@mage101 said:
Captain atom stomps.
cosmoman's forum posts
@jay_z94 said:
Lol no worries mate, I get you :D
Superman was never stated to “be 6D”. As I’ve already said, the writer says “beyond imagination” and “beyond possibility” multiple times and it’s very clearly a metaphorical theme throughout the story.
As I’ve stated before, people have knocked down entities much more powerful than themselves before, doesn’t mean they are anywhere near the level of that entity's power.
We don’t know WF’s durability but tbf, Mxy just said he can’t perceive the 6th Dimension.
WF about to hammer in a Multiverse with a special hammer and special anvil doesn’t really say anything about WF's durability.
Shattering a small planet while weakened is definitely impressive however planet breakers don’t mean anything to Titan so not sure how to use this.
Superman’s vibrations were felt across arguably 2 Universes but Hulked Thor ripped Ygg from it’s roots which contains at least 10 Universes, a much greater feat. Yet a calm Starship Hulk before he even received Mjolnir was capable of taking hits from and fighting an enraged Hulked Thor.
.
Superman never shook all of the dimensions, he was felt in them.
Not just that, he turned an entire planet into a mountain range by hitting the ground. A planet that was specifically stated to be as smooth as marble all over.
Not sure how to quantify this feat tbh, it just shows that planet busters are easy for Titan.
Yet in no way does this mean that Thor randomly created a thunderstorm on the Hulk planet. In-fact it's definitely not the case as she heard Hulk beating Thor, which itself didn't take place on the Hulk planet, therefore they heard the fight from another realm and the portal had already been closed. Even if we use your assumption that the cries in thunder was actual thunder, this is Thor’s thunder during his fight with Hulk being felt in another realm.
Her saying they heard Thor doesn’t mean that’s the only thing they heard, that’s fallacious logic. In order for them to think Hulk was fighting Thor who was crying out in Thunder, they would need to have heard Hulk too. Otherwise Thor could be crying out for any reason and they’d have no reason to think Hulk specifically "tore him in half and made the rivers with his blood".
Yes this does scale to Titan. As mentioned above, a calm Starship Hulk before he even received Mjolnir was capable of taking hits from and fighting an enraged Hulked Thor. And we know that Titan is more powerful than Starship Hulk. Yes Hulked Thor ripped his arm off but Hulk was still capable of fighting and smacked him into Ygg afterwards. Superman also has Hulk’s healing factor to contend with; in this run alone Hulk has regrown his arm twice, regenerated a gaping hole through his mid-section, tore open his own skull which healed as well as "burning and regrowing" while being shot by Tony's Celestial Hulbuster, stated to be the Celestial judgement of a hundred thousand exploding stars. Narration aside, if Superman managed to cause Hulk the damage of just 1 star, Hulk would regenerate.
This is false, he never came out against Thor. He was about to come out but then Thor said multiple times “It is too much” and stopped Tony's attack. Thor then proceeds to say “There is more at play here than either of us know. We have never faced anything like this before”. Hulk is mostly green and is very clearly stopped from fully transforming as the next time we see him he is fully green/starship hulk.
@rajjarsalt said:@jay_z94 said:- Superman didn’t “shake the cosmos”, his presence was felt from across the cosmos.
Same thing, no difference, it was felt as RUMBLING
Boom.
I guess this is my reply to Rajjarsalt too lol:
Superman never shook Universes. His presence was felt across the Universe/Universes, which then caused rumbling on Earth. If a gust of wind is felt inside a room (Universe) and that gust of wind shakes a hanging chandelier (Earth) in that room, does that mean the gust of wind “shook” the room? Obviously not lol
I know I said this before..... but you are a super sweet dud. It's like debating me..... Gave me energy to continue!
Actually it was directly stated superman was 6D, and ONLY after he started flying. Everything stated in this moment was as literal as the rumbles stated in the very same bubble:
The Author is telling you, this wasn't a metaphor. Again, The writer tells you this was a literal description of Superman's power here. 6D, and to top it off he hurt a 6D being.
As the comic shows: A being of literal dimensional difference is not getting Knocked bloody but someone as inferior as Superman was to World Forger (Non-6D to 6D comparison). When they say Superman reached a level beyond Imagination with his speed, they meant it.
Mxy's stats are all 5D. Durability as well, meaning 6D speed is not something he can handle. Hence why Superman >>> My when that Sundipped.
World Forger's Durability is 6D. Literally. Enough said, he is above 5D beings and all under him are inferior to him.
Beating planet busters when Superman at his VERY weakest was busting planets is irrelevant is the point.
If we're scaling: World Forger was going to Hammer the Multiverse into being with 1 swing (Multiversal Force) and literally is a dimension above Multiversal buster like Mxy who could barely open a door to his realm with full power. Superman still put World Forger on his but. Hulked Thor literally Ripped an Amped starships Hulks arm off. Why you keep comparing the 2 is beyond me.
Superman's vibrations were felt in all of them. Meaning, he was felt across the vacuum of (at least) 2 universes and the dimensions that usually can't feel anything from 6D.
Cool. But hitting a planet or even busting a planet is something the weakest version of Superman has already done
Planet busters, again, are nothing to this version of Superman. They clearly matter more to Titan than someone who literally is felt across universes as a vibration.
You debunked yourself. It was a thunderstorm, and not only that but she heard "hulk beating Thor" is fiction because hulk never beat Thor. He got Wrecked by Thor, even hulk acknowledged that. Again, she saw Hulk be interrupted by Thor and started with head canon based on weather. That's how Myths, like the one she literally is telling, are made.
She never said she heard Hulk, that's head canon. She quite literally says she heard cries of Thunder only. And then goes on to get the actual story wrong so you know she is making up the story based on phenomenon. Hulk never made rivers of blood with Thor, another reason to consider Thor "Voice" as a Metaphor and not actually his voice.
Again, that is not the same as Superman being in an entirely other dimension above 5D and being felt as a force on all dimensions including 3D.
Again Starship Hulk did not hold his own against Hulked Thor, he got his arm ripped off and literally BFR'd him Ygg. Even before the amp Hulk was regenerating from punishment but never really stood a chance against Hulked Thor and Odin knew that. Odin Hulk doesn't scale to Titan either, and that version literally got his ARM ripped from his body lol.
You're arguing against your own point. I never said Titan Hulk came out during that fight, but I DID say Titan hulk came out against Monolith. Guess what didn't end? Everything. Or Anything. You are relying on Metaphors.
Superman was knocking down 6D beings with his amp and Titan hulk was beating Planet busters. This is a stomp low-key
Bonus:
You forgot to mention Superman not only shook Universes (the new Multiverse) but the dimensions below said Multiverse.
Vibrating an apartment complex (1D = First Floor / 6D = Sixth floor) and the residents of the rooms on each floor saying they felt you >>>>>>> Anything Titan Hulk has in scaling or actual feats. Mxy is a Multiversal being himself and even he was below this version of Superman
@mage101 said:
Genocide has the lasso of truth which can instigate different kinds of soul attacks [like what she did to John stewart and etta so, even if she can't feed off of her rage, forerunner has no resistance to soul attacks.
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High-tier characters have feats on that level and above carol danvers has feats of almost going supernova and creating a black hole and diana has multiple black hole feats and star level feats and genocide was still damaging her. The city destruction isn't what makes that feat impressive but the attack affecting and hurting superman-prime that makes it impressive. Diana always holds back against donna but it doesn't mean that she can't do what forerunner did if she's morals off, i'll list some feats as to why diana can do what forerunner did to donna:
- The titans including donna get beaten by non a kryptonian, diana as beaten literally every kryptonian and the one's stronger than non.
- The titans including donna struggled with match [superboy's clone] Diana has thrown the real superboy like paper and he was legit scared of her.
- Supergirl one shot infected donna but infected amped supergirl couldn't beat a massively holding back diana and diana even saved her life from kryptonite robots.
- Supergirl has knocked out donna before and diana has beaten amped versions of supergirl with low-difficulty.
- Superboy heat vision was stated to be able to seriously injure donna while diana has taken heat vision from amped superman, rao, amped supergirl with no problem.
Donna has even said that she isn't a match for diana.
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I don't think forerunner is equal to monarch and featless supermen and captain atoms aren't impressive, diana has held her own against an army of alternate versions of herself and villains. Genocide also beat donna, diana, and cassie so why is forerunner's feat more impressive.
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Forerunner teambusted featless JLA while genocide team busted high-tiers with impressive feats. The BEYOND feats should be the small star level feat right? Well John and diana have more impressive feats than that.
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That monitor wasn't all that impressive on a physical level and diana has closed a rift in reality with her bare hands.
Donna and kyle rayner were also beaten in that comic by black mary marvel, the same black mary that couldn't beat diana and had to infect her with a virus to win.
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I don't think forerunner can bypass speed- stealing from barry or wally, that speedster is featless and doesn't scale to the likes of real speedsters who can steal the speed of planets. Donna's body was able to survive multiple attacks from the forerunner and the forerunner only knocked her out when she wasn't looking and was in a fight something that supergirl has done. With genocide soul hax and the fact that she is a zombie i don't see how the forerunner is winning.
So true. I actually brought that up as one of the many reasons this is such a close battle, direct soul attacks are something that will be useful against Forerunner.
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Forerunner One-hit KO'd Donna with a toss + toyed her in the rest of the fight. Donna literally almost broke her hand punching Forerunner. Genocide nor Wonder Woman are replicating that feat:
- Initial toss (She was trying to Kill Red Hood, actually told Donna to Run)
- Still Ko'd in the next panel
- Even encourages Donna to get help from others, she's literally just playing with her food:
Diana is good, but Diana nor Genocide is Treating Donna like a gnat. Donna isn't seriously injuring her fists punching Genocide.
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Forerunner held her own against Monarch, we can both attest to that. Monarch beating Soviet Supes + A Buddhist Superman that had 14D hax +Another Supes at the same time, along with other teambusting feats. Monarch has fought literal armies of Alternate Captain atoms/Supermen/W.W., yet Forerunner performed better then them all I'd say.
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John and Diana do not have more impressive feats than Monarch. Or the Monitors. And scaling aside, Forerunner just has better actual feats than Genocide.
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That Monitor would wash Wonder Woman, Ngl. Also, Monitor kept blasting her as well and couldn't put her down. Closing rifts barehanded is a beastly feat though.
The black mary Marvel W.W. fought is not the same as the one Kyle and Donna fought. 2 Different runs, and during Kyle's run she was a teambuster.
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Forerunner literally blitzed Donna, someone who can keep up with Wonder Woman. Speed Steal and Time stop are things that don't really have a level to them. Especially against Genocide who has no real speed feats.
Soul hax only works if she can CATCH Forerunner, which is a huge maybe. Being a Zombie doesn't mean much, she still has screams of pain vs Wonder woman (When she nearly cut Geno's arm off). So nerve strikes/disables will work.
@mage101 said:
@cosmoman: Wouldn't forerunner's rage amp genocide?
I don't really see forerunner beating diana and donna was able to withstand a blast from monarch that destroyed a city and hurt superman-prime
i guess that she beating donna is impressive but she never knocked her out,
something that high-tiers that aren't holding back can do and beating John stewart and red tornado and team busting wonder woman and more, something that superman can't do is far superior and genocide is dead, she isn't knocking her out she had to be contained in rebirth and diana beat her by using the lasso. Tbh, Genocide has everything working out for her.
Forerunner is more like Sinestro (Fear) than Atrocitus (Rage), shes more cold + calculating + deals in fear of her opponent. Forerunner toys with people and enjoys it, unless they're a Monitor she has no rage for them.
Forerunner survived a sneak attack that was small star level and was only KO'd......city level matters why? Diana could never blitz Donna and casually brutalize Donna the way Forerunner did. Donna never took a direct attack from Monarch, she was on the outskirts and was beyond far from the epicenter of the blast. Meanwhile Monarch straight up says Forerunner would probably survive a direct explosion + Donna nearly broke her knuckles just punching Forerunner. W.W. and Donna comparisons to Forerunner fall flat:
Correction: Forerunner 0 diffed Donna and toyed with her, and so did Monarch when he KO'd Donna. The same Monarch who fought gangs of Supermen and Captain Atoms. Monarch is a premiere teambuster and every-time she fought him she held her own, Monarch and Forerunner are in the same conversation, this is Donna (another loss to Forerunner by Donna):
- Forerunner teambusting the team Genocide did is questionable, but she has busted multiple JLA teams before and higher tier beings that have feats BEYOND that team.
- Genocide taking Monarch/Monitors and surviving their attacks is questionable. Genocide hasn't taken this level of opponent before but she did open up a portal with her bare hands. Super impressive
I think it's close, but I see Forerunner teambusting W.W. (especially with her speed bypassing speed steal) before Genocide holds her own against Monarch/Monitor/Star level sneak attacks. Genocide's body won't withstand this level of force and speed over the course of the fight + She doesn't have the strength to bypass Forerunner's durability.
The girls smack overall.
I'd put Powergirl over Guy and Aquaman due to speed and comparable strength, and Maxima is a peer to PG in both. Both of these girls could slug it out with these guys, but with their advantage (Heat&Ice based attacks/TP) they won't need to. Team girls win.
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