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#1 Edited by i_like_swords (26203 posts) - - Show Bio

Respect..

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Savage Opress

Savage Opress was a Dathomirian Nightbrother, and brother to Darth Maul. He was known for his exceptional strength, size and endurance, and overwhelming raw power in the force. However, I don't think the majority of people see far past that, and can go as far to say that Savage relies solely on strength, and has no speed, skill or refinement. That is simply not true, and hopefully at the end of this thread, you will respect Savage Opress.

Physical Prowess

Strength

It's a no brainer that Savage is a powerful being, standing at over 7 foot tall with an extremely muscular build not even typical of other Zabraks. This is due to his transformation at the hands of Mother Talzin, who decided Savage was strong enough to learn the way of the Sith under Count Dooku.

Savage was already quite strong pre-transformation, however.

During his fight with Ventress, he was able to throw her at a wall. He also cracked the stone ground with a punch, and then later on in the fight cracks the stone wall behind Ventress several times with his strikes.

Post-transformation Savage becomes incredibly powerful physically.

He breaks a mans wrist bones in his grasp. Then breaks his neck.

A guard approached Savage with his weapon drawn. The Sith grabbed his wrist and Maul heard the bones break, the weapon falling to the floor as the Falleen screamed. Savage grabbed the green head, twisting the Falleen's neck until it broke, then slammed the luckless soldier down to the floor.

Star Wars The Clone Wars: Darth Maul Shadow Conspiracy

He was strong enough to disarm Dooku in a single strike, despite Dooku being a master of positioning, leverage and lightsaber combat in general. Later on in the fight, you see Savage launch Ventress across the room with a strike.

While using a force grip, was capable of physically holding off both Obi Wan and Anakin, and then launches them several feet through the air.

Snaps durasteel binders casually just by flexing:

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Durability

He is pretty much blaster-proof from the chest down.

Resists several bursts from Dooku's lightning.

Speed/Agility

He shows a good amount of finesse and speed here, reacting to blaster bolts and dispatching opponents.

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Creates very large after-images with his blade.

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Shows skill and speed in this fight where he dodges lightsaber blows casually, even hopping above one.

He was able to temporarily deflect omni-directional blaster fire coming from extremely close range.

Shows some agility and finesse while fighting Kenobi:

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He has ignited and hurled his lightsaber faster than a room full of guards, or anyone else, could react, decapitating five people at once.

Before anyone could react, Savage had ignited both blades of his saber and hurled the weapon, sending a spinning sheet of scarlet plasma knifing through the gloomy hall. The lightsaber returned to Savage's hand, it's circuit of the room complete, and he deactivated the blades. The soldiers of the Black Sun and the Death Watch stood there, momentarily stunned. Then all heard five thumps from behind the thrones, and the five headless bodies of the Black Sun leaders collapsed where they stood.

Star Wars The Clone Wars: Darth Maul Shadow Conspiracy

Has moved in the blink of an eye.

"In an eyeblink, Maul and Savage had their lightsabers drawn and ignited, and were sending laser blasts ricocheting all around the chamber.."

Star Wars The Clone Wars: Darth Maul Shadow Conspiracy

Lightsaber and Martial Art Skill

First off, a nice showing of Force combat and skill against Jedi Master Grohto and Padawan Tatsu. He blasts Grohto and cuts off Tatsu's hand in one strike:

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What's worth noting is that Cho Mai, the Lightsaber mark of contact which involves cutting off the weapon hand of an opponent, is thought to be a demonstration superior lightsaber mastery, according to Cin Drallig:

Jedi vs Sith: The Essential Guide to the Force
Jedi vs Sith: The Essential Guide to the Force

Duels evenly with Plo Koon despite being distracted by blaster fire from clones, lands a kick, and ends up winning by tearing his mask off.

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Duels evenly with Adi Gallia and kills her using TK/horns.

Fights evenly with, and at some points gets the better of Asajj Ventress.

Pre-transformation he shows exceptional skill against a far more experienced Ventress in pure hand-to-hand.

Engages Obi Wan and Anakin simultaneously.

Sort of ambushes Kenobi and gives him difficulty with his strength.

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Force Powers

Count Dooku states that Savage was growing more powerful as each day passed, after he was released from his former master.

That creature Savage Opress is growing stronger and stronger as each day passes... He is a threat to all of us.

The Clone Wars Season 4 Episode 21: Brothers

Telekinesis

A pretty big force blast throwing off Maul and another force sensitive, and casually sending a group of men flying.

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Between himself and Maul, they Force-blast a company of soldiers.

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Force blasts a group of soldiers while fighting Plo Koon.

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Knocks out a force sensitive with one blast.

Whilst drawing heavily on Dark Rage, telekinetically blasts Anakin and Obi Wan twice. Second blast is at 0:50.

Telekinetically throws Dooku whilst drawing heavily on Dark Rage.

Pushes a Starfighter off a cliff.

Credit to Erkan12
Credit to Erkan12

Destroying a prison cell made of Mandalorian Iron. Also known as Beskar. A nigh-indestructible metal that is even lightsaber resistant.

Credit to Erkan12
Credit to Erkan12

Source for the cell being made of Mandalorian Iron:

They led Satine to a prison cell in her own palace, shutting her in a little room with a cot, desk, and chair, behind a door made of Mandalorian Iron

Darth Maul Shadow Conspiracy

Maul trusts Savage to stop a knife just before it reaches his face.

Credit to Erkan12
Credit to Erkan12

Savage has also shown some proficiency in saber throwing.

He has ignited and hurled his lightsaber faster than a room full of guards, or anyone else, could react, decapitating five people at once.

Before anyone could react, Savage had ignited both blades of his saber and hurled the weapon, sending a spinning sheet of scarlet plasma knifing through the gloomy hall. The lightsaber returned to Savage's hand, it's circuit of the room complete, and he deactivated the blades. The soldiers of the Black Sun and the Death Watch stood there, momentarily stunned. Then all heard five thumps from behind the thrones, and the five headless bodies of the Black Sun leaders collapsed where they stood.

Star Wars The Clone Wars: Darth Maul Shadow Conspiracy

Force Empathy

Savage can feel the emotions of others through the force.

Savage had felt his Master's frustration in the force and approached Maul and Vizsla, glaring at the Mandalorian.

Star Wars The Clone Wars: Darth Maul Shadow Hunter

>Click here to be redirected to my list of respect threads.<

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#2 Posted by JakeN7 (15180 posts) - - Show Bio

@i_like_swords: *nerd rage* THIS IS TERRIBLE! YOU BARELY WROTE ANYTHING! ARRGH!

Lol, I look forward to the finished product.

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#3 Posted by i_like_swords (26203 posts) - - Show Bio

@jaken7: I was about to start it when I got roped into watching Godfather 2&3 straight through, then had to restart my laptop. So I had to save my progress. It'll be done soon, though.

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#4 Posted by JakeN7 (15180 posts) - - Show Bio
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#5 Posted by Easternwind (4590 posts) - - Show Bio

@i_like_swords: Nice respect thread man. I play on using Maul or Opress in a CaV actually, Ive learned a ton about them in the last few weeks. this could help too

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#6 Edited by i_like_swords (26203 posts) - - Show Bio

@easternwind: Thanks. Ah, cool man. I'll let you know whenever I add something new. For instance.. I have added a few snippets to my TCW Maul thread if you want to check that out, and I added a new quote to my TPM Maul which is useful in skill-debates:

One of the most skilled and deadly warriors in Sith history, Darth Sidious' apprentice took part in the first encounter between Jedi Knight and Sith warrior for more than 1,000 years in the Battle for Naboo.

As a Sith devotee, Darth Maul drew his power from the dark side of the Force. He was one of the most highly trained Sith in the history of the order.

The Official Star Wars Fact File #1

Not many Sith get the accolade "One of the most skilled and deadly warriors in Sith history"

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#7 Edited by Easternwind (4590 posts) - - Show Bio

@i_like_swords: yeah thats a good one. Ill def be using them.

I love starwars characters

I'm actually using general grevious in a debate right now

and I just finished a debate against darth vader ( my first real CaV/Tourney), lots of starwars XD,

I think someone actually called you out in it, the voting is still open, but im not sure if you could vote agaisnt startwars ,ha Just kidding.

But yeah ill def be using the threads to help when I start with maul or opress.

Right now tho im using grevious , got some dope feats for him, do you have a respect thread for him too? XD

RESPECT FOR SAVAGE AND MAUL

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#8 Edited by i_like_swords (26203 posts) - - Show Bio

@easternwind: I have used Grievous.. but I just don't like him that much as a warrior. If he even suspects there's a possibility he'll lose a fight, he'll call in his droids. Or just use them to injure his opponents anyway. And has no problem killing you while you're down or injured. He is a beast, though.

I never have the effort to vote for people. It's terrible, I know, but debates can be extremely long. I vote occasionally though.

I do not have one for Grievous, but he should have one.

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#9 Posted by Easternwind (4590 posts) - - Show Bio

@i_like_swords: Thats ok, voting closed anyway i lost =( ( I was really proud of my strategy, I thought It was almost irrefutable , but aparently I didnt explain it well enough or something, anyway thats off topic) ,

I didnt find any for Grevious on the site , I was told he had amazing strength, I found some really good speed feats for him, but we are limited to Mach 5. what would you say Grevious' best feat is?

I like him because he isnt super powered ( well kinda) but he still hangs, I really like that. But really I picked him because he is beast, He cost almost all my points in the tourney lol.

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#10 Edited by i_like_swords (26203 posts) - - Show Bio

@easternwind: Best feat that isn't inconsistent (looking at you, original Clone Wars cartoon)? Probably throwing 20 strikes per second and overwhelming Obi Wan. Or stalemating Mace Windu.

As for strength.. he has something like over the strength of 10 men, and has been capable of denting the hull of a starship.

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#11 Posted by i_like_swords (26203 posts) - - Show Bio
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#12 Edited by ShootingNova (25691 posts) - - Show Bio

@i_like_swords: There's a few inconsistent feats here. Also, he defeated Koon by taking his mask off, not by virtue of being better with a blade.

But otherwise, the structure of the thread is good.

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#13 Posted by Easternwind (4590 posts) - - Show Bio

@i_like_swords: Cool thanks, Im gunna pm about something if thats ok, Cuz I dont wanna flood your thread.

@i_like_swords: There's a few inconsistent feats here. Also, he defeated Koon by taking his mask off, not by virtue of being better with a blade.

But otherwise, the structure of the thread is good.

Which?

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#14 Edited by i_like_swords (26203 posts) - - Show Bio

@shootingnova: Well, it's not like Koon bested him, or sat and let him remove the mask, and Savage was dodging/deflecting blaster bolts and force pushing clones while fighting him. I think it's a very good showing.

I know how you feel about stuff like Savage disarming Dooku, force pushing him, contending with Anakin and Obi Wan ect. But I think of it this way. The guy is a 7 foot tall monster, created for the purpose of basically being powerful. I think he has consistently shown that when he lets loose with the force, or physically, not many people can resist it.

Edit: Also, where he flourishes in power and strength, he does lack in speed and skill where other guys don't. I think we need to accept some of his showings with the knowledge that he isn't without his weaknesses.

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#15 Edited by DarthAznable (16928 posts) - - Show Bio

@i_like_swords Looks pretty good. Definitely showing the best the character has to offer. I wish he could have been more fleshed out though. He's there for a good while and is awesome then he meets Sidious. He is definitely one of the more powerful characters in TCW. Good job!

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#16 Edited by i_like_swords (26203 posts) - - Show Bio

@darthaznable: Hey, thanks.

I agree about the being fleshed out part. I hope maybe he can come back to speak to Maul as a ghost using Dathomir sorcery. And I also want his death to have a serious effect on Maul, making him more angry and powerful than ever. He did serve his purpose while he was around but he can still have a role in Mauls life in the future.

Edit: Also, his death has made me dislike Sidious even more than I did before :p

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#17 Posted by JakeN7 (15180 posts) - - Show Bio
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#18 Edited by i_like_swords (26203 posts) - - Show Bio

@jaken7: Because I predicted you'd be back. And, well, here you are.

*wink*

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#19 Posted by i_like_swords (26203 posts) - - Show Bio

Oh yeah, you'll obviously wanna see this @erkan12

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#20 Posted by Fodder76 (1951 posts) - - Show Bio

I really like this dude and your theory about him coming back as a force ghost is even better but what would be even cooler is if Savage came back as a force ghost as his original self torturing Maul because of his actions. ;)

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#21 Posted by ShootingNova (25691 posts) - - Show Bio

Well, it's not like Koon bested him, or sat and let him remove the mask, and Savage was dodging/deflecting blaster bolts and force pushing clones while fighting him. I think it's a very good showing.

I consider the blade level of skill to be roughly even, and then Savage was able to capitalize on Koon's weakness and take the mask off. If Koon didn't need a mask, then the fight would be more even, honestly. And to be fair, Koon was also shouting "Look out" and was facing away from Savage.

I know how you feel about stuff like Savage disarming Dooku, force pushing him, contending with Anakin and Obi Wan ect. But I think of it this way. The guy is a 7 foot tall monster, created for the purpose of basically being powerful. I think he has consistently shown that when he lets loose with the force, or physically, not many people can resist it.

No, the feats are just inconsistent and exaggerated. Witches of the Mist was Savage's premier debut in SW media - just like the Battle of Hypori was for Grievous, and to an extent, the Battle of Dantooine was for Mace Windu in the original CW show. They wanted Savage to be recognized as a potent villain who was not to be messed with. That's exactly why he manages to accomplish these feats.

We see him throwing Ventress across the room, but he never does that when they fight again aboard the Turtle Tanker. We see him driving back Kenobi and Anakin with no trouble (and Kenobi and Anakin don't even counterattack when he stops attacking them), and yet, later, Savage fails to do this to Obi-Wan, and on Florrum, even with Maul's help, he was unable to drive back Kenobi (I'm not referencing the dual-wielding, I'm referencing the part right after Gallia dies). For that matter, he was wrecked in a few seconds by Maul, who only fought evenly with Kenobi. We see Savage flooring Dooku with a single attack even though earlier, in the very same episode, Savage's blows were being slapped aside with laughable ease, and Dooku was casually choking him, but he later directly TKs Dooku right into the wall. I can accept that he was bloodlusted, but nothing else in the episode indicates he would have improved at all, and definitely not by such a margin. Not to mention that an enraged Savage with maximum effort was only able to lift two obelisks when Dooku lifted over a dozen with only moderate effort.

I would expect him to beat Ventress, I would expect him to be comparable to Dooku in power and strain Dooku in terms of strength, and I would expect him to pose a challenge to Kenobi. However, the high showings can't be considered to be indicative of his regular skill or power levels, since Savage has never again been portrayed at that level of potency comparative to the others.


Edit: Also, where he flourishes in power and strength, he does lack in speed and skill where other guys don't. I think we need to accept some of his showings with the knowledge that he isn't without his weaknesses.

I suppose so. You did miss a TK showing where, with only moderate effort, Savage knocks a 20m ship over a cliff.

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#22 Posted by i_like_swords (26203 posts) - - Show Bio

@shootingnova:

I consider the blade level of skill to be roughly even, and then Savage was able to capitalize on Koon's weakness and take the mask off. If Koon didn't need a mask, then the fight would be more even, honestly. And to be fair, Koon was also shouting "Look out" and was facing away from Savage.

Fair points. And I know Savage didn't beat him through blade skill but it is the "Lightsaber and Martial Art" section, and I figure that falls under the martial category. But yeah, I'm not just gonna go around saying Savage is a better duelist than Plo, he just managed to beat him in a fight.

No, the feats are just inconsistent and exaggerated. Witches of the Mist was Savage's premier debut in SW media - just like the Battle of Hypori was for Grievous, and to an extent, the Battle of Dantooine was for Mace Windu in the original CW show. They wanted Savage to be recognized as a potent villain who was not to be messed with. That's exactly why he manages to accomplish these feats.

Wasn't his debut for TCW during "Monster". And I mean.. he is a potent villain not to be messed with.

We see him throwing Ventress across the room, but he never does that when they fight again aboard the Turtle Tanker.

He actually did throw her about on the turtle tanker a couple times, and even during their exchange pre-transformation he threw her. So he has consistently thrown Ventress about physically. I dunno if you meant he hasn't done it consistently with TK. But the thing is he didn't use TK when he was fighting her with Dooku. If you look closely he throws her and then TK blasts Dooku right after.

We see him driving back Kenobi and Anakin with no trouble (and Kenobi and Anakin don't even counterattack when he stops attacking them), and yet, later, Savage fails to do this to Obi-Wan, and on Florrum, even with Maul's help, he was unable to drive back Kenobi (I'm not referencing the dual-wielding, I'm referencing the part right after Gallia dies).

Right after Gallia died Obi Wan would of had a degree of force valor, which could have let him put up a fight briefly. But even then - that 2v1 exchange only lasted a few seconds before Kenobi leaped away. So I don't really see it as inconsistent when the two situations were quite different.

For that matter, he was wrecked in a few seconds by Maul, who only fought evenly with Kenobi.

So because Kenobi fought with Maul and Savage for a few seconds, and then leaped away, and Kenobi fought evenly with Maul, but Maul wrecked Savage, it's inconsistent? Neh... different situations. Kenobi isn't as good in unarmed combat as Maul, which is what he used against Savage. And Kenobi has effortlessly dodged Savage's attacks before so I don't think there's a big inconsistency issue. The fact is, Savage was angry (which I'll note in the thread, for fairness sake, although he is angry like 70-80% of the time anyway), and he was able to drive back Kenobi and Anakin in a tight corridor. And this is consistent with the feat where he physically held out against both of them while performing a force choke, and then launched them physically, and the fact he's a lot bigger than both of them. He's just stronger, and is competent enough to use that strength to his advantage.

We see Savage flooring Dooku with a single attack even though earlier, in the very same episode, Savage's blows were being slapped aside with laughable ease

Difference is, when he floored Dooku he was in fight-mode, and was angry, like he usually is. But when he was being dodged and disarmed him and Dooku were just sparring. Just like how Dooku was able to dodge Grievous the same way during their sparring. Fights =/= sparring. And it's not like Dooku necessarily did anything wrong when he tried to parry Savage's strike - it's just Savage at that particular moment was too strong for even someone as capable as Dooku to handle. If it happened to Dooku it means it would probably happen to a lot of people - in that particular moment.

and Dooku was casually choking him, but he later directly TKs Dooku right into the wall. I can accept that he was bloodlusted, but nothing else in the episode indicates he would have improved at all, and definitely not by such a margin.

Well again, they were training/not fighting when he was choking him, the same way masters usually choke their apprentices. He TK'd Dooku in a fight situation where he was angry, and was letting loose. Dooku himself has stated that Savage had the potential to become very powerful. It all adds up.

Not to mention that an enraged Savage with maximum effort was only able to lift two obelisks when Dooku lifted over a dozen with only moderate effort.

Suppose, but we can only chalk it up to the fact Dooku is far more refined, and Savage was even more angry in that fight situation where he was being called an "unworthy apprentice" and "weak". Savage isn't a better telekinetic but he does have a lot of raw power in his force blasts. But he maybe just isn't good at lifting things.

I would expect him to beat Ventress, I would expect him to be comparable to Dooku in power and strain Dooku in terms of strength, and I would expect him to pose a challenge to Kenobi. However, the high showings can't be considered to be indicative of his regular skill or power levels, since Savage has never again been portrayed at that level of potency comparative to the others.

I think the point is - when Savage is angry.. we can expect high showings. I mean it makes sense, right? He disarms and throws Dooku, and pushes back and blasts Anakin and Obi Wan when he's angry, but when he's relatively calm in comparison with Maul on Florrum, he isn't doing the same to a lone Kenobi. But the other point is, it really doesn't take a great amount to make him angry.. which is why he has so many high showings. He's constantly letting loose. I will make some edits to the feats though, so everyone understands how Savage is capable of such feats.

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#23 Edited by i_like_swords (26203 posts) - - Show Bio

@shootingnova:

I suppose so. You did miss a TK showing where, with only moderate effort, Savage knocks a 20m ship over a cliff.

Oh yeeeeah, thanks. I forgot about that one. Just need to remember where it is on youtube now.. (finding certain clips can be such a massive pain).

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#24 Posted by Penderor (5561 posts) - - Show Bio

@i_like_swords: Its cool but arent you a little ingrained in these Zabraks lol ? :D

I am not saying its bad. I like them too but you know what I mean :)

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#25 Edited by i_like_swords (26203 posts) - - Show Bio
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#26 Edited by Erkan12 (8391 posts) - - Show Bio

Excellent work.

Also it should be note, Savage defeated bounty hunter Embo in h2h combat.

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Stopping Sugi's knife

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Destroying prison cell

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And this ;

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#27 Posted by i_like_swords (26203 posts) - - Show Bio

@erkan12: The prison cell and knifes ones are good. I'll use them (and credit you, of course). To be honest, those bounty hunters shouldn't have lasted as long as they did against Savage and Maul. TPM Maul has killed seven of the galaxies most notorious bounty hunters in "less time than it takes to say it". These guys shouldn't have posed even the smallest threat.

And honestly man.. Savage only did that because they weren't paying attention. If they were paying attention he wouldn't be able to do that.

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#28 Posted by i_like_swords (26203 posts) - - Show Bio

@shootingnova Apparently the prison cell Savage broke with the force was made out of Mandalorian Iron. How the hell did he manage that?! Isn't it nigh-indestructible?

They led Satine to a prison cell in her own palace, shutting her in a little room with a cot, desk, and chair, behind a door made of Mandalorian Iron.

Star Wars The Clone Wars: Darth Maul Shadow Conspiracy

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#29 Posted by Whirlwind_33 (1618 posts) - - Show Bio

Nice job

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#30 Posted by i_like_swords (26203 posts) - - Show Bio
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#31 Posted by Penderor (5561 posts) - - Show Bio

Every time i see that slaughterhouse near the Temple of Eedit I have a bad feeling about this.

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#32 Edited by Whirlwind_33 (1618 posts) - - Show Bio
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#33 Edited by Erkan12 (8391 posts) - - Show Bio
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#34 Edited by i_like_swords (26203 posts) - - Show Bio

@erkan12: You're a lifesaver man, thank you. Now that all of Savage's feats are here people can start respecting him.

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#35 Edited by ShootingNova (25691 posts) - - Show Bio
@i_like_swords said:

Fair points. And I know Savage didn't beat him through blade skill but it is the "Lightsaber and Martial Art" section, and I figure that falls under the martial category. But yeah, I'm not just gonna go around saying Savage is a better duelist than Plo, he just managed to beat him in a fight.

More like speed and opportunism :P

Wasn't his debut for TCW during "Monster". And I mean.. he is a potent villain not to be messed with.

So is Grievous, and Mace Windu is a potent hero. The official debut was technically this. You tend to have those top-tier showings, like Grievous on Hypori.

He actually did throw her about on the turtle tanker a couple times, and even during their exchange pre-transformation he threw her. So he has consistently thrown Ventress about physically. I dunno if you meant he hasn't done it consistently with TK. But the thing is he didn't use TK when he was fighting her with Dooku. If you look closely he throws her and then TK blasts Dooku right after.

Hardly to the same degree. She was sent flying clear across the room in Witches of Mist. Aboard the Turtle Tanker, she was just disarmed, and she actually managed to land a few blows and last quite an amount of time.

Right after Gallia died Obi Wan would of had a degree of force valor, which could have let him put up a fight briefly. But even then - that 2v1 exchange only lasted a few seconds before Kenobi leaped away. So I don't really see it as inconsistent when the two situations were quite different.

This is just complete speculation with the sole intent of creating a more desirable consequent. I don't recall Shadow Conspiracy stating this. While I do understand Kenobi with the two blades was circumstantial, you do have to note he was definitely not getting wrecked.

Besides, in that episode, they didn't even counterattack after Savage finished attacking. In the same episode, Anakin and Obi-Wan weren't even able to TK a platform away from each other. Regular EU Anakin and Obi-Wan would have been able to do that individually. LOL.

So because Kenobi fought with Maul and Savage for a few seconds, and then leaped away, and Kenobi fought evenly with Maul, but Maul wrecked Savage, it's inconsistent? Neh... different situations. Kenobi isn't as good in unarmed combat as Maul, which is what he used against Savage. And Kenobi has effortlessly dodged Savage's attacks before so I don't think there's a big inconsistency issue. The fact is, Savage was angry (which I'll note in the thread, for fairness sake, although he is angry like 70-80% of the time anyway), and he was able to drive back Kenobi and Anakin in a tight corridor. And this is consistent with the feat where he physically held out against both of them while performing a force choke, and then launched them physically, and the fact he's a lot bigger than both of them. He's just stronger, and is competent enough to use that strength to his advantage.

Kenobi's martial abilities were sufficient to break Savage's leg during their fight on Florrum. At this point you're more or less just detracting from the thread but you're not really proving anything. Obi-Wan and Anakin in Witches of the Mist failed to accomplish what Regular EU Anakin and Obi-Wan would have been able to.

Difference is, when he floored Dooku he was in fight-mode, and was angry, like he usually is. But when he was being dodged and disarmed him and Dooku were just sparring. Just like how Dooku was able to dodge Grievous the same way during their sparring. Fights =/= sparring. And it's not like Dooku necessarily did anything wrong when he tried to parry Savage's strike - it's just Savage at that particular moment was too strong for even someone as capable as Dooku to handle. If it happened to Dooku it means it would probably happen to a lot of people - in that particular moment.

Savage was clearly trying in the sparring match, and nothing indicates that his strength improved, except that he was bloodlusted. However, bloodlust is not a sufficient excuse to cover up the huge disparity between having his blows laughably easily slapped aside, and then laughably easily wrecking somebody. As I said, I would expect him to heavily strain Dooku, but to floor him instantly means he would be twice as strong as, say, Regular EU Anakin or Regular EU Grievous. As a showing, that would surpass even Yoda or Plagueis or even Sidious in terms of pure strength, and Sidious has repelled both Maul and Savage at once. You should begin to get the gist of this.

Well again, they were training/not fighting when he was choking him, the same way masters usually choke their apprentices. He TK'd Dooku in a fight situation where he was angry, and was letting loose. Dooku himself has stated that Savage had the potential to become very powerful. It all adds up.

No, it does not add up at all. Masters have never Choked their apprentices without being more powerful. You also failed to address that an enraged Savage with maximum effort only lifted two obelisks, when Dooku with only moderate effort lifted over a dozen.

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Suppose, but we can only chalk it up to the fact Dooku is far more refined, and Savage was even more angry in that fight situation where he was being called an "unworthy apprentice" and "weak". Savage isn't a better telekinetic but he does have a lot of raw power in his force blasts. But he maybe just isn't good at lifting things.

I don't see much of a difference. He outright stated he hated Dooku. Regarding lack of ability to lift something, that is a completely conjectural argument with the sole intent of creating a more desirable consequent. Nothing states anything of that sort, and this has just about never occurred in continuity. Raw power has its place in lifting things too.

I think the point is - when Savage is angry.. we can expect high showings. I mean it makes sense, right? He disarms and throws Dooku, and pushes back and blasts Anakin and Obi Wan when he's angry, but when he's relatively calm in comparison with Maul on Florrum, he isn't doing the same to a lone Kenobi. But the other point is, it really doesn't take a great amount to make him angry.. which is why he has so many high showings. He's constantly letting loose. I will make some edits to the feats though, so everyone understands how Savage is capable of such feats.

None of these are consistent, especially with regular EU. I repeat what I said - the intention was to make Savage appear incredibly powerful, hence the inconsistent feats. This is not the first time this has happened in SW media. Savage's feats do not conform to this level, and he has been enraged more than once in the past.

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#36 Posted by i_like_swords (26203 posts) - - Show Bio

@shootingnova: Man I really can tell we won't agree on this one.. it's not that I'm lacking an argument but if we do this back and forth it will possibly derail the thread. I say we agree to disagree for now.

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#37 Edited by ShootingNova (25691 posts) - - Show Bio

@i_like_swords: LOL. I'm just saying. The most important argument was this, honestly:

Savage was clearly trying in the sparring match, and nothing indicates that his strength improved, except that he was bloodlusted. However, bloodlust is not a sufficient excuse to cover up the huge disparity between having his blows laughably easily slapped aside, and then laughably easily wrecking somebody. As I said, I would expect him to heavily strain Dooku, but to floor him instantly means he would be twice as strong as, say, Regular EU Anakin or Regular EU Grievous. As a showing, that would surpass even Yoda or Plagueis or even Sidious in terms of pure strength, and Sidious has repelled both Maul and Savage at once. You should begin to get the gist of this.

It's just inconsistent, and it's really that simple.

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#38 Edited by i_like_swords (26203 posts) - - Show Bio
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#39 Edited by Erkan12 (8391 posts) - - Show Bio

I noticed some parts in sith hunter,

Force push on jedi master Grohto,

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And one shots padawan Tatsu (another feat for his speed) ;

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And about Obi-Wan battle,

I would say Obi-Wan can win against Savage due to his dueling skills (soresu), his balance and his wits. We should give some credit to Obi-Wan, but in their last duel there was some ''amp'' ...

Before Savage defeated Adi Gallia, she hitted Savage's left knee,

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But this was completely ineffective (for the first hit), then you know how it ended, Savage murdered her.

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In second round, Obi-Wan gets a little amp (similar to TPM since he saw another death) and using Adi Gallia's lightsaber (again similar to TPM, he used Qui-Gon's lightsaber)

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Then fight begins, though even a little amp was not enough, Obi-Wan began to use his wits, he persistently hits Savage's left knee , which is the same spot Adi Gallia hit before.

Lets see how many times Obi-Wan hitted to Savage's left knee ;

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In total 4 hit to Savage's left knee and it was still not enough, then Maul stomps Obi-Wan with force,

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Obi-Wan was losing bad,

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His last hope; once more Obi-Wan hits Savage's left knee and cuts his left arm with Adi's lightsaber ;

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I should give some credit to Obi-Wan for his wits, but still there was some ''amp'' and in the end Maul blasts Obi-Wan with the force.

Though thats why Obi-Wan is Obi-Wan, he won with the same way (using wits) against Anakin with taking the ''high ground'' ...

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#40 Posted by i_like_swords (26203 posts) - - Show Bio

@erkan12: I was going to need to scan the Tatsu fight, but the digital screenshot is even better. Thanks, I added it in.

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#41 Edited by Faymousinus (1275 posts) - - Show Bio

Nice, but did you forget this?

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#42 Posted by Erkan12 (8391 posts) - - Show Bio

New upload of mine ;

Savage solos...

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@faymousinus: No he didn't. Gif is available at the OP.

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#43 Posted by Faymousinus (1275 posts) - - Show Bio

@erkan12: Oh wow, didnt see that lol.

My bad.

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#44 Edited by Erkan12 (8391 posts) - - Show Bio
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#45 Posted by Erkan12 (8391 posts) - - Show Bio

I wrote at Kyle vs. Savage thread but it could be useful in this thread as well.

Adi's feats ;

From ; Star Wars- Omnibus - Menace Revealed

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Aurra Sing says, she is a famous jedi master.

Then knock her out with TK ;

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And this, stalemates with Grievous ;

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@i_like_swords

Do you know other feats of Adi Gallia ? I believe she was certainly considerable jedi master and defeating her was a good feat for Savage.

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#46 Posted by i_like_swords (26203 posts) - - Show Bio

@erkan12: She might have had a couple of feats in the Republic comic series. I'll have a look. Thanks though.

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#47 Edited by Erkan12 (8391 posts) - - Show Bio

More force feats ;

Hurls a death watch commando

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Force choke

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#48 Posted by Erkan12 (8391 posts) - - Show Bio

New uploaded, extended edition from blu-ray ;

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#49 Edited by Brightsteel (1165 posts) - - Show Bio

On the jail cell feat, are you sure the door/wall isn't made of transparisteel?

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#50 Posted by DarthAznable (16928 posts) - - Show Bio

I don't really see how Obi was amped tbh.