The word of producers should be taken as a fact no matter what?

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theCrazyBean

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Poll The word of producers should be taken as a fact no matter what? (37 votes)

Yes 24%
No 35%
I'm hungry 41%

So, DCEU Superman tanking 300 db has been topic of discussion lately, in one hand it didn't look like 300 db mainly because the ground that took the attack didn't get destroyed, and supes was even able to use a random piece of metal to shield himself and then throw it. If they were 300db the ground and the piece of metal Clark used should had been desintegrated the moment the wave reached them. Pretty much every single piece of evidence shows it wasn't even close to 300 db, but then we have producers saying it was actually that strong despite everything else. I'm well aware that we shouldn't ask for realism in this kind of movies, but at least a little bit of logic.

Well, I'm going off topic here. This lead me to ask myself if we should take as a fact what Producers say without any doubts, or take into consideration producers' words but also look to other stuff when judging a character feats? What are your thoughts?

(This thread has not the purpose of discussing that Supes feat, if you want to do that there are some active threads focused in That)

Had to do this again because I deleted the previous one by mistake

 • 
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theCrazyBean

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@mimisalome: Confirmed, a DCEU random piece of metal >>>> Cap shield

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TheLastDragonborn

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#3  Edited By TheLastDragonborn

Yes producers are a word of fact. Why is the hungry thing there? Doing it to inflate votes for your side lol?

random piece of metal is standard cbm logic defying plot force. Batman shouldnt have survived DD either and iron man would have killed the super soldiers. A yoyo was seen to be moving faster than QS in AoU so yoyo > MCU QS?

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Gotoucanario

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ASGARDIANBRONY

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No. we know we cant take writers words as absolute fact, same goes for producers.

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theCrazyBean

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@thelastdragonborn:

"Why is the hungry thing there? Doing it to inflate votes for your side lol?"

Thought that would be funny, no need to get salty about it.

"A yoyo was seen to be moving faster than QS in AoU so yoyo > MCU QS"

What? When? I'd like lo watch that scene lol, still this has nothing to do with the topic we are talking about unless producers said that yoyo > QS :)

"Batman shouldnt have survived DD either and iron man would have killed the super soldiers."

Why shouldn't Batman's had survived? He stayed off the fight for the most part of it. And Iron Man was nerfed as hell in Civil war, but if he wanted he could had used his lasers to kill them both in any moment, he just didn't want to kill Cap

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TheLastDragonborn

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@asgardianbrony: I am pretty sure the writers and producers words > logic.

This also applies to universe busters. it would literally take millions of years to bust the universe at light speed + yet people accept that easily right?

logic doesnt always apply in movies. there are so many more examples of this everywhere

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TheLastDragonborn

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@thecrazybean: Hm yeah fair point but when a producer does come out and say something (like the 300 db) it is usually to emphasize something (in this case, how strong superman is). Maybe the man hole is made by batman to withstand 300 db because he is that much of a prep god?

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Don_Higashikata

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No. we know we cant take writers words as absolute fact, same goes for producers.

It really depends on the situation. You have to extrapolate the author's intent and what is actually shown, and marry the two.

In the case of the Superman feat, there's technically no way to produce 300 db without blowing up a small mountain. However, Bruce could generate that using WayneTech. Go figure.

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TheLastDragonborn

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@don_higashikata:

This.

Just think for a moment please. 300 db is extremely powerful and it would probably destroy gotham and literally rip apart most if not all humans there. No way to really showcase that. I bet if this was marvel people would say "omg thor withstood 300 db cuz feige said it", you guys would be all over it. The 300 db statement is there for a purpose. Both to show how prepared batsy is and how strong supes is.

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ASGARDIANBRONY

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#11  Edited By ASGARDIANBRONY

@thelastdragonborn:

I am pretty sure the writers and producers words > logic.

odin is omnipotent confirmed LOL.

This also applies to universe busters. it would literally take millions of years to bust the universe at light speed + yet people accept that easily right?

this is not the same at all, universe busters wield powers far beyond mortal comprehension.

logic doesnt always apply in movies. there are so many more examples of this everywhere

and? so we should just accept every little statement? no, that's fallacious reasoning, logic must always be used in argument. consistent showings >>>>>>>>>>>>> a statement that defies logic.

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TheLastDragonborn

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@asgardianbrony: Odin is omnipotent? If the producers said so... but where is the source?

and whats to say that manhole wields powers far beyond your mortal comprehension

also superman is pretty consistent lol... he went through two town busting missiles like nothing. To this day, nothing has ever caused a visible SCRATCH on his body except kryptonite. Not even the nuke cut him and he was weakened by kryptonite. He didnt bleed at all. ALso he fell from orbit and got up like nothing. Fell through a mountain and got up looking embarrassed... took a fiery explosion at the capitol and didnt feel a thing

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nickzambuto

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Yes. The story wouldn't exist without the writers. Any feat put into the movie is from the writers. They shouldn't be held to a higher standard than statements. Them saying something out of universe isn't any different, they can easily just place it into the story if they wanted.

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ASGARDIANBRONY

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@thelastdragonborn:

Odin is omnipotent? If the producers said so... but where is the source?

Are you trolling me?

and whats to say that manhole wields powers far beyond your mortal comprehension

you have to be trolling me.

also superman is pretty consistent lo

yea, consistently nowhere near powerful enough to move tectonic plates.

he went through two town busting missiles like nothing

um, no, that never happened.

To this day, nothing has ever caused a visible SCRATCH on his body except kryptonite.

thats cutting durability. in MOS he got KOed several times IIRC.

Not even the nuke cut him and he was weakened by kryptonite. He didnt bleed at all.

why would it cut him? its an explosion. the nuke turned supes into a charred husk.

ALso he fell from orbit and got up like nothing. Fell through a mountain and got up looking embarrassed... took a fiery explosion at the capitol and didnt feel a thing

nothing even remotely close to the level of tanking 300 db or moving tectonic plates.

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JediXMan

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#15 JediXMan  Moderator

It depends. I can't make a blanket statement one way or another, and I don't know the context of this producer's statement - I don't even know what the statement is.

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theCrazyBean

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#16  Edited By theCrazyBean

@thelastdragonborn:

"Maybe the man hole is made by batman to withstand 300 db because he is that much of a prep god?"

LMAO you made me laugh there so I forgive you that first salty comment :P

"Odin is omnipotent? If the producers said so... but where is the source?"

This has been stated plenty of times, but everyone ignores it because clearly Odin isn't by feats. That's what I'm talking about, by feats that was no close to 300 db even if producers say so. The same with Odin, it does not matter how many times they say Odin is omnipotent, unless we get a feat of that, he is not.

"300 db is extremely powerful and it would probably destroy gotham and literally rip apart most if not all humans there. No way to really showcase that."

Actually, no. When two sound waves (or any kind of wave) if they have the same "power" (well, power is not the technical term, but I think you understand my point) and their gap is exactly 180° (not sure if gap is the correct term, but that was how Google translated it lol) then both waves cancel each other in the point they meet. IIRC both Sonic weapons were exactly in opposite sides, so if we assume Batman somehow managed to focus the wave to only affect in the direction Superman was, then Everything in Gotham would had been fine because the waves cancelled each other, however everything in the middle of the Sonic weapons should had been desintegrated. The Sonic waves not destroying Gotham makes sense actually, however when Supes destroyed one of the Sonic weapons and the other was still working then yeah, Gotham should had been destroyed.

"I bet if this was marvel people would say "omg thor withstood 300 db cuz feige said it", you guys would be all over it."

Nah, at least not me. I'm not bothered because it's DC and not marvel, don't think I am downplaying Supes because I think he would beat any MCU superhero or at worst stalemate Vision (still I think Supes would take a majority). I'm bothered because there are many things wrong with just accepting such an statement without a proper reason different from "A producer said that"

"The 300 db statement is there for a purpose. Both to show how prepared batsy is and how strong supes is."

Yeah, that is the reason, obviously, but that doesn't make it right.

Excuse my English, it isn't​ my first language.

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TheLastDragonborn

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Please link me to the source where Odin is omnipotent. Until then, hearsay does not count. We have a direct source for superman but not for odin (unless you guys show me).

also I wasnt salty lol... it just would have been better if you had not included that because there would be more accurate results.

You are right about the center getting destroyed... but it was positioned in a way so superman took most of not all of the db.

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deactivated-5d731ee5de2e9

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Not no matter what. Only when it aligns with the story and the character. If lois was the one between the emitters u can disregard it.

And did u really need to make a thread for this? Even disregarding this still puts dceu superman far above ur mcu heavy hitters

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TheLastDragonborn

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Are there any more producer statements we can use?

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theCrazyBean

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@DammeFavour: yeah, Supes would win against any MCU superhero. I'm not discussing that because I agree. He is stronger, more durable and faster than MCU heavy hitters

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deactivated-5d731ee5de2e9

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@thecrazybean: also it's post kryptonian invasion. So it's quite possible. The same way iron man's armour is gold titanium alloy even if it doesn't make sense

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TheLastDragonborn

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ALso, if nothing on screen contradicts the CHARACTER's showing then it should be perfectly allowed. Anything from the producers is fair game but nothing contradicts superman's durability so...

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theCrazyBean

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@thelastdragonborn: there are a few. I'll look them with their source when I get home. If we include statements made by comicbook writers then we have a lot to discuss about

"also I wasnt salty lol... it just would have been better if you had not included that because there would be more accurate results."

Well, I was including a "see results" option for people who didn't want to give their opinions about the topic but I thought "I'm hungry" would be funny and would let people who are not taking sides see the poll results. I hate when I have to vote in a poll I don't want to get involved in just to see the results

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TheLastDragonborn

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Meh, this is something which doesnt really require a "see results" as it is a more pervasive topic. Most people should have an opinion

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detacude

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@thelastdragonborn: Millions of years to bust our universe at light speed.. Are you reffering to our Milky way Galaxy or the Cosmic Web?

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TheLastDragonborn

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@detacude: the universe =/= galaxy

universe is well... the universe. cosmic web i guess

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detacude

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#27  Edited By detacude

@thelastdragonborn: Millions of years is a hefty understatement then :D, not even the judeo-christian God could pull that off and he was able to terraform a planet in 6 days

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deactivated-5a84a212043e5

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Producer statements can be helpful when there is little else to go on, but c'mon; we all know this.

Feats>*10^100>WordofGod>WordofCharacter

Obviously in the DCEU case, there is a feat, and it supersedes any goofy/unrealistic statement the producers made.

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pipxeroth

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Only when it's in terms of clarifying context. The 300db thing is clearly incorrect, the producer saying that it is isn't going to change what was shown.

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ASGARDIANBRONY

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@detacude said:

@thelastdragonborn: Millions of years is a hefty understatement then :D, not even the judeo-christian God could pull that off and he was able to terraform a planet in 6 days

why does everyone act like Genesis only talks about the creation of earth? On Day 1 God created all light, on day 4 God created all the celestial bodies/stars/ect.

im also wondering where this idea that universal characters are all PIS came from. universal and above characters dont abide by the same laws of time or space, they wield cosmic/magic powers beyond human comprehension and reality warping power.

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deactivated-5f34b01dd81ff

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Depends on the subject

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RajjarsAlt

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#32  Edited By RajjarsAlt  Online

I mean the Word of God is in the Holy Bible and yet you see how many ppl don't believe in that.

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ninetoadclown

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A producer has no authority to add in fact that weren’t there.

Even statements from writers and directors should be ignored as far as exact numbers in science goes, they don’t have the scientific background to specify.

If the writer of a movie states that character x has high level super speed. Ok, fine that works.

If they try to put a number on it that is out of their league of knowledge to justify them no.

If the writer then says that character X could circle the globe in 1 second but all is shown is that the character works hard to keep up with a missile, the. That is just them BSing a number that sounds cool.

Certain genres are absolutely rife with hyperbolic statements that people take as mathematical facts.

This is why if I ever see someone use the word “scales” and then starts spouting numbers I just consider them a moron and ignore them.

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TheBatmeme368

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#34  Edited By TheBatmeme368

Within reason, I suppose.

But this feat is very dubious, because decibel feats aren't reliable in fiction. They're some of the worst out there.

Decibels work on a logarithmic scale, meaning 200 dB is FAR more than just double 100 dB. I can't remember the exact number, but it was something like a thousand dB to destroy the entire universe. If we take decibels feat seriously, we end up with universal/multiversal Iron Man, Cyborg, Adam West Batman and a random tiger, etc.

Decibel feats aren't reliable. At all. They often contradict other showings and writers don't have a proper sense of scale. It's clearly not intended to be city level when a manhole cover survives the thing.

DCEU Superman is still really durable. Surviving a nuke at all is really damn impressive. And he didn't even look scuffed up after the battle in Metropolis. He's very tanky, but this feat is a very flimsy argument at best, and utter nonsense at worst.