PELÉ vs. MESSI

Avatar image for frozone
Frozone

367

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

Poll PELÉ vs. MESSI (67 votes)

Pelé 58%
Lionel Messi 54%

Dribbling and passing regards: Who is superior?

Who each have better individual feats on football?

Prime Pelé vs Prime Messi in an empty field going 1v1, the one who scores 10 goals above the other and dribbles the other better wins the game. Who takes it?

Who packs a bigger history and legacy on football: Brazil or Argentina?

Pelé vs. Lionel Messi
Pelé vs. Lionel Messi

 • 
Avatar image for frozone
Frozone

367

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

Cosmic Armor Superman is now bumping this thread...
Cosmic Armor Superman is now bumping this thread...

Avatar image for deactivated-64969837cbeff
deactivated-64969837cbeff

7326

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

Avatar image for king_saturn
King_Saturn

252104

Forum Posts

509

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

There is More Footage of Messi to see his Greatness compared to Pele which we for the most part just go by the Numbers and what the Old Heads tells us about how Great he was. It's an unfair comparison to some extent. We know both are Great but one has the advantage of playing in todays era where we get to see him at Club level and Country level all the time. How many games people have even watched of Pele ?

Avatar image for lemillion
Lemillion

357

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

@king_saturn: Pelé has 3 World Cups and Messi has 0 WC at the moment bro... And even if Messi win this world cup of this year it will be 1 x 3. This is unfair for Messi!!!!

Avatar image for lemillion
Lemillion

357

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

@redhood_jaytodd: No, Pele... I'd say that Pelé was a naturally gifted, powerful athlete who had excellent technique and that's why he stood still those days (still think Eusébio was a better player but he didn't played for Brazil). During Pelé's time there were no red cards with shitty grassy fields and players lunged at eachother like a horse.

Avatar image for watcer
Watcer

1604

Forum Posts

784

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 38

I think it's not a good idea to compare football players from different eras.

Avatar image for cambatta
Cambatta

105

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

Two different styles right there. Edson (Pelé's real name) for example rushed with the ball leaving everyone eating dust behind and had powerful long shots. Pelé was like a one man army just like Maradona. Messi is more technical helping his team as whole but can also perform long shots and bicycle kicks just like Pelé. Messi is probably that bit more dominant than Pelé was in his own time (in a Barcelona shirt). At the same time, both played in fantastic teams and also needed those teams to make it work to this dominant degree. Those high level of turnovers (compared to others in the same season) and number of shots point to this direction. But yea 2 different styles, a better comparison would be a Messi vs. Neymar or Messi vs. Ronaldo.

Avatar image for king_saturn
King_Saturn

252104

Forum Posts

509

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

@king_saturn: Pelé has 3 World Cups and Messi has 0 WC at the moment bro... And even if Messi win this world cup of this year it will be 1 x 3. This is unfair for Messi!!!!

The thing is though that Pele technically won 2 World Cup as in 1962 he got hurt for Brazil in the Competition early on. Brazil won the 62 World Cup on the Strength of Garrincha. Still 2 World Cups is Impressive especially as the Leading Player for the Team. I do also agree that Messi has had some Lackluster Performances for Country but dude still has had some Success. That WC has eluded him though. Another thing to consider is how Strong of a Team that Brazil was compared to Argentina during Messi's reign. Argentina is Good but Brazil was Great. Things get more Interesting though at Club Level where Messi has the Stats that excels Pele though it was different Pele's era obviously.

Avatar image for frozone
Frozone

367

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

@cambatta: Messi vs Ronaldo is a hard question

Avatar image for lemillion
Lemillion

357

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

#11  Edited By Lemillion

@king_saturn: Mané Garrincha was the second best player of Brazilian Team 1960 after Pelé. Pelé was first, and Pelé is goat. Pelé was an far more complete player than Garrincha. Garrincha was one of the best dribblers ever and an excellent scorer and crosser but he was a pure winger. Pelé had the vision to play in midfield; on top of that fact, he could easily score a goal in a game. He was not only the best finisher in the world but he was also one of the best dribblers, one of the best playmakers and one of the biggest aerial threats. He could do everything.

Avatar image for lemillion
Lemillion

357

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

Avatar image for lemillion
Lemillion

357

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

@cambatta: Again, which Ronaldo are we talking about here? Role model? Surely not as Portuguese Ronaldo has at least 2 sex scandals hanging over him... And hit an autistic children... Sorry I got absolutely no sympathy for Penaldo... Pelé is, an athletic phenomenon and goal scoring machine. C. Ronaldo is not even an dust on Pelé's shoes. Messi, Neymar, Pelé > Overrated-Naldo. Neymar is more technical and way better than C Ronaldo.

Avatar image for dryke
Dryke

80

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

Messi is the more complete footballer.

Avatar image for king_saturn
King_Saturn

252104

Forum Posts

509

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

@king_saturn: Mané Garrincha was the second best player of Brazilian Team 1960 after Pelé. Pelé was first, and Pelé is goat. Pelé was an far more complete player than Garrincha. Garrincha was one of the best dribblers ever and an excellent scorer and crosser but he was a pure winger. Pelé had the vision to play in midfield; on top of that fact, he could easily score a goal in a game. He was not only the best finisher in the world but he was also one of the best dribblers, one of the best playmakers and one of the biggest aerial threats. He could do everything.

But Pele was Hurt in the 1962 World Cup. He did not really play much in the World Cup in 1962 where Garrincha was and Scoring a lot. That's why I say Pele technically only won 2 World Cups as the Lead. Pele only played in 2 Games in the 1962 World Cup. As far as Skill, I can't argue much there but that was not the point I was making. I still think things between Pele and Messi are Closer on the Strength of Messi's club career at Barca. He's done too much there to think that just because he shows up small at times with Argentina he is behind The King.

Avatar image for aesop_rock
Aesop_Rock

30

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

@king_saturn: Messi had an awesome performance back in 2014 WC as well and was only stopped by that monster legendary Germany team who had Neuer, Kloser, Gotze, Schweinsteinger, Kross, all these dudes sacred monsters. I believe Messi would win this WC was not Germany

Avatar image for aesop_rock
Aesop_Rock

30

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

Now, I didn't saw Pelé playing neither Garrincha. Only few match footages exists. From what I've seen, Messi does stomps Pelé in terms of dribbling and passing. Pelé is just a better athlete than Messi. I've never seen Pelé score a solo goal like what Messi did against RM back in 2011 UCL Semis. Also, Messi's dribbling is insanely effective and doesn't waste time on fancy skills and whatnot. Messi FTW

Avatar image for arranvid
ArranVid

7439

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

It's difficult to compare great players from two different eras. It's like comparing Diego Maradona to Cristiano Ronaldo. My personal favourite striker of all time (and who I consider perhaps to be the best of all time) is the Brazilian Ronaldo (who is also Messi's favourite footballer) but that's irrelevant to this conversation.

Dribbling and passing - Pele

Messi is a great dribbler and passer, no doubt about it. But Pele was just as special in his prime. If you see videos of Pele dribbling, you can see he easily made it past 3 or 4 or 5 players just like Messi. Yes, Messi is doing it in a more technical era, but the pitches were more rougher in Pele's era and the ball was harder in material and the boots were clunky and rough tackling was more allowed in Pele's era. Messi's era has more advanced sport nutritional science and data science and the defending in Messi's era is better than Pele's era.

Individual feats - Pele

Pele achieved 12 goals in all World Cups, Messi has achieved 10 goals in all World Cups (and he could score more in 2022 World Cup). Both have achieved well in World Cups and in national teams. Pele was very good against world class players when he was just a teenager, like in the 1958 WC when he helped Brazil win the WC. Messi was also world class as a teenager. It's tough to decide who is better in individual feats but I edge it to Pele. Pele did have Garrincha and great Brazilian teams to help him out whereas Messi has a less-than-stellar Argentinian team that feeds him the ball...but that shouldn't discredit Pele's individual performances. There's a reason that Pele was known as 'The King' and why Maradona thought Pele was the best between Maradona vs Pele and why a war was stopped temporarily just so that the warring nations could watch Pele play. Pele was more powerful in both feet than Messi when it comes to striking into the goal, Pele was better at headers, both Pele and Messi have great skill. Both Pele and Messi are great at free kicks into the goal.

Prime Pele vs Prime Messi - Pele

Who packs a bigger history and legacy, Argentina or Brazil?

Brazil, because they have won the World Cup the most number of times. Plus, Brazil has a unique type of style to their football whereas Argentina's football style is not that eye catching. The only major point in Argentinian football was Diego Maradona and how he lead his team to World Cup victory in the 1980s (even though he did a handball goal against England and got away with it), but Brazil has had more special events.

Avatar image for k-rino
K-Rino

56

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

@lemillion: Eusébio was a "better player" but not better than César Maluco and Denis Gaúcho also of Ventania das Araripocas. Messi has a edge here, for sure sure sure. I've seen all 1.300 matches compilations of Pele (almost 800 matches being official) each match compilation with more than 15 minutes in color, I also have all his stats and studies about he and other player os their times. Also, I have seen 500 goals of Tupãzinho in Youtube, he was the closest thing to Hugo Sanchez

Avatar image for mr-yes
mr-yes

5032

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

Sheesh

No Caption Provided

125%?🤔

Avatar image for last0fth3risen
last0fth3risen

5452

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

The GOAT
The GOAT

Well, he's done it.

World Cup goes to Argentina.

Avatar image for king_saturn
King_Saturn

252104

Forum Posts

509

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

The GOAT
The GOAT

Well, he's done it.

World Cup goes to Argentina.

And with this I think Messi has cemented himself as The GOAT. I would often say I believe that Pele was The GOAT but Messi came up Huge in this World Cup especially the Final with 2 Goals and I think this settles it for me personally. Gotta tip my Hat to Mbappe too though cause when it looked like France was dead in the Water in the Second Half dude came through with 2 Goals real quick. I mean a Hat Trick in the Finals of a World Cup ? Yeah, Kylian was Beasting today too.

Avatar image for last0fth3risen
last0fth3risen

5452

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

@last0fth3risen said:
The GOAT
The GOAT

Well, he's done it.

World Cup goes to Argentina.

And with this I think Messi has cemented himself as The GOAT. I would often say I believe that Pele was The GOAT but Messi came up Huge in this World Cup especially the Final with 2 Goals and I think this settles it for me personally. Gotta tip my Hat to Mbappe too though cause when it looked like France was dead in the Water in the Second Half dude came through with 2 Goals real quick. I mean a Hat Trick in the Finals of a World Cup ? Yeah, Kylian was Beasting today too.

It was a great game. I thought the rest of it would be boring after the first 2 goals. I even cheered when Mbappe scored. Then he scored again, and I was like, wait, hold on! :). Kept me invested all the way through. I was dreading penalties, but Messi and the rest of the team delivered.

Mbappe was awesome, but he will have other championships. This had to be Messi's moment.

Avatar image for king_saturn
King_Saturn

252104

Forum Posts

509

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

@king_saturn said:
@last0fth3risen said:
The GOAT
The GOAT

Well, he's done it.

World Cup goes to Argentina.

And with this I think Messi has cemented himself as The GOAT. I would often say I believe that Pele was The GOAT but Messi came up Huge in this World Cup especially the Final with 2 Goals and I think this settles it for me personally. Gotta tip my Hat to Mbappe too though cause when it looked like France was dead in the Water in the Second Half dude came through with 2 Goals real quick. I mean a Hat Trick in the Finals of a World Cup ? Yeah, Kylian was Beasting today too.

It was a great game. I thought the rest of it would be boring after the first 2 goals. I even cheered when Mbappe scored. Then he scored again, and I was like, wait, hold on! :). Kept me invested all the way through. I was dreading penalties, but Messi and the rest of the team delivered.

Mbappe was awesome, but he will have other championships. This had to be Messi's moment.

It was nothing but straight intense after Mbappe scored that Second Goal. I mean crazy intense up until Penalty Kicks and both Teams had shots to end it in Extra Time.

Avatar image for mr-yes
mr-yes

5032

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

@watcer said:

I think it's not a good idea to compare football players from different eras.

Agreed. Who knows how each player would fare in other eras

Avatar image for socajunkie
socajunkie

14574

Forum Posts

2457

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 1

#27  Edited By socajunkie  Moderator

1. Messi has created the most chances for the past 20 years, has the most assists in football history and made the most key passes in the final third so he takes this easily. Not to mention his passing range and vision to break the lines is more comparable to an elite midfielder than a forward. Even when he was a false nine, he’d seamlessly find pockets of space and far side post passes from nothing.

As for dribbling, he’s ran past the Real Madrid defence from the halfway line and made the best keepers and defenders in the world look incompetent from Neuer and Boateng to Cassilas and Ramos. Defending in Pele’s day wasn’t nearly as developed sophisticated as it is now with organisation on a lower level. That’s not his fault, that’s just the way it is.

2. Messi has broken almost every record under the sun and the highest individual feat in football is Ballon d’or wins which he has the most of by a country mile, seven wins is unparalleled and nobody but Cristiano has come close to winning as many and only Cristiano has earned for Ballon d’or points than him.

3. That’s not really fair for Pele, sports nutrition and training has advanced so much as well as tactics that Messi has an advantage off the bat.

3. Probably Brazil since Pele kicked off their World Cup winning dynasty.

Anyway, Messi’s overall game and understanding on the pitch is a level above anyone who came before him.

Avatar image for arekdr
arekdr

3

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

Messi is the best

Avatar image for deactivated-64969837cbeff
deactivated-64969837cbeff

7326

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

Messi is the GOAT 🐐

Avatar image for k-rino
K-Rino

56

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

No Caption Provided
No Caption Provided
No Caption Provided

Rare Pelé GIFs. I have the full videos here.

Avatar image for aesop_rock
Aesop_Rock

30

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

@k-rino: This third goal was awesome.

Avatar image for aesop_rock
Aesop_Rock

30

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

I know Pelé did his things in the sentiment but mostly because I haven't seen enough of Pelé to suggest that he was ever as good as Messi at these 2 things. I'd choose Messi. What I've seen of Pelé a long time ago (full matches of 1970 World Cup and ton of highlights) he really didn't seemed to be able to execute world class dribbling and passing at the same consistence as Messi. I know exactly what kind of evidence I'd need to change my mind, I just don't think they exist

Avatar image for socajunkie
socajunkie

14574

Forum Posts

2457

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 1

#33 socajunkie  Moderator

As a side, Messi was already the best ever before winning the World Cup.

Avatar image for goodkarma
GoodKarma

546

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

  1. Messi.
  2. Pelé
  3. Maradona.
Avatar image for mr-yes
mr-yes

5032

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

Ronaldo still the goat, a corrupt WC where Messi scored a bunch of pens and a tap in changes nothing

No Caption Provided
No Caption Provided
No Caption Provided
No Caption Provided
No Caption Provided
No Caption Provided
No Caption Provided
No Caption Provided

Avatar image for goodkarma
GoodKarma

546

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

@mr-yes said:

Ronaldo still the goat

No Caption Provided

Avatar image for mr-yes
mr-yes

5032

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

@goodkarma: warra non-rigged WC for messi who only scored pens in it anyway 😭 isn’t that what you guys were burning Ronaldo for? Hypocrisy lmao

No Caption Provided
No Caption Provided
No Caption Provided
No Caption Provided
No Caption Provided
No Caption Provided
No Caption Provided
No Caption Provided
No Caption Provided
No Caption Provided

Avatar image for mr-yes
mr-yes

5032

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

On a real, I wish people stopped baselessly hating on CR7 🐐, even his teammates and coach baselessly hate him f

Avatar image for goodkarma
GoodKarma

546

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

@mr-yes: No, I mean no as in the debate isn't even close. Messi is clear of Ronaldo.

Avatar image for mr-yes
mr-yes

5032

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

@mr-yes: No, I mean no as in the debate isn't even close. Messi is clear of Ronaldo.

Cap, and the rigged WC doesn’t change that lmaoooo

Avatar image for goodkarma
GoodKarma

546

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

#41  Edited By GoodKarma

@mr-yes: You want proof? I'll make a whole-ass thread on why is Messi the greatest of all-time.

Avatar image for mr-yes
mr-yes

5032

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

Avatar image for goodkarma
GoodKarma

546

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

@mr-yes: No I'm not about what you think is a conspiracy theory or not, I mean statistical proof that Messi is clear of Ronaldo...

Avatar image for mr-yes
mr-yes

5032

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

@goodkarma: no conspiracy, only proof. See images above

No Caption Provided
No Caption Provided
No Caption Provided
No Caption Provided

Avatar image for goodkarma
GoodKarma

546

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

#45  Edited By GoodKarma

@mr-yes: So you have no actual proof that Ronaldo > Messi? I mean I myself have an assortment of evidence backing up my claim that Messi >> Ronaldo, purely based on their on pitch performances.

Avatar image for king_saturn
King_Saturn

252104

Forum Posts

509

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

The Polls are Broken. It's 44 Percent for Pele and 72 Percent for Messi. That's 116 Percent.

Avatar image for king_saturn
King_Saturn

252104

Forum Posts

509

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

Quick Question : If we say Messi has The Crown and CR7 is the Closest to it currently today. Which Footballer is Next Behind these two Titans ? Mbappe ? Neymar ? Lewandowski ? Benzema ? Mo. Salah ? Haaland ? Someone Else ?

Avatar image for mr-yes
mr-yes

5032

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

Avatar image for mr-yes
mr-yes

5032

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

@goodkarma: cba rn I have a bunch of other stuff going on rn. Maybe I’ll respond to this later if you so desire

Avatar image for king_saturn
King_Saturn

252104

Forum Posts

509

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

@mr-yes said:

@king_saturn: I’d say Neymar or Suarez, maybe Lewa

Interesting. Luis Suarez should be up there too. I was thinking about Zlatan on a list too.