TAS Reviews: Joker

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silvanus

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When I went for the movie, I wasn't quite sure of what to expect for many reasons. For one, Joker had worked perfectly as a character with no own story in The Dark Knight. The story of Joker isn't something I thought I wanted to see. But I'm really glad that I did.

Definitely one of my top 3 CBMs.

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TheAmazingSpidey

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@theamazingspidey: Nah, my brother isn't really a film fanatic like us :P

My girlfriend will be keen to see it though. Might go on Monday or Sunday if she gets out of work early. Can't wait.

Didn't know you had a GF. Happy for you and wish y'all the best xD

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TheAmazingSpidey

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@silvanus said:

When I went for the movie, I wasn't quite sure of what to expect for many reasons. For one, Joker had worked perfectly as a character with no own story in The Dark Knight. The story of Joker isn't something I thought I wanted to see. But I'm really glad that I did.

Definitely one of my top 3 CBMs.

My mum was quite skeptical going into the movie too and still doesn't like the idea of Joker having an origin story, but she says she enjoyed it as a standalone movie.

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OnlyOneEmpereor

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Excellent review for an Excellent movie.

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TheAmazingSpidey

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MonsterStomp

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Didn't know you had a GF. Happy for you and wish y'all the best xD

Its recent. We only started officially dating 2 weeks ago.

Thanks for the kind wishes!

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Vertigo-

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As someone who saw the movie last night, it was one of the best movies I've seen in the last few years. I wasn't completely sold on what I had seen in trailers, but Phoenix absolutely nailed it.

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mrmonster

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@theamazingspidey: I just saw it. I'll give a more detailed response when I have a few days to fully digest it, but my basic thoughts can be best described as pure love. I loved every single second of this movie. Perfect 10/10. Joaquin Phoenix's performance will go down as an all time best.

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TheAmazingSpidey

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@theamazingspidey: I just saw it. I'll give a more detailed response when I have a few days to fully digest it, but my basic thoughts can be best described as pure love. I loved every single second of this movie. Perfect 10/10. Joaquin Phoenix's performance will go down as an all time best.

Glad you loved it as much as I did! Phoenix was unreal.

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the_stegman

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#60 the_stegman  Moderator

Saw it Thursday by the way. The movie is beautiful. In every sense of the word. Favorite movie of the year.

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Menos_Kegare

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@thor_parker82 said:
@theamazingspidey said:
@thor_parker82 said:

Watched it today, excellent movie, I absolutely loved it, and the MVP is Joaquin Phoenix, this dude gave one of the best performances I have seen in any movie, his body language alone is insane. The entire movie was engaging, well written and very well done, but the last 20 minutes are the definition of PERFECTION, and that last part with Joker saying "nah, you wouldn't get the joke" gave me chills.

I looooooove that ending scene. Just give Joaquin the Oscar already.

I swear, if he doesn't at least get a nomination, I'll riot.

This movie had so many great moments, one of my favorites was when after getting saved by the ambulance crashing the police car and the thugs carrying him out, he just got up and started dancing on top of the car to the crowd, it captured the Joker perfectly.

That entire second-last scene was just brilliant. The bit where he uses the blood on his fingers to draw a smile on his face sent chills down my spine.

It also had a good bit of comedy as well, like the scene where the guys from the clown agency came to his apartment. He locks the door to prevent them from running or anyone coming in, kills the guy who gave him the gun and tells the other he's free to leave. But because the other guy was a midget, he couldn't open the door and had to ask Arthur to come open it for him XD.

Probably the best movie I've seen in a while tbh. Very emotional, good storytelling, great character development, and a few neat twists

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Emperorb777

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#62  Edited By Emperorb777

What I like about the film, is you can't be sure that everything you saw actually happened because of the way the film begins and ends.

I also like how you're actually going on this journey of madness with the Arthur.

Definitely my favorite movie this year and for sure in my top 3 favorite CBM. You'll never get a film like this from Marvel.

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TheAmazingSpidey

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What I like about the film, is you can't be sure that everything you saw actually happened because of the way the film begins and ends.

I also like how you're actually going on this journey of madness with the Arthur.

Definitely my favorite movie this year and for sure in my top 3 favorite CBM. You'll never get a film like this from Marvel.

Absolutely! They got the ambiguity of Joker down to a T.

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Killer94

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My review:

Joaquin delivered one of the most enthralling and most intriguing performance as the Joker

The supporting cast (albeit minor) were perfect in the development of the Joker character in context of the story

The story was paced perfectly and what I like about it was, there's an "air" of ambiguity in it, we are subjected into a narrative that can be interpreted depending on how you perceive Arthur's POV of the events.

The cinematography was nothing short of a beauty.

The score was perfect, it feels like the music Hildur composed was a character of itself.

The overall vibe really captured the 70's-80's style of character study type films, there's even a scene that is directly influenced by "The King of Comedy"

My score: 10/10 - a masterpiece

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Thor_Parker82

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@thor_parker82 said:
@theamazingspidey said:
@thor_parker82 said:

Watched it today, excellent movie, I absolutely loved it, and the MVP is Joaquin Phoenix, this dude gave one of the best performances I have seen in any movie, his body language alone is insane. The entire movie was engaging, well written and very well done, but the last 20 minutes are the definition of PERFECTION, and that last part with Joker saying "nah, you wouldn't get the joke" gave me chills.

I looooooove that ending scene. Just give Joaquin the Oscar already.

I swear, if he doesn't at least get a nomination, I'll riot.

This movie had so many great moments, one of my favorites was when after getting saved by the ambulance crashing the police car and the thugs carrying him out, he just got up and started dancing on top of the car to the crowd, it captured the Joker perfectly.

That entire second-last scene was just brilliant. The bit where he uses the blood on his fingers to draw a smile on his face sent chills down my spine.

It was brilliant

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mrmonster

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I was gonna post spoilery thoughts, but it looks like spoiler blocks aren't working right now. I'll try again later.

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buttersdaman000

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I wouldn't call it a masterpiece but it was certainly excellent. I can't believe critics are giving it mixed reviews. I really only have one thing bad to say about it, and it's a personal gripe at that. I felt they went a little too hard on the "incel" aspect at the end when he was on the talk show. I think it weakened his descent into the Joker. IMO.

Besides that, an easy 9/10.

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silkyballfro94

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Not a masterpiece, but I think it was pretty great. 8/10 or possibly 9/10 on further viewings. I thought they could've done a better job setting up the feel and world of Gotham. Yeah they told us about the mega rats, trash, rude and bad people, a little graffiti. Idk maybe that's a little something that I thought needed a little more. Anyway, I wonder how, if at all, Todd Philip's work and interaction with GG Allin influenced Joker. I'm curious.

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TheAmazingSpidey

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Just watched the movie a 2nd time. Liked it even more this time around.

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WolverineBatmanFTW

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@theamazingspidey:

I watched the film last night and since I liked your review, I thought I might share my thoughts

Let me start off by saying this is my favorite movie of this century.

Until yesterday, no film ever made me feel truly uncomfortable. Not even masterpieces like Taxi Driver, Prisoners or The Exorcist. Joker, however, made my skin crawl. And not because it's violent, but because of the film's humanistic portrayal of Joker and the seriousness with which it treats violence and insanity. It is dark, complex and extremely evocative.

It features one of the best performances of the century, and probably all time, with Phoenix's turn as Arthur. I have never seen an actor communicate the effects of existential pain and societal rejection so convincingly. Every aspect of his performance, from the look in his eyes, to his weight loss and skeletal frame, to his style of movement, to his laugh (which expressed pain and despair with utter perfection), truly blew me away. It also has a very emotionally affecting story, brilliant directing and beautiful, yet bleak cinematography. The film muses on a number of truly timeless themes, such as the prevalence and inclination of humanity towards violence, the effects of isolation on the psyche, the struggle for recognition as a human being and society's mistreatment of the downtrodden (specifically the mentally ill).

I will say this... it's a complete, total masterpiece, and dead even with The Dark Knight as my favorite comic book movie ever made, and I could praise this movie for hours on end.

Having said all that...

It's also quite possibly a very dangerous film considering the times we live in.

Never has a film shown such a fully realized, realistically humanistic psychopath. He is tragic and to regular people, a very empathetic, if eventually frightening and evil, person. However, I could see the mind of a psychopathic incel viewing Arthur as a relatable and heroic character. I believe incels are people who have been driven to madness and nihilism as a result of rejection from society and simply-put, a lack of love towards them. And that is exactly what the Joker is in this film.

If I was someone who had similar experiences as him, someone beaten down and battered by society, I could absolutely relate to and be inspired by him.

And let me be clear, I don't think this movie will necessarily create a shooter, but rather, I could see it accelerating the mental process that leads to someone with that level of instability and misanthropy committing an act of mass murder.

And that scares me.

I think I would have been a lot happier with this movie if it came out, I dunno, maybe 15 to 20 years from now, or however long it takes for this f***ing epidemic of far-right, incel-related gun violence to end.

Well, those are my thoughts. Hope you didn't mind me tagging.

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BullPR

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Good movie.

And I wrote movie, not CBM.

Not sure you can compare it to any MCU production.

If other producers take the raw material forn the comics to give us other "real" movies like this one (real original scenario, real acting real emotions etc...) that would make me a very happy man.

I can't give an accurate score, just that it is in its own category (not even TDK was that accomplished).

For info, when analysing the movie with my two oldest sons, I evaluated the movie at 12/20 but, once again, following hardest evaluation points than for CBMs.

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mrmonster

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Brilliant analysis from Wisecrack.

Loading Video...

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TheAmazingSpidey

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Brilliant analysis from Wisecrack.

Loading Video...

Thanks for sharing! Might try and watch this later today.

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TheAmazingSpidey

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@theamazingspidey:

I watched the film last night and since I liked your review, I thought I might share my thoughts

Let me start off by saying this is my favorite movie of this century.

Until yesterday, no film ever made me feel truly uncomfortable. Not even masterpieces like Taxi Driver, Prisoners or The Exorcist. Joker, however, made my skin crawl. And not because it's violent, but because of the film's humanistic portrayal of Joker and the seriousness with which it treats violence and insanity. It is dark, complex and extremely evocative.

It features one of the best performances of the century, and probably all time, with Phoenix's turn as Arthur. I have never seen an actor communicate the effects of existential pain and societal rejection so convincingly. Every aspect of his performance, from the look in his eyes, to his weight loss and skeletal frame, to his style of movement, to his laugh (which expressed pain and despair with utter perfection), truly blew me away. It also has a very emotionally affecting story, brilliant directing and beautiful, yet bleak cinematography. The film muses on a number of truly timeless themes, such as the prevalence and inclination of humanity towards violence, the effects of isolation on the psyche and society's mistreatment of the downtrodden (specifically the mentally ill).

I will say this... it's a complete, total masterpiece, and dead even with The Dark Knight as my favorite comic book movie ever made, and I could praise this movie for hours on end.

Having said all that...

It's also quite possibly a very dangerous film considering the times we live in.

Never has a film shown such a fully realized, realistically humanistic psychopath. He is tragic and to regular people, a very empathetic, if eventually frightening and evil, person. However, I could see the mind of a psychopathic incel viewing Arthur as a relatable and heroic character. I believe incels are people who have been driven to madness and nihilism as a result of rejection from society and simply-put, a lack of love towards them. And that is exactly what the Joker is in this film.

If I was someone who had similar experiences as him, someone beaten down and battered by society, I could absolutely relate to and be inspired by him.

And let me be clear, I don't think this movie will necessarily create a shooter, but rather, I could see it accelerating the mental process that leads to someone with that level of instability and misanthropy committing an act of mass murder.

And that scares me.

I think I would have been a lot happier with this movie if it came out, I dunno, maybe 15 to 20 years from now, or however long it takes for this f***ing epidemic of far-right, incel-related gun violence to end.

Well, those are my thoughts. Hope you didn't mind me tagging.

Amazing breakdown of the movie right here :)

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PayneInTheAss

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What is the thought process behind calling it the best movie of 2019 ?

Meaning, how many films have you watched released this year to asure that?

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TheAmazingSpidey

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What is the thought process behind calling it the best movie of 2019 ?

Meaning, how many films have you watched released this year to asure that?

I haven't seen every 2019 movie, so I hope people are able to infer that I mean this is the best of all 2019 movies I've seen.

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PayneInTheAss

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@theamazingspidey: Glad to know, then.

Are you into more obscure/indie/artsy stuff? or mostly mainstream?

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WolverineBatmanFTW

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@theamazingspidey:

Cheers, and I'm really glad you could see both sides of the argument. Lots of people just make up their mind and stick to one perspective- they either say it's a masterpiece and shouldn't have any sort of political analysis and that it won't inspire violence OR they say it's a sick, toxic champion of inceldom.

I think it's a great movie that was trying to comment negatively on this issue of incel related violence and also highlight the part that society plays in creating these demons, but it went a little too far in making Arthur human. It's too well made, to the point where it could INADVERTENTLY inspire the terror and violence.

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TheAmazingSpidey

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@theamazingspidey: Glad to know, then.

Are you into more obscure/indie/artsy stuff? or mostly mainstream?

Definitely interested in indie and artsy stuff as well, but it generally takes longer for me to get around to those movies. Due to their limited/delayed releases (especially since I live in Australia) I usually need to wait a bit until those movies become available for me to watch.

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PayneInTheAss

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@theamazingspidey: Did you already catch Bong Joon-ho´s Parasite?

I think that is the best of the year I´ve seen so far. Along with Midsommar.

(But yeah, I´m not an avid movie watcher tho)

Regarding Joker...I need to rewatch it to form a better opinion of the film as a whole. I loved Joaquin Phoenix as usual, as well as composer Hildur Guðnadóttir, but I need to solidify my opinions overall.

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BullPR

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@theamazingspidey: In what category would you place this Movie?

Action?

Drama?

Thriller?

CBM?

Other?

I just can't put it with the other movies using comic book characters.

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TheAmazingSpidey

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#83  Edited By TheAmazingSpidey

@bullpr: I’d say it’s a CBM and a psychological drama/thriller. As different as it is from other CBMs, the fact of the matter is it is still a movie based on a comic book property: therefore it is a CBM. The fact it is different from the rest should be embraced as an evolution of the genre, instead of being used to distance and denounce it from the genre.

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BullPR

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@bullpr: I’d say it’s a CBM and a psychological drama/thriller. As different as it is from other CBMs, the fact of the matter is it is still a movie based on a comic book property: therefore it is a CBM. The fact it is different from the rest should be embraced as an evolution of the genre, instead of being used to distance and denounce it from the genre.

In theory you are right. But there is no superpower, no supertechnology, no superhero ou villain and so on.

Replace Joker by Sabertooth and I would agree with you: a "real" movie exploring the mind of a sociopath.

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buttersdaman000

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#85  Edited By buttersdaman000

@bullpr said:
@theamazingspidey said:

@bullpr: I’d say it’s a CBM and a psychological drama/thriller. As different as it is from other CBMs, the fact of the matter is it is still a movie based on a comic book property: therefore it is a CBM. The fact it is different from the rest should be embraced as an evolution of the genre, instead of being used to distance and denounce it from the genre.

In theory you are right. But there is no superpower, no supertechnology, no superhero ou villain and so on.

Replace Joker by Sabertooth and I would agree with you: a "real" movie exploring the mind of a sociopath.

I agree for the most part. The Joker may be a quintessential comic book character, but he was used in a film completely devoid of superhero comic book properties. And I say "super hero" because that seems to be the qualifier for being a CBM nowadays. For example, we don't call "Wanted" a CBM even though it based off a comic. We don't call "Road to Perdition" a CBM even though it based off a comic. "The Walking Dead" isn't thought of a comic book tv show, even though it's based off a comic. The list goes on.

I think there needs to be certain fantastical elements involved for a movie to be considered a CBM under the colloquial usage of the term.

But, that being said, Joker is such a huge comic book character, it's hard not calling this a CBM.