Zack Snyder's Justice League Official Discussion Thread

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cocacolaman

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#1 cocacolaman  Moderator
No Caption Provided

Consider this the official discussion thread for Zack Snyder's Justice League. Spoilers will be held here. Advance at your own risk.

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MinisculeHeart

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Big improvement from the theatrical release. Fleshes out some characters and the action scenes are some of the best in CBM history.

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deactivated-60ecdb28037bb

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I can't believe Superman and Cyborg die in the Snyder Cut :(

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frozen

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#4 frozen  Moderator

Can someone tell me whether Snydercut Supes is as hopeful as the brief amount of Supes we saw in Josstice League? Josstice League sucked, but it did provide some brief scenes of the more traditional hopeful Superman.

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PrimelyGreat

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Only caught a few clips. Going to watch this thing when it releases like a normal person and see how much it improves over the Whedon version. :)

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MinisculeHeart

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#6  Edited By MinisculeHeart

@frozen: He's a bit more serious, less dialogue so he might not seem as hopeful but he still serves the same purpose in the film and his moment with Lois and Ma is great.

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Does he get any strength feats or any speed and durability feats?

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Money_Brings_Happiness

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Here is the feats that I know that people really want and my short review of the movie.

For Superman's heat vision goes through a wall in the final battle which is something we already knew it could do and his punches still create those fancy shockwaves that only displace the air though he throws a couple more. Nothing that will change anyone's opinion on his striking power though. Only thing he has going for him that is new in this go around is the Flash at the end of the movie does go legit FTL to go back in time but considering that was him going as fast as he had ever gone before by a large margin Supes doesn't scale to it. Supes also gets legitimately vaporised by the mother box fusion blast that Flash has to go back in time to stop from happening. His best actual speed feat is flying into space in like 6 seconds and posing like jesus but other fliers can do that and we already new his travel speed was on that level. He is frankly pretty much on the same level as the OG cut overall. He does no sell a hit form Step but considering the axe still fails to destroy the Nightcrawler and Aquaman, and Cyborg both take direct hits and get up fine. And frankly Step doesn't perform a single building level feat throughout the movie. His best feat is the one from the trailer and that is him making a maybe 50 meter wide crater with almost no depth. Below building level. And it is questionable as it was him reenacting what Darkseid does in the opening. A good supplementary feat but it is also one of the only things that Supes does that is different from the theatrical version of himself featswise.

Diana doesn't do anything most viners didn't already know she could do. She one shot kills the terrorist in this version but that isn't impressive. Her speed is still her best asset along with her gear. Though like in the original Steps armor withstood a hit to the leg. She does decap him though at the end after Aquaman skewers him with his trident and Supes punches him in the face. Though in she still has those jobbing moments where Step is keeping up with her and beating her despite Step also being kept up with and out maneuvered by Aquaman at times. Her speed when fighting Step really doesn't stand out much.

Flash gets the best boost in the movie having a legit FTL speed feat at the end of the movie where he says he has to go faster than light to go back in time and then does just that. He doesn't actually hit anything particularly hard though and any infinite mass punch theories don't carry any weight as his strikes can one shot parademons but that was already known. He does get an anti feat where he is running at his top speed before his FTL feat and gets shot by a parademon.(Said parademon is unironically the MVP for Darkseid's forces lol) The same shots were getting dodged and blocked by Batman.

Cyborg also gets a boost as he actually gets combat feats here. Physically his strength seems to be second to Supermans (though still way below Supes) and his energy blast at one point in the movie cut through a bunch of like 6 story buildings knocking them over.during the final battle giving him some solid energy projection. That is probably his best feat though he also has a better showing against Superman when he is reawakened though after a moment he gets worked and put down. He has some good hacking and technopathy as well. He also has this four armed mode thing that doesn't actually do much. He does stop a military vehicle from hitting a cop like in the trailer and at one point does a shoulder bash on steppenwolf which knocks him slightly into the air though doesn't really do much. Though make no mistake his physicals over all are nothing to impressive with his energy projection being his best asset.

Steppenwolf himself doesn't get the massive power boost some thought he would get. His feats stay mostly the same and at times are worse a Supes beats him down way harder this time around and Aquaman and Cyborg were giving him the work at one point. His best feat is fighting on even ground with WW, Aquaman, and Cyborg. And if anything he was losing that fight slowly but surely. Cyborg even pulls away to go deal with the mother box and while he starts gaining the upper hand eventually Diana and Aquaman start giving him work again and while he manages to knock Aquaman down forcing WW to protect him giving him an opportunity to try to stop the defenseless Cyborg who is dealing with the mother boxes as he is going for the blow that in the OG movie barely incovienced Cyborg Supes drops in and no sells it. As stated Steppenwolf really doesn't hit that hard at all and he has pretty terrible piercing output nothing Supes hasn't already dealt with. Supes then does what he did in the original cut only he slices one of Steps horns off and the beat down last a bit longer with Supes standing over him just pounding him slowly. Also after Supes shows up the others start really beating him down.

Flash as stated was running at his top speed and was going to supercharge the Cyborg and the Mother boxes but gets shot by the MVP parademon and fails causing the explosion which kills every member of the league vaporising them including Superman which causes Flash to go FTL rewind time and super charge Cyborg who starts separating the boxes and with the help of Superman does. The defeated Step stands up for a last stand and gets skewered from behind by Aquaman, punched in the face by Supes and decapped by WW while in the air from Superman's punch falling through the portal that had begun opening up and Darkseid crushes his head.

Aquaman doesn't really get any game changing feats at all. He has that trailer feat where he rides a parademon through a building and gets this cool blue bubble shockwave like effect when he hits Step but considering it's only a visual effect that doesn't do much damage to anything around him it isn't really impressive. Him skewering Step is probably his best feat here.

Flash also has really low pain tolerance as well. Anytime a hit from the enemy landed he screamed and was out of the fight. Frankly he was taken out of nearly every fight in the movie at one point or another. At one point he gets hit in the leg which hurts him so much he can't move when two parademons gank him and he has to get saved by Diana. He never directly engages with Step though probably either because he would have absolutely worked him over and that isn't good or the plot or because he doesn't have the damage output to do anything meaningful. Leaning towards the second option frankly. Besides one shotting parademons he doesn't even really throw a punch throughout the movie. He only ever plays support killing parademons. So despite the FTL feat frankly his greenness and poor combat skills mean far slower things often take him out. Other then when he rewinds time he frankly was probably the LVP of the team on multiple occasions despite getting the biggest amp of the team.

Also for Step he directly punches the window of the Nightcrawler multiple times and fails to break it. He really has decent durability but terrible damage output. His physicals without his axe are nothing to write home about with well below building level striking with his punches and even with his axe his best feat can probably be calculated as below building level. Cyborg and Aquaman could take hits just fine and it never pierced anything worth mentioning. He honestly wasn't really much more impressive then his theatrical self if at all.

Darkseid doesn't do much. He fights the old gods but is defeated as Uxas and he has the slam that Step kinda sorta copies later in the film. His Omega beams have exactly one appearance that is in a teaser already where it kills an Atlantean. He almost certainly is far above Step but he doesn't do much. He tanks some attacks from the old gods which is nice I guess and he takes a blast and kills the relatively featless Green Lantern.

Mini review

The movie itself was way better than the OG cut I would give it an 7/10. It was good. I would rate it higher but some scenes felt weird and the music didn't always line up with the tone of the scene. And a few problems from the OG were in this one such as the main villain still being as dry as paint character wise and some of the dialog being awkward. Also their where a few weird CG moments like when Supes reawakens and Flash does this weird back pedaling motion that looks weird and their are a couple moments like that. And while the movie is better with the longer run time four hours is excessive.

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deactivated-60ee206c1e31a

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It's the best DCEU film imo.

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JimJaspers20675

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#10  Edited By JimJaspers20675

Most boring 4 hours of my life.

Yikes, and this guy had the keys to the dceu.

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PortgasDACE1122

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@jimjaspers20675: It was better than the first and it cleared a lot of things up. The new fights were cool too. But I couldn't help but think if BvS and JL were never made we would've probably had a better DCEU. Man of Steel was perfect. idk why they decided to rush things like Doomsday and JL.

but let me also state I don't really read comics but I try to keep up where I can whether it be wikis, animations, youtube(comicstorian and such), and SOME reading.

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organic

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Ip-man-at-4157

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Lol.

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Ip-man-at-4157

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Nice.

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ProfessorD

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So uh Flash proved everyone wrong here. All those in and out of universe statements were legit. He's far beyond light speed

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J_Normal

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Flash easily became the fastest live action speedster bar Reeves Superman.

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FangDaNerd

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That Wonder Woman vs Steppenwolf fight was amazing

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Deathu101

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Darkthunder

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@factg said:

Does he get any strength feats or any speed and durability feats?

he's more or less the same

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Darkthunder

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@organic said:

@money_brings_happiness:

Is sup faster when he fights the flash? Any bullets frozen?

Any race at the end?

I didn't see any race there, thats good

no bullets frozen. Flash is ftl I guess, but supes is not. He basically has the same speed feats except the one where he and flash are saving civilians

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ProfessorD

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@professord: @j_normal:

You do realize it's not canon right?

ZSJL is canon to MOS and BvS as stated by Snyder

You're gonna be hard pressed to scale the Whedon cut. Patty said she and other directors threw it out and don't consider it canon

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J_Normal

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#22  Edited By J_Normal

@professord:

https://www.google.com/amp/s/movieweb.com/amp/justice-league-snyder-cut-not-dceu-canon/

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=_L5w9ZXPIWA

https://www.google.com/amp/s/heroichollywood.com/zack-snyder-joss-whedon-justice-league-dceu-canon/amp/

Its not canon

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KillianDuclark

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#23  Edited By KillianDuclark

Recently watched it.

It wasn't an improvement in my opinion.

Same story, but with a whole lot of unnecessary fluff.

Some character development scenes would have been nice if they had remained in the theatrical cut, but that's pretty much all the positive that I can say about it.

The CGI was decent to awful st times.

The action, something Zack normally excels at, was pretty much by the numbers or a slightly longer version of the theatrical cut.

Over all my feelings on the theatrical cut is some how better than synder cut. The theatrical cut was mess but that was explained by the studios interference.

The synder cut was a over bloated disappointment with no reason for being so

4/10

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thanosii

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My thoughts 💭

1. Diana got an upgrade to her bracelet clash

2. Superman has no fear added or taken but he did get statued by FTL Flash

3. Flash is confirmed FTL feats

4. Aquaman has an AoE strong enough to ragdoll Steppenwolf

5. Steppenwolf isn't arrow proof and his armour is confidence related. When ever he got scared the armour faded.

6. The Epilogue is totally unnecessary

7. Darksied got one shot and nearly died to Ares

A good, long movie but is definitely not canon. For one Mera says her parents died but in the Aquaman movie her father was alive. He also met Mera twice while in Aquaman it was the second time she met him.

2.

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Eazy_Pezy

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#26  Edited By Eazy_Pezy

No matter what you think about the movie we can all at least agree Amber Heard was the worst thing about the movie

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kgb725

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So uh Flash proved everyone wrong here. All those in and out of universe statements were legit. He's far beyond light speed

I doubt it. Let's not pretend he's pulling comic speeds here. Nothing was quantifiable

@j_normal said:

Flash easily became the fastest live action speedster bar Reeves Superman.

He's not faster than the cw boys

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deactivated-60ecdb28037bb

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Can someone send me a gif of Supes and Cyborg and the motherbox scene? Or Flash time travelling?

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the_stegman

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#29  Edited By the_stegman  Moderator

I'm 45 mins in and the difference in tone and pacing is staggering.

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cocacolaman

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#30 cocacolaman  Moderator

I got about 2 hours 30 minutes in, definitely different and I’m liking it

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MonsieurMaster

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Snyder knows how to do a climax. That whole ending is how you make a universe, how you get people excited and hooked in. This was way better than how the Avengers did it. In an alternate reality, this releases instead of Whedons cut and were waiting for JL 2.

Overall this movie was just an amazing team up.

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deactivated-60600b79ed2c5

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A very solid film and a nice redemption from 2017 disaster (specially Cyborg, he was the MVP). It's Zack Snyder's love letter to DC fans.

The only issue I had was that CGI was unpolished and raw in several scenes.

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barretstrife

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#33  Edited By barretstrife

Batman killed Harley Quinn. The whole Batman Joker scene 👌.

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TobeyMaguire84

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Snyder knows how to do a climax. That whole ending is how you make a universe, how you get people excited and hooked in. This was way better than how the Avengers did it. In an alternate reality, this releases instead of Whedons cut and were waiting for JL 2.

Overall this movie was just an amazing team up.

In which alternate universe does a 4 hour movie get released

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MonsieurMaster

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the_stegman

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#38 the_stegman  Moderator

@barretstrife: I'm not sure he did. He said he held her dying in his arms and she told him to make Joker suffer, makes it seem like Joker was somehow responsible for her death

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the_stegman

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#39  Edited By the_stegman  Moderator

This movie was leaps and bounds above the 2017 one. Flash actually does stuff at the end besides save a random family. Cyborg actually has heart and his father is actually important.

Steppenwolf does more than run around yelling "Mother!!!"

Superman, while still obviously the strongest, doesn't show up and save the day alone.

If this is the end of this universe, the epilogue is kinda pointless, but awesome to see nonetheless.

9/10 a sight to behold. I'd put it on par with IW/Endgame tbh.

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finalkingthanos

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Honestly loved it, up there with my all time faves like TDk and IW and so on. Sure films like Logan are "better films" but as a cbm blockbuster I loved it.

Be pretty gutted if this is the end, a JL2 and JL3 with some changes in the script (looking at you Bruce/Lois) and I honestly think we.wpuld have a legendary 5 party story from MoS to look back on.

Seriously who doesn't want the forces of the GL Corps and heroes of Earth etc fighting Apokolips and Superman vs Darkseid in full force.

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barretstrife

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Cyborg also has some form of matter manipulation.

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deactivated-6081fb94189dc

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Then in tiers is?

God Tier: Flash with full speed., Superman, Uxas, Old Gods.

High Tier: Steppenwolf, Cyborg, Wonder Woman, Aquaman, Flash in "normal" speed.

Street Tier: Batman and Parademons.

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deactivated-60f4d10418f1d

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Yeah, Snyder cut needs a sequel

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finalkingthanos

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Snyder knows how to do a climax. That whole ending is how you make a universe, how you get people excited and hooked in. This was way better than how the Avengers did it. In an alternate reality, this releases instead of Whedons cut and were waiting for JL 2.

Overall this movie was just an amazing team up.

Summed up my feelings as well, hoping we get some form of continuation

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NamelessMonster

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#46  Edited By NamelessMonster

Just finished watching it was way better than the predecessor

I liked

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beatboks1

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Here is the feats that I know that people really want and my short review of the movie.

For Superman's heat vision goes through a wall in the final battle which is something we already knew it could do and his punches still create those fancy shockwaves that only displace the air though he throws a couple more. Nothing that will change anyone's opinion on his striking power though. Only thing he has going for him that is new in this go around is the Flash at the end of the movie does go legit FTL to go back in time but considering that was him going as fast as he had ever gone before by a large margin Supes doesn't scale to it. Supes also gets legitimately vaporised by the mother box fusion blast that Flash has to go back in time to stop from happening. His best actual speed feat is flying into space in like 6 seconds and posing like jesus but other fliers can do that and we already new his travel speed was on that level. He is frankly pretty much on the same level as the OG cut overall. He does no sell a hit form Step but considering the axe still fails to destroy the Nightcrawler and Aquaman, and Cyborg both take direct hits and get up fine. And frankly Step doesn't perform a single building level feat throughout the movie. His best feat is the one from the trailer and that is him making a maybe 50 meter wide crater with almost no depth. Below building level. And it is questionable as it was him reenacting what Darkseid does in the opening. A good supplementary feat but it is also one of the only things that Supes does that is different from the theatrical version of himself featswise.

Diana doesn't do anything most viners didn't already know she could do. She one shot kills the terrorist in this version but that isn't impressive. Her speed is still her best asset along with her gear. Though like in the original Steps armor withstood a hit to the leg. She does decap him though at the end after Aquaman skewers him with his trident and Supes punches him in the face. Though in she still has those jobbing moments where Step is keeping up with her and beating her despite Step also being kept up with and out maneuvered by Aquaman at times. Her speed when fighting Step really doesn't stand out much.

Flash gets the best boost in the movie having a legit FTL speed feat at the end of the movie where he says he has to go faster than light to go back in time and then does just that. He doesn't actually hit anything particularly hard though and any infinite mass punch theories don't carry any weight as his strikes can one shot parademons but that was already known. He does get an anti feat where he is running at his top speed before his FTL feat and gets shot by a parademon.(Said parademon is unironically the MVP for Darkseid's forces lol) The same shots were getting dodged and blocked by Batman.

Cyborg also gets a boost as he actually gets combat feats here. Physically his strength seems to be second to Supermans (though still way below Supes) and his energy blast at one point in the movie cut through a bunch of like 6 story buildings knocking them over.during the final battle giving him some solid energy projection. That is probably his best feat though he also has a better showing against Superman when he is reawakened though after a moment he gets worked and put down. He has some good hacking and technopathy as well. He also has this four armed mode thing that doesn't actually do much. He does stop a military vehicle from hitting a cop like in the trailer and at one point does a shoulder bash on steppenwolf which knocks him slightly into the air though doesn't really do much. Though make no mistake his physicals over all are nothing to impressive with his energy projection being his best asset.

Steppenwolf himself doesn't get the massive power boost some thought he would get. His feats stay mostly the same and at times are worse a Supes beats him down way harder this time around and Aquaman and Cyborg were giving him the work at one point. His best feat is fighting on even ground with WW, Aquaman, and Cyborg. And if anything he was losing that fight slowly but surely. Cyborg even pulls away to go deal with the mother box and while he starts gaining the upper hand eventually Diana and Aquaman start giving him work again and while he manages to knock Aquaman down forcing WW to protect him giving him an opportunity to try to stop the defenseless Cyborg who is dealing with the mother boxes as he is going for the blow that in the OG movie barely incovienced Cyborg Supes drops in and no sells it. As stated Steppenwolf really doesn't hit that hard at all and he has pretty terrible piercing output nothing Supes hasn't already dealt with. Supes then does what he did in the original cut only he slices one of Steps horns off and the beat down last a bit longer with Supes standing over him just pounding him slowly. Also after Supes shows up the others start really beating him down.

Flash as stated was running at his top speed and was going to supercharge the Cyborg and the Mother boxes but gets shot by the MVP parademon and fails causing the explosion which kills every member of the league vaporising them including Superman which causes Flash to go FTL rewind time and super charge Cyborg who starts separating the boxes and with the help of Superman does. The defeated Step stands up for a last stand and gets skewered from behind by Aquaman, punched in the face by Supes and decapped by WW while in the air from Superman's punch falling through the portal that had begun opening up and Darkseid crushes his head.

Aquaman doesn't really get any game changing feats at all. He has that trailer feat where he rides a parademon through a building and gets this cool blue bubble shockwave like effect when he hits Step but considering it's only a visual effect that doesn't do much damage to anything around him it isn't really impressive. Him skewering Step is probably his best feat here.

Flash also it has really low pain tolerance as well. Anytime a hit from the enemy landed he screamed and was out of the fight. Frankly he was taken out of nearly every fight in the movie at one point or another. At one point he gets hit in the leg which hurts him so much he can't move when two parademons gank him and he has to get saved by Diana. He never directly engages with Step though probably either because he would have absolutely worked him over and that isn't good or the plot or because he doesn't have the damage output to do anything meaningful. Leaning towards the second option frankly. Besides one shotting parademons he doesn't even really throw a punch throughout the movie. He only ever plays support killing parademons. So despite the FTL feat frankly his greenness and poor combat skills mean far slower things often take him out. Other then when he rewinds time he frankly was probably the LVP of the team on multiple occasions despite getting the biggest amp of the team.

Also for Step he directly punches the window of the Nightcrawler multiple times and fails to break it. He really has decent durability but terrible damage output. His physicals without his axe are nothing to write home about with well below building level striking with his punches and even with his axe his best feat can probably be calculated as below building level. Cyborg and Aquaman could take hits just fine and it never pierced anything worth mentioning. He honestly wasn't really much more impressive then his theatrical self if at all.

Darkseid doesn't do much. He fights the old gods but is defeated as Uxas and he has the slam that Step kinda sorta copies later in the film. His Omega beams have exactly one appearance that is in a teaser already where it kills an Atlantean. He almost certainly is far above Step but he doesn't do much. He tanks some attacks from the old gods which is nice I guess and he takes a blast and kills the relatively featless Green Lantern.

Mini review

The movie itself was way better than the OG cut I would give it an 7/10. It was good. I would rate it higher but some scenes felt weird and the music didn't always line up with the tone of the scene. And a few problems from the OG were in this one such as the main villain still being as dry as paint character wise and some of the dialog being awkward. Also their where a few weird CG moments like when Supes reawakens and Flash does this weird back pedaling motion that looks weird and their are a couple moments like that. And while the movie is better with the longer run time four hours is excessive.

It doesn't say he was going at his fastest in what you refer to as an antifeat. We clearly heard him say he could go ftl whe talking about building a charge as he approaches light speed before he hits it. His task was to build a lot of charge to power Vic. What he was referring to when he said I can't keep this much longer was he couldn't maintain the charge much longer. He could always go FTL anytime he wanted to. It was also made pretty clear that he could speed heal just by thinking about it, so it's just a matter of getting past the pain and the distraction of it.

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beatboks1

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@thanosii:

Agree with you re epilogue. They only needed the Kent farm scene and MAYBE keep the Lex/Deathstroke scene as it was in the post credits on theatrical release and replace Supes Flash race with MMH Bruce meeting.

They could have also had most of the slow motion shots play at normal speed (except where to show Supes and Flash reactions obviously) and cut the opening Supes death reaching you know what to a third.

So it could have easily been 40 mins less without cutting too much. I honestly hated the injustice shit in the epilogue but loved most of the rest.

I found that the motivations shown made the plot a lot easier to follow and understand personally

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ProfessorD

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#49  Edited By ProfessorD

@j_normal said:

@professord:

https://www.google.com/amp/s/movieweb.com/amp/justice-league-snyder-cut-not-dceu-canon/

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=_L5w9ZXPIWA

https://www.google.com/amp/s/heroichollywood.com/zack-snyder-joss-whedon-justice-league-dceu-canon/amp/

Its not canon

It's canon to MOS and BvS. That's a fact. Go watch his interviews with Grace Randolph from 7 months ago. He refers to these 3 films as the "Snyderverse"

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@factg

Supes isn't that big a part of the MB scene. Cyborg and Flash are responsible for the heavy lifting Supes just pushes them apart after they're done and therebis no "blowback"