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#1 Posted by WindCloud (2796 posts) - - Show Bio

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The most powerful cat  VS.  a fully grown, 10 ft. tall, walking nightmare.  Who wins ?
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#2 Posted by vuviper (5651 posts) - - Show Bio

Setting is important here

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#3 Posted by cracks (6974 posts) - - Show Bio

Hen hao de wenti! Wo bu zhi dao!

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#4 Posted by WindCloud (2796 posts) - - Show Bio
@vuviper said:
" Setting is important here "
Open, grassy plains, in the middle of a forest.  Head to head confrontation.  Nothing to hide behind.
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#5 Posted by WindCloud (2796 posts) - - Show Bio
@cracks said:
" Hen hao de wenti! Wo bu zhi dao! "
Take a educated guess then.
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#6 Posted by vuviper (5651 posts) - - Show Bio

Grizzly will try to use it's size to intimidate the Tiger, standing on its hind legs, also allowing it to crush a rushing Tiger. Grizzlys are used to being feared, even by the bigger polar bears. A siberian tiger has encountered smaller bears before and preys on them. He would either wait till the grizzly misses or right when the Grizzly stands up to attack it's most vulnerable spots, biting onto its neck and clawing its face
 
The Bear also doesn't have a size advantage here

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#7 Posted by sevennames27 (1589 posts) - - Show Bio

Grizzly Bear wins unless the Siberian Tiger gets backed into a corner, then who knows.    

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#8 Edited by Count Bleck (775 posts) - - Show Bio

Which type of brown bear?  Coastal brown bears tend to grow quite large and almost universally exceed 1,000 pounds.   More inland bears are only 1/2-2/3rds that big on average.   A Coastal Kodiak Brown bear would slaughter any cat to have ever lived, even giant felines such as Smilodon populator, The American lion, would be killed by a modern Kodiak brown bear.  Now a more inland bear can still kill a one ton moose with one blow to the head, a hit a tiger wouldn't survive, but the tiger would have better chances.   It would still lose a good majority of the time.  

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#9 Posted by vuviper (5651 posts) - - Show Bio
@Count Bleck: Grizzly
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#10 Posted by Count Bleck (775 posts) - - Show Bio
@vuviper said:
" @Count Bleck: Grizzly "
Yellowstone grizzly? Kodiak Island Grizzly?  Be more specific.
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#11 Posted by vuviper (5651 posts) - - Show Bio
@Count Bleck: Do you think it'll make a difference which kind? If so you could explain why
 
Grizzly's never have to face an opponent as powerful as the Siberian Tiger. They compete with Grey Wolves and cougars and occasionally eat a black bears
 
Siberian Tigers regularly prey on bears roughly the size of a Grizzly
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#12 Posted by Count Bleck (775 posts) - - Show Bio
@vuviper said:
" @Count Bleck: Do you think it'll make a difference which kind? If so you could explain why  Grizzly's never have to face an opponent as powerful as the Siberian Tiger. They compete with Grey Wolves and cougars and occasionally eat a black bears  Siberian Tigers regularly prey on bears roughly the size of a Grizzly "
A kodiak island grizzly can weigh about a ton.  A grizzly only 2/5ths that size can kill a one ton moose with one blow.  A tiger hit by that would die instantly.
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#13 Posted by Count Bleck (775 posts) - - Show Bio

Also, Grizzly bears compete with wolverines, some really far north ones occasionally meet polar bears.  They deal with mountain lions, and in the past they'd deal with American lions, who are nearly %20 bigger than Siberian tigers, they'd deal with their larger Giant Short Faced bear cousins, they'd deal with the american cheetah, which is really just a Puma better built for running, They clashed with Smilodons, and some even had to deal with terror birds.

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#14 Posted by Lance Uppercut (23226 posts) - - Show Bio

Animal Planet said the bear would win. Cable's never lied to me before right? -stares at Bill O'Reilly- Oh yeah....

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#15 Posted by capall (8206 posts) - - Show Bio
@vuviper said:
"Grizzly will try to use it's size to intimidate the Tiger, standing on its hind legs, also allowing it to crush a rushing Tiger. Grizzlys are used to being feared, even by the bigger polar bears. A siberian tiger has encountered smaller bears before and preys on them. He would either wait till the grizzly misses or right when the Grizzly stands up to attack it's most vulnerable spots, biting onto its neck and clawing its face  The Bear also doesn't have a size advantage here "

siberian tiger doesn't have any chance of winning against a grizzly bear
the bear does have a size advantage also 
the bear's neck is so thick with fat and fur that the tiger is not able to penetrate it
the bear has enough power to crush the tiger's back or skull easily not to mention it's more intelligent than the cat
in the wild siberian tiger may attack a cub or a much smaller brown bear but in most cases the tiger would walk the other way knowing that the mother bear is around, also in the wild much smaller asian black bears will attack a tiger to steal it's kill since they are also scavangers, a grizzly also has claws that are adapted for digging and chomping down trees and barks and it's so poweful that it rips the tree trunks
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#16 Posted by Bio Guyver (7152 posts) - - Show Bio
@Lance Uppercut said:
" Animal Planet said the bear would win. Cable's never lied to me before right? -stares at Bill O'Reilly- Oh yeah.... "
LOL
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#17 Posted by Ziro (1357 posts) - - Show Bio

The bear.

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#18 Edited by vuviper (5651 posts) - - Show Bio
@capall: Just went with this
 The largest populations are found in coastal areas where weights are typically 500-750 lbs (225–340 kg). 
 
you guys are probably right though i was just guessin based of wiki
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#19 Posted by Count Bleck (775 posts) - - Show Bio
@vuviper said:
" @capall: Just went with this  The largest populations are found in coastal areas where weights are typically 500-750 lbs (225–340 kg).   you guys are probably right though i was just guessin based of wiki "
Kodiaks are a bit bigger than that. 
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#20 Posted by vuviper (5651 posts) - - Show Bio

Interesting
 
 

Asian Black Bears and Ussuri Brown Bears constitute 5-8% of the Siberian tiger's diet. In particular, the brown bear's input is estimated to be 1-1.5%. Certain tigers have been reported to imitate the calls of Asiatic black bears to attract them. Brown bears are typically attacked by tigers more often than black bears, due to their habit of living in more open areas and their inability to climb trees. When hunting bears, tigers will position themselves from the leeward side of a rock or fallen tree, waiting for the bear to pass by. When the bear passes, the tiger will spring from an overhead position and grab the bear from under the chin with one forepaw and the throat with the other. The immobilised bear is then killed with a bite to the spinal column. After killing a bear, the tiger will concentrate its feeding on the bear's fat deposits, such as the back, hams and groin. Tiger attacks on bears tend to occur when ungulate populations decrease. While tigers can successfully hunt bears, there are also records of brown bears killing tigers, either in disputes over prey or in self defense. There have been observations of both bears that changed their path after coming across tiger trails, and of bears following tiger tracks with no signs of fear and sleeping in the same den. However, despite the possibility of tiger predation, some brown bears actually benefit from the tiger's presence by appropriating tiger kills that the bears may not be able to successfully hunt themselves, as they usually dominate these disputes over kills.
  
 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Siberian_tiger#Interspecific_predatory_relationships
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#21 Posted by capall (8206 posts) - - Show Bio
@vuviper said:
"Interesting
 
 

Asian Black Bears and Ussuri Brown Bears constitute 5-8% of the Siberian tiger's diet. In particular, the brown bear's input is estimated to be 1-1.5%. Certain tigers have been reported to imitate the calls of Asiatic black bears to attract them. Brown bears are typically attacked by tigers more often than black bears, due to their habit of living in more open areas and their inability to climb trees. When hunting bears, tigers will position themselves from the leeward side of a rock or fallen tree, waiting for the bear to pass by. When the bear passes, the tiger will spring from an overhead position and grab the bear from under the chin with one forepaw and the throat with the other. The immobilised bear is then killed with a bite to the spinal column. After killing a bear, the tiger will concentrate its feeding on the bear's fat deposits, such as the back, hams and groin. Tiger attacks on bears tend to occur when ungulate populations decrease. While tigers can successfully hunt bears, there are also records of brown bears killing tigers, either in disputes over prey or in self defense. There have been observations of both bears that changed their path after coming across tiger trails, and of bears following tiger tracks with no signs of fear and sleeping in the same den. However, despite the possibility of tiger predation, some brown bears actually benefit from the tiger's presence by appropriating tiger kills that the bears may not be able to successfully hunt themselves, as they usually dominate these disputes over kills.
  
 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Siberian_tiger#Interspecific_predatory_relationships "

hmm, the facts that i have given you is based on the national geographic, but you can check em out on their site as well as many videos from youtube as well
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#22 Posted by MisterGuyMan (2599 posts) - - Show Bio

Grizzly wins easy.  Even a small Grizzly is larger than a large Siberian Tiger.

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#23 Edited by Vortex13 (12140 posts) - - Show Bio

This could actually go either way. A bangle tiger can sometimes take down a small elephant, and Siberians are larger than bangles. Siberian tigers deal with large bears in Russia and can win, though truthfully I don't think the bears in Russia are larger or the same size, they are smaller. The Bear definitely has power over the tiger, but Siberians are no push over either, however the tiger has speed and agility over the bear. The tiger could lunge at the bear and get its throat before the bear can swipe at it, we're talking about a cat that can jump around 12 feet I think. As others have said though one swipe from that bear might be able to kill the tiger, though when Siberians fight they swipe at each other too and they can kill animals with one swipe as well. The tiger has much sharper claws and can dish out a lot of hurt. I think the bear might ultimately win this, but the bear might die afterwords from injuries.

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#24 Posted by capall (8206 posts) - - Show Bio
@Vortex13 said:
"This could actually go either way. A bangle tiger can sometimes take down a small elephant, and Siberians are larger than bangles. Siberian tigers deal with large bears in Russia and can win, though truthfully I don't think the bears in Russia are larger or the same size, they are smaller. The Bear definitely has power over the tiger, but Siberians are no push over either, however the tiger has speed and agility over the bear. The tiger could lunge at the bear and get its throat before the bear can swipe at it, we're talking about a cat that can jump around 12 feet I think. As others had said though one swipe from that bear might be able to kill the tiger, though when Siberians fight they swipe at each other too and they can kill animals with one swipe as well. The tiger has much sharper claws and can dish out a lot of hurt. I think the bear might ultimately win this, but the bear might die afterwords from injuries. "

a bangle tiger may take down a infant or dying elephant that has been abandoned or lost but even a healthy young elephant would destroy a tiger easily and mostly a tiger knows that a mother or other members of the elephant is around so it wouldn't mess with a elephant as elephants are animials that live in tight groups of families
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#25 Posted by Vortex13 (12140 posts) - - Show Bio
@MisterGuyMan: not actually true small grizzlies are around 700 to 900 lbs the average male tiger is 650 lbs not that far off. Plus the larger recorded Siberian tigers have been recorded around 1,000 lbs. Thats around the same size of a larger grizzly.
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#26 Posted by Vortex13 (12140 posts) - - Show Bio
@capall: That is true but the tiger still has speed and agility over the bear, like I said it could go either way I am leaning towards the bear but people seem to think that the bear wins easily I think it'll be a close fight though.
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#27 Posted by capall (8206 posts) - - Show Bio
@Vortex13 said:
" @capall: That is true but the tiger still has speed and agility over the bear, like I said it could go either way I am leaning towards the bear but people seem to think that the bear wins easily I think it'll be a close fight though. "

i can agree with that, it mainly depends on the size, age, the mood and how hungry these predator/omnivore's are at the time when they meet each other in the wild
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#28 Posted by MisterGuyMan (2599 posts) - - Show Bio

I'm not really talking about the statistical anomalies.  The largest Siberian Tiger was 847 lbs.  The largest grizzly found is significantly larger.  Even still, any given Grizzly is likely larger than any given Siberian Tiger.
 

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#29 Edited by Vortex13 (12140 posts) - - Show Bio
@capall: Yup. I'm glad that you got you're information from national geographic, I'm getting mine from their too. I own the national geographic book of mammals, I'm hoping to get one of reptiles and insects too. It wont be from national geographic though I don't believe they have one's for those.
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#30 Posted by capall (8206 posts) - - Show Bio
@Vortex13 said:
" @capall: Yup. I'm glad that you got you're information from national geographic, I'm getting mine from their too. I own the national geographic book of mammals, I'm hoping to get one of reptiles and insects too. "

i love the national geographic i even have that channel on HD and on demand as well as books, lmao
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#31 Posted by whacknasty (5864 posts) - - Show Bio
@MisterGuyMan said:
"I'm not really talking about the statistical anomalies.  The largest Siberian Tiger was 847 lbs.  The largest grizzly found is significantly larger.  Even still, any given Grizzly is likely larger than any given Siberian Tiger.
 

 
 
"

Geeeze... Is that a legit photo?  I get creeped out looking at how massive a lion's head is when i go to the zoo...this bear would have been scary... 
 
Do any of you guys know what that animal planet series is called where they do these theoretical animal battles? I remember seeing one that had a short faced bear in it, and a huuuuge shark, but i cant find them anywhere... 
 
And I'll have to say the grizzly too (unless we start going with some extremely large cats...), but he will have battle scars for the rest of his days..
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#32 Edited by vuviper (5651 posts) - - Show Bio
@whacknasty: Jurrassic Fight Club
 
thats cool, mine where just wiki'ed but there are the sources listed for that paragraph
 ^ Heptner, V. G. & Sludskii, A. A. 1992. Mammals of the Soviet Union. Vol. II, part 2, Carnivores(Feloidea), p. 177. Leiden, E. J. Brill. 784 pp. ISBN 9004088768 
 
 ^ Vratislav Mazak: Der Tiger. Nachdruck der 3. Auflage von 1983. Westarp Wissenschaften Hohenwarsleben, 2004 ISBN 3 894327596 
 
  1. ^ Seryodkin, Ivan (2006). " The ecology, behavior, management and conservation status of brown bears in Sikhote-Alin (in Russian).". Far Eastern National University, Vladivostok, Russia. pp. 1-252 . http://uml.wl.dvgu.ru/rscv.php?id=74.  
  2. ^ Brown, Gary (1996). Great Bear Almanac. p. 340. ISBN 1558214747.  
  3. ^ Seryodkin, I. V., J. M. Goodrich, A. V. Kostyrya, B. O. Schleyer, E. N. Smirnov, L. L. Kerley, and D. G. Miquelle. 2005. Relationship between tigers, brown bears, and Himalayan black bears. Pages 156-163 in D. G. Miquelle, E. N. Smirnov, and J. M. Goodrich (eds.), Tigers of Sikhote-Alin Zapovednik: Ecology and Conservation. Vladivostok, Russia: PSP.
  4. ^ [Table 1. Location, physical status, size and circumstances of deaths of Amur tiger males in the Russian Far East, 1970-1994. http://tigers.ru/articles/tab_eng.html#tab1]
  5. ^ Anatoliy Grigorievitch Yudakov and Igor Georgievitch Nikolaev (2004). The Ecology of the Amur Tiger based on Long-Term Winter Observations in 1970-1973 in the Western Sector of the Central Sikhote-Alin Mountains (english translation ed.). Institute of Biology and Soil Science, Far-Eastern Scientific Center, Academy of Sciences of the USSR . http://tigers.ru/books/ecolog/ch12_en.html.
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#33 Posted by Vortex13 (12140 posts) - - Show Bio
@whacknasty: That photo is not legit. You can tell because the head is bigger then his shoulders and back, if it was real you would see them behind the head. Also the head is just too massive period, it's definitely a fake. It's too big all together they are only 10 feet tall even Kodiak's aren't that big. Think of a buffalo, they can way up to 2,300 lbs and they are not even that big. It's completely fake.
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#34 Posted by whacknasty (5864 posts) - - Show Bio
@Vortex13:
Cool, thanks.  I was worried about having to find some RPG's to even go camping anymore...
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#35 Posted by chaos-soul (1516 posts) - - Show Bio

tiger

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#36 Posted by MisterGuyMan (2599 posts) - - Show Bio

That picture actually is legit.   This particular bear was responsible for a few human deaths.  There are other pictures but I only posted that one because the others are pretty graphic.  There's even a picture of a half eaten human leg. 
 

http://www.blackbearheaven.com/world-record-grizzly-bear.htm
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#37 Posted by Lunacyde (28178 posts) - - Show Bio

The Grizzly would win. It's extremely dense bone structure, devastating claws, brute strength and the fact that the Tiger's preferred method of attack will be highly inneffective due to the bears thick fur and fat, and loose neck skin all factor into the bears victory. Remember in the late 19th century there were pit fights between Grizzly Bears and full gorwn male lions in California. The Grizzly won every time.

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#38 Posted by King Saturn (222962 posts) - - Show Bio
The Grizzly Bear would win
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#39 Posted by Vortex13 (12140 posts) - - Show Bio
@whacknasty said:
" @Vortex13: Cool, thanks.  I was worried about having to find some RPG's to even go camping anymore... "
The picture you posted is misleading though because if you look at the picture at the bottom of the page you linked it is mush smaller than the top picture would lead you to believe. It's the angle of the shot that makes it look much more massive than it actually is.
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#40 Posted by whacknasty (5864 posts) - - Show Bio
@Vortex13:
Huh? 
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#41 Posted by BillyBonzo (433 posts) - - Show Bio

a fully grown grizzly bear  would be able to kill a siberian tiger 
bears are some of the most powerful land predators on earth with polar bears being the most powerful and aggressive 

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#42 Posted by Vortex13 (12140 posts) - - Show Bio
@whacknasty: Oh sorry, I posted to the wrong person.
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#43 Posted by Count Bleck (775 posts) - - Show Bio

A male 1,500 pound Kodiak bear would defeat any felid to have ever lived.  Including the "saber toothed" Machairodontidaes.  Although Marchairodus Kabir, The American and European Cave Lions,  and Smilodon Populator would have a good shot.   The saber-toothed cats would not immediately try to bite the bear though, their sabre's are weak in the middle and can easily break there, as a matter of fact, their skulls in general were fragile, with this trait being more extreme in the Smilodons, who had longer "Saber teeth" than Marchairodus.   The American/European lion was less heavily built than the Machairodontidaes, but it was bigger by a bit, so that could even the odds, not to mention, it was more agile than it's saber toothed peers.   
 
Modern felids really don't stand much of a chance against Kodiak Brown bears.

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#44 Posted by Count Bleck (775 posts) - - Show Bio
@Vortex13 said:

" @whacknasty: That photo is not legit. You can tell because the head is bigger then his shoulders and back, if it was real you would see them behind the head. Also the head is just too massive period, it's definitely a fake. It's too big all together they are only 10 feet tall even Kodiak's aren't that big. Think of a buffalo, they can way up to 2,300 lbs and they are not even that big. It's completely fake. "

Actually, Snopes.com confirmed that the photo is real.  And Snopes has never been wrong, not even once.
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#45 Posted by Lantern Prime (12987 posts) - - Show Bio

Man this is a hard one. Tiger has the speed, agility and strength to match the Grizzly but hte Grizzly has speed and power as well. But it depends I think if it was a straight forward fight the Bear has the advantage....If it was  an ambush by the Tiger then I think he Tiger has the advantage at that point. But its hard choice for me. But one thing i'll say is the Mountain Gorilla(Silverback) one time defeated the Tiger by breaking his back...
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#46 Edited by Count Bleck (775 posts) - - Show Bio
@Lantern Prime said:

" Man this is a hard one. Tiger has the speed, agility and strength to match the Grizzly but hte Grizzly has speed and power as well. But it depends I think if it was a straight forward fight the Bear has the advantage....If it was  an ambush by the Tiger then I think he Tiger has the advantage at that point. But its hard choice for me. But one thing i'll say is the Mountain Gorilla(Silverback) one time defeated the Tiger by breaking his back... "

Unlikely, a Leopard ambushed a Silverback once and disemboweled it, it then proceeded to kill a female gorilla.  And this was documented by a well-known naturalist of the day.  Granted it's a pretty old account, but a leopard still killed two gorillas.  This isn't surprising as leopards and gorillas have virtually the same amounts of strength, due to the fact that pound for pound, leopards are the second strongest felids only exceeded by jaguars, and leopards are far better armed than gorillas.
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#47 Posted by Lantern Prime (12987 posts) - - Show Bio
@Count Bleck said:
"@Lantern Prime said:

" Man this is a hard one. Tiger has the speed, agility and strength to match the Grizzly but hte Grizzly has speed and power as well. But it depends I think if it was a straight forward fight the Bear has the advantage....If it was  an ambush by the Tiger then I think he Tiger has the advantage at that point. But its hard choice for me. But one thing i'll say is the Mountain Gorilla(Silverback) one time defeated the Tiger by breaking his back... "

Unlikely, a Leopard ambushed a Silverback once and disemboweled it, it then proceeded to kill a female gorilla.  And this was documented by a well-known naturalist of the day.  Granted it's a pretty old account, but a leopard still killed two gorillas.  This isn't surprising as leopards and gorillas have virtually the same amounts of strength, due to the fact that pound for pound, leopards are the second strongest felids only exceeded by jaguars, and leopards are far better armed than gorillas. "

Actually I heard a similar story where the Gorilla killed the leapord when it caught it out of the air...
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#48 Posted by Count Bleck (775 posts) - - Show Bio
@Lantern Prime said:
" @Count Bleck said:
"@Lantern Prime said:

" Man this is a hard one. Tiger has the speed, agility and strength to match the Grizzly but hte Grizzly has speed and power as well. But it depends I think if it was a straight forward fight the Bear has the advantage....If it was  an ambush by the Tiger then I think he Tiger has the advantage at that point. But its hard choice for me. But one thing i'll say is the Mountain Gorilla(Silverback) one time defeated the Tiger by breaking his back... "

Unlikely, a Leopard ambushed a Silverback once and disemboweled it, it then proceeded to kill a female gorilla.  And this was documented by a well-known naturalist of the day.  Granted it's a pretty old account, but a leopard still killed two gorillas.  This isn't surprising as leopards and gorillas have virtually the same amounts of strength, due to the fact that pound for pound, leopards are the second strongest felids only exceeded by jaguars, and leopards are far better armed than gorillas. "
Actually I heard a similar story where the Gorilla killed the leapord when it caught it out of the air... "
Almost certainly not at night.  Any way, tigers were the primary predators of Gigantopithecus, a Kodiak bear sized great ape, as were Sumatran leopards, who were the size of Tigers, and as they were built like their modern day cousins, they were of course a good deal stronger and were probably the dominant predator in asia. 
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#49 Posted by Vortex13 (12140 posts) - - Show Bio
@Count Bleck:
" @whacknasty said:
" @Vortex13: Cool, thanks.  I was worried about having to find some RPG's to even go camping anymore... "
The picture you posted is misleading though because if you look at the picture at the bottom of the page you linked it is mush smaller than the top picture would lead you to believe. It's the angle of the shot that makes it look much more massive than it actually is. "
I already addressed that the picture was real but the angle of the picture he showed made the bear look larger and was misleading. But yes I was wrong about it being fake.
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#50 Posted by Son_of_Magnus (15463 posts) - - Show Bio