Marvel's Multiverse is NOT Infinite according to "Logic"

Many Marvel debaters proved to me, that Higher and Bigger infinities do not exist in fiction. Because Infinity should be everything, the all, all equal infinities are! There can never be anything bigger or surpassing Infinity!

Shame on me! But that said, let's apply the same type of "Muh Logic" to Marvel!

If Multi-Eternity's Marvel Multiverse body WAS Infinite, why is there a White Void and things that are bigger than Multi-Eternity's Body? Why is First Firmament bigger than Multi-Eternity?

MEANING that Marvel's Multiverse is FINITE, if there are things bigger than Marvel's Multiverse and OUTSIDE IT.

@supermanthor@yasindermann@soratoumiga@rijehu

Bring this up, anytime Marvel Bois bring up "You cannot have bigger infinity!!!".

@sungsam: thanks

Infinite D doesn't exits in Fiction.

Creators just make Some Illogical Sh**.

Honestly, you can just blame this on writers retconning stuff to fit their own narrative. Jim Starlin, for instance, is notorious for that. I seriously doubt Marvel or any comic book company uses concepts like Infinity, literally.

Yeah, and I proved that Marvel's Multiverse isn't infinite at all.

At least we know that WF Mxy can stomp LT now.

@sungsam: was there ever doubt about WF mxy stomping LT ?

If we talk about Marvel Fanboys (of which they outnumber us on this forum) Yes.

@sungsam: Still Fictional characters are mixture of Lower and Higher dimensions.

Even Our actual universe is Ad Infinitum not infinite.

Also White Void is surprising place.

It has Space But not Time.

@sungsam: read dr. Strange sorcerer supreme #21(second half of the issue, skip the first part if you want) . I was going to make a thread about it when I read it a few months ago but was too lazy to do so, it explains infinity in dimensions.

That's fine LT.

But you have to help me..... tell the other Marvel debaters that trying to argue against bigger infinities in fiction, renders Marvel as weak, compared to Baseline Multiversals in other verses.

That is the point I was trying to make on this thread. I do agree that Marvel's Multiverse is Infinite, but if they are gonna use MUH LOGIC against other verses, it has to backfire as well. Otherwise, we are double standardizing.

Wow, nice.

@sungsam: I don't care about these battles between comics fans.

But a little bit of mathematics here:

I hope you realize that there is an infinity of numbers between 2 and 3...

Just saying.

Anyway keep playing together.

So just like everything in fiction, Infinity has something inferior to it? I mean, no Multiverse is infinite. There is always something outside of it, be it creator or some other outer-dimensional concept. This means nothing. Completely irrelevant. Still no different than all the other Multiverses. This was also a thing since WAAAAYYY back in a day so it is not anything new either.

This thread is mean't to drive a point. I actually agree with you.

So because Marvel's Multiverse is not infinite to this extreme standard, therefore all other fictions with Infinite Multiverses are not Infinite.

How can you say that? I can literally write a fiction that has an Infinite Multiverse with nothing outside it and done.

@sungsam:

So because Marvel's Multiverse is not infinite to this extreme standard, therefore all other fictions with Infinite Multiverses are not Infinite.

No, they are simply not infinite because they are not. A big majority of fictional universes with concept of "Multiverse" often introduces something that is "above/beyond/away" from the Multiverse, be it it's predecessor, successor, creator, or simply a concept irrelevant to it. I honestly don't understand the point of this confirmation of yours when same thing applies to almost everything else. It is not like anyone believes Marvel Multiverse is indestructible or whatever. The only beings that are truly infinite are Omnipotent characters like God/Creator.

Not that you are particularly wrong but this statement is completely pointless given that almost nobody says otherwise, and the fact that this logic/rule applies to almost everything. It's like making a blog about strong character being weaker than some other X character, which does not mean anything when nobody said that the former is literally unbeatable. Statements like "infinity", "omnipotence" and "all powerful" are all over exaggerated in all forms of fiction, and just live up to those standards in comparison to us mortals, while in reality, they are not.

And I haven't seen anyone who thinks otherwise so, again, I am not sure what your point is.

How can you say that? I can literally write a fiction that has an Infinite Multiverse with nothing outside it and done.

By all means do it. Fan fiction does not really count.

@sungsam: I can understand

@sungsam

...there was literally a character called infinity in marvel

a single character made it infinite even regardless of all the other characters and embodiment in the marvel multiverse

even if that wasn't the case

just because you don't believe it doesn't mean it can and does exist in fiction

lacking on your evidence in the op anyways

Name these fictions, interview and vet every single Multiverse fiction on the planet. Write me a statistical paper,confirming your affirmation that this applies to most fictions, with confirmed scans that there is something much larger than this so called "Infinite Multiverse" and then I will take your anecdote seriously. Since you are making big leaps about "All fictions" or "Most fictions" and this and that.

Because I know for example, that Ben 10's Multiverse is infinite, with nothing stated to be larger than said structure, excluding the said Multiverse. And some other fictions like Umineko having Infinite Universes in its Vertical Whatnot Multiverse with explicitly nothing beyond it from what I've heard. In fact, Demonbane's Multiverse also has nothing outside the whole thing, and is called the "Macrocosm" nothing beyond it from what I've read. As well. Numbers and Mass is all.

I'll be sure to research more names of more Infinite Multiverses with nothing outside it.

But it's a big leap, to assume that Marvel does it this way, so all to most other fictions do it that way.

By all means do it. Fan fiction does not really count.

Things I create are independent on copyrighted works. They are not fanfiction.

@sungsam: Their are different infinitys. The countable and the uncountable infinity. That is actually a mathematical fact.

This thread is based on a misunderstanding of what infinity means, an dit misinterprates the effect that perspective has on that meaning.

Sure, lol. This is obviously the opposite.

So you agree there are Higher Infinities? THAT is your answer?

@sungsam: No. That's not what Im saying. I'm saying that the reality of an uncountable infinity does not make the countable infinity finite.

So is that your way to rationalize my scan above?

So what Infinity do you think Multi-Eternity is? Uncountable or Countable?

neil gaiman is a coward, everything he writes furthers the interests of his novel investors who support juadism, fake-paganism and scientology... that's how small his universe is .... follow the money

Neither Marvel nor DC are or ever were infinite. Crisis on Infinite Earths was only a marketable name, in the actual story it was said AM consumed thousands of universes before going for the last five.

You are talking about the Bleed. The Local Multiverse that COIE was all about and whatnot is but an infinitesimal finite fraction of DC's True Infinite Multiverse Whole beyond the Source Wall that none surpasses.

Neil Gaiman is simply one of those guys who took too much LSD, Coke, got drunk and stoned too much in the 80s and started writing weird stuff. It makes sense when you see where's he's from the family are a Jew Scientology cult in Britbong, there are certain subjects he won't touch, out of cowardice or because the thought police might come knocking on your door? Gaiman follows a bunch of illuminati freemason mumbo jumbo, he let's other men soddomize his wife, she was part of some weird All-Seeing-eye Pyramid Eclectic Society fraternity club, these Phi Nu Theta are basically party drug users, there is probably a ton of blackmail on them lying around, the mystic pseudo spiritual freaks who follow religious weird voodoo crap, Willie Garson, Joss Whendon and the gay rapper Khalif Diouf Le1f were part of the same masonic frat club. The Judaism upbringing and the raised scientologist just adds the final layer of madness to his work, its all the same crap over and over again.

I agree.

I think they are infinite, in of sense that each day new universes are born, but are not literally infinite.

@sungsam: I'm not rationalizing anything. I'm saying you don't understand what infinity means.

You're trying to rationalize your own misunderstanding.

I only wanted your opinion. That's all.

@sungsam Lol, didn't know I was tagged. Alright, I am going to debunk the size of the marvel multiverse.

Here we see that Eternity is at building level and he is the embodiment of the multiverse. Here is you're anser, THE MARVEL MULTIVERSE IS JUST ON BUILDING LEVEL!

what is canon?

Does it really depend on who is writing on P.I.S happens?

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Depends on personality type. This is also what religious mystic types do .... and what of Introverted iNtuitive Thinking Perceiving? Extraverted Sensing (modern types: ESFP, ESTP) ? the ESFPs get caught up in the excitement of the moment, and want everyone else to feel that way, too or the ENFP Personality The Campaigner or Extraverted Feeling (modern types: ESFJ, ENFJ) or Who are some famous INTPs? Thinking (T) vs. Feeling (F)The three areas of preferences introduced by Jung are dichotomies (i.e. bipolar dimensions where each pole represents a different preference). Jung also proposed that in a person one of the four functions above is dominant – either a function of perception or a function of judging. Isabel Briggs Myers, a researcher and practitioner of Jung’s theory, proposed to see the judging-perceiving relationship as a fourth dichotomy influencing personality type [Briggs Myers, 1980]:Judging (J) vs. Perceiving (P)The first criterion, Extraversion – Introversion, signifies the source and direction of a person’s energy expression. An extravert’s source and direction of energy expression is mainly in the external world, while an introvert has a source of energy mainly in their own internal world.or there is another type the Idealist type INFJ or ISFP - Quiet, serious, sensitive and kind. Do not like conflict, and not likely to do things which may generate conflict or the other Logicians You May Know.

Once you see a writers history, the readers connections, the personality type and the psuedo mystic religious agenda and political agendas behind their work, it makes a whole lot more sense

As you know, there are countless realities, new ones bring constantly created by every decision made by any individual being withing this infinite realm. This ever-expanding network of dimensions must be regulated to keep spillover from occurring and preventing chaos.

Source : Thanos - The Infinity Conflict .

By choosing whether or not to touch my nose, I have created an alternative reality, have I not?

Infinite realities, Endless actualities is a concept even my mind cannot fully gasp.

Source : Thanos - The Infinity Finale.

@sungsam: Most forms of fiction related to comics at least. Which is what I base my opinion off of since Marvel is comic book universe. DC has stuff beyond it as well and same goes for a lot of other comic book universes. For video games and cartoons, I can't speak for those so fair enough. But even they have some examples. Either way, I still do not see the point of this blog. Who says Marvel's Multiverse is "infinite"? Probably a lot of people but not in sense that you are trying to present. "Infinite" by itself is relative term in fiction. A universe can be infinite by human standards. Multiversal beings are infinite by human standards. And there are beings in Marvel above even Multiversal ones.

Marvel fans themselves acknowledge existence of other beings so, actual use of "infinity" is pretty loose.

I can agree here.

How would of you interpret this scan(bottom panel)? Just trying to get opinions other than my own.

Anyone??

Thnx in advance!

@obeyron said:

As you know, there are countless realities, new ones bring constantly created by every decision made by any individual being withing this infinite realm. This ever-expanding network of dimensions must be regulated to keep spillover from occurring and preventing chaos.

Source : Thanos - The Infinity Conflict .

By choosing whether or not to touch my nose, I have created an alternative reality, have I not?

Infinite realities, Endless actualities is a concept even my mind cannot fully gasp.

Source : Thanos - The Infinity Finale.

+10

Yeah, in comics, the word "infinite" is usually used as a hyperbole.

We can find the same thing, in DC

A few examples.

1-In infinite crisis, it was said that there was an infinite number of universes.

-The anti-monitor claimed that he destroyed an infinite number of universes

-Later on, it was reviled that he actually destroyed 1 million universe

-Also, 5 universes were spared. How can he claim he destroyed an infinite number of universes minus 5? Infinite is not a number

2-In rebirth, it was claimed that the dc universe now contain an infinite number of universes.

-Yet, later it was reviled that the new dc universe contains only 196 833 universes:

@cramem:

Your scans refer to the Wild Storm Multiverse only, which is but a fraction of the DC Source Wall Multiverse which is just a fraction of the True Infinite Multiverse of DC that we had not seen yet that is under Snyder's recent retcons.

Even the "Multiverse" that the Anti-Monitor destroyed is just a fraction of the larger Multiverse. Inside the Bleed.

Of course they're Finite Multiverses because they're not the real deal. Just part of an Infinite Whole.

The difference however, is that DC is recently patching up their mistakes with proper reasoning while being self aware. Basically, DC rationalizes to us, that any Multiverse that was proven to be Finite, is just a smaller group of Universes of the Infinite Whole Multiverse so that DC will never be proven wrong when DC claims it is an Infinite Multiverse, we are just confused about its structure. It's been this hinted that way since Hypertime came back and the 5th Dimension Universe of Mxy being outside the Source Wall. Something Marvel should have done similarly, but they didn't.

But yeah, I see your point.

@cramem: Just to point out, your scan says 196,833 dimensional space, not 196,833 Universes. It says the number of Universes equals to the number of atoms making up the Earth, which is much greater than this number (but of course not infinite).

This is fiction, anything is possible here.

Real Life Logic usually doesn't make sense in Fiction. If we use Real Life Logic, then characters like Superman or Flash, who can travel faster than Light, would be having infinite power/energy.

You can't defy Logic.

If fiction made complete nonsense Then it has no meaning can't be use any battle threads,Gen discussion.

The second scan says "What we call reality is an array of 196,333 parallel universes"

In this case: Dimension= Parallel universe.

@sungsam: Interesting.

Thank you for the informations.