent Then it could be All powerful,All knowing,All where.Also even they call someone omnipotent we shouldn`t be worried because comic book itself will debunk it in future(They already did)
Ben state he failed to do that.Ben is the voice of reason.They created it from their thought Ben`s thought making some difference in the universe
what a bunch of nonsense, ben asked them to recreate the universe, they copied it and failed to create the exact copy. Bellicus and Serena were the one who created the universe with their power. watch the episode, clear your bias and watch the episode, you have no argument here.
and in the end of the episode "Universe vs Tennyson" where ben is put into trail for unauthorized creation of universe, the court even holds Serena and Bellicus as the Culprit and fines them.
SERENA AND BELLICUS AGREED TO COPY THE UNIVERSE AND THEY FAILED TO MAKE AN EXACT REPLICA. END OF THE STORY.
THE SHOW BACKS ME UP.
I said they can do anything only if they agree paradox escape from them before they agree.Alien X is omnipotent not omniscience.X punished him because paradox has disturbed their arguing.
I am confusing nothing.
pay attention to the video I show you.
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starting at 3:10
Paradox enters Alien X
Paradox : Hello!!!!
Ben: Professor paradox?
Paradox : You will not convince serena and bellicus to help you, not today.
then while Serena and Bellicus were debating, serena notices paradox
Serena : Time walker, you are not welcome here.
Bellicus : Agreed , Resolve punish paradox, for ignoring the treaty between him and the celestialsepiens race.
Serena : Seconded. ( here she literally agrees to punish paradox)
Paradox : I'm not supposed to go 500 lightyears near them.
after that he escapes.
so yeah paradox escapes after they agreed on punishing him. Not to mention the fact they were mad at paradox for violating the treaty. which is something omnipotent beings don't need.
NOW DON'T GIVE ME THE EXCUSE THAT PARADOX, ESCAPED BEFORE THEY COULD DECIDE THE PUNISHMENT, BECAUSE IF THEY WERE OMNIPOTENT, PARADOX COULD NEVER ESCAPE WITHOUT GETTING PUNISHED.
not to mention the fact paradox, changed ben back without serena and bellicus's will, in the past the episode " X = ben + 2" we see that ben cannot transform back without them agreeing.
In ben 10 it means can do anything.
and I gave you proof that they can't.
You know that because comic book itself debunked it.In X case Both show AND creator not only show or creator but both of them state they are omnipotent and can do anything.
DC/Marvel used omnipotent,omniscience and omnipresent Then it could be All powerful,All knowing,All where.Also even they call someone omnipotent we shouldn`t be worried because comic book itself will debunk it in future(They already did)
just like comics debunked the contextless,baseless claims, so did the show Ben 10 debunked that X or any other celestialsepiense are not omnipotent.
PROOF OF THAT FACT ARE
1. CELESTIALSEPENCE NEEDED TO MAKE TREATY WITH PARADOX. (WHICH OMNIPOTENT BEINGS DON'T NEED TO DO,ESPECIALLY CONSIDERING HOW MUCH THEY HATE PARADOX)
2. NON OMNIPOTENT BEINGS LIKE AGGREGOR WAS CAPABLE OF ABSORVING THEIR ENERGY. THAT CAN NEVER HAPPEN, AS EVEN THE SMALLEST POWER OF AN OMNIPOTENT BEING IS INFINITE, AND AGGREGOR IS NOT INFINITE, NIETHER IS HIS ABSORBING CAPABILITIES.
3. THE WHOLE PARADOX THIG.
4. PARADOX TRANSFORMING BEN WITHOUT EVEN SERENA AND BELLICUS AGREEING.
5. SERENA AND BELLICUS FAILED TO MAKE AN EXACT COPY OF THE UNIVERSE DESPITE AGREEING TO DO SO.
6. THE CELESTIALSEPIENS AND BOUNDED BY THE LAW, AND UNAUTHORIZED UNIVERSE CREATION IS A CRIME, FOR WHICH BEN WAS HELD GULITY.
7. THE FIGHT WITH GALACTIC GLADIATOR, WHICH HE LOST. AN OMNIPOTENT BEING DOESN'T LOSE A FIGHT, EVEN IF IT IS AGAINST OTHER OMNIPOTENTS.
and you're gonna take the shows word?
in "forge of creation " Paradox says that Aggregor would become omnipotent if he absorbs the power of an infant celestialsepien. THAT CAN NEVER HAPPEN, A NON OMNIPOTENT BEING CAN NEVER BECOME OMNIPOTENT NO MATTER HOW MUCH POWER HE/SHE ABSORBS.
and in "universe vs tennyson" Chadzmuth calls the entire race of celestialsepiense omnipotent, in an desperate attempt to save ben, which no one buys and ben is still found guilt.
and you wanna talk about the creators, you wanna talk about Matt Wayne? he has no concept of omnipotence. here what he says.
he says that Alien X is omnipotent in THIS UNIVERSE.
that is literally a limit. if a being is omnipotent he should be omnipotent everywhere. no matter what universe he is in.
AN OMNIPOTENT BEING DOESN'T SUDDENLY BECOMES NON OMNIPOTENT IF HE GOES TO ANOTHER UNIVERSE, THEY DON'T LOSE THE CAPABILITIES OF DOING ANYTHING IF THEY ARE IN OTHER UNIVERSE.
MATT LITERALLY DEBUNKED HIMSELF.
AND WITH ALL THESE EVIDENCE, NO ONE CAN DENY THE FACT THAT ALIEN X IS NOT OMNIPOTENT.Unless they are biased fanboys.
@shadowwaker said:
@fat_hobo389 said:
@shadowwaker said:
1. Great the forge of creation exists outside of time.
so?
It's where ideas come to life...
2. Just love to stretch what you can't prove...I said I don't know why they were mad. That doesn't mean I didn't know about the treaty. The show doesn't explain it.
they were mad because paradox is violated the treaty it is literally in the video.
You are severely stubborn. It hurts my soul. Do you know why they were mad about the treaty...of course you don't.
3. The forge of creation is where ideas are created. What don't you get?
so? did I ever disagreed with that? however that doesn't make it remotely equal to the over void, at all because over void is the page and DC's entire multiverse in it looks like a tiny little spot.
So the overvoid is where ideas are made. I already told you this. You have an idea and it get created. Good talk.
4. Yet again you ignored that the show doesn't explain the why Paradox made a treaty with the celestialsapians. I know why the forge isn't visible...You said it was still visible from an access point.
no I said it was visible before paradox hid it as he himself implies.
That was the map of infinity he hid. Not the forge of creation.
5. Well maybe if you weren't trying so hard to debunk nothing, then this wouldn't be an issue. Yet again. You still don't understand. The show never showed or explained the treaty only that there is one.
that's not the point though, the point though, the point is omnipotents do not need to make treaty with non omnipotents, because they are omnipotents they can do anything, but that is not the case here is it.
They do if you are a timewalker.I It makes perfect sense.
All one needs to do is realize why treaties are made in the first place. Peace and compassion. Serena. Now get off my back.
lol you're kidding right? you're bringing serena here? the same serena who despite being the voice of love and compassion, got angry as hell by the mere sight of Paradox and didn't hesitated for a moment and agreed on punishing paradox, so much for your knowledge matey.
I needed to bring Serena, because you forgot how celestialsapians debate. You need to be reminded again?
get off your back? yeah that ain't happening, if this "debate" goes for a year I will keep debating for a year or years I will keep debating. don't get me wrong I have social life and my studies, I am currently in college, with math being my main and have to attain it every day, I to go gym every morning at 6 and most importantly I play a crap ton of video games over 70 to 100 in a year (not a lie by any means) and read some decent amount of comics, manga (mostly video game related ones). but that will never stop me from coming here and debunk the nonsense of people like you spread about things that I love like ben 10 which basically was the only cartoon and two of the only show(the other being pokemon) I watched when I was a kid. as you said I am super stubborn. there was time in this site when I claimed that I don't know much about ben 10 just so that I can avoid being called out as ben 10 had a bad reputation back then and I was fairly new, but not anymore.
This debate is going to go on for a year. Oh no...365 days stuck in constant stubborn debating. Also great job on your life's story, but perhaps you need a refresher course of Ben 10. Just as I am doing on the weekends and after school.
Because Galactic Gladiator wasn't defeated. He was lost in thought...The battle could still go on, but the council knew how how it takes for a celestialsapian to make a decision. He made a decision to which was not to fight Ben, but to escape that was the easiest choice. In the end he was given too many decisions. What don't you get?
you know you say that I need to watch the show, yet you're the one who is in dire need of doing that as it is obvious that how little you know about it.
Each time you show me what I already know and you just can't see.
I have showed you 3 links of the video here's the fourth
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let's watch it and let's prove you wrong again shall we, at 1:27 we see gladiator moving and regenerating his hand despite seeing multiple copies of ben, so no he was not lost in thought or motionless. at 1:32 we see the alien x making a void of some sorts, and at 1:33 we see gladiator trying to destroy that said void by punching it. at 1:36 we see gladiator trying to escape that void and at 1:38 we see that an energy constructs binds gladiator and pulls him inside that void and begging at 1:42 we see some sort of explosion happening which incapacitates gladiator i.e he loses. and definitely is unable to fight as ben carries him in. so yeah he loses. BIG TIME.
Voting on what to do...Hand vs multiple Bens. Hand wins. Now he has one target, but he's not focused enough to get out of it. Then he becomes motionless. What aren't you seeing?
Celestialsapians aren't bound by laws. Given the lack of punishment when creating recreating a new universe. Not too mention the reason why Celestialsapians even know about the recreation of a universe in the first place.
what? they indeed are, I mean how can you even deny that is beyond me, if they were not bounded by law they would never have to care about one unauthorized recreation,but they were and instead of going anywhere else they went to intergalactic court. it is true that they often create universes as ben's lawyer Chadzmuth said that (not that it is necessarily true as despite using that as a case for ben he was still found guilty), but it is unauthorized universe creation or recreation that got ben into trouble, so yeah they are bounded by law.
Bounded by a law that is barely followed; therefore there is no law. The court could only happen if a celestialsapian was not affected. And they weren't.
Yet again he wasn't hurt. The copies grew too large for his galaxy sized hand.
are you incapable of reading? I never said that gladiator was hurt, I said that ben destroyed his hand and got loose from his clutches.
Well now i am confused. Was it not you who claimed the Galactic Gladiator was hurt in previous posts? I believe it was, my dude.
A child...meaning you? It's interesting that you would associate yourself with them.
If I was a child then it would be more embarrassing for you, as it would mean that you are less knowledge able than a child and can not even understand what a child is saying.
That would hurt me more if i wasn't gifted myself.
I'm wanking...You are funny. Have you tried being a comedian?
and you should really get a checkup from a doctor as you are incapable of reading and understanding the simplest thing.
A checkup...right. Still laughing.
It's where ideas come to life...
So the overvoid is where ideas are made. I already told you this. You have an idea and it get created. Good talk.
so ideas coming to life makes the overvoid ? you're joking right? in mario there's a place called dream depot where the dreams of that places residents create new realities.
when in final crisis morrison said that when he says Ideas he meant the ideas of authors.
seriously this is what the infinite multiverse of DC looks like in the over void
the comparison is just asinine, and can you actually prove that the forge exists outside the multiverse? any official proof from the authors or statements from the show. I want solid proof not your fan theory.
You are severely stubborn. It hurts my soul. Do you know why they were mad about the treaty...of course you don't.
for christ's sake watch the show, they were mad because paradox broke the treaty. watch it again here
Voting on what to do...Hand vs multiple Bens. Hand wins. Now he has one target, but he's not focused enough to get out of it. Then he becomes motionless. What aren't you seeing?
really? seriously? when a celestialsepien even remotely loses focus that means he/she is indecisive. and when that happens they immediately become motionless, but that doesn't happens with here as we see him still trying to escape. so yeah try again.
Bounded by a law that is barely followed; therefore there is no law. The court could only happen if a celestialsapian was not affected. And they weren't.
yeah keep making excuses anyone that is not biased can see what is happening.
That was the map of infinity he hid. Not the forge of creation.
right you seriously need to watch the show before debating about it. Paradox hid both the forge and the map.
look at here.
Paradox:you want to go to the forge of creation, I am here to take you there.
Gwen: How? it's hidden.
Paradox : true, but I am the one who hid it.
yeah, so yeah, it is now quite clear to me ,how much you know.
They do if you are a timewalker.I It makes perfect sense.
no it does not make sense, it doesn't matter who you are, you will always be inferior to an omnipotent being. To an omnipotent the value of spiderman and The Living tribunal is the same. so no the treaty is still one of the many proofs that celestialsepiens non omnipotent.
@shadowwaker said:
@fat_hobo389: Now you listen here and you listen well. Omnipotence is all about unlimited power. And Alien x is well within this category.
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As for the Map of infinity. I have heard of all those Infinity items, but i have only seen the Infinity Gaunlet in action. Can these item's reach points beyond space and time?
A human who gained full control over a celestialsapian's body. He was not able to think with one mind. Why do I feel like you are underestimating Ben Tennyson.
Galactic Gladiator was put under a state of thought at the end. He was motionless.
I can't read simple logic...You got some nerve insulting someone who has the comprehension level that exceeds most people. I can make sense of pretty much anything.
I didn't entirely contradict myself. Thoughts usually tie in with how smart you are.
Galactic Gladiator wasn't scratched as you can see with his hand not having a scratch on him. Galactic Gladiator was as big a Galaxy. You can see all the galaxies are his size.
PIS ? so much excuses, omnipotents are not bounded by plot, even not omnipotents have shown capability of defying plot and generating it. some of them have even defied and killed the author.
mandrakk and thought robot from final crisis are literally plot generator, they can create stories literally, Lord of nightmares from Slayers literally beat the shit out of the stories author with a shovel, Lord english from homestuck literally went inside the author andrew hussy's realm and killed him despite the author having previous knowledge and prep. Asagi from disgaea franchise literally goes into differnt games in order to conquer them and become the protagonist, and none of these guys are omnipotent, so you expect me to believe that an omnipotent would be bounded bounded by plot or PIS? yeah no deal with the fact that alien X or the celestialsepiense are not omnipotents, and you cannot prove otherwise.
Sigh, Besides Mandrakk and thought robot. None of those guys have existed outside space and time. And can create their universe without a medium..
also reply to my comments at your hearts will, I probably won't be able to reply before sunday morning or evening, but reply I will,as that's a certainty.
Cool beans i'll just wait for my new hardware to be delivered.
if we go by that text book definition of omnipotence then there would be omnipotent characters everywhere. but that's not the definition that is used in fiction, in fiction when someone is omnipotent that would mean that said character is all powerful, unbeatable, no one can defy him/her or even harm her remotely and he/she can do anything and everything they are not bounded by anything, they are the supreme. and that is not the case with alien x or any other celestialsepien and I have give more than enough proof of that and I will give you more.
As for the Map of infinity. I have heard of all those Infinity items, but i have only seen the Infinity Gaunlet in action. Can these item's reach points beyond space and time?
yes, almost every single one of them can. infact asgard in marvel exists outside of time and space.
doctor who's TARDIS can also go in places which are beyond time and space.
and Forget all that ,in chrono trigger a man made time machines like epoch and lucka's time machine can travel in a place that is literally THE END OF TIME. and DARKNESS BEYOND TIME, where time and space don't exist.
A human who gained full control over a celestialsapian's body. He was not able to think with one mind. Why do I feel like you are underestimating Ben Tennyson.
I am not underestimating him. you're overestimating ben's and alien x's capabilities.
Galactic Gladiator was put under a state of thought at the end. He was motionless.
no he simply lost. ben confused him when he made multiple copies of himself, if Galactic gladiator were to be in a motionless state then he would have turned motionless as soon as ben made multiple copies of himself, but see him moving and regenerating his arm even after ben makes multiple copies of alien x.
I can't read simple logic...You got some nerve insulting someone who has the comprehension level that exceeds most people. I can make sense of pretty much anything.
yeah I apologize for that but you'e not understanding my simple logic in this thread. why? because you just said this two things
1st you said
Galactic Gladiator wasn't scratched as you can see with his hand not having a scratch on him. Galactic Gladiator was as big a Galaxy. You can see all the galaxies are his size.
okay when did I said his hand were scratched? I said
HIS BLOODY HANDS WERE DESTROYED AND BEN GOT OUT OF IT'S CLUTCHES, AN OMNIPOTENT BEINGS HANDS ARE NEVER DESTROYED, IT CAN NOT BE EVEN SCRATCHED, BUT GLADIATOR'S WAS HAND WAS DESTROYED SO NO HE OR ANY CELESTIALSEPIENCE IS NOT OMNIPOTENT.
I said as you can see what I said and what you interpreted. This is either because You didn't understand what I was saying, or you didn't properly read what I am saying.
2nd
Sigh, Besides Mandrakk and thought robot. None of those guys have existed outside space and time. And can create their universe without a medium. Whereas Alien X and other celestialsapians only require 6 or more thoughts to create an entirely new existence.
okay why exactly did you bring up the point, who existed out of time and space and who doesn't? I know who does and who doesn't, but my original comment was that about PIS. I said that those characters despite being non omnipotent beings are still not bounded by story or plot, so it is impossible for an omnipotent being to be bonded by plot i.e PIS.this was my point, but yet again you said something absolutely unrelated to this matter. So yeah your actions speak for themselves
now about existing outside of time and space and creating universe without any medium part.
what does existing outside of time and space have to do with power? absolutely nothing.
as I showed you before. asgard and the people of asgard exist out of time and space.
in pokemon giratina's distortion realm and giratina exist outside of time and space. in chorno trigger Spekkio the master of war exists outside of time and space.
in Marvel the true Limbo where Immortus resides, exists outside of time and space , and neither of these characters are even the most powerful in their own universe let alone omnipotent.
NOW WHAT DOES RECREATING THE UNIVERSE WITH OUT MEDIUM HAS TO DO WITH A BEINGS POWER? ABSOLUTELY NOTING.
THERE ARE SEVERAL BEINGS IN FICTIONS HAVE DONE THIS AND THEY ARE NOT EVEN THE MOST POWERFUL IN THEIR RESPECTIVE FRANCHISE.
WORLDS FUNNEST MXYZPTLK DESTROYED THE MULTIVERSE AND RECREATED IT WITHOUT ANY MEDIUM, AND THIS WAS AN INFINITE MULTIVERSE NOT AN FINITE UNIVERSE.
MOLECULE MAN, FRANKLIN AND REED RICHARDS RECREATED MARVEL MULTIVERSE WITHOUT ANY MEDIUM AND AGAIN INFINITE MULTIVERSE NOT FINITE UNIVERSE.
THE PROTAGONNIST OF HYDLIDE 3 DID THAT AND MANY MORE
IN ALL IN ALL RECREATING SOMETHING WITHOUT A MEDIUM MEANS NOTHING AS THE MEDIUM USUALLY HAS NOTHING TO WITH A BEINGS POWER.
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