arnoldoaad

this is the problem with our conversation

There is no such thing as "Outside the timelines" we cannot define what that is

as for the ongoing, yes it is an ongoing, it is titled Pandora: Trinity of Sin, and PS will be renamed as Phantom Stranger: Trinity of Sin

I dont think she will die simply because she really doesnt have an status quo to begin with to change it from there all is just mystery"

It just makes no sense to build up and build up and build up to just end with her dead.

I doubt that considering her new ongoing

now, that would be an awesome ending

no it doesnt

It is not clearly at all because Phantom Stranger was never Judas nor an assh*le who created the Specter, Raven or others and The Question was just a guy with a mask who investigated conspiracies and didnt had magical powers

semantics

the end result is exactly the same

@akbogert: I mean that readers know nothing about Pandora or the box to be sure. or more realistically, to even care.

I feel like DC is treating Pandora as this big breakthrough character and she is just going to fall into obscurity in the next few years when she stops being relevant.

Canonically the council didnt existed before the new 52 because it didnt exist

you cannot change that retroactively because in essence is 2 completely different timelines

@colonyofcells: but Flashpoint didnt rebooted the universe, it was Pandora, its 2 completely different things

@akbogert: interesting that you mention the necessity of Wildstorm in the DCU to "deal with a coming threat" when the entire Wildstorm catalog just crash and burned during the new 52, thats not even mentioning that there is not a single Wildstorm character involved on Trinity War.

about Pandora recovering the box, no one knows anything about that for sure.

there is a paradox, your explanation doesnt dispel it

But it changed for the Question and Phantom Stranger and the wizard shazam.
they do have an origin before and after.

even if we use your timeline beginning with the FCBD origin before the new 52 then what did she accomplished by changing the universe?

except at the end of Flashpoint Barry still remember that it happen, and gives Batman the letter from his father, Which appeared again on Justice League

Its like CoIE, just that it made more sense on CoIE

@akbogert: but that moment shows Phantom Stranger and the Question, who wasnt a supernatural entity...

ok we are moving in circles

lets look at like this

Pandora had to exist on the pre-new 52 DC, then she changes the timeline of DC and mixes it with Vertigo and Wildstorm then she creates the new 52 world of DC

the FCBD issues shows her origin in the new timeline.

her origin before that is completely unknown and it CANNOT be the same one on FCBD, simply because of the changes on PS and The Question, and it doesnt matter if you dont know who the question is, you just need to know that he was not magic based.

that is the problem with using her to change the world and then give her a story that has nothing to do with how she changed the world rather how she came to be in this new world

The problem is even bigger if you consider that the box might not have existed pre-new 52 either because in the new timeline we have all this guys who might be derivative of her own origin and didnt existed before.

@akbogert: - BUT within the comic book multiverse which DC has created, the council has always existed

but that isnt true

where has it been said that the council always existed?