Is Warcury the most durable being in One Piece for now?

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MaderFlame

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Edited By MaderFlame

Poll Is Warcury the most durable being in One Piece for now? (29 votes)

Exactly, he makes Kaido looks like a joke 45%
Nah, Kaido was WSC, he still sh*ts on him and others Fraudosei 24%
Kaido got caught off guard, Warcury brace himself 3%
Nah, that's Lunarian King 21%
Nah, Imu solos 7%
Xebec solos 0%
Roger solos 0%

He literally no sold an attack that floored Kaido on his *ss

I don't get why these old timers scared of Kaido, if one of them is already more durable and tougher than him

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Supreme101

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Seems to be the only durable planet too. Then again Luffy was fatigued and not fresh so.....

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LilacPlasmaBeam

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Would appear so

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LordV

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warcury seems more solid while kaido is more rubbery, if luffy spammed more of those warcury mightve cracked but kaido could've taken way more even if it hurt him, then again warcury is immortal. anyway i think thats an ability of his that he uses to solidify his body actively while kaido's defense is more passive.

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byondeon

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@lordv said:

warcury seems more solid while kaido is more rubbery, if luffy spammed more of those warcury mightve cracked but kaido could've taken way more even if it hurt him, then again warcury is immortal. anyway i think thats an ability of his that he uses to solidify his body actively while kaido's defense is more passive.

Not really. We know that Luffy was pretty much out of it at that point. Not at his peak in Gear 5 considering that all this have basically spanned a few hours at most. And he have been in and out of Gear 5 several times.

So it's safe to say that Warcury didn't take the full power of Luffy while Kaido was.

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MultifandomBoyo

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This is Post Wano Luffy after Haki blooms where he was seen fighting level with Hybrid Kaido in base at times before it all ramped up.

I'd say he's more durable than Lower forms of Kaido for sure (Human, Dragon, Possibly Initial Hybrid Form), We have to see more of what he can take from G5 to say if he cliffs Kaido completely

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Edgelord91

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I'd still say second to flames on lunarians. King also no sold kaido damaging attacks

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Edgelord91

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PlagueDocter

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Definitely seems so alongside he just no sold both Egghead Luffy's Red Roc and then later a G5 Punch to the point Luffy hurt his hand twice.

Flame On Lunarians also are one of the most durable characters ever and then Kaido & Big Mom.

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nassergrant19

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Yes

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BBNakedSnake

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Probably, since Luffy didn't hurt himself trying to hurt the Flames On Seraphim unlike what happened with Warcury

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socajunkie

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#12 socajunkie  Moderator

Yes.

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MonvieZ3

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No, People here are just blinded by hype and recency bias as He only tanked a no named G5 attack while Kaido was still in one piece after taking G5 Best attack, Fodder pig must overpower G5 Bajrang first before people jump into a conclusion

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PlagueDocter

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#14  Edited By PlagueDocter

@monviez3 said:

1) No, People here are just blinded by hype and recency bias

Or just maybe the fact that Warcury NO SOLD a Red Roc and a G5 gigant type punch is what is impressive... Luffy never had such a reaction while punching Kaido the closest we got is when they both headbutt eachother

2) as He only tanked a no named G5 attack while Kaido was still in one piece after taking G5 Best attack,

Kaido got hurt by weaker G5 Attacks than Bajrang Gun in fact he was getting hurt by Base, and Gear 2/3/4 Luffy... yet despite it all Warcury can NO SELL G5 Luffy's punch striaght to the face and he does so that G5 Luffy HURTS his own hand by punching Warcury.

3) Fodder pig must overpower G5 Bajrang first before people jump into a conclusion

No he doesn't.

First off even Kaido didn’t overpower Bajrang Gun nor do you need to as to have better durability than Kaido. Second this is Egghead Luffy a stronger fresher Luffy than the one Kaido fought. Thirdly all you need to do is have better durability feats than Kaido to be more durable like with Warcury is...

No Caption Provided

Like I have shown which is said by Luffy that his skin is so hard which it is to the point Luffy's hurting his own hand by punching Warcury meanwhile Warcury is literally utterly unphased while no selling these attacks while also being Immortal on top of his durability.

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DerTilt

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Cant believe people still try to argue with an clown like Monviez

Yes,Warcurys Dura>Kaidos Dura.Thats clean as day

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Supreme101

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Yea as seen so far. Gorosei are still fraud ass clown jobbers tho

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Eredin12

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#17 Eredin12  Online

Yea seems like it.

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shirso

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Yup

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Enemybird

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IDK... Buggy was able to no sell a yonko level attack as well.

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Yray

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#20  Edited By Yray

Seems to be the case

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#21  Edited By socajunkie  Moderator

@enemybird: Mate, if there’s anything in One Piece that bothers me, it’s Buggy taking Mihawk’s slashes. I don’t care about the retroactive implication and evidence that black blades don’t have the anti-DF properties that conscious Haki infusion does; it still feels wrong and disturbs my soul.

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Enemybird

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@enemybird: Mate, if there’s anything in One Piece that bothers me, it’s Buggy taking Mihawk’s slashes. I don’t care about the retroactive implication and evidence that black blades don’t have the anti-DF properties that conscious Haki infusion does; it still feels wrong and disturbs my soul.

While we are on the topic. If black blades are the pinnacle of swordsmanship, is enma a buff over shusui or did it just make Zoro use more haki? Something to think about I guess.

Mihawk will hold back and fight people (i.e east blue Zoro) who have no chance at winning. He did not one shot instead opting to lower himself to the smallest blade he could find. I think if we use that we can excuse why he didn't just blast through everyone at mf.

As for Buggy he may not have known about his DF and thus used a lazy attack that would have killed pretty much any fodder with the exception of Buggy.

He didnt really seem to know about Jozu either.

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socajunkie

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#24  Edited By socajunkie  Moderator

@enemybird: Enma forced Zoro to not only use more Haki but subsequently force him to control his Haki flow better or else he’d die. This had the great benefit of increasing his AP and Haki regulation. It's interesting to note his growth from Wano, where Enma wouldn’t stand for Zoro just using ACoA and demanded he use ACoC to not hold back, to Egghead, where Zoro has nigh full authority and chose to lower his level to ACoA against Lucci, as that made more sense for a battle of attrition as he knew he needed his ACoC reserves against stronger foes on the island. Enma accepted it. Shusui had more weight and increased Zoro’s general AP as a result, but it didn’t compare to the upgrades Enma provided, IMO. Moreover, narratively, Enma has to emphatically be above Shusui because Zoro is moving towards endgame One Piece. Black blades are the peak of a sword’s base durability and AP, it seems.

Agreed. Canon proof is Mihawk’s "hunting rabbits" statement.

I agree again regarding Buggy and Jozu. In the latter's case, I’ll say I think he knew of Jozu’s existence given Hawk-Eyes had knowledge of Vista, but I don’t think he knew the specifics of Jozu’s DF and Haki level based on the reaction to the Commander stopping the slash.

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Xebec

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@socajunkie said:

@enemybird: Mate, if there’s anything in One Piece that bothers me, it’s Buggy taking Mihawk’s slashes. I don’t care about the retroactive implication and evidence that black blades don’t have the anti-DF properties that conscious Haki infusion does; it still feels wrong and disturbs my soul.

While we are on the topic. If black blades are the pinnacle of swordsmanship, is enma a buff over shusui or did it just make Zoro use more haki? Something to think about I guess.

Mihawk will hold back and fight people (i.e east blue Zoro) who have no chance at winning. He did not one shot instead opting to lower himself to the smallest blade he could find. I think if we use that we can excuse why he didn't just blast through everyone at mf.

As for Buggy he may not have known about his DF and thus used a lazy attack that would have killed pretty much any fodder with the exception of Buggy.

He didnt really seem to know about Jozu either.

@enemybird: Enma forced Zoro to not only use more Haki but subsequently force him to control his Haki flow better or else he’d die. This had the great benefit of increasing his AP and Haki regulation. It's interesting to note his growth from Wano, where Enma wouldn’t stand for Zoro just using ACoA and demanded he use ACoC to not hold back, to Egghead, where Zoro has nigh full authority and chose to lower his level to ACoA against Lucci, as that made more sense for a battle of attrition as he knew he needed his ACoC reserves against stronger foes on the island. Enma accepted it. Shusui had more weight and increased Zoro’s general AP as a result, but it didn’t compare to the upgrades Enma provided, IMO. Moreover, narratively, Enma has to emphatically be above Shusui because Zoro is moving towards endgame One Piece. Black blades are the peak of a sword’s base durability and AP, it seems.

Agreed. Canon proof is Mihawk’s "hunting rabbits" statement.

I agree again regarding Buggy and Jozu. In the latter's case, I’ll say I think he knew of Jozu’s existence given Hawk-Eyes had knowledge of Vista, but I don’t think he knew the specifics of Jozu’s DF and Haki level based on the reaction to the Commander stopping the slash.

the old ass "mihawk didn't cut jozu" argument was resolved before MF imo

during EL, while zoro fought kaku he tried to use haki (breath of all things) to bypass his Tekkai, but kaku kept switching between using Tekkai and not using it, so when zoro was tuned in to cut his iron body, because he struck against flesh his swords didn't cut Kaku

it's literally a matter of the swordsman choosing what to cut or not; mihawk lunched an attack to cut Whitebeard, made of flesh, not jozu made of diamond (also worth pointing out that iirc jozu did not tank the attack, he blocked it with his fists then redirected it upwards)

No Caption Provided

my opinion = fax

ur opinion = creditless

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socajunkie

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#26 socajunkie  Moderator

@xebec: Wow, that rings true, especially:

‘mihawk lunched an attack to cut Whitebeard, made of flesh, not jozu made of diamond’

110%, I never thought of that.

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yoroshi0

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@dertilt said:

Cant believe people still try to argue with an clown like Monviez

Yes,Warcurys Dura>Kaidos Dura.Thats clean as day

damn, an elder > kaido

this is the most outrageous hot take i've ever seen on this site. and this says a lot

@monviez3 said:

1) No, People here are just blinded by hype and recency bias

Or just maybe the fact that Warcury NO SOLD a Red Roc and a G5 gigant type punch is what is impressive... Luffy never had such a reaction while punching Kaido the closest we got is when they both headbutt eachother

2) as He only tanked a no named G5 attack while Kaido was still in one piece after taking G5 Best attack,

Kaido got hurt by weaker G5 Attacks than Bajrang Gun in fact he was getting hurt by Base, and Gear 2/3/4 Luffy... yet despite it all Warcury can NO SELL G5 Luffy's punch striaght to the face and he does so that G5 Luffy HURTS his own hand by punching Warcury.

3) Fodder pig must overpower G5 Bajrang first before people jump into a conclusion

No he doesn't.

First off even Kaido didn’t overpower Bajrang Gun nor do you need to as to have better durability than Kaido. Second this is Egghead Luffy a stronger fresher Luffy than the one Kaido fought. Thirdly all you need to do is have better durability feats than Kaido to be more durable like with Warcury is...

No Caption Provided

Like I have shown which is said by Luffy that his skin is so hard which it is to the point Luffy's hurting his own hand by punching Warcury meanwhile Warcury is literally utterly unphased while no selling these attacks while also being Immortal on top of his durability.

gorosei have regeneration that keeps them at the game but their level is no different from that of an admiral tier

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PlagueDocter

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@yoroshi0 said:

1) damn, an elder > kaido

Warcury is more durable than Kaido (and he's immortal).

His skin is so hard even G5 Luffy is hurting his hand punching him.

2) this is the most outrageous hot take i've ever seen on this site. and this says a lot

How is it outrageous or a hot take... it's proven... we see it...

No Caption Provided

We see Warcury no sell a Egghead Red Roc and a G5 attack.

3) gorosei have regeneration that keeps them at the game but their level is no different from that of an admiral tier

They are all top tiers (Yonko, Admirals, Gorosei).

Saturn with a glare could hurt G5 Luffy and knockdown Egghead Sanji... he also with his Poison Spit Bombs could blow up himself, Ju Peter, and WARCURY to bits...

No Caption Provided

Remember how Warcury is so durable... yet Saturn can blow him to bits... that's an insane AP feat for Saturn.

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Enemybird

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#29  Edited By Enemybird

@socajunkie: @xebec: That's not what happened. Zoro wanted to break Kaku's iron body with his next attack. However, instead of just tanking it with tenkai he instead uses tempest kick "dragon slice" to negate Zoro's attack. He then says that he decides whether to use tenkai or to negate it with something else.

Sounds like Kaku is mocking Zoro when he says " would you have been able to cut me if i were metal?" Becuase again wanted to break Kaku's tennkai.

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Enemybird

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@plaguedocter: The "blew them to bits' statement seems a little hyperbolic to me personally. I don't think topman was blow into bits. Perhaps that's what Broggy thought happened.

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PlagueDocter

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@enemybird said:

1) The "blew them to bits' statement seems a little hyperbolic to me personally. I don't think topman was blow into bits. Perhaps that's what Broggy thought happened.

We literally see it happen... they have no body left (since they were blown to bits) and became the shadowy forms after their body was destroyed as to regen.

Also why would Brogy be wrong they are looking DIRECTLY at them and have been engaged in battle with them or a while by then.

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yoroshi0

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@yoroshi0 said:

1) damn, an elder > kaido

Warcury is more durable than Kaido (and he's immortal).

His skin is so hard even G5 Luffy is hurting his hand punching him.

2) this is the most outrageous hot take i've ever seen on this site. and this says a lot

How is it outrageous or a hot take... it's proven... we see it...

No Caption Provided

We see Warcury no sell a Egghead Red Roc and a G5 attack.

3) gorosei have regeneration that keeps them at the game but their level is no different from that of an admiral tier

They are all top tiers (Yonko, Admirals, Gorosei).

Saturn with a glare could hurt G5 Luffy and knockdown Egghead Sanji... he also with his Poison Spit Bombs could blow up himself, Ju Peter, and WARCURY to bits...

No Caption Provided

Remember how Warcury is so durable... yet Saturn can blow him to bits... that's an insane AP feat for Saturn.

No Caption Provided

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Enemybird

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#33  Edited By Enemybird
@plaguedocter said:

@enemybird said:

1) The "blew them to bits' statement seems a little hyperbolic to me personally. I don't think topman was blow into bits. Perhaps that's what Broggy thought happened.

We literally see it happen... they have no body left (since they were blown to bits) and became the shadowy forms after their body was destroyed as to regen.

Also why would Brogy be wrong they are looking DIRECTLY at them and have been engaged in battle with them or a while by then.

We literally don't see it happen. We see an explosion and shadowy figures in the flames shortly after. You can't tell if topman is regenerating or not.

At the end of thriller bark chapter 484 page 15, Usopp thought Kuma's Skull was cracked while looking DIRECTLY at Sanji kicking him in the head with concasse. I think that's a similar situation to what's going on here.

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Xebec

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@socajunkie: @xebec: That's not what happened. Zoro wanted to break Kaku's iron body with his next attack. However, instead of just tanking it with tenkai he instead uses tempest kick "dragon slice" to negate Zoro's attack. He then says that he decides whether to use tenkai or to negate it with something else.

Sounds like Kaku is mocking Zoro when he says " would you have been able to cut me if i were metal?" Becuase again wanted to break Kaku's tennkai.

doesn't really matter, it still sets up the fact that kaku is not gonna maintain tekkai all the way to let zoro read his defense and cut through it

throughout the fight we see zoro and kaku clash multiple times, or zoro straight up hitting kaku, and he doesn't slash kaku because he can't read whether he's gonna use tekkai or not (it's notable that whenever Kaku uses tekkai during the fight, he name drops it)

the one time he did cut kaku it's cause kaku dodged instead of swapping between them so zoro's attack connects

my opinion = fax

ur opinion = creditless

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PlagueDocter

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#35  Edited By PlagueDocter

@enemybird said:

1) We literally don't see it happen. We see an explosion and shadowy figures in the flames shortly after. You can't tell if topman is regenerating or not.

The shadowy figures are them not having a body... the shadowy-ness is how their bodies get formed we saw this when they were summoned it took a bit for their body to form after going through the magic circle.

No Caption Provided

2).At the end of thriller bark chapter 484 page 15, Usopp thought Kuma's Skull was cracked while looking DIRECTLY at Sanji kicking him in the head with concasse. I think that's a similar situation to what's going on here.

Not even remotely the same.

Seeing someone blown to pieces and thinking someone has a broken skull are two different things. One you can see their body parts getting obliterated the other you need X-Ray vison for...

I don't know why you are pushing back against this Enemybird we are told and shown it happen and the aftermath...

No Caption Provided

We know it hit them, we know it blew up on them, we know they were blown to bits and we see that and we are told so and that they became all shadowy again like when they hadn't formed prior...

EDIT: Grammer.

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#36  Edited By Enemybird

@plaguedocter: In chapter 1085 the five elders were in drawn shadowy form while attacking Sabo for a more dramatic effect. I can't really say the elders being drawn that way is conclusive evidence that they were blown to bits. If it were undeniable i.e (they were shown as bits on panel) we wouldn't be having this conversation. I am only saying that this is the way it looks to me.

I am pushing back on it because if what you allege is true, it would mean Saturn potentially has the strongest attack in the verse period. Forget everything else we've seen so far. I'm just not really to accept that without absolute undeniable proof.

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deactivated-6672dc4dc7827

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Kaido mid diffs

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PlagueDocter

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#38  Edited By PlagueDocter

@enemybird said:

1)In chapter 1085 the five elders were in drawn shadowy form while attacking Sabo for a more dramatic effect. I can't really say the elders being drawn that way is conclusive evidence that they were blown to bits.

Why not.

Also Sabo's was silhouettes not shadowy creatures like shown in Egghead.

No Caption Provided

2) If it were undeniable i.e (they were shown as bits on panel) we wouldn't be having this conversation. I am only saying that this is the way it looks to me.

Dorry, Brogy and Luffy saw them blown to bits on panel is that not good enough for you and they even commented on it and how it didn't matter since they were immortal... if they didn't get blown up why say they did, why show them without their body, why have Luffy comment on that it won't matter as they're immortal why say any of it jf they never got blown up in the first place... see it makes ZERO sense to think how you are Enemybird...

No Caption Provided

And be real do you think Oda would show gore to that level with bloody scraps and body parts strewn across the battlefield when he can just tell you they were blown up and show them without a body.

3) I am pushing back on it because if what you allege is true, it would mean Saturn potentially has the strongest attack in the verse period. Forget everything else we've seen so far. I'm just not really to accept that without absolute undeniable proof.

"Allege is true" it is true no buts about it.

Also why is it that hard to believe... Warcury is already the most durable ever as of yet barring Lunarian's flame on hax... why would one of them having one of the strongest attacks out there not be possible when like I said one of them has the best durability out there.

EDIT: Grammer.

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Enemybird

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#39  Edited By Enemybird

@plaguedocter: There is no proof they were actually blown to bits. Why is that so hard for you to understand? We the audience did not see it period. The elders don't transform into shadows when they regen. That is you speculating. We have seen Saturn regen his arm from nothing it wasn't a shadow.

As I've shown, sometimes characters get it wrong. Because we did not see the elders blown to bits Broggy statement could have been an assumption similar to how Usopp assumed Kuma's head was cracked.

Posting the same scan 50 times isn't going to show the elders blown to bits.

This post isn't about what's hard to believe and what is not. It's about what has undeniably been proven and what has not. Topman has proven better durability than Kadio, yes. But Kaido isn't the most durable being in the verse. He isnt even the most durable in his own crew.

Saturn has not proven his AP because of what I mentioned.

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PlagueDocter

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#40  Edited By PlagueDocter

@enemybird said:

1) There is no proof they were actually blown to bits.

No Caption Provided
No Caption Provided

At this point I literally don't care you are in outright denial and are upping the standard for proof just becuase of your disbelief that Saturn has such AP.

We don't need to see their body parts blown up especially when there wouldn't be any as they were "blown to bits" or in other translations "they're gone" both emphasizing how there is nothing left after they got hit by Saturn's explosive poison spit

No Caption Provided

As such there wouldn't be anything to see in the first place as there was nothing left which is why all we saw was their shadowy figures left... Enemybird you are asking for a piece of proof that they got blown up which literally doesn't exist I can't show you their blown up bodies since their bodies were blown to bits and it would be basically impossible to show becuase well there's nothing left of them except their shadowy figures which you already don't think is enough proof to think they got blown up... and this is despite the fact that there's plenty of proof supporting that they got blown up like I've said:

We know it hit them, we know it blew up on them, we know they were blown to bits and we see that and we are told so and that they became all shadowy again like when they hadn't formed prior...

And:

Dorry, Brogy and Luffy saw them blown to bits on panel is that not good enough for you and they even commented on it and how it didn't matter since they were immortal... if they didn't get blown up why say they did, why show them without their body, why have Luffy comment on that it won't matter as they're immortal why say any of it jf they never got blown up in the first place... see it makes ZERO sense to think how you are Enemybird...

Or how about compare this:

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They obviously didn't have their bodies anymore as a result of the explosion as we literally don't see them anymore and they are like their shadowy forms when they were summoned in.

I don't even know why I'm going through all this trouble... it should be readily apparent to ANYONE that what I'm saying is true as all you need to do is read the like one page from the manga itself and you are good to go...

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TLDR: Cope Enemybird and stop asking for something that literally doesn't exist.

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Enemybird

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#41  Edited By Enemybird

@plaguedocter: First of all I'm not asking you for ANYTHING. I am telling you that the level of proof required to bring this to the standard of undeniable proof does not exist.

  • Broggy's statement is not 100% reliable. Because characters can get it wrong. Broggy even thought Dorry was dead on little garden and got that wrong. Ussop thought Kuma's skull was cracked etc. Literally countless examples of this in the story.
  • We did not see them blow to bits. We see an explosion and shadowy figures standing (body intact) in the flames. We don't see the regen happening like wedid with Saturn who again wasn't shadowy when he regenerated his arm.

I don't need to cope. I am perfectly willing to accept feats when I see them. This one could go either way so i am leaving the possibly open until then. Get out of your feelings.

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PlagueDocter

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@enemybird: What do you mean your not asking for ANYTHING... you want proof that they were blown to bits which literally cannot exist.

Also like I said prior:

Seeing someone blown to pieces and thinking someone has a broken skull are two different things. One you can see their body parts getting obliterated the other you need X-Ray vison for...

Stop comparing what Brogy's observation to Ussop's speculation there are levels to it and Brogy has direct visual confirmation Ussop doesn't as he doesn't have X-ray vison it's just speculation on what he knows about Sanji's kicks.

And like I said we wouldn't see there body in the first place:

We don't need to see their body parts blown up especially when there wouldn't be any as they were "blown to bits" or in other translations "they're gone" both emphasizing how there is nothing left after they got hit by Saturn's explosive poison spit.

As such there wouldn't be anything to see in the first place as there was nothing left which is why all we saw was their shadowy figures left... Enemybird you are asking for a piece of proof that they got blown up which literally doesn't exist I can't show you their blown up bodies since their bodies were blown to bits and it would be basically impossible to show becuase well there's nothing left of them except their shadowy figures which you already don't think is enough proof to think they got blown up.

And be real do you think Oda would show gore to that level with bloody scraps and body parts strewn across the battlefield when he can just tell you they were blown up and show them without a body.

Also once again:

Dorry, Brogy and Luffy saw them blown to bits on panel is that not good enough for you and they even commented on it and how it didn't matter since they were immortal... if they didn't get blown up why say they did, why show them without their body, why have Luffy comment on that it won't matter as they're immortal why say any of it if they never got blown up in the first place... see it makes ZERO sense to think how you are Enemybird...

Honestly I'm done with this Enemybird... live in your own world at this point I've said all that could be said regarding this matter and all the reasons and the reasons why this and that yet you still don't think so.

You want to see their blown up bodies but that can't be done as their is nothing left of them since they were blown to bits/into nothing. It's like asking for a character who can erase things to see the body of one of their victims... it just doesn't work you can't see the body as there'd be no body to be seen in the first place as the very method of their ability leaves nothing behind same principle with Saturn blowing them all to bits you can't be shown nothing since it's nothing.

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#43  Edited By Enemybird

@plaguedocter: You ever heard of a framing bias?

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For some reason you are not even acknowledging that Broggy and many others have been wrong before. It's the typical plaguedocter brick wall. You even went as far as to quote reply yourself. It's sad.

Again, I never asked you for anything. Go back and look for yourself. I offered a different perspective based on what I observed, and you got mad.

Bottom Line

The standard of proof for me is going to be higher because if it is true, then it pretty much represents a paradigm shift in scaling. It has nothing to do with whether I like Saturn or not.

Topman having the hardest skin in the verse doesn't change much because there are characters who are invulnerable already. I could also make a case that Barto's barrier is similar to Topman's skin.

A Yonko potentially being one shot isn't even a totally new idea via Magellan's DF.

However an explosion being so much for powerful than Luffy's punches that it completely destroys what Luffy could not even damage is something totally different. It deserves a highest level of scrutiny until it is confirmed from not just your perspective but virtually all.

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PlagueDocter

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#44  Edited By PlagueDocter

@enemybird said:

1) You ever heard of a framing bias?

Ever heard of the source material?

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2) For some reason you are not even acknowledging that Broggy and many others have been wrong before. It's the typical plaguedocter brick wall. You even went as far as to quote reply yourself. It's sad.

Yes basically anyone can be wrong... so... that doesn't mean what Brogy observed and said and what Luffy corroborated is automatically wrong. Give me an actual reason that Brogy and Luffy are wrong beside you being unable to accept Saturn's feat as it goes beyond what YOU think is possible... despite we have already had things that went beyond what was previously thought possible like with Warcury's durability whose to say ANOTHER Gorosei can't have something of their own that also goes beyond what was previously thought possible but powerwise... especially when all the Gorosei have been showing things beyond what is though possible like Immortality, magic circles, etc so why stop at power.

And so what if I copy paste what I wrote why is that relavant all it does is chop down time for me as I don't have to type everything out and needlessly repeat the same words.

Also what brick wall... you mean the source material which directly showcases what's happened.

3) Again, I never asked you for anything. Go back and look for yourself. I offered a different perspective based on what I observed, and you got mad.

"And [I] got mad," oh please your just wrong there's nothing for me to be mad about except maybe your frustrating lack of understanding for the scene. You're somehow making out something that should be 1 + 1 = 2 into 1 + 1 = 3 it's just wrong nothing else about it.

4) The standard of proof for me is going to be higher because if it is true, then it pretty much represents a paradigm shift in scaling. It has nothing to do with whether I like Saturn or not. Topman having the hardest skin in the verse doesn't change much because there are characters who are invulnerable already. I could also make a case that Barto's barrier is similar to Topman's skin.

One's defense (barrier), one's hax (Lunarian Flame-on), the other is striaght up durability with Warcury having insanely tough skin tougher than Kaido and Big Mom. It stand stands to reason that if someone is incrediblely durable then there must be someone to be able to harm them so why not Saturn a fellow Gorosei.

5) A Yonko potentially being one shot isn't even a totally new idea via Magellan's DF.

Impel Down Blackbeard ain't on a Yonko's level in the least.

6) However an explosion being so much for powerful than Luffy's punches that it completely destroys what Luffy could not even damage is something totally different. It deserves a highest level of scrutiny until it is confirmed from not just your perspective but virtually all.

It's not just my perspective... it's the manga's... as both Brogy and Luffy corroborate exactly what I'm saying alongside the intent and visuals aswell.

Also be real with yourself Enemybird do you honestly think for a second that we are ever gonna circle back to that moment in the manga to "clarify" it at best we'll get the anime but the anime ain't in the least reliable.

Enemybird if you are to answer anything just answer this ONE question WHY are both Brogy and Luffy wrong... for what reason are they wrong and can't they be trusted on this matter.

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Enemybird

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@plaguedocter: I cannot rely on Brogy's statements alone because it is not reliable. He and many others have gotten it wrong. I am not pulling this out of thin air. It happens...a lot. It may have been done to create tension or to subvert the expectations of the reader. I am not sure if you were asking a rhetorical question or not but there are reasons why this happens.

From what I see personally, there is a massive explosion and shadowy figures almost immediately after with bodies completely intact as best as we can see. There is no evidence that I can personally obverse that they were blown to bits or regenerating after the explosion. All we can rely on is the statement alone which just cant do. hopefully the anime sheds some light.

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PlagueDocter

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@enemybird said:

1) I cannot rely on Brogy's statements alone because it is not reliable. He and many others have gotten it wrong. I am not pulling this out of thin air. It happens...a lot. It may have been done to create tension or to subvert the expectations of the reader.

That is NOT a valid reason Enemybird.

What indicates it was for tension... nothing in fact there's evidencce to the contrary since we already know that they are immortal by then... why subvert expectations when nothing showcases it was to subvert expectations and if anything we already got the subvertation since the poison spit exploded... and once again just becuase someone CAN be wrong doesn't mean whatever they say is automatically wrong and same can be said vice versa people can be right but that doesn't mean they are right all the time now does it we must take all things into consideration about the characters involved to come to a correct answer.

Also it's not only Brogy it's Luffy too who corroborated what Brogy said.

You still haven't answered the question.

So answer the question WHY are Brogy and Luffy not valid...

Becuase we know they aren't know liars and there's no reason for them to lie especially in this instance, we know this is a direct observation these characters are making as they are firsthand witnesses, we know both of them corroborate that those Gorosei were blown up, we know the intent behind the scene is them getting blown up by their own attack, the visuals, dialogue, follow that they have been blown up... I could go on... Enemybird the stance you're taking is just wrong it's just as how I've been saying for a while now:

Dorry, Brogy and Luffy saw them blown to bits on panel is that not good enough for you and they even commented on it and how it didn't matter since they were immortal... if they didn't get blown up why say they did, why show them without their body, why have Luffy comment on that it won't matter as they're immortal why say any of it if they never got blown up in the first place... see it makes ZERO sense to think how you are Enemybird...

2) I am not sure if you were asking a rhetorical question or not but there are reasons why this happens.

Not rhetorical I'm genuinely asking for what reason would Oda do ALL of this just to NOT have them get blown up... why... why... just MAKE IT MAKE SENSE Enemybird because even if I were to follow everything what you're saying it still makes no sense at all.

3) From what I see personally, there is a massive explosion and shadowy figures almost immediately after with bodies completely intact as best as we can see. There is no evidence that I can personally obverse that they were blown to bits or regenerating after the explosion. All we can rely on is the statement alone which just cant do.

I hope you understand there's a difference between silhouettes and the Gorosei as shadowy figures.

Also we DON'T see their bodies after we see shadowy figures not their bodies. If we saw their bodies they would be in color and we'd see details not just pitch black... if what we saw was their bodies they wouldn't be wispy but they are just like when they arrived.

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If they had their bodies they'd look like Saturn on the left side of the page but we don't see that we see the shadowy figures just compare Ju Peter's shadowy figures they're the same... same eye, same X, same wispy form...

4) hopefully the anime sheds some light.

I don't care about the anime in the least it's been wrong and altered things far too much from the first few episodes to the halfway point to the ones coming out right now.