Do you think the Egyptians were black?

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AssertingValor

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@cloakx14: because it's in Africa?? Tell me your joking...

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The Impersonator

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Egyptians were white until the sun's rays turned them black.

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Naamah_Obyzouth

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Some were. And some were not.

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Agent9149

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Yes. They can be classified as Black. But do know that in present day not all Egyptians identify as Black. Some do.

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Hyperion_X

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Anicent Egyptians were Black. Yes, some were darker and lighter than others but they were still Black. The Egyptians that you see today are NOT the way Egyptians looked 3000 years ago. Egypt has been conquered around a dozen different times throughtout it's history. Most of these conquers were Middle Eastern ( Canaanites, Persians, Turks, Arabs, Assyrians, etc.) and even the White Romans. The Egyptians of yesteryear looked similar to present day Black Sudaneese. The powers that be just don't want to admit that the most powerful civilization on Earth was created by Black people. It's one of history's biggest lies along with Columbus discovering America. There's plenty of proof to support this: the statue of King Tut's Black grandma, Black people depicted in various Egyptian art and early Greek explorers who claimed Egyptians were BLACK.

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Lunacyde

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#107 Lunacyde  Moderator

It's a pointless debate. Black and White are arbitrary designations.

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jayman1999

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Ofcourse the true ancient Egyptians were black

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Hyperion_X

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@lunacyde: said: It's a pointless debate. Black and White are arbitrary designations

If that's true than why aren't Black people given credit for anything except for inventing peanut butter? But technically your pretty much right

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Jonny_Anonymous

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#110  Edited By Jonny_Anonymous

The idiocy in this thread is astounding.

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Lunacyde

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#111 Lunacyde  Moderator

@hyperion_x: Because people are ignorant.

Race being arbitrary and socially constructed also has nothing directly to do with why black people don't get the credit they deserve.

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deactivated-59dfd33ed3601

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It would be hard to believe due to all the whitewashing

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deactivated-5a937e573d769

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Anicent Egyptians were Black. Yes, some were darker and lighter than others but they were still Black. The Egyptians that you see today are NOT the way Egyptians looked 3000 years ago. Egypt has been conquered around a dozen different times throughtout it's history. Most of these conquers were Middle Eastern ( Canaanites, Persians, Turks, Arabs, Assyrians, etc.) and even the White Romans. The Egyptians of yesteryear looked similar to present day Black Sudaneese. The powers that be just don't want to admit that the most powerful civilization on Earth was created by Black people. It's one of history's biggest lies along with Columbus discovering America. There's plenty of proof to support this: the statue of King Tut's Black grandma, Black people depicted in various Egyptian art and early Greek explorers who claimed Egyptians were BLACK.

No it wasn't. It was created by aliens, everybody knows that.

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Mortein

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By modern day American standards most of them would be considered black.

By modern day Egyptian standards, most of them would not be considered black.

Race is not a well defined concept.

This is our best estimation of how Egyptians looked like.

Loading Video...

And this is how people look in Egyptian today,

No Caption Provided
No Caption Provided
No Caption Provided

and most of them are not considered to be black.

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lordraiden

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There were the Kushites who ruled for a period as kings, but, op needs some more definition? Nubian black? No, ancient Egyptian dynasties weren't very dark/black skinned.

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lordraiden

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@cloakx14 said:

@pipxeroth: so you're saying she was white, right ?

Yes, Cleopatra was of Greek descent and was white.

Macedonian, actually.

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Pipxeroth

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@pipxeroth said:
@cloakx14 said:

@pipxeroth: so you're saying she was white, right ?

Yes, Cleopatra was of Greek descent and was white.

Macedonian, actually.

I consider Macedonians white.

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lordraiden

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#118  Edited By lordraiden
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Pipxeroth

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@pipxeroth said:
@lordraiden said:
@pipxeroth said:
@cloakx14 said:

@pipxeroth: so you're saying she was white, right ?

Yes, Cleopatra was of Greek descent and was white.

Macedonian, actually.

I consider Macedonians white.

Um, sure? (I know I am)

Wait, I'm confused. What exactly are you trying to correct me on? Macedonians are Greek, so if you're of Macedonian descent you're of Greek descent by extension.

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lordraiden

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@lordraiden said:
@pipxeroth said:
@lordraiden said:
@pipxeroth said:
@cloakx14 said:

@pipxeroth: so you're saying she was white, right ?

Yes, Cleopatra was of Greek descent and was white.

Macedonian, actually.

I consider Macedonians white.

Um, sure? (I know I am)

Wait, I'm confused. What exactly are you trying to correct me on? Macedonians are Greek, so if you're of Macedonian descent you're of Greek descent by extension.

Um, not quite. Not quite at all, actually. The Greeks hated King Philip and thought the Macedonians were barbarians. Statements like that are how you start WWIII lol Macedonians are not Greeks and Greeks are not Macedonians. That's what I was correcting you on when you said Cleopatra was Greek, she was a descendant of Ptolemy who was one of Alexander's generals who ended with taking Egypt, which is how you got Cleopatra.

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Pipxeroth

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@lordraiden: Eh, it's pretty much semantics you're arguing over. The fact is Macedon and the macedonians were all part of the Greek Civilisation as far as culture goes once Alexander the Great took control. But I understand your point.

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lordraiden

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@lordraiden: Eh, it's pretty much semantics you're arguing over. The fact is Macedon and the macedonians were all part of the Greek Civilisation as far as culture goes once Alexander the Great took control. But I understand your point.

Fair enough. Though I think Alexander only inherited what his dad build from scratch, and he was taught in Greek philosophy and the one credited with spreading the Greek culture, i'll give you that. Heck, that's why you the NT was written in Greek, suppose everyone can thank Alexander for that lol

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FirestormFate1919

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It's pretty much factual that the majority weren't.

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deactivated-5d2b83d5a0d79

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They were blond and blue eyed white people.

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removekebab

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#125  Edited By removekebab

Arab most likely; so no.

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HeroUp2112

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#126  Edited By HeroUp2112

Well, since (during parts of the Egyptian Empire) Ancient Egypt extended all the way down into the Nubian Desert some Egyptians were undoubtedly black, though I think it's safe to say that the majority, for most of the Ancient Egyptian periods were Arabian.

Some, the Ptolomies, were even of mixed Greek/Arabian ancestry so there's that too. Some were even Roman/Arabian/Greek. Odds are pretty good some were even Arabian/Black. So you've got a pretty good melting pot going in in the Later Kingdoms.

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Hyperion_X

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You people claiming that anicent Egyptians were Arabian are naive. Arabics invaded Egypt like a thousand years ago, possibly more. The U.S. was invanded and conquered 400 years ago and look how the demographics of America has changed since then. Most Americans with Native American heritage are Hispanic, White or Black. Think of how different the demographics of Egypt would be now after a few thousand years of conquests and occupations. Also consider that Egypt was conquered by both the White Roman Empire and the Arab Ottoman Turks for centuries.

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Petey_is_Spidey

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They Arab. I don't understand why this is so hard to believe.

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HeroUp2112

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You people claiming that anicent Egyptians were Arabian are naive. Arabics invaded Egypt like a thousand years ago, possibly more. The U.S. was invanded and conquered 400 years ago and look how the demographics of America has changed since then. Most Americans with Native American heritage are Hispanic, White or Black. Think of how different the demographics of Egypt would be now after a few thousand years of conquests and occupations. Also consider that Egypt was conquered by both the White Roman Empire and the Arab Ottoman Turks for centuries.

Um...no. The first people from the Arabian Peninsula to conquer into Egypt were Muslims in 616-629 AD...or so the archeologists say, well after the beginning of the Egyptian Empire in about 3100 BC. Furthermore, the lighter color of their skin has much more to do with their location along the equator and the similar environmental factors between Northern Africans and those on the Arabian Peninsula than any other factor.

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Hyperion_X

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#130  Edited By Hyperion_X

@heroup2112: said: Um...no. The first people from the Arabian Peninsula to conquer into Egypt were Muslims in 616-629 AD...or so the archeologists say, well after the beginning of the Egyptian Empire in about 3100 BC. Furthermore, the lighter color of their skin has much more to do with their location along the equator and the similar environmental factors between Northern Africans and those on the Arabian Peninsula than any other factor.

That is false. The Arabian Peninsula kingdoms of the Canaanites, Persians, Assyrians and a few others conquered Egypt well before the 7th century all the way back in the B.C. era. Go back and read your history, son.

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HeroUp2112

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@heroup2112: said: Um...no. The first people from the Arabian Peninsula to conquer into Egypt were Muslims in 616-629 AD...or so the archeologists say, well after the beginning of the Egyptian Empire in about 3100 BC. Furthermore, the lighter color of their skin has much more to do with their location along the equator and the similar environmental factors between Northern Africans and those on the Arabian Peninsula than any other factor.

That is false. The Arabian Peninsula kingdoms of the Canaanites, Persians, Assyrians and a few others conquered Egypt well before the 7th century all the way back in the B.C. era. Go back and read your history, son.

I'm not sure where you're getting that the Canaanites ever conquered Egypt, they were only ever under the dominion of Egypt (and others). Furthermore, the Assyrian Empire, under King Esarhadon didn't conquer Egypt (in less than a month in fact...pretty impressive) until 671 BC. The Persians didn't conquer until 525 BC. I'm pretty well versed in History, especially Egyptian History, so we'll have to respectfully have to disagree. Further, I'd bet no small bit of money that I'm significantly older than you. Referring to the "son" thing. :)

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Hyperion_X

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First you said that no one from the Arabian Peninsula conquered Egypt until 616 AD and then you said that they were conquered by the Persians and the Assyrians in the BCs. I JUST SAID THAT. You seem confused, bruh

Oh and there are dark-skinned people in both North Africa and the Middle East they're just not the majority. Hell, there's even some dark-skinned Sicilians that are darker than modern day Egyptians

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Hocko1999_VIRUS

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If they aren't, that's racist and problematic and rape culture.

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hyiena

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Mixed

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9dragons

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#135  Edited By 9dragons

The Egyptians are neither Black or White, they are Mediterranean people. Black and White are just inclusive labels people use because they can't self identify with their ancestry and culture. For example, my upper middle age friend is a proud third generation Irish American that would constantly correct people on his heritage, as did my Jewish friends, as did Spanish friends and so on. The Black and White binary is purposely vague and doesn't tell people who you are, a confusion that benefits no one, but leaders that purposely manipulate the people.

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Revan-

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The majority probably were.

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removekebab

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Green_Tea

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ask the director of Gods of Egypt.

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IceDemonKing

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No, but I am.

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Inquisitor_Lavellan

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@9dragons said:

The Egyptians are neither Black or White, they are Mediterranean people. Black and White are just inclusive labels people use because they can't self identify with their ancestry and culture. For example, my upper middle age friend is a proud third generation Irish American that would constantly correct people on his heritage, as did my Jewish friends, as did Spanish friends and so on. The Black and White binary is purposely vague and doesn't tell people who you are, a confusion that benefits no one, but leaders that purposely manipulate the people.

No Caption Provided

Pretty much this.

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deactivated-5d2b83d5a0d79

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They were pale skinned and blonde, and only thought they looked brown.

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BlessedbyHorus

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There are many anthropological/genetic material that suggest that the Ancient Egyptians were indigenous Africans and thus "black." Ancient Egypt as we know it was populated from the south and green Sahara. During the green sahara many African groups inhabited it. When the desert dried up thats when we started seeing a migration into the area now known as Egypt.

Moe importantly the Ancient Egyptians had a tropically body plan like modern day Africans and not Europeans or Middle Easterners who are cold adapted.

"The raw values in Table 6 suggest that Egyptians had the "super-Negroid" body plan described by Robins (1983).. This pattern is supported by Figure 7 (a plot of population mean femoral and tibial lengths; data from Ruff, 1994), which indicates that the Egyptians generally have tropical body plans. Of the Egyptian samples, only the Badarian and Early Dynastic period populations have shorter tibiae than predicted from femoral length. Despite these differences, all samples lie relatively clustered together as compared to the other populations." (Zakrzewski, S.R. (2003). "Variation in ancient Egyptian stature and body proportions". American Journal of Physical Anthropology 121 (3): 219-229.

I can post more...

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Revan-

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BlessedbyHorus

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#144  Edited By BlessedbyHorus

@petey_is_spidey said:

They Arab. I don't understand why this is so hard to believe.

First off all Arabs didn't even exist during that time. Nor does Ancient Egyptian culture show ANY similarities to Ancient culture from the Arabian peninsula. The ancestors of the Ancient Egyptians didn't even come from the Arabian peninsula but Sudan and the Green Sahara.

And if you wanna bring up modern Egyptians, many genetic studies agree that while modern day Egyptians descend from the Ancient Egyptians they are heavily admixed and lost many of the diverse African genetic lineages that would have been associated with the Ancient Egyptians.

But more importantly.

Conclusion

To sum up, Nubia is Egypt’s African ancestor. What linked Ancient Egypt to the rest of the North African cultures is this strong tie with the Nubian pastoral nomadic lifestyle, the same pastoral background commonly shared by most of the ancient Saharan and modern sub-Saharan societies. Thus, not only did Nubia have a prominent role in the origin of Ancient Egypt, it was also a key area for the origin of the entire African pastoral tradition.

http://www.academia.edu/545582/The_..._Africa_A_View_from_the_Archaeological_Record

I don't know why people are using modern day Egyptians who received significant admixture from other regions and wouldn't be true representation on how the Ancient Egyptians looked.

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Usha

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#145  Edited By Usha

Nahhh, they were all white and had British accents. Factz!

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BlessedbyHorus

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#146  Edited By BlessedbyHorus

@crimsoncake said:

There is no conclusive evidence if they were or not. It becomes even more complicated with the fact that the Egyptians and Nubians were constantly trying to take each other over. I believe they had Nubians as rulers for a single dynasty but it's safer to assume they were "multi-ethnic".

1. There were NEVER a "Nubian" people. "Nubians" were just the people south of Egypt i.e in the land of Sudan. "Nubians" composed of many ethnics like the Medjay, Kushites and many others.

2. More importantly the Ancient Egyptians and "Nubians" were the same people essentially.

"The period when sub-Saharan Africa was most influential in Egypt was a time when neither Egypt, as we understand it culturally, nor the Sahara, as we understand it geographically, existed. Populations and cultures now found south of the desert roamed far to the north. The culture of Upper Egypt, which became dynastic Egyptian civilization, could fairly be called a Sudanese transplant." (Egypt and Sub-Saharan Africa: Their Interaction. Encyclopedia of Precolonial Africa, by Joseph O. Vogel, AltaMira Press, Walnut Creek, California (1997), pp. 465-472 )[119]

^^This study hints that Upper Egyptians were essentially the same as the people from the Sudan.

Me having a long time interest in Ancient Egyptian civilization would like anyone to prove that the Ancient Egyptians were closer to Middle Easterners in culture, genetics and physical appearance than surrounding indigenous Northeast Africans.

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BlessedbyHorus

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@9dragons said:

The Egyptians are neither Black or White, they are Mediterranean people. Black and White are just inclusive labels people use because they can't self identify with their ancestry and culture. For example, my upper middle age friend is a proud third generation Irish American that would constantly correct people on his heritage, as did my Jewish friends, as did Spanish friends and so on. The Black and White binary is purposely vague and doesn't tell people who you are, a confusion that benefits no one, but leaders that purposely manipulate the people.

No Caption Provided

First of all... What exactly is a "Mediterranean people?" Italians, Greeks and Iberians are also "Mediterranean people." Are those three groups also lumped in with Mediterranean people like modern day Egyptians, Syrians and Libyans? No. Second using heavily admixed groups like modern Egyptians as a representation for the Ancient Egyptians is futile.

Yes I agree that "black" and "white" are vague and are not biologically defined. BUT the Ancient Egyptians were again indigenous Africans and clustered genetically with indigenous Africans who would be deemed "black."

But let me explain why modern Egyptians are futile representations for their ancient ancestors... Lets take a look at this very important part of the genetic study on MODERN day Egyptians:

Using ADMIXTURE17 and principal-component analysis (PCA)18 (Figure 1A), we estimated the average proportion of non-African ancestry in the Egyptians to be 80% and dated the midpoint of the admixture event by using ALDER20 to around 750 years ago (Table S2), consistent with the Islamic expansion and dates reported previously.

http://www.cell.com/ajhg/fulltext/S0002-9297(15)00156-1

What its essentially say that modern day Egyptians started seeing the bulk of their non-African genetic admixture 750 years ago during the time when the Arabs came in. This is WAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAY after the dynastic period of Ancient Egypt. Now... When they removed the non-Africans components from modern Egyptians (dated to 750 years ago), they concluded that Ancient Egyptians were actually closer to African groups like the Yoruba.

Now do you and others see how modern Egyptians are a futile example? I have even more studies.

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BlessedbyHorus

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Everybody who is interested on the Ancient Egyptians origins should watch this video by S.O.Y. Keita.

Loading Video...

S.O.Y. Keita who is a known and respected anthropologist.

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BlueHope

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#149  Edited By BlueHope

@removekebab said:

Arab

Those are the current egyptians not the ethnic group of ancient egypt.

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Revan-

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