Mutant Genetics Discussion

thoughts???

jean and scott have kids, yet their "Children" have jean's powers? none of scott? like really?

Magneto has kids(sorry im counting SW and QS so fu marvel) QS power is kinda like magneto's speed and how magnets work(not getting into it)......SW is more magic then mutant .........Polaris actually has magneto's power

emma and scott's older daughter from x-men the end only had telepathy........then a ult daughter Ruby who had both emma's and scott's power?

i always thought if 2 mutant parents had kids, their children should have both powers......i guess it goes by who's trait is stronger

i thought scott's "genes"(well according to Sinister who is a mutant geneticist) were supposed to be strongest so his kids should only have his power

(wont be a matter of time before rogue and gambit has children, wonder what there power would be)

what is 2 parents who had wings have a kid? it has a chance to cancelled it out?

its genetics, which basically means nothing goes. Any power or any thing during the history of people can be passed on pretty much. I'm the youngest of 7 kids. My father had black hair, brown eyes (he was also half native american) my mother brown hair blue eyes. All my brothers and sisters exept one had brown hair and blue eyes. I had one sister with Blond hair. Then one of my brothers has kids with a brown headed woman, all three of their kids are red headed.

So there is a base line structure to genetics but nothing is 100 percent and then you factor in this is made up and passed on via a dozen different writers, with different realities, time lines, ect. You are really farting in the wind right now

@mcklayn: oh yeah?

what about this Scenario:

jean(mother) : Astral ProjectionBlast PowerFlightForce GenerationHypnosisIllusion Levitation,Possession,PsionicPsychic,Telekinesis,Telepathy

Bishop(father) : has the power to channel kinetic energy, releasing it generally through beams of energy

if they have a kid who has Tk and bishop power to absorb energy and release it .......could the kid use Tk to power his second mutation?

in that example yes the kid could, thats not really an genetics question its more of a what if power question but yea

I don't know friend.

The better question is how come Bishop is a black dude and his sister, Shard, is a white woman?? That was always the real mystery.

Seriously though I think it's because Bishop was originally supposed to be Australian aborginal and not black. You can tell by his initial design that he has a wider nose and wavy hair as opposed to the sort of hair that people of sub saharan african descent have. Their parents were also quite obviously aborignes and were actually from Australia, mate. I think Shard was just supposed to possess "lighter features" that you see sometimes manifest in those people.

I guess I solved the mystery. Woop. Probably also a potential throw to being related to Gateway in there....I know that was hinted in Generation X.

I am curious to know how many X-Men have actually changed race or ethnicities over the years.Probably more than you think.

Anyways....on topic...

Magneto's kids are all retcons.

Gambit and Rogue did have a kid in another reality who basically had Rogues powers but he could control them.

I agree that it's weird all Jean and Scott's kids have Jean's powers...though, when you think about it, Jean does have and interesting power set while Cyclops just shoots lasers out of his face, so, meh. They could likely do something with his solar absorption though, like Vulcan.

Which parent's power's genetic marker would we consider more dominant? Jean is one of the most powerful mutants ever in multiple realities so it goes without saying that her TP/TK combo edges out Scott's optic blasts in the expression of both Cable and X-Man's gifts, although each has been shown to blast yellow energy from one eye. (but that may be from a cybernetic implant in Cable's case) Rachel developed her own time shifting ability, but never quite lived up to the psionic output her mother could. Funny thing is Ruby Summers is an example of TP not winning over unusual variations of the two other (what I would consider more recessive) power sets, so the dominant doesn't always win out either. Xavier and Logan both sired sons with Mystique in BotA, Xavier's inheriting telepathy and Logan's a more effective combination of his and Raven's abilities.

Seems TP, TK and the feral/regen combo are the most prominent dominant traits with energy and molecular manipulators trailing close behind.

Jean and Scott's genetics was already explained to us.

The Grey genome is an Omega level mutant strand with Unlimited potential.

The Summers group are powerful mutants with the ability to channel limitless energy.

The mistake alot of people make is in forgetting that Rachel, Nate, Cable and Stryfe have shown prominent energy manipulation in the past. On top of time, reality and spacial warping on levels that no version of Jean Grey without the Phoenix has ever displayed.

So while none of them have inherited Optic blast, Jean's entire family has been presented as having a long history of psychics. Where Scott's has just had a random host of powerful energy manipulators. So it doesnt really surprise that Jeans kids would develop telepathic/telekinetic powers just at even higher power levels then shed been presented with.

Even when we look at someone like Ruby Summers, we see a character who has a multitude of abilities that reflect both her parents, but clearly ranks as just another limitless energy manipulator on the Summers without displaying any high tier power levels that Jean's potential wouldve given her.

Characters like Xavier who have a history of psychic mutants in their family despite skips of many generations are just more of play in portraying how DNA works. Sometimes it gives you an exact duplicate like Xavier Jr. And sometimes it gives you a evolution of that same trait like a Legion.

Sometimes you get similar traits, sometimes you don’t. Hell, some mutant children don’t get powers. Grayson Creed for example.

@god_spawn: who is Grayson Creed ?

@supermanthor: Graydon Creed was a child of Sabertooth and Mystique who was born a normal human. He has an intense hatred for mutants and was prominent in the Friends Of Humanity, a prejudice mutant group bent on spreading mutant hate through any solution necessary.

Me and @Red_Paladin had an interesting conversation about this very thing at one point in time. We discussed how Sinister apparent obsession with Scott and Jeans genetics prevented interesting pairings like Jean and Wolverine’s potential children. With that in mind, we looked to Shine from the Renew Your Vows Reality as an example of the potential of Wolverine and Jean how her powers could become something akin to Photokinesis.

@koays: Genetically, Sinisters obsession makes sense, but it is a very stunting one, not allowing him to see other potential options like Magneto’s line or Xavier’s line.

@pyrofn: oh ok

@pyrofn: Well as far as we know Magnetos line only goes as far as 2 generations. Though I've always said if he took the same interest in Polaris and Havok as he did Jean and Scott it would be an interesting twist. Though considering how his goal is almost universally to create a being who defeat a celestial powered ageless being who can control every Atom in his body....I could see how telekinesis trumps magnetism.

Xaviers line to me represents more of a example of a less stable mutation. Like he couldve taken Xaviers DNA and not been sure if he would get a meh Xavier Jr or a God tier like Legion.

Besides if he had the summers and their limitless energy abilities his best bet was to have an omega levels Unlimited ability to multiply it by. And then once he got into the fact that the Greys tk and tp abilities manifesting were a dominant trait he basically was guaranteed that the multiplier would land on the powerset that could basically allow you to manipulate reality with their minds.

Say what you will, but if Polaris and Havok had a kid that was 5 times as strong as Magneto....he'd still only be able to control Magnetism.

Meanwhile Nate, Cable and Rachel can restructure whatever they want at will and have all only really been limited by their willingness to push themselves. I mean Cable is supposed to be able to extinguish stars, and Nate dropped a sun on some people when he got really mad.

It's whatever the writer wants it to be. They'll typically mix and match small quirks, but I have a suspicion that Omega mutants have more 'dominant' genes, so to speak. I.e. Jean Grey's childrens are more likely to manifest telepathy or telekinetic based powers.

Considering his obsession with genetic purity,maybe he didn't consider logan as pure because of his animal like nature.

Well if we look at it objectively, Jean's Psionic abilities allow her to push past all mental limitations, more so with her psionic energy absorption ability...

Logan's feral abilities let him equally push past all his Physical limitations, and adds massive versatility and Logan's healing factor has been coveted by Sinister multiple times, even when he already had Sabertooth's DNA already, available to him.

At best Cyclops's abilities allow for greater overall potential energy, (although if Sinister was being objective, he would be after Vulcan for this instead of Scott) however this is like overclocking hardware, where the much higher than recommended output will likely severely damage the components, this is why Nate is dying and why the life seed couldn't save him as adding more energy = quicker burnout, of his overclocked body, Elixir could repair the damage short term however in the long term he needs a way of dealing with the physical strain to his body, ie giving him a healing factor, or the Juggernaut's powers.

Conclusion Sinister isn't being objective about his experiment, Jean and Logan offspring would be far more versatile, and stable for his experiments...

Some Genetic traits skip a generation, Grayson could have a kid similar to Raze with both his parents abilities, let's hope he didn't have too many one night stands, and none of them were telepaths...

@red_paladin_: See what your missing is Sinisters actual goals. We know that hes had other energy manipulators like Gambit in his files, and powerful telepaths like Xavier. Hell I think he even has Shaw.

But his obsession was always with creating the strongest mutant to combat the strongest mutant. To that end he spent years manipulating multiple DNA lines around the world and only then did he end up on Summers and Grey.

Ultimately it was even explained in AoA that while AoA saw Jean as having every cell in her body be a center of power, what made Nate special was that he had that same potential but with the powers dialed up to 11.

While Logan DNA has clearly been something hes been interested in, I think it falls more into the category of things he'd like to incorporate into himself or things he'd like to further develop.

Remember Sinister has half a dozen Jean clones and a petting zoo filled with X-Men clones already, none of which seem to really be as big a priority as a Grey-Summers kid. It's possible that, especially given his habit of returning with new power sets, he simply sees these as things to incorporate into himself. Important question should always be asked about Sinister and the multiple levels of his goals like....if he has high tier telepathy and access to the worlds strongest Psi-lines, who's telepathy did he steal to add to his own?

As for Having Wolverines healing factor added to Jeans powers being somehow superior to Scott and Jean's. (As stupid and shippy as this convo seems) your missing what exactly made the Summers line so important to him as hes stated that there potential and secrets go beyond the mere combo powers that are being discussed here.

And aside from the fact that power levels and abilities of the Grey-Summers line in a age by age comparison all eclipse Jean's. You have to consider that potentially the weakest of all the Grey/Summers kids Rachel is the key factor in a bloodline that Sinister considers to be to dangerous by combining that Summers-Grey potential with that of Franklin Richards.

The burnout aspect of the Greys really needs to be discussed though, since we have one instance of Jean losing control at a young age but only when she presumably wasnt tempered and developed the same way as she did after meeting Xavier in the main line.

Nate being killed by his own powers but partly due to the fact that hes had accelerated growth and never been shown any restraint or understanding of his powers.

Cable who's growth was stunted by the TO virus and was passed 30 years of age before he truly developed his powers.

Rachel. Who's never shown any hints of exploding or overtaxing herself partly due to lower levels of powers. But also likely because she was the most similarly trained to Jean of the group with less opportunity to explore her growth.

Finally we have Stryfe who spent his entire life training and has never once been shown to burnout or hurt for power. (Still has not feats, but hes powerful)

Also let's not get it confused. Nate IS dying. But hes been shown to be able to reassemble his entire being from energy before. If his powers do overclock and he explodes he'd likely do the same thing if his conciousness survives.

Compared to this, anything any of the healers would add is inconsequential.

That said there is merit to the Vulcan

Idea. However because of his origins its possible that Sinister didnt know that he existed initially or that due to Shiar interference he wasnt as viable.

That said it should be noted that Maddie Pryor, Sinisters homemade Jean not only sought out Scott initially but immediately followed him with Havok when she couldnt have him. So it's even possible (and implied to a degree) that Sinister knew that at some point in Scott and Jean's generation the highest quality stock would be born so he considered Havok a great replacement.

Regardless Sinister was trying to fight a guy powered by Celestials. That's why Summers/Grey line and there raw power was so important to him. He needed a weapon and he doesnt care if it only had one shot before it fell apart . Which is why he never tries to build himself a SummersGrey body.

Ultimately while he might be facisnated by the capabilities of amping Jean's powerset and genetics with Scotts....hes still experimented with Hundreds of mutants and bloodlines to many different ends so it's not really as though he hasnt considered these other combinations just that he doesnt need them to perform a function. (Basically why he commends scott on finding a good mate in Emma, whose family is filled with Psionics, but beyond that doesnt seem to care about their union more then any other)

@pyrofn: rogue's and gambits's kid had rogue's power in x-men: the end? i always thought it wasnt revealed......i know rogue and magneto had a kid where the boy had rogue's power and was crazy powerful

@koays:i dont know ......i always though sinister was obsessed with scott and his power cause it was the only thing that could hurt Sinister

yeah i like it more if the kid had both of its parents power kinda like loganXmystique from the future kid Raze(who had shape-shafting powers with claws and a healing factor lol a "triple threat"

@hopesummersforthefuture: That's never been true. And honestly it would be kinda silly.

Sinister: "Now for my evil plan!! I'll spend generations breeding people so I can create someone who can kill me!!"

LOL

didnt as told in "the adventures of cyclops and phoenix" or was it "age of Apocalypse" Sinister wanted a strong mutant to kill Apocalypse.........found it in grey/summers as per Cable

thats why Apocalypse infected Baby-cable with the tecno-virus to weaken him

@hopesummersforthefuture: Yes Sinister wanted a powerful being to kill Apocalypse. You wrote that Sinister wanted a powerful being to kill Sinister.....which is silly.

@koays: Wasn't sinister involved with all weapon I to X program?If he was then it would be interesting if Scott was designated as weapon ZERO.

no thanks........scott wasnt created in a lab

I meant like an inspiration,like a blue print of super powered genome.

Scott and Jean children gets a variation of both of their powers it just manifest itself more so in Psychic Energy. Scott ability like all the summers is absorbing and manipulating energy. Jean ability is Psychic manipulation. Their children powers manifest as being able to manifest and manipulate powerful Psychic Energy. Also while Scott ability manifest itself as Optic blast at full power he would be like his brother Vulcan shown in Ultimate X-Men after Banshee evolved his powers.

As far as Gambit and Rogue they had 2 children in X-Men end in which their son Oliver developed Rogues ability but had better control. Rogue is a little bit tricky though because she takes on certain genetic markers when she absorbs other species such as she took on the appearance of a Limbo demon after absorbing it, gained part Cree DNA after absorbing Carol, then there was the time she absorbed a skull at genetically became a skrull. So if Rogue had absorbed a Demon, Alien or Deity around the time she became pregnant the child would more than likely also possesses some other species DNA. However mutant wise their mutant abilities would be a mix between Rogue and Gambits abilities. So basically either Energy or absorption based or more than likely both.

@koays: •”See what your missing is Sinisters actual goals. We know that hes had other energy manipulators like Gambit in his files, and powerful telepaths like Xavier. Hell I think he even has Shaw.

But his obsession was always with creating the strongest mutant to combat the strongest mutant. To that end he spent years manipulating multiple DNA lines around the world and only then did he end up on Summers and Grey.”

Over the centuries, true, but we can’t honestly say he’s found every specimen out there, like Matthew Malloy and he barely only started paying attention to Bobby recently. With how imperfect the Grey-Summers line is, one would think he’d keep searching for the right solution to this puzzle.

•”Ultimately it was even explained in AoA that while AoA saw Jean as having every cell in her body be a center of power, what made Nate special was that he had that same potential but with the powers dialed up to 11.”

Aka power he couldn’t handle. Either Sinister should’ve gave him training or he should’ve remedied the problem of his powers either burning out or overloading him. But the flaw with Sinister is how infallible he believes he is.

•”While Logan DNA has clearly been something hes been interested in, I think it falls more into the category of things he'd like to incorporate into himself or things he'd like to further develop.”

A waste of potential if you ask me. Ignoring Shine, there are still multiple posibilities to do with Logan’s powerset. Animal instincts aside and bone claws removed from this scenario, we basically have an enhanced superhuman with probably one of the most powerful healing factors under ones like Deadpool or those that can resurrect the dead. That means not only an above average superhuman physique to handle pressure of any kind, but an increased stamina rejuvenating them, so that they are up and ready within a few minutes if the injuries are that extensive.

•”Remember Sinister has half a dozen Jean clones and a petting zoo filled with X-Men clones already, none of which seem to really be as big a priority as a Grey-Summers kid. It's possible that, especially given his habit of returning with new power sets, he simply sees these as things to incorporate into himself. Important question should always be asked about Sinister and the multiple levels of his goals like....if he has high tier telepathy and access to the worlds strongest Psi-lines, who's telepathy did he steal to add to his own?”

A better question would be this: Why stop at one kid from a single line? He had an army and they were working quite well as it was until the Phoenix Five stepped in, in which even then, they ran into some blocks. Not enough to stop them completely until the Madelyne Pryor clones stepped in of course.

•”As for Having Wolverines healing factor added to Jeans powers being somehow superior to Scott and Jean's. (As stupid and shippy as this convo seems) your missing what exactly made the Summers line so important to him as hes stated that there potential and secrets go beyond the mere combo powers that are being discussed here.”

If you mean potential, that could also technically be the same said about Logan and Jeans line.

•”And aside from the fact that power levels and abilities of the Grey-Summers line in a age by age comparison all eclipse Jean's. You have to consider that potentially the weakest of all the Grey/Summers kids Rachel is the key factor in a bloodline that Sinister considers to be to dangerous by combining that Summers-Grey potential with that of Franklin Richards.”

Potential yes, but we even seen Franklin as an adult succumb to the fatal flaw in such power in the paragraph below this one.

•”The burnout aspect of the Greys really needs to be discussed though, since we have one instance of Jean losing control at a young age but only when she presumably wasnt tempered and developed the same way as she did after meeting Xavier in the main line.”

That is not uncommon to Jeans line solely seemingly. It seems to happen every so often with mutants and power they can’t handle. Either their powers fizzle out or they get overloaded with power. That is where I believe the Wolverine line could hypothetically fix the issue. Referring to all the times Wolvie, Laura, and the almighty Gabby have used Cerebro and others like it, their powerset gave them the ability to keep alive and withstand the power that should be frying their brain. Heck, Gabby couldn’t feel that pain. If one were to add that to Jeans family line or a descendant of her and Scott’s children, that child should hypothetically have the body to handle that kind of power. Even it hurts said offspring, the body would end repairing itself as their powers are pushed further and further.

•”Nate being killed by his own powers but partly due to the fact that hes had accelerated growth and never been shown any restraint or understanding of his powers.

Cable who's growth was stunted by the TO virus and was passed 30 years of age before he truly developed his powers.

Rachel. Who's never shown any hints of exploding or overtaxing herself partly due to lower levels of powers. But also likely because she was the most similarly trained to Jean of the group with less opportunity to explore her growth.

Finally we have Stryfe who spent his entire life training and has never once been shown to burnout or hurt for power. (Still has no feats, but hes powerful)”

Something Sinister is unwilling to put effort in is give proper training to his subjects. Because of that, he’s basically sending walking suicide bombers or duds with nothing left after spending their reserves. Madelyne is a good example of a dud at first who eventually matched Jean in her powerset. But Sinister didn’t anticipate that Maddie would have powers, so had it not been for Jeans training, Madelyne probably wouldve overloaded herself. That’s why if Sinister doesn’t want to put in that effort and solely focus on unlimited potential and high levels of powers, he needs to find ways of solving the flaws and kinks in his plans.

•”Regardless Sinister was trying to fight a guy powered by Celestials. That's why Summers/Grey line and there raw power was so important to him. He needed a weapon and he doesnt care if it only had one shot before it fell apart . Which is why he never tries to build himself a SummersGrey body.”

A smarter person would’ve figured out what went wrong to ensure results, but that also means admitting one is wrong. Soooo......

•”Ultimately while he might be facisnated by the capabilities of amping Jean's powerset and genetics with Scotts....hes still experimented with Hundreds of mutants and bloodlines to many different ends so it's not really as though he hasnt considered these other combinations just that he doesnt need them to perform a function. (Basically why he commends scott on finding a good mate in Emma, whose family is filled with Psionics, but beyond that doesnt seem to care about their union more then any other)”

So, does that mean he doesn’t care if his plan succeeds or not?

@pyrofn: See the thing is that your implying that hes only looked at the Summers-Grey line.

Weve seen repeatedly that he has examined and played with the Gene's of all types of mutants. The Marauders are basically a toy line with the amount of times hes cloned them.

The fact is there is nothing to suggest that he was single minded in his goal. Just that when it came to his stated goal of opposing Apocalypse he knew what weapon he felt was best suited to it.

Think about it, Sinister's goals have never been to conquer the world or dominate the planet. He's really only in this for his own shits and giggles with the exception of the Apocalypse beef.

Hes cloned or manipulated the DNA of colossus, namor, gambit, scott, jean, havok,logan, Cable, Malice, Scalp hunter, the nasty boys...etc (and I do mean etc because hes got a ridiculous amount of genetic fodder weve seen him gather)

Weve seen plenty of different experiments that's hes done that have nothing to do with Summers and Grey lines.

The Summers and Grey lines though served the purpose he needed them too. He doesnt care about Cable except as the pinnacle of his work and in that he accomplishes his task. Sure Cable can go nuke himself and half the planet....as long as Sinister accomplishes the goal that's all he cares about until

That said when it comes to Sinister flaws...hes vein as all hell and has an ego up his rear. But look at his failures.... Maddie was just a failed clone with no signs of life until the Phoenix gave her life, AoA Sinister kept Nate on ice while he aged him up and only through Nate escaping before Sinister was ready did Nate have the troubles he did.

Really though Sinister has never been solely focused on raw power so much as the science, shits and giggles that effect him on a day to day basis.

@koays: I'm more into thinking he didn't consider logan pure/royal because of his animal like nature.Also among the Summers brothers,Scott is the firstborn,there's that.Also he's "into" Scott/Summers than Jean.Who would be better mate for Scott beside jean in the eyes of Sinister?

@mrnihal: Well maybe, but hes experimented with Havok just as much.

I think what everyone's missing is that it's more likely that hes experimented with Logan's genes already and got what he needed from it.

Sinisters interest in Scott could come from the fact that the X-gene is supposedly transmitted from males and Scott compared to Havok is closer to "limitless power".

Really though we know for a fact that despite generations of experimenting that Summers DNA is still so much of a mystery that Sinister was willing to give up Cyclops and Jean both because he thought he'd be given the answer to it.

@koays: “Really though Sinister has never been solely focused on raw power so much as the science, shits and giggles that effect him on a day to day basis.”

If such is the case, then doesn’t that mean he is finished with the Grey-Summers line? Has he not already witnessed what the mutant offspring of the Summers line could bring?

@pyrofn: Hasnt he been finished? I mean it's possible that what he was doing in Gillens Uncanny and AvXConsequences was more positioning and guiding the Summers bloodline by manipulating and observing Scott's actions and that he thinks that somewhere down the line he can possibly push the bloodline even further by continuing it down the generations....

But it's clear Sinister hasnt tried to actively do anything with Scott Havok or Jean since the 90s. At least that we know of...so maybe he is done with them for this generation.

Like I said though, it's hard to paint Sinister as having ever been this soley Summers obsessed madman though since outside of Inferno and some minor moments along the way, the only time he seemed SUPER interested in the Summers line again was when he was encountering the Cable/Stryfe and X-Mansband the chance to further his research through them and those encounters. Hes just spent far too long with his hands in everything.

This one is interesting. How to approach such a topic exactly? It's not like skin tone or eye color is approximate to a superpower? But I guess that kind of parallel should be involved because what else is there to base it on? My family has all of them skin tones between white and brown. My sister has twins now one of them is light eyed whitey, and the second is dark eyed... I don't, is it brownie? lol

Anyway, point is that the issue of inheritance in my opinion does have to include a resemblance to previous generations. Sometimes even copypaste. It's ok. I see that a lot. At the same time, what happens when parents have completely unrelated superpowers? Like for example what Colossus and Kitty child power would be? I came up with the idea of density control so s/he would basically have them both. When solid - hard as metal, when not, can as well phase.Now with characters like Havok an Polaris it's easier, they would just have a crazy energy manipulator. Someone like Vulcan. It's just fitting. Etc.

@adamtrmm@koays@pyrofn@mrnihal As an aspiring genetics major it has always appeared to me that the X-Gene mimics certain real-life genetic quirks which, although heritable, are also extremely prone to inter-generational mutation which increases natural diversity in a much faster way. Essentially, although a sequence itself is inherited by the child, a natural mutation causes the alleles to shift just enough that it's unique from the parents while still being very close.

Within the X-Men world all mutants share the X-Gene, which would (in a real-life scenario) mean that all mutants share a common ancestor somewhere down the line. Of course the whole Celestial/Phoenix Force bit messes with that a little but for the sake of explanation we'll use that theory to explain. Essentially the very first mutant--the first human to spontaneously develop an X-Gene with no prior history of it--was the only ACTUAL mutant. Like the first person to have blue eyes or blond hair. This is the only way that the X-Gene could be a shared trait traceable by Sentinels and not just with each mutant being genetically unique as a species like the Inhumans (originally) were.

Now, the uniqueness of each mutant would only be possible if the X-Gene was more than just a single gene. It has been stated occasionally that it is in actuality much more than a single gene, and that's also what I am going to presume going forward. If the X-Gene were a single gene shared by ever member of the Homo superior subspecies then every one of them would possess the same power, and any who did not would not technically be mutants. However, if it is merely a casual term, then this would make it much easier. Essentially all mutants would share roughly 90%-99% of their X-Gene, with some flexibility for certain strains like Wolverine's (which seems to be mutation-resistant). This shared portion would account for them being considered the same species and allowing them to interbreed, but allow for enough natural deviance to account for children not inheriting their parents' powers. Whether or not a child inherits the parent's mutation is a form of natural selection itself, as that sort of microevolution would dictate whether or not the parent's X-Gene mutation is beneficial enough to become cemented in the population.

The inheritance of mutant powers has nothing to do with a game of mix-and-match and everything to do with the relative mutant strain present in the parents'. Right now the mutant species is in a state of flux due to the X-Gene only becoming active now, but that won't last forever. It has even been stated before, by Skin I believe. The fact that most mutants are produced by humans likely ties into the high rate of mutation. Once mutants become common enough then interbreeding will be between mutants, and the frequency of inter-generational mutations will decrease. Mutations like Rogue's--ones which inhibit reproduction--will become less frequent. Mutant subsets--such as feral mutants, or psychics, or energy manipulators--will begin to group together, and eventually will begin to wipe each other out either through better survival chances or open warfare. The most successful ones will spread their DNA through the population, and eventually humanity will become a race of unified super-beings like the Skrulls. That is also why mutants are not, technically, a species, but a subspecies. They can still breed with humans and produce fertile offspring. However, after a couple millennia without humans, THEN they might have evolved into something genetically distinct.

A lot of this I've picked up over the years, but it does explain Sinister's goals. Sinister has always been about the strength of the mutant race and has performed many unspeakable acts towards this goal, including exterminating the Morlocks. From a genetic perspective this is wise, as many of them possessed detrimental mutations which could negatively affect the gene pool if they were to reproduce. Sort of like wiping out genetic diseases by killing the first people to ever possess them; cruel, but effective. If the mutant race was destined to stay variable forever then this would make no sense, so obviously he is planning for this kind of unified future. It was stated once that the Summers bloodline is "mutant-pure", implying that an untold number of Scott's ancestors have carried an X-Gene, dormant or otherwise. If this is true then Scott would be more likely to possess a "fixed" X-Gene; that is, one which is highly resistant to mutation inter-generationally. This would give him a leg up in an evolutionary sense, because his children would be more likely to carry his abilities and spread them through the population. If so--again, all hypothetical here, this is just pieced together from comics--then the addition of Jean's X-Gene could allow for a mutant strain possessing her immense psychic abilities, but fixed so that they are permanently embedded. Meaning that the Scott/Jean genetic line would have a very high chance of keeping those powers for a longer time, and giving the mutant race a higher probability of ending up with those powers on a species level.

So as for Magneto's children, or a hypothetical Kitty/Colossus one, there's no way to say. Lorna got Magneto's powers but there was enough of an inter-generational mutation for her to get green hair. Wanda would have originally had energy-based powers like him (according to the wiki; I can't remember where I read it), but exposure to Cthon's energy caused them to become magical. Pietro got his father's face and hair, but not his powers. Compared to, say, Xavier, whose child(ren) all seem to share his psychic abilities. It does seem that psychic powers have a higher chance to move on--possibly hinting at a more recent ancestor for all of them--but it's impossible to say.

Again, all of this is suuuuper shaky, and only pieced together from my biology knowledge and comic history.

I should not have started drinking before reading this....

Will be back in the AM to discuss.

The Summers's bloodline goes back to Black Womb and Daniel Summers, her abilities were nothing like Scott's, Alex's or Gabriel's, Sinister's interest in Daniel goes back to him being a mute boy who escaped from his Lab, during the further adventures of Cyclops and Phoenix, where Jean and Cyclops unwittingly became two of the first Mutants Sinister had ever encountered. (which is probably a large part of his obsession with them)

Jean's family goes back to Fiona Knoblach (The Dark Mother) who also had massive Psionic ability which she passed on to many of her decedents,(including Jean) Sinister was very aware of the existence of Fiona given that he sent people to kill her...

it is interesting to note that only 1 of Scott's many alternate timeline children has been shown to share his abilities, (Ruby Summers) where as Most of Jean's share her Psychic abilities, and most of Logan's share his Feral ones, where as of all of Mystique's kids the only one to share her shape shifting abilities is Raze and Azazel passes on Teleportation abilities most of the time, Emma also seems to reliably pass on her abilities more often than not however Storm rarely passes on her Weather abilities, although when it comes to the Guthrie's their mutations are so varied between a single generation, I have no odea how to explain them...

@red_paladin_: His relation to Black Womb doesn't mean that she would have the same powers, it just means that generations of mutant inbreeding would result in his mutation become locked in. As for the bit with their children, an argument could be made that some mutants are more or less mutated than others. I mean Jean Grey is a psychic so powerful she attracted The Phoenix, while other mutants only have blue skin or wings. There are many levels to genetic inheritance beyond just "Mother or father" so there's really no way to know for certain unless it is outright stated. The Guthrie mutations likely tie into them having human parents. As for the others, that is just natural deviation. I knew a guy whose every son looked almost identical to him. This could be sheer coincidence or it could mean that his traits have some kind of unexplained resilience that his wife's lacked. The same can be true for mutants.

@njchrispatrick: You should also note Jean Grey and the Phoenix Force when it comes to her family line. True, Jeans genetic template is what drew the Phoenix Force due to her psychic signature, but it has been apparent that Jean and Rachel aren’t the only ones with this connection. According to Shiar, apparently, Jeans entire family line holds the potential for becoming its host. While the Phoenix can possess any it wishes, it picks and chooses psychics on a frequent basis. Rachel became a host because of her psychic signature being identical to Jean as well as Madelyne Pryor whose genetic structure was identical to Jean. If Jeans family has that same potential to become Phoenix, would that not mean that Jeans family line also has a fixed gene as well that draws this cosmic entity to it? Because aside from Sara, none of the Grey family line have psychic powers, patent or otherwise. Gailyn and Joseph also are mutants confirmed, but we never got confirmation on what their powers were.

@red_paladin_: And I guess you just answered my question regarding Jeans family line. My bad @njchrispatrick.

@pyrofn:The Phoenix is one of those shakier features that it is harder to get a lock on, given the whole "omnipotent supernatural entity" thing. But I'd imagine that, yea, there's something in the Grey genetics that makes them special or something. That could actually be an interesting story to see at some point--maybe some past Grey ancestor had something happen to them that altered them and would later allow their descendants to carry a gift for Phoenix possession.

Of course, then there's also the argument that The Phoenix's choice ISN'T genetic. The Shi'ar might've believed that it chose hosts based on genetic connection but we've never really gotten any confirmation that it was the actual bloodline that drew the Phoenix and not shared psychic powers or something else, given that Rachel and Madelyne were both offspring (of sorts) of Jean. This would also explain why it has no issues with utilizing other psychics like the Cuckoos or Quentin. The Phoenix's love of psychics is well-known, though.

I believe you misunderstood my point, you stated that you believed that the summers line is a fixed/stable Mutant line, however the only identified mutant in their heritage is Black Womb, who they share none of the Mutant abilities of, and we know that scott's parents and grand parents were regular human's so I'd consider it more likely their mother Catherine was carrying a high potential to have mutant children, given that all 4 of her kids had Mutant abilities, (the forth being Adam X who was created artificially) add in that only 1 of Scott's many alternate universe kid's have been shown to have clearly inherited any of his abilities, (Ruby Summer's) I can't see how there is anything superior about his generic's given that there are many other better choices available to Sinister...

Quite alright, I'm happy to have been of help... :)

@red_paladin_: I was just basing it off the fact that Sinister himself has been quoted to say that Scott's family line has been stated to be "mutant-pure". There is no exact reference to what this means, but based on how purity is often defined (especially given the fact that Sinister came from an aristocratic society) it would not be amiss to assume that it means that many, if not all of Scott's recent ancestors carry an X-Gene. We only know of one who was an actual mutant, but carrying the X-Gene still counts.

Sinister has made contradictory and/or false statements before, such as Sinister/Miss Sinister stating in one instance them both wanting to take over Laura's body, to gain her healing factor, and in another one that Sinister would not want/take samples of her DNA because she was simply an inferior copy of the original, opting instead to take them from Daken, then it is discovered from Sinister's own files that Laura isn't actually a clone but rather Logan's and Sarah Kinney's daughter, however looking at the possible way's that particular statement could make sense, he could either mean that Scott's entire direct line were active mutants (which we know is not true) or much more likely he isolated one particular x-gene by breeding out any and all other X-gene mutations by introducing non X-gene carriers to the direct Summers line over several generations and then reintroducing 1 particular x-gene into their line via Catherine marrying Corsair, essentially Sinister was seemingly trying to create Cyclops, maybe because of Scott and Jean's time traveling to the point of Sinister's own origin, and them becoming two of the first mutants he ever met, and we know from Xavier's own files that the potential of Scott's abilities are considered very limited, unlike his brother Vulcan who's ability potential is unlimited...

Congratulations my fellow X-viners. I was able to read through the entire thread with its long replies and not only I wasn't embarrassed or felt like I'm wasting my time, but I also kinda felt inspired in the end. Reminded me of them goodoltimes on here.

rachel once used a telekenetic optic blast. does that count?