Superman vs Magneto.

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bisofprey

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Hey this is my first post! But going to get straight to it.

Classic/All Star Superman vs Pre M-Day Magneto.

Both powered.

And I know this debate has already being made and it was full of 'Magneto could take Superman's blood out him" but I must remind Superman doesn't need to breathe to survive under red sun. (See him in Atlantis and Space) And this is first encounter, no pre-preparation. Both discover their opponents power in battle.

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The_Wotan

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Magneto.

On fundamental scale this is not really a fair battle since we have an alien powered by solar electromagnetic energy vs the Master of Electromagnetic force, and this is not really a good idea to pair them against each other by logical means. We already saw what would happene when a second tier Magnetism user like Dr. Polaris fought Superman, he essentially had total control both the battlefield and even Superman's own solar energy inside him, this battle would go much worse, since aside from those tricks that Polaris pulled of Magneto can also fry his nervous system, use iron in blood to just kill him or mind control him, and etc.... the list of Magneto's versatile abilities is rather huge to say the least.

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bisofprey

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#4  Edited By bisofprey

@the_wotan: Yes, but could he know that Clark is superpowered by solar energy?

I feel like Magneto would blast him with everything, and if I'm not mistaken his most powerful blasts

include blasting gamma rays, uv rays which would basically empower Clark.

Also i have already aclared theres a big probabilty Clark doesn't have iron on his blood since he's capable of living without oxygen and adapting to every environment.

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The_Wotan

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#5  Edited By The_Wotan

@bisofprey:

Yes, but could he know that Clark is superpowered by solar energy?

Erik has abilities to sense electromagnetic energy disturbances on planetary (against Iron Man during AvX) and even lightyears away (when saving Kitty from planet killing bullet), so sensing EM disturbance inside a being that is in close proximity to him is not gonna be problem for him, that's for sure, friend.

In simple terms, Magneto has magnetic senses to solve this issue.

I feel like Magneto would blast him with everything, and if I'm not mistaken his most powerful blasts

I would suggest you to read more regarding Magneto, since it would clarify that Magneto RARELY uses energy blasts in his battles. He would use either frying someone's nervous system or iron in blood before using energy blasts.

include blasting gamma rays, uv rays which would basically empower Clark.

Not only does Magneto rarely use energy blasts, but he doesn't use light/photonic attacks, he uses standard EM Field blasts which are not in Clark's area of energy absorption, so i don't see how this is an argument really.

To add more, even if Erik uses such type of attacks, Clark's body would be unable to absorb it, since it would be essentially tug of war i.e. who will have more grip on the energy, Clark's absorbing abilities or Magneto's mastery of magnetic forces to harm him, and under these notions Magneto is undoubtely gonna overpower him rather easily, add to that the fact that Magneto has control over energy on SUBATOMIC level and and it's just becomes unfair, Magneto has simply more fundamental grip on electromagnetic energies.

Besides that, Magneto has had many tug of wars regarding energy control over magnetism and he was always the winning one, this battle would be no exception to that notion.

On top of that, one ocassion Magneto was even capable of taking control of Phoenix Force Jean's energies, i suppose you know who and what Phoenix is....

Also i have already aclared theres a big probabilty Clark doesn't have iron on his blood since he's capable of living without oxygen and adapting to every environment.

The fact that Clark's blood is RED by default negates the whole argument that his blood doesn't contain iron, a bit of clarification from my side, you see from biological standpoint the reason blood appears red in color is because of the fact that it contains iron, now by doing simple logical analysis and it would tell us that Clark does have iron in blood.

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helloman

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#6  Edited By helloman

Magneto wins.

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reactor

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Without PIS, either could win

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ParagonxXx

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#9  Edited By ParagonxXx

Two points need mentioning.

1. I find it puzzling that Dr. Polaris is used as an example of how well Magneto would do against Superman when the OP states this is classic/All Star Superman who has never fought Dr. Polaris, only the mainstream Superman has.

2. Mainstream Superman won the rematch against Dr. Polaris, so Magneto beating Superman is not a sure thing simply because he can manipulate the electromagnetic field. Superman has fought and beaten beings who could do that (i.e. Strange Visitor). Not saying Superman would win, but I am saying Superman is not going to be a push over like some posters believe. Plus, it depends on who is writing the story as well. Either opponent could win based on the whim of the writer. I can actually see scenarios where either one could win this.

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The_Wotan

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@paragonxxx:

1. I find it puzzling that Dr. Polaris is used as an example of how well Magneto would do against Superman when the OP states this is classic/All Star Superman who has never fought Dr. Polaris, only the mainstream Superman has.

I would suggest you to use the tag option when you are referring to someone's arguments, that would be nice and thanks.

Regarding the versions, in this case it doesn't matter that much, since Dr. Polaris was not using basic energy blasts to harm Superman, which in this case you would be right since in basic battle systems we can't use different versions to define basic forms of stipulations, but in our case Polaris was using HAX side abilities of magnetism, like draining and blocking Superman's powers, and that's how he was winning, in such context we can use this comparison, no matter the version.

2. Mainstream Superman won the rematch against Dr. Polaris, so Magneto beating Superman is not a sure thing simply because he can manipulate the electromagnetic field.

Friend, here you are presenting rather a wrong/false equivalency stipulation here, in that fight Polaris was not using the abilities that he used in Pre-Flashpoint fight against Superman, you would be correct to use such comparison if Polaris used those abilities and Superman overcame them, but as we both know Polaris played "dumb", so the comparison doesn't work, since my arguments are implying useage of the hax side of abilities regarding magnetism, like draining, energy manipulation and so on.... and those abilities are beyond Superman's flying brick powerset to resist and overcome, in simplified terms, people here have given a specific term to such instances i.e. Polaris "jobbed".

To add more, Magneto's skills are vastly above that of Polaris, what he can do, Magneto can do better and more, be it shields, metal manipulation, energy manipulation and so on....

Superman has fought and beaten beings who could do that (i.e. Strange Visitor).

Same as above, another basic false equivalency since SV was not using the same abilities as i mentioned, in her fight against Superman, she was also using basic type of attacks, like energy blasts, physical attacks and such, so kinda referrencing her in our case lacks certain relevancy overall.

Not only that in the context of their fight Superman used elements such as WATER and METALS to DRAIN/NEGATE her powers, so the context once agains renders the relevancy of such instance to null, since he didn't overpower her abilities, just negated them by using outside elements, which are kinda irrelevant against Magneto, since he is not a walking energy being (the main reason why it worked on SV in a first place).

But outside of that, she was actually giving Superman a hard time, with basic energy and physical attacks, this is coming from a character who lacks feat in that area, unlike Magneto, of course.

Action Comics #759

But even if Magneto uses those basic type of attacks, which he rarely does, those attacks would be magnitudes higher in potency than those Superman withstood from Polaris and SV, after all his attacks have damaged the likes of Hulk, Hercules, Doctor Strange and so on....

Not saying Superman would win, but I am saying Superman is not going to be a push over like some posters believe.

Except, sadly, he is gonna be a pushover, friend, what is Superman gonna do when Magneto uses his iron in blood to kill, mind control or restrain him, what is Superman gonna do when Magneto fries his nervous system, what is Superman gonna do when Magneto shuts down his brain, what is Superman gonna when Magneto drains him of his solar cocktail and blocks his powers, and the list of such abilities goes on and on.... Superman is powerful, no doubt about that, but against such odds, he simply doesn't stand a solid chance.

Plus, it depends on who is writing the story as well. Either opponent could win based on the whim of the writer. I can actually see scenarios where either one could win this.

You are correct under specific plot induced narrative elements, anyone can win. But here we don't use such stipulations so to speak, we simply look at individual characters, their powers and abilities, analize it and in the end draw logical conclusion who would win, simple as that, and in such notions, the winner would be Magneto.

Also regarding those scenarios, those are rather irrelevant really, since writers have showcased scenarios where powerfull characters lose to someone of street caliber like Batman or Spider-Man, just because such narrative scenarios happened, doesn't make it correct.

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CryoModeste5

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Can`t really decide