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#11901 Posted by Supra-Man (3144 posts) - - Show Bio

I can't speak for Omega, as I don't know them, but I can tell you that a bloodlusted Nemo is weaker than the standard one.

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#11902 Posted by Yggdmillennia (1243 posts) - - Show Bio

@supra-man: Omega was more or less a Kratesis tier opponent, not beating her because her offense surpassed his defense however he had the physical capability and equipment to keep up with her.

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#11903 Posted by Supra-Man (3144 posts) - - Show Bio
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#11904 Edited by Yggdmillennia (1243 posts) - - Show Bio

@supra-man:

https://comicvine.gamespot.com/profile/omegablast452/blog/cvnu-werewolf-omega/88857/

Here's a link on him then :p

Note blog never got 100% complete

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#11905 Posted by Maverick_6 (10434 posts) - - Show Bio

Omega would decimate Contingency from what I've idly glanced at in their bios.

She has very little in the realm of a viable means of beating him. She can't BFR him. If it takes a multi-city destroying attack to "make him begin to move" than you'd probably talking about breaking large portions of countries to actually have a chance at basically throwing the equal to a cross. If he wasn't unarmored, anyway.

This isn't to speak of his defenses against any manner of hax, that makes him arguably as impenetrable as she is. Telepathy is invalid. Bloodbending/Transmutation/Telekinesis and the like are invalid. Reality Warping on the scale of a God is invalid.. His armor can withstand planetary attacks. His cape is completely indestructible. He more or less has every power in the book and an answer to most any possible situation that doesn't involve using a character that outlcasses him in nigh-every regard.

More or less, he has answers to Contingency, but Contingency doesn't have a contingency for him. He's eventually going to close the distance and destroy her there eventually more often than not. She maybe has one or two ways out, but I don't see her beating him for any kind of majority.

Omega 9.5/10

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#11906 Posted by Deicidium (615 posts) - - Show Bio

@maverick_6: How does he win 0.5 fight?

Time to drop the blunt, Mavie boi.

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#11907 Posted by Maverick_6 (10434 posts) - - Show Bio

@deicidium: I need it to balance out all this crack.

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#11908 Posted by Deicidium (615 posts) - - Show Bio
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#11909 Posted by Hawkshade (4974 posts) - - Show Bio

Honor Avenger vs Grimmwald

Conditions:

  • No prep for Grimmwald. Honor Avenger gets ten minutes of prep inside an empty but fully stocked police station.
  • No bloodlust
  • In character
  • Morals on

Setting:

  • The Grimm City 19th precinct HQ
  • Battlefield is the interior of the building, neither party may exit the building for any reason
  • Fight takes place at noon; full daylight but the power is out

Equipment:

  • Both have all equipment in their bios.
  • Additionally Honor Avenger has any equipment she can scavenge from the police station in her ten minutes of prep-time, including firearms, riot equipment and body armor

Motivations:

  • Grimmwald is motivated by the desire for justice; Honor has killed every police officer in the station and he is responding to their final distress call. He will not fight to the death unless it is within his character to do so.
  • Honor sees herself as purging Grimm City of the weak, including the vigilantes who she doesn't believe are strong enough to survive. She will not fight to the death unless it is in her character to do so.

Victory Conditions:

  • No BFR
  • Death, KO or incapacitation
  • Additionally either party can flee the battlefield if and when it is in their characters to do so. This counts as victory for the other party.
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#11910 Posted by Rosso (5459 posts) - - Show Bio

Requesting details on Grimmie's moral code?

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#11911 Posted by Hawkshade (4974 posts) - - Show Bio

@rosso: To the best of my knowledge he doesn't kill unless he thinks there is no other way. Where that exact line is, I don't know.

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#11912 Posted by Rosso (5459 posts) - - Show Bio
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#11913 Posted by Hawkshade (4974 posts) - - Show Bio
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#11914 Posted by Grimmwald (3351 posts) - - Show Bio

@hawkshade: @rosso: That GIF, LOL. And yup, LL is right. Grimmwald doesn't kill unless he feels he absolutely has to.

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#11915 Posted by Rosso (5459 posts) - - Show Bio
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#11916 Posted by Grimmwald (3351 posts) - - Show Bio

@rosso: Not if the worst Honor Avenger did was kill every police officer in the station. What would compel him to do so though would be if during his fight with her, he felt she was too dangerous to be kept alive. So that'd depend on how powerful she is or how difficult she is to KO etc. coupled with his quick psychological evaluation of her. So basically if she proves to be exceptionally dangerous (like an Alpha Dog) and irredeemably immoral, then he might feel the need to kill her.

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#11917 Posted by Rosso (5459 posts) - - Show Bio

Just noticed I'm in the picture, and I resent this slanderous image. I'll see Mr. "Bitcoin Billionaire" in court.

Disclaimer: I don't really know the feats for these fighters, so expect that I'm incomplete.

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#11918 Posted by Hawkshade (4974 posts) - - Show Bio
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#11919 Edited by Rosso (5459 posts) - - Show Bio

This is interesting, and I have to admit I'm not 100% sure what I think of this one. I'd love to play with a powerset like that one. Also love it if Risky came back and that was a thing that happened.

Operationalising HA's stats for easier reference.

  • Agility - Above Average/Athlete
  • Durability - Normal
  • Energy projection - Negligible
  • Skill - Master of multiple forms
  • Intelligence - Gifted
  • Mental power - Basic training/experience
  • Speed - Athletic. Above average but below peak
  • Stamina - above average
  • Strength - Peak human

HA has a little bit of prep, so she might try to set an ambush if she knows Grimm's coming, but he won't fall for that because he can sense her through vibrations. Possibly through the walls. Not sure how far this extends, but he could sense a vest in the soil and other bodies moving in the air, once they got within a certain range, so it's feasible he'd sense HA. If not before he entered, then soon after.

I'd actually give a skills advantage to HA. She's virtually a photographic reflexes person, and her bio says of her power, "a more abstract application to this power is her ability to understand certain concepts. So far she has only shown to understand the principles of martial arts she has directly been attacked with" and suggests she's mastered many forms (the card/stat system says something like a dozen, though I don't know whether or not this is exactly the case). Even if Grimm comes with a style she's unfamiliar with, she'll understand everything about his physical capabilities the instant they make physical contact.

Grimmwald probably wouldn't know this, so he probably doesn't feel a particular need to avoid hand to hand combat. He's also got ranged weapons, though HA will have arguably superior gear (in some areas) depending on how she equips herself in the station. Body armor to protect against blades and things, and maybe gas. (I admit I don't know what kinds of armaments police tend to have stocked away, except shotguns and shields and armor and some gas weapons of their own.)

What may help save him here is Grimmwald has superior physical stats. HA is athletic but below peak human in speed and agility, above average in stamina. Meanwhile, Grimmwald has blatantly superhuman strength and speed--even if just above peak human, it says what he can do lies beyond human capability. Additionally, his radar sense is kinda like a clairvoyance in that it'll tell him where all the moving bodies are, where projectiles are flying, what muscles are at play inside her (and thus, which moves she's making), and so on. And it sounds like, based on Impero's descriptions, he's quite astute at knowing what the different movements in concert mean.

So it's her skill and the Grimm Police Dept. armaments vs his superior physicals, and some of his armaments are better than what she's likely to find.

Out of striking distance I'd probably give it to HA because I think I've also seen police can get access (even if non-standard) to weapons capable of automatic fire, and she could use flashbangs to overload and disorient his senses (which I totally forgot until just now). This is especially dangerous if she gets that first touch and then is able to make some distance because she could flash him once, or a bunch of times, and shoot him while he's reeling. (She'd also learn about his phobia. But I don't know if that applies because the power is out, and I don't know if his tech phobia applies just when he knows/thinks tech is functional, or if it's a full general thing.) She might be able to play on this [the flashbang/overload idea] while he's feinting. Or depending on how she opens the encounter, may try to blind and disorient him from the onset. I'm not sure whether or not Grimm is in general a bullet-timer/can dodge gunfire itself (i.e. without being disoriented, he may be able to avoid that; or not, I don't know).

I think I'd give it to Grimm more often than not. He's bigger, stronger, and faster. He outweighs her by approximately 40 lbs anyway (several weight classes, that's a big deal), and he's 6'2" while she's 5'7" so he'll have a decided reach advantage which he seems to know how to use. Can't get too rangey and has to stay aggressive, or she could take advantage. In grappling, I admit I'm a little torn. He's a lot stronger than her and that counts for a lot. Also, he could sense where every part of her body is so it's gonna be hard for him to lose any positional battle, and he could sense if she was going to grab for something to stab or shoot him with. (Although she may be able to use that knowledge to her advantage.) At the same time, as soon as they make contact, she understands his grappling capabilities, everything about his style, the principles of wrestling and jiu jitsu, and may be able to form a way to beat him.

However I think generally speaking we tend to overestimate the importance of skill at the highest level of these things and probably here Grimm's stats will give him an edge. It's quite often the case that the more skilled fighter is beaten simply because the other fighter had better stats.

I've got Grimmwald 6/10, but also there was a lot of "I don't know" here, so the whole breakdown thing?

I'm gonna peace out on this note and if someone better wants to have a crack at it...
I'm gonna peace out on this note and if someone better wants to have a crack at it...

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#11920 Posted by Beremud (622 posts) - - Show Bio

@rosso: That...was a lot better than I could ever manage.

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#11921 Posted by Rosso (5459 posts) - - Show Bio

@beremud: I'm not fishing for compliments, dammit! If I say it's bad, it's bad!

Don't contradict me or else...
Don't contradict me or else...

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#11922 Posted by Beremud (622 posts) - - Show Bio

@rosso: If you think I'm contradicting you, you're wrong. >:P

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#11923 Posted by Rosso (5459 posts) - - Show Bio

@beremud: Well, I think so, but I'm never wrong.

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#11924 Posted by Beremud (622 posts) - - Show Bio

@rosso: I know that you believe you understand what you think I said, but I'm not sure that you realize what you heard was not what I meant.

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#11925 Posted by Rosso (5459 posts) - - Show Bio
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#11926 Posted by Hawkshade (4974 posts) - - Show Bio

@rosso:That was an excellent breakdown. I only have one point of contention:

However I think generally speaking we tend to overestimate the importance of skill at the highest level of these things and probably here Grimm's stats will give him an edge. It's quite often the case that the more skilled fighter is beaten simply because the other fighter had better stats.

In real life that's often true. But I don't think it would be in a comic book world because the level of skill goes so much higher. Comic book fighters can develop skills far in excess to street leveler stats. So while a RL human's physical abilities might only go up to say, five, and a comic book human's physical abilities go up to eight (while remaining street level) the street levelers skills could potentially go up to fifteen.

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#11927 Edited by Mr-Teddy (300 posts) - - Show Bio

Nemo, Brutus, Johann, Donn, Maverick

No Caption Provided
No Caption Provided
No Caption Provided
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Vs Saint Speed

Rules

Round 1:

Who would be the fastest person to destroy @saint_speed's spot or get him off the couch by all means necessary. Allowing close allies/outside sources to help out but for every ally they have, it will reduce 1/10 of their prep time. No BFR.

  • Maverick: 1 week of prep
  • Donn: 1 week of prep.
  • Johann: 1 week of prep.
  • Brutus: 1 day of prep.
  • Nemo: 2 hours of prep.

Round 2:

They all work together. No prep. They have 4 hours to get Todd off the couch. The couch is indestructible.

No Caption Provided

@supra-man@warsman@hound_of_war@maverick_6

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#11928 Posted by Last_Man_Standing (743 posts) - - Show Bio

@mr-teddy:

Does Saint have any aversions to certain smells or sensations? Turning the couch into pudding for example.

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#11929 Posted by Mr-Teddy (300 posts) - - Show Bio

@last_man_standing: nah, I think he's probably used to smells since he's always drunk and smelling like peepee.

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#11930 Posted by Last_Man_Standing (743 posts) - - Show Bio

@mr-teddy:

True. Making him all that pudding wouldn't do anything but give him a snack anyway.

Taking his beer and putting it into a fridge across town would just make him upset or he would nap it out.

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#11931 Posted by Pronoia (1443 posts) - - Show Bio

His powerset contradicts his origin story, if he was even a fraction as fast as everyone implies he is then he could have saved the girl in the well before any collapse could happen.

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#11932 Edited by Mr-Teddy (300 posts) - - Show Bio

@pronoia: ye lmao, that's the whole point. Was trying to parody stupid/all tragic origins and their characters being constantly themed around it.

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#11933 Edited by Supra-Man (3144 posts) - - Show Bio

Scenario Breakdown - Nemo

This may be the Caped Colossus' greatest challenge. Without the ability to remove the couch from the battlefield or destroy its surroundings, he'll have to rely on outpacing Saint Speed. Speed may as well be symbiotically connected to the couch. Furthermore, Nemo would be utterly committed to a lack of collateral damage throughout the duration of the battle. We're in an open scenario here, so basically anywhere's game for speed. The two hours of prep won't do him much, as he has no information on Speed in the Vault.

Feats for Saint Speed:

  • His bio lists him as "the world's fastest hero."
  • Saint Speed has read a Tom Clancy novel in ten seconds, and the Lord of the Rings series in under a minute. The implication is that he was able to fully enjoy / process these works at such speeds.
  • Having talked to Wheatley about the nature of Speed's powers, we know that he doesn't necessarily move more quickly, but rather, "exist faster." This is why Speed is able to move without destroying his surrounding environment. It also significantly reduces the chances he can be taken by surprise.
  • Saint Speed could, in his prime, save people around the entire world. He was a hero on a global scale, denoting a high level of awareness as well as mobility.
  • Speed was able to go for a walk around the town of Opportunity CA., effortlessly dragging his couch along with him, in the time that Bottle-Rocket was able to finish the word "joe." He moves so quickly that he does not seem to move at all.
  • Saint Speed has severe depression.

Comparing this list to Nemo's speed feats, it's clear that Saint Speed has a much greater control over small movements rather than distance sprinting. When I was asked about who would win in a race between the two, I answered Nemo, because his speed can climb past what's normally conceivable almost indefinitely in a straight line. The eucatastrophic drive that powers him would enable him to overcome such a challenge if they were traveling towards a finish line, but as far as matching Speed's movements in a close ranged area, he'd probably be unable to keep up.

He could try to use his entropic breath to freeze Saint Speed, as he did against the Avatar in Heavens Unite, but that would result in his gradual transformation into pure energy, destroying him utterly as he transcends the material plane. As per the scenario, if he's determined to do it by any means necessary, it's conceivable that Nemo would sacrifice himself to slow Saint Speed and his couch to complete and utter motionlessness in a denouement worthy of Monty Python, but as per the rules of comedy, this probably wouldn't work.

The only victory scenario I can truly see for Nemo is if he accelerates himself to Saint Speed's mental processing speed and takes the time to convince him to leave his spot by slowly working him out of his depression. This could occur within the given time parameters, as the months-long recovery period would be accelerated to maybe around an afternoon. With 2 hours of prep to figure out Speed, Nemo might be able to do this, but it'd be harder than redeeming Nuclear Johann.

I'd say Nemo 5/10 at the end of the day, there are too many factors to consider.

Scenario Breakdown - Brutus

OK, this one's more complicated. Brutus' bio contains a multitude of gear and his history is filled with solving "unsolvable" problems. He can completely erase matter from existence via God Particles, and has absorbed Reynard's powers as well. What's most essential, though, is Brutus' obsessive tendencies. Throughout his canon appearances on CV, the most consistent aspect of Brutus' character has been his single-minded determination bordering on complete psychosis. If he's told to get Saint Speed away from his spot, he will devote every microsecond of his day of prep time to dismantling the situation front-to-back.

He will not care about what Saint Speed wants, because he knows what Saint Speed needs. Brutus commits deeds based on the things he sees without pausing to breathe, because it's his creed. It enabled him to lead the Union and breed a clone son to carry on his greed. He will not accede to Speed staying where he wants to be - he'd be willing to force-feed him a nuclear bomb and blow Opportunity off the map before he recedes.

As for countering Saint Speed's speed, I don't really know. He'd probably just retreat. The issue with Brutus is that he's frank and forceful. His bio quote is a definition of utilitarianism in the efficiency sense. He has no style, he has no grace. Speed would vamoose the moment he realized his spot was under fire from a force he couldn't fight back against. Cerberus drones wouldn't be of any help either, because those were against the rules.

Saint Speed 7 / 10, Brutus would probably require more prep to win.

Scenario Breakdown - Johann von Derfflinger

Johann is in a boat similar to Brutus, in that they're both committed to a better tomorrow as they see it. If destroying Speed's spot meant accomplishing that, then there's no doubt that either he or Brutus would be the most driven to accomplish it by any means necessary. This breakdown goes about the same as the one before, as both players have a similar modus operandi. The main difference I can see right now is that Johann would be more likely to try negotiating with Speed based on what I've seen of him. However, this is likely to be ineffective, as Speed processes the world too quickly to hold a conversation. The negotiations would be short.

The main distinction I see between Johann and Brutus in this scenario is that while Brutus wielded political power before, he seems to have mostly retreated from that scene. Warsman is still the head of the NeoMarch and would be likely to use the movement to his advantage. Sacrificing prep time for a vast network of allies, he'd turn society itself against Saint Speed by highlighting the great power he squanders by remaining on his couch all day. #CouchGate would trend within moments as the NeoCorp's vast network of internet trolls coordinates social media strikes on Casa del Rocket. Then Typhon would bust through the roof and startle Speed, but perhaps with the distracting factor of him being on the news he's watching, he'd remain.

The NeoMarch may fail to remove Speed from his couch, but his adamant attachment to such a thing relative to his great power would propel them to even greater political heights, after which Venezuela would probably get invaded again or something. The question is also this - if Warsman acquires physical ownership of the couch, is it still Speed's? Technically, it belongs to Bottle-Rocket, so if he worked with him, he may find a way to outwit the hyper-speedster.

Johann 5/10 if he starts a hashtag.

Scenario Breakdown - Donn

Even Saint Speed needs to sleep. Donn's stealthy approach to problems like this sets him apart from every other combatant mentioned thus far. Using Goodneighbor for reconnaissance, I think it'd be a fairly simple move for him to isolate ways to deal with Speed without ever actually engaging him. The massive week of prep time he's been allotted would enable him to easily spread a sleep-inducing chemical agent into Casa del Rocket, disabling Speed entirely.

He has numerous feats for sneaking, and his pride would force him to act cautiously, rather than the other characters, who likely become less effective when under such circumstances. There are no situations in which Donn could possibly permit himself to be embarrassed by this depressed sack-of-**** has-been speedster, so he'd put everything into it. The government collapses as all of its resources are funneled into finding a foolproof way to remove Speed from his spot, and ultimately, it works out.

Along the way, though, we'd be seeing a level of strain put on Alexander comparable to the sort Bane put Batman through during the Knightfall saga. As the enigma of this couch obsesses him, I would expect CV's entire street level rogues gallery to try and engage him along the way. We'd be seeing villains from throughout Donn's century-long career coming out of the woodwork to finally challenge him in the open, as unlike other operations the Black Bat takes part in, this is occurring in a very public space. Gassing Speed is just half the battle. Donn might not make it out alive, even if he gets him off the spot. We're looking at a comic medium here too, so it's more serialized suffering without a guaranteed return to the status quo until maybe two years after initial publishing.

Donn 9/10...but at what cost?

Scenario Breakdown - Maverick

Maverick wins.

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#11934 Posted by Last_Man_Standing (743 posts) - - Show Bio
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#11935 Posted by Supra-Man (3144 posts) - - Show Bio

@last_man_standing: The perfect example of why you need us...sits before you! LETHARGICALLY!

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#11936 Posted by Last_Man_Standing (743 posts) - - Show Bio

@supra-man:

He does not fight for his or your humanity!

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#11937 Posted by Supra-Man (3144 posts) - - Show Bio

@last_man_standing: I forgot the bonus round. I'm guessing they'd all sabotage each other accidentally.

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#11938 Posted by Last_Man_Standing (743 posts) - - Show Bio

@supra-man:

Johann would just sliiiiiiiide off into the shadows and twiddle his thumbs menacingly.

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#11939 Posted by Mr-Teddy (300 posts) - - Show Bio

@supra-man: You're a madman. If I had put every character on that list vs Saint speed you probably would've done it in less than a day. The real Saint Speed is Jack.

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#11940 Posted by Supra-Man (3144 posts) - - Show Bio

@mr-teddy: My lecture got cancelled last night. Gave me some free time in the bank lol

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#11941 Posted by Hawkshade (4974 posts) - - Show Bio

Go back four pages and you're a year and a half back. Good lord. I will have to return this thread to it's former glory.

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#11942 Posted by Hawkshade (4974 posts) - - Show Bio

Zeon Liafador vs Ada Guillaume and Rosso

Zeon Liafador has returned to life and set her eyes upon Ada's criminal empire. By torturing one of Ada's minions she learns that Ada will be meeting a mercenary that works for her (Rosso) in Grimm City and she sets up an ambush.

Ada knows Zeon has returned to life and though she isn't expecting the ambush she believes Zeon is too weak to live and thus a violation of the natural order; she is happy to kill Zeon when she arrives and offers Rosso a ten million dollar bonus to help her kill Zeon the moment Zeon reveals herself.

Conditions:

  • Zeon has twenty four hours of prep and the advantage of surprise
  • No bloodlust
  • In character
  • Morals on

Setting:

  • Grimm City
  • Battlefield is one square mile of abandoned warehouses, storage facilities and factories
  • Fight takes place at midnight, heavy rainstorm; the only light is from the streetlamps.

Equipment:

  • Both have all equipment in their bios with a few exceptions-- Zeon does not have her power ring or light whip.

Powers:

  • Zeon does not have her Shadow powers. For the purpose of this battle she is restricted to her gear, fitness and skills only.

Victory Conditions:

  • No BFR
  • Death, KO or incapacitation
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#11943 Posted by Grimmwald (3351 posts) - - Show Bio

@hawkshade: Ada and Valentina should win handily. Zeon is a very skilled fighter with the kind of killer instinct you just can't teach. But without her shadow powers, she's not much more than a master martial artist with armor, a bow and arrows (including explosive arrows), and some bladed weaponry. I say the team should defeat Zeon because Ada is a psionic. Now, I don't think Ada can use her telepathy to command Zeon to kill herself because Zeon is incredibly willful and bending her mind won't be easy, even for a telepath. But if Ada decides to attack Zeon's mind with psionic bolts while she telekinetically strangles her to death, it's game over. Especially if half of Zeon's attention will be on Valentina who is an agile and well trained assassin with guns.

On one side, she'll be worried about gunfire, and on the other, her mind is being relentlessly attacked while some telekinetic force is strangling her. But that might not happen because Valentina and Ada are in character for this battle. And Ada does not like physical confrontation. She's far more likely to hang back and let Valentina do the fighting. She does not like getting physical. And while Valentina does have guns, Zeon's armor is strong enough to resist gunfire. And in the event that Valentina closes the distance against Zeon, it won't be in her favor. I don't know how tall Zeon is, but reach won't matter because Zeon is better armored and her pressure point strikes will cause more significant damage to Valentina than Valentina's strikes will Zeon. And because Ada likes to avoid physical conflict, Zeon (who has prep here) will know to use that habit against her. Probably by luring her into a false sense of security by fighting Valentina and suddenly catching Ada off guard with an arrow shot at a vital organ.

Also, Zeon's armor can withstand small explosives, so unless Valentina brings something more substantial than guns, it's going to be difficult for her to deal any meaningful damage. And a head-shot will be difficult because Zeon is a peak human and will be far faster and more agile than any ordinary target. That and Zeon has fought powerful beings like Ziccarra before. And she has prep here. She can devise a plan to account for the disadvantages she'll face in this battle. If they weren't in character, team one would win. Mostly because the key to victory for the team lies with Ada. I don't think Valentina can defeat Zeon, and Ada isn't likely to even fight if she's in character. I'd give this 6/10 for Zeon.

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#11944 Posted by Hawkshade (4974 posts) - - Show Bio

@grimmwald: Yeah, the fight being in character makes a big difference due to Ada's aversion to conflict.

I had a few thoughts on the battle but I wasn't sure exactly how people would see this one. It's a fight with a lot of variables; psychic power, nuanced IC elements and so forth. One thing I was wondering was about Zeon having the advantage of surprise, and Ada believing Zeon should die because dying previously proved she wasn't worthy of life (to Ada, for the purpose of this battle.)

Would Zeon set up an ambush and take Ada down with an arrow before Ada knew she was in a fight? Zeon does have the advantage of surprise and twenty four hours to prep. Or would Ada be able to counter this?

Another question I was considering was Rosso's weapons. Her handgun is one of the most powerful handgun rounds on earth and the .338 lapua magnum will break your shoulder and make you cry, to say nothing of whatever it hits lol. Zeon's armor might protect her but being hit with a much smaller caliber pistol round will really, really hurt even when you're wearing a trauma plate. And stopping an explosion is much easier than stopping a bullet because the explosions force is dispersed across a large surface area but every ounce of energy in the bullet is hitting a spot the size of the tip of your pinky finger. So I think that even if Zeon's armor protected her Rosso's weapons would hurt her. It would be like getting kicked and punched by a really big, really strong opponent.

But Zeon has a lot of canon, a lot of feats and a really good bio, in my opinion. I rate her as the top fighter skill wise in the Liafador world. Her arrows are good and there are a lot of them, her armor is good and as you point out, her pressure points are extremely dangerous in close quarters.

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#11945 Posted by Grimmwald (3351 posts) - - Show Bio

@hawkshade: There are a lot of variables to consider in this battle yeah. It's why it's so interesting!

Zeon has spent the majority of her life surrounded by incredibly powerful family members, like Ziccarra and Thee Champion (family through marriage). She's been forced into battle against significantly more powerful opponents. Twenty hours to prepare for a psionic would be enough time for her. She's used to having to gameplan against more powerful opponents. So I do believe that she would plan to ambush Ada and 8/10 it would work considering Ada is more of a political manipulator, she doesn't have the necessary instincts for battle (at least not that I've seen yet) to react quickly enough to Zeon.

True, getting hit by that round would be very painful. But I don't think that'd be much of a factor. Zeon won't be hindered by pain. It's never worked on her before. Even if the round does injure her, it won't hinder as much. Zeon's fought through horrifying injuries without so much as wincing because of sheer force of will. And if her armor is comparable to vibranium like her bio describes, it'll be that much more difficult to injure her. She's also been through the Liafador Pit which is an extremely traumatic experience, both physically and psychologically, and she survived. She'll probably still get injured by the rounds anyway but she's fought through much worse injuries, and given that she's a peak human (and judging from her feats, it's more Captain America than the actual peak human limits), she'll be more difficult for Valentina to aim at.

That being said, what makes this fight a Zeon one is that she has prep and Ada's characterization would make it a lot easier for Zeon to win than it should be. But also Zeon's feats.

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#11946 Posted by Feral Nova (58325 posts) - - Show Bio

Yeah... idk who would win, but just FYI, Zeon's bio is severely outdated '>_>

She actually doesn't have the ring (Nox/Marcus took it from her), she doesn't have the whip, and she doesn't have her darkness powers.

The only powers she had was her Aggressor abilities (basically Sith powers :P). Her aggressor powers were so strong that she was able to overpower the control of a blood bender. Not sure if you would allow her these abilities for the fight, or not, but honestly they're a big part of her and if she doesn't have them, I don't know how well she would do in this fight lol. A lot of her feats were accomplished because she had her Aggressor abilities and were able to make herself stronger through her anger and pain. Without it, I'm not sure how far she could get in this fight lol.

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#11947 Edited by Pronoia (1443 posts) - - Show Bio

Filly vs Goodneighbor

Battle to the death in Pre-Destroyed Gothic.

Scenario 1) No prep

Scenario 2) One week prep for both and Filly gets a twenty strong gang of drug addicts as cannon fodder/meat shields

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#11948 Posted by Supra-Man (3144 posts) - - Show Bio

Goodneighbor destroys in both rounds. He's more skilled, more ruthless, and has more combat-oriented physicals and reliable gear. He's been trained by Alexander Donn and developed superhuman powers following his use of the Ancient Methods. Filly can't compare.

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#11949 Edited by ParagonxXx (4139 posts) - - Show Bio
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#11950 Posted by Supra-Man (3144 posts) - - Show Bio

Ivana overall, I'd say. Reaver would be the first to go down, and I don't know how Richard would react to encountering his clone mom for what I'm guessing is the first time. It'd probably rattle him, though.