Legends of Tomorrow Episode #103 - "Blood Ties"

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#51 Posted by Heatforce (6557 posts) - - Show Bio

@the_kidd said:
@heatforce said:
@the_kidd said:

Three episodes in and this bullshit where the team beats Savage but lets him escape have already annoyed me. When Rip had Savage's semi-lifeless body why didn't they took him back to the ship, sedate him and let Kendra kill him when she recovers?

I dont get why Savage is so threatening, sure he is immortal but cant Rip simply remove from the time stream or bury him alive under a mountain of concrete. If Kendra needs to be the one who kills him, the team could stomp him(Firestorm & Rip already solo'd him) and have Kendra come in at the last minute to deliver the killing blow.

1. The knife rip used to slit his throat was from the night of the meteor. Those items can still incapacitate him but unless hawk girl uses the knife (in particular) he won't stay dead

2. He can regenerate from a single cell. What makes you think he will even regenerate in that body? Sure it seems logical but when you can do what cell did in dragon ball z I think your options are open. Like I dunno, stashing some fresh blood away and kept under lock and key by his followers somewhere else on the planet?

3. Savage is actually weaker than when he was introduced in the present. He gets stronger with each reincarnation he kills so seems like he was underjuiced. Still I agree rip holding him down was a little forced.

4. The fodder are pretty skilled. It's not like they were taking on simple thugs. Sarah said how skilled they were so I think thats enough.

  1. Whats your point? Rip had both the Dagger and Savage's body in his possession and he just left them their. I know Savage wont stay dead that is why I said to sedate or just KOing him until Kendra is capable to kill him.
  2. Wont that result in clones? Fair point but since nobody knows how Savage powers work, you would think Rip could of at least take the body back to the ship to analyze it better. I mean no one knew the Hawks blood also extents people so taking Savage's body would of been beneficial in some way.
  3. Weaker by 1 Hawkgirl? In the time of 1975-2016 Savage would of killed one pair of Hawks but Rip interference allowed Savage to kill a version of Hawkman ahead of time. The difference is inconsequential. Savage is 4000 year old warrior that held his own agast Green Arrow, Hawk Couple and Flash but he somehow lost to Rip.
  4. Relevance? They had beaten all the fodders, if the fodders had taken away the dagger and Savage's body during the confusion then okay but that did not happen. Rip just f***ing walk away leaving Savage(& Dagger?) laying on the ground.

1 & 2 It's not like it matters because of his regeneration - which was told to us by Rip - so the time masters do know about savage just not everything. For all we know studying a souless meat-suit would do them no good as this is a magical problem, not biological. Besides, only Kendra and carter heard the truth about what it would take to kill savage - Kendra and the dagger.

3 Well maybe we just got to give it to Rip for being a good knife fighter. He did almost kill Savage in Egypt. Hopefully it's covered a bit more about his skill set. I wouldn't say the diference is inconsequential. We don't know how much he gets boosted. We only know that when he was last boosted during the flash & arrow cross over, he destroyed a city.

4 Yeah I don't know why he tossed the dagger tbh. Some of this stuff may be covered in the next episode so we just got to wait. Was it the same dagger though? I'll need to check.

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#52 Posted by The_Kidd (12441 posts) - - Show Bio

@the_kidd said:
@heatforce said:
@the_kidd said:

Three episodes in and this bullshit where the team beats Savage but lets him escape have already annoyed me. When Rip had Savage's semi-lifeless body why didn't they took him back to the ship, sedate him and let Kendra kill him when she recovers?

I dont get why Savage is so threatening, sure he is immortal but cant Rip simply remove from the time stream or bury him alive under a mountain of concrete. If Kendra needs to be the one who kills him, the team could stomp him(Firestorm & Rip already solo'd him) and have Kendra come in at the last minute to deliver the killing blow.

1. The knife rip used to slit his throat was from the night of the meteor. Those items can still incapacitate him but unless hawk girl uses the knife (in particular) he won't stay dead

2. He can regenerate from a single cell. What makes you think he will even regenerate in that body? Sure it seems logical but when you can do what cell did in dragon ball z I think your options are open. Like I dunno, stashing some fresh blood away and kept under lock and key by his followers somewhere else on the planet?

3. Savage is actually weaker than when he was introduced in the present. He gets stronger with each reincarnation he kills so seems like he was underjuiced. Still I agree rip holding him down was a little forced.

4. The fodder are pretty skilled. It's not like they were taking on simple thugs. Sarah said how skilled they were so I think thats enough.

  1. Whats your point? Rip had both the Dagger and Savage's body in his possession and he just left them their. I know Savage wont stay dead that is why I said to sedate or just KOing him until Kendra is capable to kill him.
  2. Wont that result in clones? Fair point but since nobody knows how Savage powers work, you would think Rip could of at least take the body back to the ship to analyze it better. I mean no one knew the Hawks blood also extents people so taking Savage's body would of been beneficial in some way.
  3. Weaker by 1 Hawkgirl? In the time of 1975-2016 Savage would of killed one pair of Hawks but Rip interference allowed Savage to kill a version of Hawkman ahead of time. The difference is inconsequential. Savage is 4000 year old warrior that held his own agast Green Arrow, Hawk Couple and Flash but he somehow lost to Rip.
  4. Relevance? They had beaten all the fodders, if the fodders had taken away the dagger and Savage's body during the confusion then okay but that did not happen. Rip just f***ing walk away leaving Savage(& Dagger?) laying on the ground.

1 & 2 It's not like it matters because of his regeneration - which was told to us by Rip - so the time masters do know about savage just not everything. For all we know studying a souless meat-suit would do them no good as this is a magical problem, not biological. Besides, only Kendra and carter heard the truth about what it would take to kill savage - Kendra and the dagger.

3 Well maybe we just got to give it to Rip for being a good knife fighter. He did almost kill Savage in Egypt. Hopefully it's covered a bit more about his skill set. I wouldn't say the diference is inconsequential. We don't know how much he gets boosted. We only know that when he was last boosted during the flash & arrow cross over, he destroyed a city.

4 Yeah I don't know why he tossed the dagger tbh. Some of this stuff may be covered in the next episode so we just got to wait. Was it the same dagger though? I'll need to check.

1-2 Disagree, there is always more to learn. I'm willing to bet Savage regenerate and not respawn which would of made that a ridiculously stupid decision.

3 Savage is a 4000 year old warrior(who is supposedly enhanced). Rip must be a top-tier fighter in the CWverse. Also The Staff of Horus is fueled under its own powers source, it destroying Central City had nothing to do with Savage absorbing the Hawks lifeforce.

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#53 Posted by deactivated-5c9535a734784 (2578 posts) - - Show Bio

Okay I love The Flash, arrow is negligible but it's been three episodes now and I'm still not feeling it. Some parts are good but others are just meh. I think I'll give it one more episode and if it doesn't grab me, I'll have to drop it. I'll probably replace it with Agent Carter.

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#54 Posted by Doc-Holiday (3850 posts) - - Show Bio

@docholiday said:
@heatforce said:
@docholiday said:

@heatforce: He wont learn, ever. He is a nit-picker.

The type of person who will watch a tv show or movie and say "Yeah, it's great that Superman can fly and shoot lasers out of his face but I just saw that gun fire 32 rounds of ammo when I checked online and the military only uses 30 round magazines so what, is it a magic gun?"

Nah he's fine. We all do it in some way or another. But this is the vine and thankfully we can challenge each other’s comments and hopefully end our debates on friendly terms.

Friendly terms? Never! :P

I don't really care, I just don't plan to let everything slide either, I would rather have a discussion or debate.

I do enjoy a good debate. Especially on this site, my least favorite thing is to see a post regarding something and someone says "I don't like this very much" and then be attacked for expressing their opinion if it wasn't a positive one. "Well, if you don't like it, why comment?" Well most likely because that person wanted to open a dialogue.

I don't like the Supergirl show, I can't get into it at all and checked, it's been losing viewers like the Titanic lost passengers, it started at just about 13 mil and none has about 6.5 mil so it's dropped 50% where as Flash and Arrow have had less, maybe around 4 mil but they have maintained some consistency losing or gaining only small amounts. Now, I've posted these types of things before and people simply respond "if you don't like it, why are you here?" Because I want to talk to fans to see what went wrong with what we love? I love comics, love sci-fi and love fantasy/magic and when I see the best or my favorite characters not accurately represented or dramatically changed to suit some need it bothers me because it devalues the character.

Take the new F4 for example, it turned out as terribly as I expected (for numerous reasons) and one issue I had was with the actor choice for Johnny Storm for two major reasons; 1. taking a white character and changing him black is offensive to white and black fans because it says to white fans that a favorite character you grew up and identified with isn't important and we'll simply change their race and it says to black fans you will feel fine if we take a white character and change their race rather than have a character to identify with 2. regarding the last part of point one, it is offensive because there are numerous amazing black super heroes in comics (Blade came out 2 years before Spiderman and did amazingly well) and to seemingly disregard these characters that kids have grown up reading and identifying with is belittling to an entire group of people

Aww I like Supergirl so that has me concerned. The first few episodes are a bit meh but then I started to get an upgraded 'Lois and Clark the new adventures of superman" vibe. I loved the hell out of that show back in the day. Hopefully the Flash crossover will bump it up. The only thing that I don't really like are the fight scenes while they are in the air. Sometimes it feels like the wires are jumping out at me lol.

Flash wont save it. Two reasons; one, it's too late in the game after losing half their viewers and two, they said early on that Flash, Arrow and others wouldn't cross-over so saying now they will makes them look desperate or they already lost potential viewers who were hoping for a cross over long ago and decided not to watch an isolated program that so clearly needed to be connected to the others.

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#55 Edited by The Impersonator (8500 posts) - - Show Bio

I really liked the episode. This show is getting better and to say the fact that Vandal Savage is becoming a good villain. I'm curious to see how the team can beat Savage by the end of the season.

That being said, I've asked myself, why Rip didn't go back in time before Vandal became immortal. Here, the third episode clearly showed that Rip did go back in time and tried to kill him, but he was interfered by the guards. No matter how many times you go back and change the past, the results are still the same. This also applied, when Captain Cold tried to change his childhood history.

I also liked how the writers explored Cold's backstory in the third episode. They didn't show this in the previous episodes of Flash, which was very interesting. So, I'm thinking they might do the same thing for Heatwave in further episodes.

Also, I've heard that some people argue the fact that Sara's bloodlust was supposed to be gone, after she was cured by Constantine. And they say that it's a continuity error. It isn't. If you think about it, Constantine may have restored Sara's soul, but the bloodlust was still there. This also happened after Thea came back from the Lazarus Pit.

Again, this was a good episode. Can't wait to rock the 80's.

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#57 Posted by redbird3rdboywonder (7157 posts) - - Show Bio

I'm loving the series thus far. It was a surprise that they killed Carter but they'll probably pick him back up in the 80's. Loving Caity Lotz too. If I had one problem about this episode it would be this, where did Sara's bloodlust magically reappear from? I thought the whole reason the bloodlust comes from is that the soul of the person being resurrected was damaged but I thought Constatine being brought in fixed it

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#58 Posted by loppez (21 posts) - - Show Bio

I can't believe that people actually think the show is good.

plot is lame, flat characters, even fight scenes don't look so good.

Only thing I see is pew pew laser guns, super powers. everything feels so rushed.

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#59 Posted by Koays (11810 posts) - - Show Bio

Lol I liked it... People are over analyzing even by SciFi/comic standards.

More action then an episode of flash and better cast repore then arrow. It works.

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#60 Posted by kiba (3743 posts) - - Show Bio

@redbird3rdboywonder: what do you mean where did it come from? She had it in arrow while they were saving Ray. I don't know why anyone says she was cured. John just put her soul back.

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#61 Edited by TheShaman (1 posts) - - Show Bio

NIce episod

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#62 Posted by birdman400 (1558 posts) - - Show Bio

@heatforce said:
@docholiday said:
@heatforce said:
@docholiday said:

@heatforce: He wont learn, ever. He is a nit-picker.

The type of person who will watch a tv show or movie and say "Yeah, it's great that Superman can fly and shoot lasers out of his face but I just saw that gun fire 32 rounds of ammo when I checked online and the military only uses 30 round magazines so what, is it a magic gun?"

Nah he's fine. We all do it in some way or another. But this is the vine and thankfully we can challenge each other’s comments and hopefully end our debates on friendly terms.

Friendly terms? Never! :P

I don't really care, I just don't plan to let everything slide either, I would rather have a discussion or debate.

I do enjoy a good debate. Especially on this site, my least favorite thing is to see a post regarding something and someone says "I don't like this very much" and then be attacked for expressing their opinion if it wasn't a positive one. "Well, if you don't like it, why comment?" Well most likely because that person wanted to open a dialogue.

I don't like the Supergirl show, I can't get into it at all and checked, it's been losing viewers like the Titanic lost passengers, it started at just about 13 mil and none has about 6.5 mil so it's dropped 50% where as Flash and Arrow have had less, maybe around 4 mil but they have maintained some consistency losing or gaining only small amounts. Now, I've posted these types of things before and people simply respond "if you don't like it, why are you here?" Because I want to talk to fans to see what went wrong with what we love? I love comics, love sci-fi and love fantasy/magic and when I see the best or my favorite characters not accurately represented or dramatically changed to suit some need it bothers me because it devalues the character.

Take the new F4 for example, it turned out as terribly as I expected (for numerous reasons) and one issue I had was with the actor choice for Johnny Storm for two major reasons; 1. taking a white character and changing him black is offensive to white and black fans because it says to white fans that a favorite character you grew up and identified with isn't important and we'll simply change their race and it says to black fans you will feel fine if we take a white character and change their race rather than have a character to identify with 2. regarding the last part of point one, it is offensive because there are numerous amazing black super heroes in comics (Blade came out 2 years before Spiderman and did amazingly well) and to seemingly disregard these characters that kids have grown up reading and identifying with is belittling to an entire group of people

Aww I like Supergirl so that has me concerned. The first few episodes are a bit meh but then I started to get an upgraded 'Lois and Clark the new adventures of superman" vibe. I loved the hell out of that show back in the day. Hopefully the Flash crossover will bump it up. The only thing that I don't really like are the fight scenes while they are in the air. Sometimes it feels like the wires are jumping out at me lol.

Flash wont save it. Two reasons; one, it's too late in the game after losing half their viewers and two, they said early on that Flash, Arrow and others wouldn't cross-over so saying now they will makes them look desperate or they already lost potential viewers who were hoping for a cross over long ago and decided not to watch an isolated program that so clearly needed to be connected to the others.

not be rude or anything but do you remember AOS for season ratings? first episode pulled in 17 million viewers , end of the season ended at 8 mill , now third season barely pulls 4 million

Avatar image for doc-holiday
#63 Posted by Doc-Holiday (3850 posts) - - Show Bio

@docholiday said:
@heatforce said:
@docholiday said:
@heatforce said:
@docholiday said:

@heatforce: He wont learn, ever. He is a nit-picker.

The type of person who will watch a tv show or movie and say "Yeah, it's great that Superman can fly and shoot lasers out of his face but I just saw that gun fire 32 rounds of ammo when I checked online and the military only uses 30 round magazines so what, is it a magic gun?"

Nah he's fine. We all do it in some way or another. But this is the vine and thankfully we can challenge each other’s comments and hopefully end our debates on friendly terms.

Friendly terms? Never! :P

I don't really care, I just don't plan to let everything slide either, I would rather have a discussion or debate.

I do enjoy a good debate. Especially on this site, my least favorite thing is to see a post regarding something and someone says "I don't like this very much" and then be attacked for expressing their opinion if it wasn't a positive one. "Well, if you don't like it, why comment?" Well most likely because that person wanted to open a dialogue.

I don't like the Supergirl show, I can't get into it at all and checked, it's been losing viewers like the Titanic lost passengers, it started at just about 13 mil and none has about 6.5 mil so it's dropped 50% where as Flash and Arrow have had less, maybe around 4 mil but they have maintained some consistency losing or gaining only small amounts. Now, I've posted these types of things before and people simply respond "if you don't like it, why are you here?" Because I want to talk to fans to see what went wrong with what we love? I love comics, love sci-fi and love fantasy/magic and when I see the best or my favorite characters not accurately represented or dramatically changed to suit some need it bothers me because it devalues the character.

Take the new F4 for example, it turned out as terribly as I expected (for numerous reasons) and one issue I had was with the actor choice for Johnny Storm for two major reasons; 1. taking a white character and changing him black is offensive to white and black fans because it says to white fans that a favorite character you grew up and identified with isn't important and we'll simply change their race and it says to black fans you will feel fine if we take a white character and change their race rather than have a character to identify with 2. regarding the last part of point one, it is offensive because there are numerous amazing black super heroes in comics (Blade came out 2 years before Spiderman and did amazingly well) and to seemingly disregard these characters that kids have grown up reading and identifying with is belittling to an entire group of people

Aww I like Supergirl so that has me concerned. The first few episodes are a bit meh but then I started to get an upgraded 'Lois and Clark the new adventures of superman" vibe. I loved the hell out of that show back in the day. Hopefully the Flash crossover will bump it up. The only thing that I don't really like are the fight scenes while they are in the air. Sometimes it feels like the wires are jumping out at me lol.

Flash wont save it. Two reasons; one, it's too late in the game after losing half their viewers and two, they said early on that Flash, Arrow and others wouldn't cross-over so saying now they will makes them look desperate or they already lost potential viewers who were hoping for a cross over long ago and decided not to watch an isolated program that so clearly needed to be connected to the others.

not be rude or anything but do you remember AOS for season ratings? first episode pulled in 17 million viewers , end of the season ended at 8 mill , now third season barely pulls 4 million

Yes and it is scraping by, Marvel is most likely throwing money at the problem because they want as many tie-ins for the movie as possible. I stopped watching after season 1.

To take another look at Supergirl, they can't pull her out of Supermans shadow. They are promoting the next episode with the fact that they show a kid superman, which contradicts the fact he was sent to Earth as a child and shows that she is only important if Superman exists in some fact of her reality.

The smarter thing to do for her show would have been to make her Superman; by that I mean, have her come to Earth as a baby, have Kal-El not exist, just give her, his story instead of having her live in his shadow.

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#64 Posted by birdman400 (1558 posts) - - Show Bio

@docholiday: I think that's the point , we witness Kara growing up , trying to distance herself from her cousin's shadow but she knows it will never happen , I mean every portrayal of supergirl from animated to smallville has always had her as " Superman the Man of Steel!, Supergirl the cousin of Superman" , once your found to related to arguably the greatest superhero ever , you just have to get used to being under his shadow

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#65 Posted by Doc-Holiday (3850 posts) - - Show Bio

@docholiday: I think that's the point , we witness Kara growing up , trying to distance herself from her cousin's shadow but she knows it will never happen , I mean every portrayal of supergirl from animated to smallville has always had her as " Superman the Man of Steel!, Supergirl the cousin of Superman" , once your found to related to arguably the greatest superhero ever , you just have to get used to being under his shadow

But having this episode with him as a child (along with the incongruity) shows that she isn't out of his shadow. I honestly thought this show was a bad idea from the beginning. I prefer Wonder Woman, she is strong, independent and doesn't share her backstory with any of the major JL members

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#66 Posted by birdman400 (1558 posts) - - Show Bio

@docholiday: have you seen the ideas for the WW shows they tried to make it? purely awful , if should make a show , make a birds of prey

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#67 Edited by The_Kidd (12441 posts) - - Show Bio

Episode 4 was leaked ahead of time, its much better than the previous 3 episodes.

@birdman400 said:

@docholiday: have you seen the ideas for the WW shows they tried to make it? purely awful , if should make a show , make a birds of prey

Bird of Prey was already a terrible show that got canceled.

Avatar image for doc-holiday
#68 Posted by Doc-Holiday (3850 posts) - - Show Bio

@docholiday: have you seen the ideas for the WW shows they tried to make it? purely awful , if should make a show , make a birds of prey

I am saying go in the direction Linda Carter went. Instead though everyone seems to miss the point.

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