@lykopis: No one here is legitimately saying taht it's okay to rape someone, the debate is
*what constitutes a sex object
* what is reasonable precaution for a person to take?
* at what point does playful insenuation cross the line into genuine hurtfulness?
*There is NO such thing as a sex object. I don't care if she's shaking her breast with noting, but nipple tassels she is a person and never an object.
*People shouldn't have to take precautions in a public setting with hundreds of people around. It isn't a dark alley these women "and men" are in plain site.
*The moment the victim feels uncomfortable or violated.
* If someone is at a sheck-out desk, checking out groceries, is your first thought " I need to keep this person's emotional state in mind, and try not to just presume that this person wants to check out my groceries" or "would you please check these out?"
* I don't think plain-sight sexual harassment at cons is really a big thing, and I'm kind of wondering why you have '"and men"' in quotations
* the problem is, everyone becomes uncomfortable at a different point, some people are made deeply uncomfortable when they see people dreesed in skimpy outfits, or when they have some flirt with them, or if anyone provides any evidence that would compromise their particular beliefs, any action anyone takes could violate or discomfort those around said person
Not sure where you are going with that first bit
Men can get harassed too, but it is less prevalent
I fail to see how seeing someone in something that is usually swimsuit like would make you uncomfortable. Just from personal experience I don't think a human body is disgusting and don't see why anyone else would be, but regardless personal beliefs can't infringe on personal freedom and cosplay is a form of expression.
@pyrogram: You just quoted me AGAIN while omitting the part that would answer your own question: "While the vast majority of reactions still fall outside the realm of acceptability or defensibility." The point of a caveat is that it points out the exception to the rule. I am saying that a small portion of what people call unacceptable is, in my mind, not really unacceptable given the circumstances. Some of the innuendo/commenting is to be expected based on the nature of the character/costume. I am making excuses only for a fraction of the verbal response (and for the mindset which leads into it). Nothing else.
A character who is designed to make people horny -- whose outfit is clearly designed not for practicality but for titillation -- will, if created effectively, cause most people to view the character not as a real, interesting, complete human being, but as someone whose existence is justified by how it makes you feel down below. Why any self-respecting woman wants to embody that, I don't know. I'll still personally give her the benefit of the doubt, but I don't think it's fair to expect everyone to be like me. You spend long enough thinking of a character as someone you'd love to "tap" if they were real, and then you see someone who did such a good job at recreating that character's look that she may as well be that "real" version, and you're bound to say something you wouldn't say to most people. I think it's outrageously naive to be surprised or infuriated by that.
So like I said earlier, greater lenience depending on how objectified the original character is. It's a subjective scale, but it's a scale, not a black and white issue. If you see it as such, cool. I don't. I won't. And while I obviously hate having to disagree with friends, I can't help it if we come to different conclusions when confronted with the question, as @betatesthighlander1 said: "at what point does playful insenuation [sic] cross the line into genuine hurtfulness?" No matter how accepting/lenient a person is, there are obviously people whose comments are just outright crossing lines. I'm merely seeking a more critical evaluation for where that line is, and reminding people that one person's limit may be different from someone else's. For cosplayers, this is a cautionary tale in trying to avoid doing cosplays which are going to draw the sorts of thinking and remarks you know you are not personally comfortable with handling. For non-cosplayers this is a cautionary tale in trying to avoid making anyone uncomfortable with your words, whether or not you secretly think they "are asking for it." If everyone were thoughtful and decent, this discussion wouldn't be happening at all, but since people aren't, I think taking precautions is something everyone should do.
To go back to my original post, I am simply saying that no matter how unfair or limiting it may be, please don't walk through Central Park alone at night. I agree that you should be able to. But the way the world is, it's probably not going to end well for you. So save yourself the headaches. People suck and do and say stupid things and even if you're careful you still have to put up with that. But when you have an opportunity to avoid an obvious pitfall, don't tempt fate. If you do, and things go badly, I'm not going to blame you, and I'll gladly stand beside you when fighting the abusers, but I'll still wish you hadn't done it.
Now hold up. That is incredibly restricting to women who are comic fans. Wonder Woman, Storm, these women are objects?
They embody powerful women and they look good doing it, and yes that person should be infuriated. It isn't their fault that random guy has a Wonder Woman fetish and can't control himself? They just wanted to dress up, take pictures and have fun, and challenging their self respect based on what someone else considers modest is ridiculous.
I'm sorry, but this sounds alot like you are defending someones inappropriate behavior.
Quick unimportant question. What does everyone mean by "pasties"? It's just that here in the U.K., a pasty is a kind of food, like pastry filled with meats, vegetables etc, and I'm guessing that's not what you mean.
^Unless the cosplayer in question actually was dressed like this.^
I F-ing hate this thread. When I started this thread I was trying to show people someone's art that I thought was pretty cool...... I never thought this was going to turn into a F-ing debate about if it's Ok to sexual harass someone! This is just stupid........ I'm walking away in frustration.