Ranking Avatar Characters in a Tier System

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silentbat

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#1  Edited By silentbat

Hey guys, currently I'm working on tiering the Avatar characters from The Last Airbender and Legend of Korra. I'll start off my own list here but this will be completely up to debate by you all. I know no one will agree on the consensus so I'll play as mediator.

Rules of Thumb:

I'm tiering based on 1 (the best) and then going down from there. The way I will differentiate each tier is as follows: Someone goes below another character by one tier if they can put up a good fight but lose a majority.

1. Same Tier

- Characters go on the same tier if we agree that a match-up between them would be 5/10 split or even as close as 6/10.

2. One Tier Difference

- Someone goes below another character by one tier if they can put up a good fight but lose a majority (this included verdicts in the 7-8/10 range.

3. Two Tier Difference

- Someone goes two spots below another character if it's virtually impossible for them to defeat the other (9/10 and 10/10 verdicts).

The most important thing here will be establishing the Tier-1 characters, as they will dictate the rest of the list.

Each character will be used as we've seen them in the television series and following comic book series.

TIER 1 (GODS & SPIRITS)

No Caption Provided
  • Avatar Aang (Avater-State)
  • Avatar Korra (Avatar-State)
  • Avatar Roku (Avatar-State)
  • Avatar Kyoshi (Avatar-State)
  • Avatar Kuruk (Avatar-State)
  • Avatar Yangchen (Avatar-State)
  • Avatar Wan (Avatar-State)
  • Unavaatu (Dark Avatar-State)
  • Hundun
  • Cosmic Energy Korra

TIER 2 (SUB-GOD)

No Caption Provided
  • Vaatu
  • Raava
  • Old Iron
  • Dark Spirits
  • Koh, the Face Stealer
  • Hei Bai
  • The Colossus

TIER 3 (BLOOD-BENDERS)

No Caption Provided
  • Amon
  • Yakone
  • Tarrlok
  • Hama (she would not defeat Katara or the rest above, but anyone else is auto-win)

TIER 4 (AVATAR)

No Caption Provided
  • Aang
  • Korra
  • Wan
  • Roku
  • King Bumi

TIER 5 (GRANDMASTERS)

No Caption Provided
  • Unalaq
  • Iroh
  • Tenzin
  • Zaheer (flight)
  • Pakku
  • Jeong Jeong
  • Ozai

TIER 7 (HIGH TIER)

No Caption Provided
  • Toph
  • Katara
  • Hama (debatable, against non-bloodbenders she auto-wins)
  • Huu
  • Zhu Li (mecha tank)
  • Azula
  • Ming Hua
  • Ghazan
  • Kuvira
  • Zuko
  • Piandao
  • Lin
  • Suyin
  • P'Li
  • Zaheer (pre-flight)
  • Combustion Man

TIER 8 (MID TIER)

No Caption Provided
  • Mako
  • Bolin
  • Tonraq
  • Kya
  • Eska and Desna
  • Dai Li Agent
  • Ty Lee
  • The Lieutenant
  • Asami
  • Mai
  • Suki
  • Iroh II
  • Tarrlok (sans blood-bending)
  • Jet
  • Zhao

TIER 9 (LOW TIER)

No Caption Provided
  • Earth Empire Soldier
  • Chi Blocker
  • Yuyan Archers
  • Bumi (airbender)
  • Jinora
  • Kai
  • Meelo
  • Opal
  • Xin Fu
  • The Boulder (and his gang)

TIER 10 (FOODER)

No Caption Provided
  • Air Nomads
  • Ikki
  • Earth Kingdom Trooper
  • Fire Nation Trooper
  • Kei Lo
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anthp2000

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#3  Edited By anthp2000  Moderator

There are many things wrong with this list like with all tier lists of course (it's highily subjective) but for now, I'll just post my own thoughts on who the strongest benders are, bar bloodbending and 4 elements or featless people. Keep in mind that the list below is on a neutral environment with enough water, metal, earth etc.

1. Aang (airbending)

2. King Bumi

3. Tenzin

4, 5, 6. Azula / Toph / Katara

7. Ming Hua

8. Lin Beifong

9. Suyin Beifong

10. Kuvira

11. Unalaq

12. Korra (water)

13. P'Li

14. Zuko

15. Ghazan

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silentbat

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@anthp2000: That's more of a ranking, less tiering.

Also ... Kuvira below Suyin? And Suyin below Lin? That's definitely some interesting ranking there, especially when Kuvira seemed decisively above Suyin in Book 4 (same with Suyin > Lin, also in book 4). That said, I would put Suyin at least one tier below Kuvira. And I would put Kuvira and Suyin either in the same tier or Kuvira just above.

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anthp2000

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#5  Edited By anthp2000  Moderator

@SilentBat: Yeah, but they're the high tiers for me (though they are spread on different levels on my head).

I have a fight analysis on Suyin vs Kuvira on my blog. Check it out.

I'll elaborate more in a few hours. Along with some others things for your tier list.

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juiceboks

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#6 juiceboks  Moderator

You're going to have to explain why you have two of the most powerful spirits in existence that are also responsible for giving the Avatar access to their most powerful forms, in the same tier as Amon.

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anthp2000

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#7  Edited By anthp2000  Moderator

@SilentBat: Alright, here is how I'd put the characters on a tier list. The (*) means the characters are dead even with each other. I'm not gonna include characters that are featless or borderline featless.

Tier 1 - God Tier (spirits, avatar state, basically all the hax in the series)

  • (1)*AS Aang (leveled the entire city BSS, destroyed SC Ozai without trying, spiritbending, flight)
  • (1)*AS Kyoshi (split an island in half and threw it away)
  • (2)*Cosmic Energy Korra (faught Unavaatu to a stalemate)
  • (2)*Unavaatu (destroyed Republic City and faught CK to a stalemate)
  • General Old Iron (faught AS Aang to a stalemate)
  • AS Yangchen (faught General Old Iron for days nonstop)
  • AS Roku (faught a volcano)
  • AS Korra (spiritbending, flight, immense power and speed)
  • DAS Unalaq (matched AS Korra)
  • Raava (defeated Vaatu, regeneration)
  • Vaatu (held his own against Raava, regeneration)

Tier 2 - Bloodbenders (nothing to say here, too much hax)

  • *Yakone (bloodbent an entire courhouse with his eyeballs)
  • *Amon (uses bloodbending to take away bending, resisted Tarrlok's bloodbending, top notch speed and durability)
  • Tarrlok (just like the others, can bloodbend many people during the day)
  • Full Moon Katara (defeated Hama)
  • Full Moon Hama (bloodbender, great waterbender)

Tier 3 - Unbeatable Masters (basically the 2 strongest benders in existence by far and comet amped firebenders)

  • Sozin's Comet Azula (instant lightning, flight, broken raw power, only second to Aang combat speed-wise, lightning redirection)
  • Sozin's Comet Ozai (flight, broken raw power, huge lightningbolts)
  • Avatar Aang (4 elements) (same as Air Aang but more versatality and battlefield control)
  • Aang (air) (super speed, huge raw power, great versatality)
  • King Bumi (broken raw power, huge versatality, top notch speed)
  • Sozin's Comet Zuko (broken raw power adn AoE, decent mobility, top notch speed)

Tier 4 - Top class Masters (these are some of the most powerful benders we've seen, each one with their own style and specialty)

  • Tenzin (top notch raw power, top notch mobility with giant airspouts, great agility and balance, good versatality)
  • *Katara (most versatile bender period, huge raw power, immense mobility with icebending)
  • *Toph (huge raw power - basically scale of building+ level with a gesture not restricted by the environment, huge versatality and battlefield control)
  • *Azula (top notch raw power, single fastest and most powerful attack in the bending world with 2 gestures - lightning, best CQC in the series, second fastest character, insane balance and agility, huge destructive output)
  • Ming Hua (top notch power - absurd feats like drilling underground, one of the fastest characters in the series, only second to Aang in agility, psychic bending, can one shot anyone with a flash freeze water arm, nigh-unbeatable octopus form)

Tier 5 - Fast and Furious Masters (metalbenders with their insanely good potential combos / one wrong move, one single opening and it's over against them, 2 of the best waterbenders in the series with good mobility, huge raw power and good versatality, Avatar Korra, one of the most, if not the most well rounded bender in the series)

  • *Lin Beifong (huge raw metalbending power, ton notch speed, great agility and balance, insane precision, versatality and dangerous volume with cables, great battlefield control)
  • *Suyin Beifong (huge raw metalbending power, one of the fastest characters in the series, isnane agility, huge fire rate with metal strips, insane projectile versatality with cables, metal blades and metal sheets, great battlefield control)
  • Kuvira (top notch metalbending power, one of the fastect characters in the series, insane fire rate and good versatality with cables and metal strips, great battlefield control)
  • Avatar Korra (4 elements) (huge raw power, broken scale with waterbending, huge mobility with air spouts, great versatality, great AoE, great battlefield control)
  • Unalaq (good mobility with water spouts, top notch raw power, great versatality)
  • Korra (water) (same as 4 elements Korra with less options for defence, battlefield control and mobility)

Tier 6 - Top Notch but not Top Enough (benders with great raw power, good speed and mobility, good versatality etc. but not enough to match the rest above, the 4 best non-benders in the series on paper with insanely good skills, speed, agility and the ability to one shot anyone they touch in their own ways)

  • P'Li (huge destructive output, good agility, kept up with slower versions of Lin, Su and the Metal Clan, top notch fire negation)
  • Zuko (top notch raw power, top notch speed, versatile enough to keep up, second best CQC in the series with swords)
  • Ghazan (good mobility with earthbending as well as natural agility, great combat/travel/movement speed, good battlefield control, top notch raw power)
  • Desna & Eska (top notch raw power, top notch speed, good versatality, insane fire rate)
  • Korra (air) (huge mobility with air spouts, huge raw power and AoE, good versatality)
  • Huu (insane durability, regeneration, good speed and good battlefield control)
  • Aang (earth) (good raw power, great versatality and battlefield control)
  • *Ty Lee (second only to Aang and Ming Hua in agility, best h2h in the series with chi blocking, Kyoshi Gear to block what she can't dodge)
  • *Mai (one of the best marksmen in street level, above arrow speed projectile that pressure the fastest, has pinpointed unpredictable and tiny small targets, good agility and speed)
  • Suki (a weaker version of Ty Lee with a tad less chi blocking and agility, still has a good reach advantage with fans, Kyoshi Gear, trained since she was 8 years old to become a KW)
  • Master Piandao (best swordsman in history who took on 100 firebenders in 1 battle and won, very good speed, taught Zuko how to use the broadswords)
  • Jet (matched Zuko in swordsmanship, top notch speed keeping up with Aang, great agility)
  • Bolin (top notch raw power, decent speed, great battlefield control)

Tier 7 - Skilled Benders, Good Nonbenders (decent bending abilities, some good power or mobility there and there and non-bending skillz)

  • *Zaheer (flight, good raw power, good versatality)
  • *Korra (fire) (good raw power, great agility, top notch speed, one of the best h2h in the series)
  • Mako (good raw power, lethal instant lgihtning, decent speed and great agility)
  • Combustion Man (huge destrcutive power)
  • Kya (great raw power, great versatality, good speed and agility)
  • Hama (great raw power, great versatality, decent speed - can keep up)
  • Lieutenant (top notch speed, great agility, one of the best CQC in the series with reach advantage using Kai Sticks)
  • Tonraq (decent raw power, good versatality, good agility and speed)
  • Asami (great martial skill, good agility and speed, electrifying glove)

.... Anyone else you might think about adding here.

Feel free to ask me about anything of those and anyone feel free to debate me.

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anthp2000

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#8  Edited By anthp2000  Moderator

And I have Asami above Tonraq and below the Lt.

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deactivated-597fe3e7af56f

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And I have Asami above Tonraq and below the Lt.

Asami actually stomped the LT when they fought (literally took him down in 2 moves). Tonraq should be above her in move environments, because he's significantly more versatile.

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deactivated-597fe3e7af56f

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I'm just going to copy and paste what I wrote in a different thread, with some minor adjustments:

All of these tiers are in no particular order, unless otherwise specified.

God Tier:

Cosmic Energy Korra

Unavaatu

Avatar State

Dark Avatar State

Hundun

Demigod Tier:

Vaatu

Raava

Old Iron

High-end fodder dark spirits (like the one that wrecked team avatar)

Koh the Face Stealer

Hei Bai

The Colossus

Hax Bloodbender tier:

Amon

Tarrlok

Yakone

Avatar Tier

King Bumi

Roku

Korra

Aang

Grandmaster Tier:

Wan

Unalaq

P'li

Katara

Tenzin

Void Zaheer

Combustion Man

JJ/Iroh/Ozai/Sozin (by hype)

High Tier:

Toph

Huu (with swamp and prep)

Azula

Ming Hua

Ghazan

Kuvira

Bolin (low end of the tier)

Zuko

Zaheer

Pakku

Lin

Suyin

Mecha Tank Zhu Li

Mid Tier:

Mako (high end of the tier)

Tonraq (higher in the North Pole)

Kya

Eska and Desna (higher in the North Pole)

Composite Dai Li agents

Ty Lee (lower end)

The Lieutenant (lower end)

Asami (lower end)

Mai (lower end)

Suki (lower end)

Hama (lower end)

Iroh II

Amon (limited, lower end)

Tarrlok (no bloodbending)

Jet (lower end)

Low Tier:

Zhao

EE Soldiers

Fodder Chi Blockers

Yuyan Archers

Bumi

Jinora

Kai

Meelo

Opal

Xin Fu

The Boulder

Fodder Tier:

Ikki

Fodder Air Nomads

EK Troops

FN Troops

Kei Lo

NOS Members

Also, one last thing to note, a fight is not determined by a character's tier. They're ranked by how they'd do against the verse as a whole, so versatility is a large part of it. It is completely possible for a lower tier character to beat a higher tier character (for example, Kuvira would beat P'li or CM if they started inside of about forty feet).

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Tektonic

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@mial42 said:

I'm just going to copy and paste what I wrote in a different thread, with some minor adjustments:

All of these tiers are in no particular order, unless otherwise specified.

God Tier:

Cosmic Energy Korra

Unavaatu

Avatar State

Dark Avatar State

Hundun

Demigod Tier:

Vaatu

Raava

Old Iron

High-end fodder dark spirits (like the one that wrecked team avatar)

Koh the Face Stealer

Hei Bai

The Colossus

Hax Bloodbender tier:

Amon

Tarrlok

Yakone

Avatar Tier

King Bumi

Roku

Korra

Aang

Grandmaster Tier:

Wan

Unalaq

P'li

Katara

Tenzin

Void Zaheer

Combustion Man

JJ/Iroh/Ozai/Sozin (by hype)

High Tier:

Toph

Huu (with swamp and prep)

Azula

Ming Hua

Ghazan

Kuvira

Bolin (low end of the tier)

Zuko

Zaheer

Pakku

Lin

Suyin

Mecha Tank Zhu Li

Mid Tier:

Mako (high end of the tier)

Tonraq (higher in the North Pole)

Kya

Eska and Desna (higher in the North Pole)

Composite Dai Li agents

Ty Lee (lower end)

The Lieutenant (lower end)

Asami (lower end)

Mai (lower end)

Suki (lower end)

Hama (lower end)

Iroh II

Amon (limited, lower end)

Tarrlok (no bloodbending)

Jet (lower end)

Low Tier:

Zhao

EE Soldiers

Fodder Chi Blockers

Yuyan Archers

Bumi

Jinora

Kai

Meelo

Opal

Xin Fu

The Boulder

Fodder Tier:

Ikki

Fodder Air Nomads

EK Troops

FN Troops

Kei Lo

NOS Members

Also, one last thing to note, a fight is not determined by a character's tier. They're ranked by how they'd do against the verse as a whole, so versatility is a large part of it. It is completely possible for a lower tier character to beat a higher tier character (for example, Kuvira would beat P'li or CM if they started inside of about forty feet).

Basically this.

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anthp2000

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#12  Edited By anthp2000  Moderator

@mial42: Yes but I always found that questionable. I'm pretty sure it was just because she caught him off-gaurd, even though he attacked her. She betrayed them and all. I'm still not quite sure though.

I don't see Tonraq dealing well with Asami at all. Any move he uses from ice ramps to water arms is bad story due to her electric glove and she is faster than him.

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deactivated-597fe3e7af56f

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@anthp2000:

I mean, that is Asami's only real feat against a named fighter, so it's hard to rank her exactly, but I think taking down the Liuetenant easily was meant to be a signal that she was very good. She's also got another nice H2H feat:

No Caption Provided

Taking down 6 fodder chi-blockers in quick succession - the reason it's better than most fodder feats is that all of these ch-blockers have at least a minimum level of H2H skill (or else they couldn't be chi-blockers).

As for Asami vs Tonraq, her electricity is close range, all Tonraq has to do is stay away with ice ramps and hit her with water or ice blasts. Asami's not as good against benders as she is against nonbenders, because she's not incredibly agile (she's still very agile, but not to the same degree as someone like Ty Lee) and lacks ranged attacks.

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anthp2000

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#14 anthp2000  Moderator

@mial42: I gotta review Asami's feats. She sprobably better than I thought after checking out some gifs and videos.

Tonraq can't use ice ramps outside the water. He gets electrified.

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deactivated-597fe3e7af56f

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@anthp2000:

He can use ice ramps on the water though, and ice ramps don't conduct electricity.

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anthp2000

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#16 anthp2000  Moderator

@mial42: I was going to bring it on our CaV but ice is a conductor of electricity, it's just not as good as water because the ions are not as mobile inside.

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deactivated-597fe3e7af56f

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@anthp2000:

Ice is a very poor conductor compared to water, both because it's pure H2O and because of the different arrangement of ions. There's no reason to believe that the glove is powerful enough to electrocute someone through feet of ice.

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Jonez_

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@anthp2000: yeah Korea should be higher. Some of the feats she pulled off at the EOS without Avatar State were absolutely insane.

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#19  Edited By anthp2000  Moderator

@jonez_: I agree they're insane. Just not as much as the others above her fighting to their fullest.

@mial42: The glove could KO Lin and Tenzin for several minutes. I'd say it can.

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#20  Edited By katrurius17
@SilentBat said:

Hey guys, currently I'm working on tiering the Avatar characters from The Last Airbender and Legend of Korra. I'll start off my own list here but this will be completely up to debate by you all. I know no one will agree on the consensus so I'll play as mediator.

Rules of Thumb:

I'm tiering based on 1 (the best) and then going down from there. The way I will differentiate each tier is as follows: Someone goes below another character by one tier if they can put up a good fight but lose a majority.

1. Same Tier

- Characters go on the same tier if we agree that a match-up between them would be 5/10 split or even as close as 6/10.

2. One Tier Difference

- Someone goes below another character by one tier if they can put up a good fight but lose a majority (this included verdicts in the 7-8/10 range.

3. Two Tier Difference

- Someone goes two spots below another character if it's virtually impossible for them to defeat the other (9/10 and 10/10 verdicts).

The most important thing here will be establishing the Tier-1 characters, as they will dictate the rest of the list.

Each character will be used as we've seen them in the television series (comic book feats apply where they align with the shows).

TIER 1 (GODS & SPIRITS)

No Caption Provided
  • Avatar Aang (Avater-State)
  • Avatar Korra (Avatar-State)
  • Avatar Roku (Avatar-State)
  • Avatar Kyoshi (Avatar-State)
  • Avatar Kuruk (Avatar-State)
  • Avatar Yangchen (Avatar-State)
  • Avatar Wan (Avatar-State)
  • Unavaatu (Dark Avatar-State)
  • Hundun
  • Cosmic Energy Korra

TIER 2 (SUB-GOD)

  • Vaatu
  • Raava
  • Old Iron
  • Dark Spirits
  • Koh, the Face Stealer
  • Hei Bai
  • The Colossus

TIER 3 (BLOOD-BENDERS)

  • Amon
  • Yakone
  • Tarrlok
  • Hama (she would not defeat Katara or the rest above, but anyone else is auto-win)

TIER 4 (AVATAR)

  • Aang Too high
  • Korra Too high
  • Wan
  • Roku
  • King Bumi

TIER 5 (GRANDMASTERS)

  • Unalaq
  • Iroh
  • P'Li Too high
  • Tenzin
  • Zaheer (flight) Too high
  • Pakku ?
  • Combustion Man Too high
  • Piandao Too high
  • Jeong Jeong Questionable
  • Ozai

TIER 7 (HIGH TIER)

  • Toph
  • Katara
  • Hama (debatable, against non-bloodbenders she auto-wins)
  • Huu
  • Zhu Li (mecha tank) Questionable
  • Azula
  • Ming Hua
  • Ghazan
  • Kuvira
  • Bolin Questionable
  • Zuko
  • Zaheer ?
  • Pakku ?
  • Lin
  • Suyin
  • Zaheer (pre-flight) ?

TIER 8 (MID TIER)

  • Mako
  • Tonraq
  • Kya
  • Eska and Desna
  • Dai Li Agent
  • Ty Lee
  • The Lieutenant
  • Asami
  • Mai
  • Suki
  • Iroh II
  • Tarrlok (sans blood-bending)
  • Jet
  • Zhao Too high

TIER 9 (LOW TIER)

  • Earth Empire Soldier
  • Chi Blocker
  • Yuyan Archers
  • Bumi (airbender)
  • Jinora
  • Kai
  • Meelo
  • Opal
  • Xin Fu
  • The Boulder (and his gang)

TIER 10 (FOODER)

  • Air Nomads
  • Ikki
  • Earth Kingdom Trooper
  • Fire Nation Trooper
  • Kei Lo

The Grandmasters bracket is way too big, and you listed some of the characters more than once.

Besides that not too bad, but why no (later)comic versions and what is with amps?

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@anthp2000:

Through direct contact. Through several feet of an extremely poor conductor? I highly doubt it.

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@mial42 said:

I'm just going to copy and paste what I wrote in a different thread, with some minor adjustments:

All of these tiers are in no particular order, unless otherwise specified.

God Tier:

Cosmic Energy Korra

Unavaatu

Avatar State

Dark Avatar State

Hundun

Demigod Tier:

Vaatu

Raava

Old Iron

High-end fodder dark spirits (like the one that wrecked team avatar)

Koh the Face Stealer

Hei Bai

The Colossus

Hax Bloodbender tier:

Amon

Tarrlok

Yakone

Avatar Tier

King Bumi

Roku

Korra Questionable(but at least much more likely than with his explanation)

Aang Questionable(but at least much more likely than with his explanation)

Grandmaster Tier:

Wan

Unalaq

P'li Too high

Katara Too high(except bloodbending, but then too low)

Tenzin

Void Zaheer Too high

Combustion Man Too high

JJ/Iroh/Ozai/Sozin (by hype)

High Tier:

Toph

Huu (with swamp and prep)

Azula

Ming Hua

Ghazan

Kuvira

Bolin (low end of the tier)

Zuko

Zaheer

Pakku

Lin

Suyin

Mecha Tank Zhu Li

Mid Tier:

Mako (high end of the tier)

Tonraq (higher in the North Pole)

Kya

Eska and Desna (higher in the North Pole)

Composite Dai Li agents

Ty Lee (lower end)

The Lieutenant (lower end)

Asami (lower end)

Mai (lower end)

Suki (lower end)

Hama (lower end)

Iroh II

Amon (limited, lower end)

Tarrlok (no bloodbending)

Jet (lower end)

Low Tier:

Zhao

EE Soldiers

Fodder Chi Blockers

Yuyan Archers

Bumi

Jinora

Kai

Meelo

Opal

Xin Fu

The Boulder

Fodder Tier:

Ikki

Fodder Air Nomads

EK Troops

FN Troops

Kei Lo

NOS Members

Also, one last thing to note, a fight is not determined by a character's tier. They're ranked by how they'd do against the verse as a whole, so versatility is a large part of it. It is completely possible for a lower tier character to beat a higher tier character (for example, Kuvira would beat P'li or CM if they started inside of about forty feet).

Same problem with the way too big Grandmaster tier, but your explanation at the end is far better than his(much less DBZ style) and you don't listed anyone more than once.

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katrurius17

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#23  Edited By katrurius17

@mial42 said:

I'm just going to copy and paste what I wrote in a different thread, with some minor adjustments:

All of these tiers are in no particular order, unless otherwise specified.

God Tier:

Cosmic Energy Korra

Unavaatu

Avatar State

Dark Avatar State

Hundun

Demigod Tier:

Vaatu

Raava

Old Iron

High-end fodder dark spirits (like the one that wrecked team avatar)

Koh the Face Stealer

Hei Bai

The Colossus

Hax Bloodbender tier:

Amon

Tarrlok

Yakone

Avatar Tier

King Bumi

Roku

Korra Questionable(but at least much more likely than with his explanation)

Aang Questionable(but at least much more likely than with his explanation)

Grandmaster Tier:

Wan

Unalaq

P'li Too high

Katara Too high(except bloodbending, but then too low)

Tenzin

Void Zaheer Too high

Combustion Man Too high

JJ/Iroh/Ozai/Sozin (by hype)

High Tier:

Toph

Huu (with swamp and prep)

Azula

Ming Hua

Ghazan

Kuvira

Bolin (low end of the tier)

Zuko

Zaheer

Pakku

Lin

Suyin

Mecha Tank Zhu Li

Mid Tier:

Mako (high end of the tier)

Tonraq (higher in the North Pole)

Kya

Eska and Desna (higher in the North Pole)

Composite Dai Li agents

Ty Lee (lower end)

The Lieutenant (lower end)

Asami (lower end)

Mai (lower end)

Suki (lower end)

Hama (lower end)

Iroh II

Amon (limited, lower end)

Tarrlok (no bloodbending)

Jet (lower end)

Low Tier:

Zhao

EE Soldiers

Fodder Chi Blockers

Yuyan Archers

Bumi

Jinora

Kai

Meelo

Opal

Xin Fu

The Boulder

Fodder Tier:

Ikki

Fodder Air Nomads

EK Troops

FN Troops

Kei Lo

NOS Members

Also, one last thing to note, a fight is not determined by a character's tier. They're ranked by how they'd do against the verse as a whole, so versatility is a large part of it. It is completely possible for a lower tier character to beat a higher tier character (for example, Kuvira would beat P'li or CM if they started inside of about forty feet).

Same problem with the way too big Grandmaster bracket(to a lesser extend, but with a completely unfitting Katara), but your explanation at the end is far better than his(much less DBZ style) and you don't listed anyone more than once.

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anthp2000

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#24  Edited By anthp2000  Moderator

@mial42: It's not an EXTREMELY poor conductor. You're reaching.

Besides, Asami is agile enough to catch him imo. And she should be faster considering she took down the Lt. so easily.

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anthp2000

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#25  Edited By anthp2000  Moderator

Hmm, I forgot about Wan. On my list, I'd put him right above the 4 non-benders.

And DOBS Dai Li agents would be right under them.

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deactivated-597fe3e7af56f

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@katrurius17:

The main reason I have Katara so high is because of her versatility. She doesn't really have any notable weaknesses, and she's solid in practically any environment with water. She's also got some of the best environmental awareness and tactical skills in the verse, allowing her to fully abuse moves like plantbending or vapor-bending in a fight.

For Void Zaheer, the reason he's so high is that he's nearly impossible to hit unless you have spammable long range AOE (which is rare in the avatarverse), and he has great range himself, allowing him to snipe people with AOE outside of their effective range.

P'li and CM are so high mainly because of their offense (obviously). If you don't take them out as soon as the fight starts, they can get momentum and obliterate practically anyone. P'li also has her top-tier fire negation, which is very helpful against firebenders. Honestly though, I'd probably move them to high tier upon rethinking it, because they lack the versatility to deal with nearly any (fair) situation that the other people on their tier have (basically, in moderately favorable conditions, they can take pretty much anyone, but in unfavorable conditions they're much lower).

As for Aang and Korra, they're so high because of their versatility and power. Korra has complete battlefield control with water + earthbending, excellent offense with all of her elements bar earthbending, very good defenses in general, very good mobility, and she's near the top of the verse in every physical stat. Aang is ludicrously fast, agile, mobile, powerful, and versatile with just airbending (it helps that airbending is a good counter for both fire and earthbending), and his earthbending offers him partial battlefield control. His lightning redirection allows him to deal with the one element airbending isn't well suited for blocking. Both of them also get another perk of having all four elements - they can deal with their opponent's offense with one element (for example, if Aang was fighting King Bumi, he could use his incredible boulder negation to deal with King Bumi's attacks) while attacking with another element that's harder for their opponent to deal with (for example, King Bumi would need to block all of Aang's airblasts, which is harder than just negating them (since instead of a gesture, you need a gesture and time for the shield to appear)).

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katrurius17

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@mial42:

The main reason I have Katara so high is because of her versatility. She doesn't really have any notable weaknesses, and she's solid in practically any environment with water. She's also got some of the best environmental awareness and tactical skills in the verse, allowing her to fully abuse moves like plantbending or vapor-bending in a fight.

But that is a very big weakness, she is too dependened on the surroundings and even her specific location in the area(obviously the reason for her environmental awareness, she absolutely needs that ability). So her position would just make sense in a favourable setting, which not rly fits your explanation imo.

For Void Zaheer, the reason he's so high is that he's nearly impossible to hit unless you have spammable long range AOE (which is rare in the avatarverse), and he has great range himself, allowing him to snipe people with AOE outside of their effective range.

Sure he is hard too hit, but that should not put him on the position of a Grandmaster(a true Grandmaster shouldn't have the slightest problems with him, and there are too many high-tiers who could beat him).

P'li and CM are so high mainly because of their offense (obviously). If you don't take them out as soon as the fight starts, they can get momentum and obliterate practically anyone. P'li also has her top-tier fire negation, which is very helpful against firebenders. Honestly though, I'd probably move them to high tier upon rethinking it, because they lack the versatility to deal with nearly any (fair) situation that the other people on their tier have (basically, in moderately favorable conditions, they can take pretty much anyone, but in unfavorable conditions they're much lower).

I actually 100% agree with that :D, but that was also my problem.

As for Aang and Korra, they're so high because of their versatility and power. Korra has complete battlefield control with water + earthbending, excellent offense with all of her elements bar earthbending, very good defenses in general, very good mobility, and she's near the top of the verse in every physical stat. Aang is ludicrously fast, agile, mobile, powerful, and versatile with just airbending (it helps that airbending is a good counter for both fire and earthbending), and his earthbending offers him partial battlefield control. His lightning redirection allows him to deal with the one element airbending isn't well suited for blocking. Both of them also get another perk of having all four elements - they can deal with their opponent's offense with one element (for example, if Aang was fighting King Bumi, he could use his incredible boulder negation to deal with King Bumi's attacks) while attacking with another element that's harder for their opponent to deal with (for example, King Bumi would need to block all of Aang's airblasts, which is harder than just negating them (since instead of a gesture, you need a gesture and time for the shield to appear)).

That explanation is actually pretty good, but i have still my doubts with them above Gandmaster tier.

There are people in the high tier who can get dangerous for them in too many situations, and they also completely lack the experience of the imo real Grandmasters.

Although i have actually a general problem with this whole tier, cause i would also put Bumi more on the upper-end of the Grandmaster-tier.

Your different system neutralizised it to a good degree, but 2 tiers screams almost you're untouchable for thebother one. That's of course much more important for his system, but it still feels completely wrong in comparison to high tiers(neither of the 3 is rly untouchable for many of them, excluding Roku cause he could be actually).

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anthp2000

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#28 anthp2000  Moderator

Also I challenge anyone here for proof that Koh the Face Stealer can beat Mai :p

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deactivated-597fe3e7af56f

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@katrurius17:

But that is a very big weakness, she is too dependened on the surroundings and even her specific location in the area(obviously the reason for her environmental awareness, she absolutely needs that ability). So her position would just make sense in a favourable setting, which not rly fits your explanation imo.

This is of course assuming that the location is at least fair (say, Misty Palms Oasis in terms of water), or a forest without obvious water. Obviously if there's no water she'd get bodied. She had Azula on the ropes using only a small amount of water (she had a lot more available, but didn't use it), so she can be effective with relatively small amounts of water. Furthermore, thanks to her training from Hama there are a lot more favorable locations for her than for other waterbenders.

Sure he is hard too hit, but that should not put him on the position of a Grandmaster(a true Grandmaster shouldn't have the slightest problems with him, and there are too many high-tiers who could beat him).

There is not a single character in the verse (with the possible exceptions of Avatar Wan and Comet Ozai, due to their comparable mobility and insane durability) who could beat Void Zaheer easily. As for high tiers that could beat him, there are some, but none I could see doing it for a majority (except Mecha-Tank Zhu Li, because he literally can't even hurt her and she has the range to tag him eventually).

That explanation is actually pretty good, but i have still my doubts with them above Gandmaster tier.

Again, the main reason they're above Grandmaster Tier is because of their versatility. Neither of them has a bad matchup, and they're both highly effective in almost any setting.

There are people in the high tier who can get dangerous for them in too many situations, and they also completely lack the experience of the imo real Grandmasters.

I can't see any high-tier character giving Aang, Korra, or Bumi more than a mid-dif fight if they're serious and in a neutral location.

Although i have actually a general problem with this whole tier, cause i would also put Bumi more on the upper-end of the Grandmaster-tier.

The thing about Bumi is that very few characters can deal with even one of his attacks, he's fast enough to smack around a serious Aang, he's got loads of environmental attacks, he's got digging moves for surprise attacks, and incredible mobility. I can't see any Grandmaster Tier character beating him, although Void Zaheer could stalemate him and Wan or Unalaq could both give him issues.

Your different system neutralizised it to a good degree, but 2 tiers screams almost you're untouchable for thebother one. That's of course much more important for his system, but it still feels completely wrong in comparison to high tiers(neither of the 3 is rly untouchable for many of them, excluding Roku cause he could be actually).

They're not untouchable, far from it. The higher grandmasters like Wan and Unalaq are both perfectly capable of giving high-extreme dif fights to Avatar-tier characters. It's just that they have bad matchups (for example, lightning users take away Unalaq's water spout, and P'li's combo of fire negation and long ranged spammable AOE offense allow her to body Wan under most conditions) or other things that make them lower relative to the verse as a whole, whereas neither Aang or Korra really has a bad matchup (since they're far more versatile than Wan or Unalaq).

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katrurius17

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#30  Edited By katrurius17

@mial42:

This is of course assuming that the location is at least fair (say, Misty Palms Oasis in terms of water), or a forest without obvious water. Obviously if there's no water she'd get bodied. She had Azula on the ropes using only a small amount of water (she had a lot more available, but didn't use it), so she can be effective with relatively small amounts of water. Furthermore, thanks to her training from Hama there are a lot more favorable locations for her than for other waterbenders.

But i understood you're explanation as a more realistic approach, and assuming a "fair" setting is very unrealistic.

I would count that fight as a solid showin of Katara, but Azula's performance was ultra inconsistent and it made zero sense that she had her on the ropes there at all(especially cause of the tiny amount she used, that was actually completely absurd). The spalsh which hit Azula for example shouldn't work against any high-tier(obviously including Azula), and even the better if not all mid-tiers should be able to deal with that. The water arms are more dangerous, but Azula completely ignored several openings in that scene(and at least no high-tier should do that usually).

And my biggest problem is the exact location weakness, Katara is limited to stay close to the water source(which would be a heavy weakness in a real fight) for any better technique.

There is not a single character in the verse (with the possible exceptions of Avatar Wan and Comet Ozai, due to their comparable mobility and insane durability) who could beat Void Zaheer easily. As for high tiers that could beat him, there are some, but none I could see doing it for a majority (except Mecha-Tank Zhu Li, because he literally can't even hurt her and she has the range to tag him eventually).

I didn't talked about beating him easily, but all the (imo true)Grandmasters should be pretty clearly above him. And i see Katara(she is 100% high tier for me), Ming Hua, Azula, Zhu Li and maybe Kuvira beating him for the majority, at least in a neutral setting. Zuko, Lin and Suyin maybe in a for them favourable setting. Just being hard to tag don't win fights, and he is not on the lvl of the most other high tiers in the most other regards. So in a neutral setting is it just a question if they can tag him, and the better high tiers should be able to force possible openings.

Again, the main reason they're above Grandmaster Tier is because of their versatility. Neither of them has a bad matchup, and they're both highly effective in almost any setting.

I still don't see them as that all around effective, and Aang + Korra are still too inexperienced and make too many mistakes.

I can't see any high-tier character giving Aang, Korra, or Bumi more than a mid-dif fight if they're serious and in a neutral location.

Hell no Bolin maybe, but most of the better high tiers(Katara, Azula, P'Li and a few others) are clearly able to give at the very least high diff fights and Grandmasters even at the very least very high to extreme high diff fights(which is the reason why i would put them together). And in for them unfavourable situations even worse.

The thing about Bumi is that very few characters can deal with even one of his attacks, he's fast enough to smack around a serious Aang, he's got loads of environmental attacks, he's got digging moves for surprise attacks, and incredible mobility. I can't see any Grandmaster Tier character beating him, although Void Zaheer could stalemate him and Wan or Unalaq could both give him issues.

That's why i would put him at the upper end, but i absolutely don't see Void Zaheer stalemating him.

Earth is not the best element against Zaheer, but King Bumi is much better in virtually everything possible(just flying shouldn't be enough to close this very big gap, not even in a favourable setting).

They're not untouchable, far from it. The higher grandmasters like Wan and Unalaq are both perfectly capable of giving high-extreme dif fights to Avatar-tier characters. It's just that they have bad matchups (for example, lightning users take away Unalaq's water spout, and P'li's combo of fire negation and long ranged spammable AOE offense allow her to body Wan under most conditions) or other things that make them lower relative to the verse as a whole, whereas neither Aang or Korra really has a bad matchup (since they're far more versatile than Wan or Unalaq).

But just not having a rly bad match up shouldn't be enough for an own tier, the Grandmasters and even high tiers are much too close to them for that.

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OP updated. I'll start marking characters that are questioned to be lowered or raised.

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Shouldn't Toph be wherever Bumi is? I recall them stalemating.

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deactivated-597fe3e7af56f

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@kj27:

Toph is uniquely suited for fighting earthbenders because of her seismic sense. Again any non-earthbender however, Bumi is (much) better.

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@mial42 said:

@kj27:

Toph is uniquely suited for fighting earthbenders because of her seismic sense. Again any non-earthbender however, Bumi is (much) better.

Pretty much, but its still a feat within itself for her to fare so well. Now that I think about it, is there any bender like toph that fits a similar mold?(being well suited to fight anyone of their specific element?)

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deactivated-597fe3e7af56f

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@deathhero61:

Zuko or P'li come to mind for firebending.

Ghazan is the obvious choice for earthbending, along with Bolin.

For water and air, no one is really much more effective against their own element then others.

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thebuckaronatr

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#36  Edited By thebuckaronatr

@mial42:

Zuko or P'li come to mind for firebending.

I can maybe halfway understand P'Li, but Zuko???

The only time i remember where he was especially effective against fire was in his fight with Crazula, but that was more like a sane focused person is very effective against an insane unfocused person.

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deactivated-597fe3e7af56f

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@thebuckaronatr:

Zuko has good fire negation feats, and his fire spout feat. He also has his defense against CM feat, and lightning redirection. All of these are very useful against firebending, but useless against any other element.

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thebuckaronatr

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#38  Edited By thebuckaronatr

@mial42 said:

@thebuckaronatr:

Zuko has good fire negation feats, and his fire spout feat. He also has his defense against CM feat, and lightning redirection. All of these are very useful against firebending, but useless against any other element.

Well ok but that is not much different from Azula, except that her shield more useful outside firebending is. Although considering that Zukos dragonfire also matched her blue fire would i say his spout could have the same effect as her shield, which means working against all 4 elements and even boomerang chan the ark-nemesis of each firebender XD.

Even Mako has most of these just in weaker, so that seems to be pretty common for firebenders.

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deactivated-597fe3e7af56f

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@thebuckaronatr:

The difference here is that Azula has other moves (like lightning) that are more useful against non-firebenders then firebenders, meaning she's not really specialized against firebending, being more of a general purpose fighter.

Azula's shield works against more than just firebending, but it's weaker than Zuko's (tying into my point about Azula being more able to fight multiple elements than Zuko). And I'd be wary of saying Azula's feats apply to Zuko (or vice versa). They're equal in power, but they have different move sets.

As for Mako, he doesn't have the fire spout, or his shield against CM, both of which are high end fire defense moves.

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thebuckaronatr

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#40  Edited By thebuckaronatr

@mial42: Ok if you put it that way makes it more sense, i mean it fits. A big part of his way was to being able to fight Azula, so is later abilities are pretty much made for that.

Although i think either his shield can do the same or is in fact weaker, cause a shield made out of flames that can block solid things should be stronger than one that can just neutralize fire.

Are you sure that Mako never used a shield, i could have sworn i remember something like that?

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deactivated-597fe3e7af56f

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Ok if you put it that way makes it more sense, i mean it fits. A big part of his way was to being able to fight Azula, so is later abilities are pretty much made for that.

This is pretty much exactly how I think of Zuko's move set actually.

Although i think either his shield can do the same or is in fact weaker, cause a shield made out of flames that can block solid things should be stronger than one that can just neutralize fire.

I think Azula's shield is just a skill thing, applying the concussive properties of firebending to a shield.

Are you sure that Mako never used a shield, i could have sworn i remember something like that?

He has against Ming Hua, but not the same type of shield Zuko used against CM.

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anthp2000

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#42 anthp2000  Moderator

Ah, I believe P'Li, Ghazan and Ming Hua all specialise against traditional benders of their elements.

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I agree about Zuko. His lightning-re-direction, like with Iroh, negates a specific subset of fire-benders, but not most.

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I'm just going to copy and paste what I wrote in a different thread, with some minor adjustments:

All of these tiers are in no particular order, unless otherwise specified.

God Tier:

Cosmic Energy Korra

Unavaatu

Avatar State

Dark Avatar State

Hundun

Demigod Tier:

Vaatu

Raava

Old Iron

High-end fodder dark spirits (like the one that wrecked team avatar)

Koh the Face Stealer

Hei Bai

The Colossus

Hax Bloodbender tier:

Amon

Tarrlok

Yakone

Avatar Tier

King Bumi

Roku

Korra

Aang

Grandmaster Tier:

Wan

Unalaq

P'li

Katara

Tenzin

Void Zaheer

Combustion Man

JJ/Iroh/Ozai/Sozin (by hype)

High Tier:

Toph

Huu (with swamp and prep)

Azula

Ming Hua

Ghazan

Kuvira

Bolin (low end of the tier)

Zuko

Zaheer

Pakku

Lin

Suyin

Mecha Tank Zhu Li

Mid Tier:

Mako (high end of the tier)

Tonraq (higher in the North Pole)

Kya

Eska and Desna (higher in the North Pole)

Composite Dai Li agents

Ty Lee (lower end)

The Lieutenant (lower end)

Asami (lower end)

Mai (lower end)

Suki (lower end)

Hama (lower end)

Iroh II

Amon (limited, lower end)

Tarrlok (no bloodbending)

Jet (lower end)

Low Tier:

Zhao

EE Soldiers

Fodder Chi Blockers

Yuyan Archers

Bumi

Jinora

Kai

Meelo

Opal

Xin Fu

The Boulder

Fodder Tier:

Ikki

Fodder Air Nomads

EK Troops

FN Troops

Kei Lo

NOS Members

Also, one last thing to note, a fight is not determined by a character's tier. They're ranked by how they'd do against the verse as a whole, so versatility is a large part of it. It is completely possible for a lower tier character to beat a higher tier character (for example, Kuvira would beat P'li or CM if they started inside of about forty feet).

This more or less.

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#45  Edited By MetalJimmor

Zaheer with flight has no reason to be on the grandmaster level. Achieving flight didn't make his airbending better, it just gave him a unique power like combustion bending or bloodbending.

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deactivated-6249a821a8c64

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Some High Tiers (Katara, Toph, S&S Azula, Ming and probably the three metslbenders & possibly P'li) belong in the GM tier, Zaheer is high tier, Wan is either high or GM tier.

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#47  Edited By silentbat

Alright, focusing the conversation on the God/Spirit Tier right now ...

My current ranking is ...

  1. AS Avatar Roku (Full Training, Fully Realized)
  2. AS Avatar Kyoshi (Splitting a peninsula)
  3. AS Avatar Aang (Fight with Old Iron, Dominating SC Ozai)
  4. AS Avatar Korra (Weakened AS after Harmonic Convergence)
  5. AS Avatar Wan (Full Realized. But first and on-going Avatars get better)
  6. AS Avatar Kuruk (Don't know enough...)
  7. AS Avatar Yangchen (Don't know enough...)
  8. AS (Dark) Unavaatu (Upperhand on Comic Energy Korra)
  9. Cosmic Energy Korra (Contended with Unavaatu but needed assistance for final defeat)
  10. Hundun (Contention with AS Avatar Korra)

@arcus1@korraspirit@deathhero61@sean12345@killerwasp@anthp2000@dratini1331@killerwasp@jr_avatarexpert@loklegends@dreadpool@strictlyanime@nighthunder@pooty

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Gnitrup

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#48  Edited By Gnitrup

Hi, this is the latest video I've seen about this on youtube " https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CV4TNTc3F8s& " and after watching the show a couple times, still have difficulties when I'm trying to compare characters like Azula with Bumi or Toph, and Ozai with Iroh...

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EmmaFrostXmen

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I remember Pakku saying in North and South that Katara was better than him, so Pakku should be below Katara, Toph, And Azula (who are all around the same level)

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gunchar16

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This list is just terrible, wrong tiers, wrong placings and no visible coherence.