Boxing Vs. Wrestling

IMO boxing is superior fighting style. First of all I don't care how big and strong you are - if you are not train to protect your head, then few straight up punches to the head will mess you up really bad. This is MMA vs. Sumo but principle is this same - small guy punching big, bad wrestler into submission:

second of all: wrestling is useless outside the ring, especially against multiple opponents

well, given the choice i go with boxing, we all start stand up...to be fair tho, it's up to the individual who can use their technigue and timing most effectively...

@toby5678910 said:

@Delta1938 said:

@toby5678910 said:

@Stronger said:

How many f#cking times will I say that there are NO BETTER MARTIAL ARTS THAN OTHERS..

THERE ARE ONLY BETTER F#CKING FIGHTERS.

There are better martial arts, a lot of martial arts use unnecessary movements, and look at judo - the whole marital art is ceremonial, you have to let yourself get tossed around like a rag-doll, no one uses judo IRL - most useless martial art ever. (thats why you see 0 judo fighers in mma).

um I've trained in Judo. I've used it in street fights. I've used it rather effectively, actually.

And you see 0 Judo fighters in MMA? I see one here.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=X1d_XS5BvnM

And here.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wa5j6NFgJKg

And one of the top ranked women in the world here.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Rf-eNVAeC0U

Consider yourself "owned."

LOL 1% of mma fighters use Judo and there all shit. Only losers and babies who are afraid to get hurt learn Judo LOL, I live in Hawaii and everyone and there grandma here knows Judo.

Consider yourself "owned" when you meet a BJJ figher, then you will learn the difference between ceremonial throws and throws designed to be efficient.

LOL your telling me one of the top ranked women in the world in JUDO (not MMA) uses JUDO ??? ORLY ??? She only has 4 MMA fights and 3/4 of them she won using a JuJitsu arm bar...

In reality Judo is just above Capoeira in usefulness.

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/f/fd/BoiseIdahoCapoeira.ogv

You clearly don't know what the Hell you're talking about. You claimed that there's ZERO fighters in MMA using Judo, I proved multiple examples. Your poor grasp of English and constant "LOL" also further detracts any credibility you had left.

And I'll need to meet a BJJ fighter to learn what grappling is? Do you know why the technique known as "Kimura" is named that in Brazilian Jiu-Jitsu? It's because a Judo dude named Kimura owned one of the Gracies with it. Broke the same arm twice, but the Gracies are too stupid to tap-out. Also, it's worth noting that the Gracies had once issued a challenge against Benny Urquidez but backed-out when they found-out he actually knew grappling, and trained under a couple of Judo legends.

And last I checked, Ronda Rousey was ranked #1 in the world in women's MMA. Of course I doubt she would be ranked as #1 in the world in Judo since she's focusing on MMA and even when she competed internationally, "only" got a Bronze in the Olympics and a Silver in the World Championships. Damn dude, I don't even need to own you, you just own yourself being wrong all the time.

Also, Jiu-Jitsu is not exclusive to armbars. Especially since Judo had them first.

I wonder what else you'll post to make a fool of yourself.

Not really a relevant discussion for the Battles Forum. Should be in Off-Topic.

@Picard said:

IMO boxing is superior fighting style. First of all I don't care how big and strong you are - if you are not train to protect your head, then few straight up punches to the head will mess you up really bad. This is MMA vs. Sumo but principle is this same - small guy punching big, bad wrestler into submission:

second of all: wrestling is useless outside the ring, especially against multiple opponents

So if Boxing is the superior style, why has it historically lost to Wrestling in style VS style matches dating back to eat least the Victorian era?

Boxing.

Albeit it looks like this turned into an MMA thread.

Thing is, there's different kinds of Boxers.

You got your defensive boxers with great reflexes and head movement (Floyd Mayweather, Juan Manuel Marquez)

Your brawlers (Jack Dempsey, Joe Frazier, Rocky Marciano)

Tyson is also a brawler/inside fighter, but he had amazing headmovement as well.

Different types of boxers put up different types of fights.

Take a huge guy like George Foreman and it's really hard to take him down, ESPECIALLY with his huge power and reach. He woulda KOed the wrestler before wrestler tried to take him down.

Foreman would've broken a wrestler's jaw and put him in a coma.

Ali woulda dodged a wrestler's take down, and thrown a two punch KO.

Tyson would've just killed anyone.

Klitschkos would be too huge and too rangy to do anything against.

___________________________________

Plus, boxers have insane heart and toughness, insane conditioning. Old boxers used to go up to even 45 rounds. Gatti and Holyfield, Margarito had insane toughness, heart and chin. They woulda died in the ring.

A lot of boxers grew up in the street, so IDK why people say boxers "can just punch" pretty sure they can kick, grab, and in Tyson's case - bite.

Street fight, I have my money on a good boxer over a good wrestler any day.

@toby5678910 said:

Kimbo slice = Boxer

Seth Petruzelli = Wrestler

Skip to 4:15

Seth Petruzelli = Karate champion. I'd hardly call that "wrestling" especially since there was absolutely no wrestling in that fight, just Seth beating the crap out of Kimbo.

@Delta1938 said:

@Picard said:

IMO boxing is superior fighting style. First of all I don't care how big and strong you are - if you are not train to protect your head, then few straight up punches to the head will mess you up really bad. This is MMA vs. Sumo but principle is this same - small guy punching big, bad wrestler into submission:

second of all: wrestling is useless outside the ring, especially against multiple opponents

So if Boxing is the superior style, why has it historically lost to Wrestling in style VS style matches dating back to eat least the Victorian era?

First off all I have only your word for it. I don't know if that really happened. Second of all: it depends on the boxer, depends on his skills. Realistically I don't see how wrestler could protect himself from being punched in the head. Wrestlers are not trained to fight with someone who punch. They are not used to that kind of punishment. And video I posted above show that I have right - punches to the head = win for the boxer.

@Delta1938: I misread the OP I thought we were talking your general stand-up fighter (don't know how I did that but we all make mistakes). Muay Thai and such striking oriented arts incorporate take down defense as part of the art form to stay on your feet. Given that boxers don't have that if the wrestler can get them to the ground, they will win. That being said a good boxer still has great foot movement and incredible speed. So I guess it still boils down to the better person, not really the better style. Muhammed Ali was known for speed and manuverability, so a wrestler might might have trouble taking him down. But I think wrestling overall incorporates more manuverability as they operate from a standing position to the floor. So wrestling has somewhat more versatility, but it will still boil down to the fighter.

On a side note, I saw someone hating on Capoeira (at least it seemed like hating), and while I've never trained in it (I've extensive training in Muay Thai, Tae Kwon Do, BJJ, Krav Maga, and military combatives) Anderson Silva (arguably the best pound for pound fighter in the world) trains in Capoeira. It's primarily why he's so difficult to hit in the ring. Just food for thought, every art has its niche. I know it's totally unrelated to the topic, but I figured I'd throw it out there.

@Picard said:

second of all: wrestling is useless outside the ring, especially against multiple opponents

I know you didn't just say that wrestling is useless outside of the ring. I was a state wrestler, and you know what, it saved my life. Twice. Once in school, a kid had a knife to my throat from behind. I don't how I did it, must of been adrenaline, but I flipped him over my back and held him down till a teacher came and helped me. A second time a guy on a street I was arguing with tried stabbing me. I did a fire-mans carry, and beat the heck of him. We both went to jail. But I got out, he didn't.

Point I'm trying to make is, Wrestling is amazing for self-defense. It's nowhere near useless.

@JediXMan said:

@toby5678910 said:

Kimbo slice = Boxer

Seth Petruzelli = Wrestler

Skip to 4:15

Seth Petruzelli = Karate champion. I'd hardly call that "wrestling" especially since there was absolutely no wrestling in that fight, just Seth beating the crap out of Kimbo.

Actually, Petruzelli was a wrestler in high school, and successful enough to be offered a college scholarship(but ended-up turning it down I guess). But it is true that he didn't actually use wrestling there. Just pointing-out Petruzelli does have a wrestling background.

@Picard said:

@Delta1938 said:

@Picard said:

IMO boxing is superior fighting style. First of all I don't care how big and strong you are - if you are not train to protect your head, then few straight up punches to the head will mess you up really bad. This is MMA vs. Sumo but principle is this same - small guy punching big, bad wrestler into submission:

second of all: wrestling is useless outside the ring, especially against multiple opponents

So if Boxing is the superior style, why has it historically lost to Wrestling in style VS style matches dating back to eat least the Victorian era?

First off all I have only your word for it. I don't know if that really happened. Second of all: it depends on the boxer, depends on his skills. Realistically I don't see how wrestler could protect himself from being punched in the head. Wrestlers are not trained to fight with someone who punch. They are not used to that kind of punishment. And video I posted above show that I have right - punches to the head = win for the boxer.

HUMAN WEAPON makes mention of this, as well as some articles I've read on the Internet. They also make mention of Style VS Style matches on Wikipedia in a few different articles(including the MMA article). They did happen in the Victorian era. Then you've got Muhammad Ali being unable to defend being taken-down in his match with Inoki on I think it was 3 occasions. And the only reason Ali didn't lose that fight is he demanded rules handicapping Inoki(he officially couldn't grapple and was stopped and got a point deducted for each takedown, and he couldn't kick unless he had one knee on the ground) and Inoki had 3 fouls, making the fight officially a draw. But Ali clearly was on the losing end. Then we have Royce Gracie taking the boxer down at UFC 1(and normally BJJ guys have inferior takedowns compared to Division I wrestlers), and then Randy Couture's fight against James Toney.

And the video? Actually Daiju Takase isn't a boxer, he's more of a grappler. But what do you expect him to do against someone LITERALLY more than twice his size? Yes, Yarborough literally weighed more than twice(I think it was close to 3 times) Takase. But for some reason he goes for the takedown in the fight. Also, Yarborough is one of the worst examples. Sumo has been extremely unsuccessful in MMA, Yarborough's record was a whole 1-3(one of the wins by submission stated to be "smothering") and a Sumo wrestler of his size is a lot slower than more conventional styles. This is one of the best match-ups for a striker(pretending Takase is primarily a striker) against a grappler even with the size difference. Also, your argument is horrible. Look at how the Sumo wrestler couldn't move much once he was on the ground. He was physically unable to defend himself because of his size, not because he was getting seriously hurt. Don't watch MMA? A more conventional wrestler would've been less likely to be stuck in Yarborough's situation.

@GraniteSoldier said:

@Delta1938: I misread the OP I thought we were talking your general stand-up fighter (don't know how I did that but we all make mistakes). Muay Thai and such striking oriented arts incorporate take down defense as part of the art form to stay on your feet. Given that boxers don't have that if the wrestler can get them to the ground, they will win. That being said a good boxer still has great foot movement and incredible speed. So I guess it still boils down to the better person, not really the better style. Muhammed Ali was known for speed and manuverability, so a wrestler might might have trouble taking him down. But I think wrestling overall incorporates more manuverability as they operate from a standing position to the floor. So wrestling has somewhat more versatility, but it will still boil down to the fighter.

On a side note, I saw someone hating on Capoeira (at least it seemed like hating), and while I've never trained in it (I've extensive training in Muay Thai, Tae Kwon Do, BJJ, Krav Maga, and military combatives) Anderson Silva (arguably the best pound for pound fighter in the world) trains in Capoeira. It's primarily why he's so difficult to hit in the ring. Just food for thought, every art has its niche. I know it's totally unrelated to the topic, but I figured I'd throw it out there.

I didn't say it was impossible for the boxer to win, but realistically the odds would be against him, and history backs this. And you bring-up Ali, as I've pointed-out at least twice before in this thread(once before in this post), Ali was actually afraid of a grappler when he participated in a Style VS Style match in the 70's, and demanded that grappling be against the rules. Inoki broke the rule 3 times and took Ali down without problem each time.

And it was Toby who was hating on Capoeria. But the argument you gave isn't the best. Silva had already been well versed in Muay Thai, and also had a Taekwando black belt, I believe well before he ever started Capoeria. I recall it's rope system being similar to the belt system in a number of styles, and he's a yellow rope in there.

Oh, and speaking of Anderson Silva.....

https://sphotos-a.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-snc7/600159_10151073280876075_1867273692_n.jpg

Personally, I think grapplers are superior to boxers/strikers.

@Delta1938: I didn't say you hated on capoeira, and I am well aware Anderson Silva and his career, I was simply trying to make a point that any style with proper application can be useful. And I also said wrestling had far more versatility than boxing, but I also said that the fighter matters more (which is really why I referenced Silva, capoeira and Tae Kwon Do are not known as heavy MMA arts). But in a straight match style vs style with average fighters yes wrestlers will have greater versatility.

I'd say typically a good wrestler would beat a good boxer.

wrestlers very easily win because boxers are only good at fist fighting while standing on the ground.

Wrestlers are trained how to defend theirselfs when they're on the ground and someone on top of them.

I knew a whole team of wrestlers back in high school and most of em didn't want it with the "fighters." Only one of em could hang.

@toby5678910: Watch the language and tone, please. Thanks.

@rangersoul6 said:

Tyson would've just killed anyone.

Tell that to hollyfield and lewis

@toby5678910 said:

@Stronger said:

How many f#cking times will I say that there are NO BETTER MARTIAL ARTS THAN OTHERS..

THERE ARE ONLY BETTER F#CKING FIGHTERS.

There are better martial arts, a lot of martial arts use unnecessary movements, and look at judo - the whole marital art is ceremonial, you have to let yourself get tossed around like a rag-doll, no one uses judo IRL - most useless martial art ever. (thats why you see 0 judo fighers in mma).

This was the biggest crap I have ever heard in years.You just broke a record.Amd I am dead serious.

Even the special forces use many Judo moves and there are a lot other martial arts decended from Judo(Like Sambo,Brazilian Jujitsu)

In all martial arts there are unecessary movements.You just have to use your mind and not only what you are taught in dojos.That's what good fighters do.

And MMA fighters are nothing but rank ameteurs at best in terms of fighting.If you wanted me to take you seriously you wouldn't use that example.

Also Judo is stated by many people to be one of the most effective martial arts.

Open up a book once in a while or go visit a dojo cause your setence was at least ridiculous.

I practice Judo for 3 years and I am at green belt rank.So I know a couple thing more than you about this..

@Delta1938 said:

If you knew anything at martial arts,this would be the first thing.

If the boxer is fast enough then he wins. If not then the wrestler takes him to the ground and its over.

@nishi99 said:

If the boxer is fast enough then he wins. If not then the wrestler takes him to the ground and its over.

Thing is the wrestlers are trained to get people on the ground even if you're standing. The reason fighting a wrestler is more dangerous is because not only can they get you on the ground while you're both standing, but if they get you on the ground then its game over, plus if the boxer got the wrestler on the ground first the wrestler could also take the boxer down by the wrestler just being on the ground... boxers are only trained to punch while standing up... wrestlers can do both.

Depends on the fighter. James Toney didn't last a round against Couture yet Ray Mercer KO'd Tim Sylvia in 10 seconds

Yeah,

I'll say 8/10 Wrestler d-_-b

@TERMINATOR1000: I agree with that. But the boxer could still win if he hits him first because all boxers do is punch so there punch's are most likely the best in the world. Now yeah the wrestler can punch just not that hard because it's not there thing. However at the end of the day i would likely put my money on the wrestler.

I have taken wrestling and I would say that if I fought a boxer, I would be trying to get him on the floor as fast as I can(I have taken tae kwon do) or grapple him.

If a guy who does nothing but swing at me. I'd keep my guard up like crazy until I have a chance to shoot in at him and get him on his back.

7/10 I could take on a boxer(I'm in Highschool so I mean a highschool level boxer)

Boxing ftw!

@slimj87d: the chances of a boxer killing someone without gloves are probably 1 in 10000000. They'd probably break their hand instead. The gloves and hand wrapping are supposed to let you punch harder than bare knuckles.

I like how this guy makes a response to a post more than 3 years ago.

Probably wrestling.

Depends entirely on the circumstance of the fight and the individual fighters.

+1

I was an all-state Wrestler and have fought many Boxers. I usually manhandle them fairly well. Sure if they hit me just right, it would mean lights out. I tend to not allow that to happen. Once you get a Boxer on his back, he is pretty sqrwed.

Also ruthless aggression goes a long way. Why German suplex someone when you do it through a coffee table or onto a hard surface. I am ruthless in actual fights.

Wrestler wins.

I almost made a reply to a year-old post a couple of weeks back.

I decided it would be smarter not to.

Lol, it's just funny how I sometimes see a huge post to call out a user that hasn't even been active for like 3 or 4 years. They probably wait a few days for a response and think they wont he debate.

A way to almost always win every debate... You're on to something. lol

I am not getting into a giant discussion because I don't feel like it but all I'm going to say is I have my reasons for thinking boxing is better.

Wrestling FTW

+Greatness

If everything is equal, wrestling will ushualy win, I'm confident about that.

Actually, I'm pretty sure the boxer would win because he's at an advantage. He is used to punching and swift movement with the limbs and has greater reaction time.

it depends greatly but its been proven that boxers struggle to get a good punch off as they can be easily taken to ground before firing a shot. If its a free fight normally the wrestler takes it although does depend on which wrestler and which boxer obviously. In a boxing match expect the boxing to win before half way through round 1.

Wrestling is the superior martial art in a single combat situation. A wrestler could just hold the boxer down and rain strikes from top since the boxer has no takedown defence and no way of fighting back effectively once on the ground.

If it stays on the feet long enough, boxer. If it goes to the ground, wrestler.