Is MCU Spider-Man > MCU Scarlet Witch?

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rajjarsalt

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#1  Edited By rajjarsalt

We'll start with early versions first. Freshman year Spidey vs fresh from Avengers training Wanda

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intermediate with folding Strange...Spider-Man's feat is more impressive because Strange was in the Mirror Dimension - and Strange is one confirmed user of the Book of Cagliostro - meaning he too would get amped by it. Also, it's Strange's own realm - he's "in control" or whatever.

Spider-Man also was his jovial self despite Strange tearing out his soul, smacking him with a train,and doing this

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The Mirror Dimension no-sold a hex from MoM Wanda, threatened her as well to the point that even crawling through it shredded her up.

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rajjarsalt

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#2  Edited By rajjarsalt

Thusly I have proven that Spider-Man kept up with Wanda at the beginning of her career and even in EoS, Wanda level attacks prove to be nothing to him. Because as you know, there's a difference between bouncing off and blowing up, and it's as big as Wanda is attractive. A tiny ball might bounce off of you with nothing to show for it, but a grenade will literally part you here, there, and everywhere.

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heiqn

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#3  Edited By heiqn

Wanda died to falling debris... Spider-Man eats Thanos punches and tank universal explosions and resist snap...

Not to mention she didn't live up to hype unlike Spider-Man who got legit 40+ lightning timing feats and 7 floor busting durability. Wanda at best scales Strange who got blitzed by the slow pathetic abomination called Gargantos...

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deactivated-64232b99e9c14

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You don't need this type of scaling to know why he's more powerful than her

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death4bunnies

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#5 death4bunnies  Moderator

@rajjarsalt:

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Yeah I think he tied up her hands right at the end of the gif here.

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This one is pretty good too^

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The intent is there.. your mirror dimension stuff is further proof of what’s right in front of our eyes.

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nassergrant19

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@heiqn said:

Wanda died to falling debris... Spider-Man eats Thanos punches and tank universal explosions and resist snap...

Not to mention she didn't live up to hype unlike Spider-Man who got legit 40+ lightning timing feats and 7 floor busting durability. Wanda at best scales Strange who got blitzed by the slow pathetic abomination called Gargantos...

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Great_Darkness

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lol, find something more productive to do Raj.

If you spent this amount of time and effort on something else, you would've found a solution for climate change, a cure for cancer and solved world poverty/hunger and a cure for COVID while you were at it.

Good job tho ig.

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Megadhel

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@heiqn said:

Wanda died to falling debris... Spider-Man eats Thanos punches and tank universal explosions and resist snap...

Not to mention she didn't live up to hype unlike Spider-Man who got legit 40+ lightning timing feats and 7 floor busting durability. Wanda at best scales Strange who got blitzed by the slow pathetic abomination called Gargantos...

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rajjarsalt

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#9  Edited By rajjarsalt

@rajjarsalt:

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Yeah I think he tied up her hands right at the end of the gif here.

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This one is pretty good too^

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The intent is there.. your mirror dimension stuff is further proof of what’s right in front of our eyes.

AHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH!

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mr-yes

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Obviously 🙄

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geekryan

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lol, find something more productive to do Raj.

If you spent this amount of time and effort on something else, you would've found a solution for climate change, a cure for cancer and solved world poverty/hunger and a cure for COVID while you were at it.

Good job tho ig.

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Gshshe

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You're right.

Anyway, in Civil War, Spider-Man and Wanda were almost equal, and Wanda has gone through two growths since

angry

https://youtu.be/Z-RMCM0NxaY

Darkhold

https://youtu.be/COO98Rg6iVU

But what about Spider-Man?

New suit

https://youtu.be/fSuZrDcUtts

Iron Spider-Man

https://youtu.be/X3x2zUunjl0

upgraded suit

https://youtu.be/ko-pvluFBEc

Spider Sense Awakening

https://youtu.be/jKIJ3tj72kU

a rise in combat power due to anger

https://youtu.be/fEWSgfNMkjE

Spider-Man has become stronger many times, which means he can easily crush Wanda.

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deactivated-644c7202b7524

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Spider-man is stronger, but wanda has Hax.

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Aystarr

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Raj, who is the Wanda fan that hurt you this bad?.

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rajjarsalt

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#17  Edited By rajjarsalt
@aystarr said:

Raj, who is the Wanda fan that hurt you this bad?.

Don't worry, dear Aystarr, I'm not on Nasser's payroll or anything, I'm just having fun

@death4bunnies has also taught me about Spider-Man having the powers of a spider, like hypnosis, which is a good counter to Wanda's TP since she's a girl

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yejj

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Bruh

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death4bunnies

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#19 death4bunnies  Moderator

@death4bunnies has also taught me about Spider-Man having the powers of a spider, like hypnosis, which is a good counter to Wanda's TP since she's a girl

Facts… Spider hypnosis works on the fairer sex.

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yejj

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Raj more like my dinner

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FromFurtherDisc

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#21  Edited By FromFurtherDisc

The Witch Wanda has some speed but Spidey has a level of precog, evasion, 'spider sense' and outright top speed where he can blitz her.

Although they turned her into a 'plot device' in Dr Strange Multiverse of Madness where she fights Xavier in telepathy and wins.

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lightyagamigod2

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Good thread and yea he is

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Justaxviel

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Justaxviel

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obsessed thor fanboy

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lightyagamigod2

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DarkRealm

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People unironically believe so.

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Justaxviel

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lightyagamigod2

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Justaxviel

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rajjarsalt

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lightyagamigod2

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lightyagamigod2

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#33  Edited By lightyagamigod2
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Justaxviel

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rajjarsalt

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#36  Edited By rajjarsalt
@justaxviel said:

@rajjarsalt : obsessed thor fanboy as usual

Verily have I put thee into the dirt before regarding that buttboy of an elder god, and now since it has been revealed that Wanda did not get his power...I am thy master! Not e'en Chthon can save thee now!

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Justaxviel

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"Verily have I put thee into the dirt before regarding that buttboy of an elder god"

Keep cry god of fanboy

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rajjarsalt

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"Verily have I put thee into the dirt before regarding that buttboy of an elder god"

Keep cry god of fanboy

I have defeated you, your fate is as how I see fit, for I have reduced "Elder Goddess Wanda" to dust, I am crying out of laughter at your abysmal state!

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death4bunnies

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#39 death4bunnies  Moderator

So far…..zero attempts to debunk…0 arguments against the premise of the OP.

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KryptonianKing88

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Strange and Wanda were both holding back in their respective fights with Spider-Man.

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death4bunnies

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#41 death4bunnies  Moderator

Strange and Wanda were both holding back in their respective fights with Spider-Man.

Spidey was also holding back, but y’all don’t want to factor that in.

In fact Spidey never attacked Strange like that, while Strange hit Spidey with a train, was frustrated using his arsenal of spells, turned the world upside down, brought in the Grand Canyon, and Spidey still won.

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Then again, you don’t accept anything you’ve seen Spidey do outright onscreen, you’ve called everything man’s done an outlier, from his raw lifts, his overpowering Cull outright in 2 separate movies.. even to him overpowering Buckys metal arm. … so maybe these are just more Spidey feats for you to disregard.

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KryptonianKing88

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@death4bunnies: Holding back limits Strange and Wanda a lot more than it does Peter. Strange goes from blocking black holes and attacks from Dormammu to throwing around trains and buildings. Same for Wanda, especially due to the nature of her powers, from ripping open Ultron's chest to struggling with a tower.

Then again, you don’t accept anything you’ve seen Spidey do outright onscreen, you’ve called everything man’s done an outlier, from his raw lifts,

Yeah no. I've never called any of his notable lifting feats outliers.

his overpowering Cull outright in 2 separate movies..

2 instances of him overpowering a high tier character (slightly moving Thanos doesn't count btw, everyone's done that) vs 40+ instances of him losing/being comparable to far less powerful characters

even to him overpowering Buckys metal arm. … so maybe these are just more Spidey feats for you to disregard.

Not an outlier, and not a good feat. Bucky was holding back. Same film has Cap and Iron Man stalemating him in raw strength

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death4bunnies

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#43 death4bunnies  Moderator

@death4bunnies: Holding back limits Strange and Wanda a lot more than it does Peter. Strange goes from blocking black holes and attacks from Dormammu to throwing around trains and buildings. Same for Wanda, especially due to the nature of her powers, from ripping open Ultron's chest to struggling with a tower.

Strange turned the world upside down, and tried to smash Spidey with buildings.. Spidey didn’t even try to punch him and Spidey blitzed him multiple times.. and proved the web incap will work. I contend based on that very showing Spidey tends to land web shots before the wizard can stop him.

He did it again right after he was hit by a train. Webs the box before strange could react.

Then again, you don’t accept anything you’ve seen Spidey do outright onscreen, you’ve called everything man’s done an outlier, from his raw lifts,

Yeah no. I've never called any of his notable lifting feats outliers.

his overpowering Cull outright in 2 separate movies..

2 instances of him overpowering a high tier character (slightly moving Thanos doesn't count btw, everyone's done that) vs 40+ instances of him losing/being comparable to far less powerful characters

Not A high tier.. it was controversial In one movie then happened again in the next.. SMH, like I said Spidey can’t have a feat.

even to him overpowering Buckys metal arm. … so maybe these are just more Spidey feats for you to disregard.

Not an outlier, and not a good feat. Bucky was holding back. Same film has Cap and Iron Man stalemating him in raw strength

Bucky was holding back too? And that’s why Spidey overpowered him? Lmao!! You can hear his metal arm writing and grinding.

And youve called this an outlier before… Bucky holding back is funny tho, as Spidey is clearly overpowering him.. plain as day.. Guidebooks back this.

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Not that overpowering Bucky is even close to his highend feats.

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It wasn’t Bucky holding back, clear on screen Spidey overpowers him.. plus Spidey has way way better feats that WS anyways.

Imo this proves my point, for whatever reason you can’t accept what Spidey has done onscreen.

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KryptonianKing88

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@death4bunnies:

Strange turned the world upside down, and tried to smash Spidey with buildings.. Spidey didn’t even try to punch him and Spidey blitzed him multiple times.. and proved the web incap will work. I contend based on that very showing Spidey tends to land web shots before the wizard can stop him.

Okay, still far weaker than his other showings.

Blocking a power stone blast >>>>>>>>>

Blocking Dormammu's blast >>>>>>>>>

I'm assuming you concede on Wanda since you didn't address her at all?

He did it again right after he was hit by a train. Webs the box before strange could react.

Bro your own gif shows Strange isn't even looking at him when the box gets webbed and pleading before Peter pulls it. Not a blitz.

Not A high tier.. it was controversial In one movie then happened again in the next..

Outliers can happen two, three, a thousand times. If it contradicts the vast majority of their showings its an outlier. And no mid tier is ripping apart the Hulkbuster.

Guidebooks back this.

Fair.

Imo this proves my point, for whatever reason you can’t accept what Spidey has done onscreen.

Denying it would be like for example if I were to use headcanon to say Hela destroyed Thor's hammer with magic. It's clear Spider-Man overpowered Cull Obsidian, it's just not at all consistent with his other feats.

I think the major point of contention is Cull Obsidian. I'll write a quick scale for him down below, If Spider-Man has any other feats putting him at Cull's level, then I can accept its not an outlier.

Cull tanked a hit from Mjolnir - Mjolnir blew a big hole in Jotunheim - calced at country level

Cull could hurt and tank attacks Iron Man - Iron Man tanked a meteor at sub rel speed - calced at Island level iirc. Iron Man made Thanos bleed, Thanos tanked wearing the IG, which was bare minimum 5.8 gigatons - island level.

Can you show any island to country level feats for Spider-Man to make his showings against Cull consistent? If you can't, don't bother replying.

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death4bunnies

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#45 death4bunnies  Moderator

@kryptonianking88:

Ofc I’m not conceding Wanda.. I already said he was holding back too… and webbed her hands while she was throwing cars at the kid.. his attack landed hers did not.. both holding back but one throwing cars one shooting webs and being agile and fast.

Same with strange and Spidey, Strange was throwing trains at him Spidey was webbing him up.

I showed multiple times Spidey and his webs outpaced strange not just that one(and he webbed in twice in the first gif, guess you think strange wasn’t paying attention for the second webbing too.



Webbed the box..”Don’t”…then webbed again ^

Hit by a train, greater distance away.. ^^ still gets the box first.

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And we already saw a web incap is good to beat Strange, left him hanging over the Grand Canyon for 8 hours.

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You are denying Spidey > Cull in strength tho.

Even after this.

And this.

And Spiderman redirecting the thrown taxi and sone more.

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Because you told me not to comment if I couldn’t beat Cull high ends with Spidey highends.. here^^ I can.. go ahead and call outlier.

Strength Pulls down Thanos arm..........Grabs Thanos head and bends him over.........

Striking Staggers Thanos with a kick......Staggers Thanos 3 more times

Dura Takes a viscous clothesline from Thanos .... Slammed by Thanos cracking the ground

Here are sone more to ignore^^

You listed 2 Cull feats, he was also stepped on by Giantman, floored by Panther, and blew up against wakandas barrier.. and repeatedly overpowered by my boy spidey.. I guess all but Spidey is now island level? Sorry I don’t accept a high tier that dies by getting stepped on by Giantman…

…plus all the feats you listed for Cull who Spidey directly overpowered are scaling feats

You listed 2 good feats for Cull

Tanking Mjolnir from cap and Ironman blasts are dura not strength(Spidey also took shot strait from a arc reactor)

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Ripping up HB 2 was accomplished by outriders.

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So in this thread alone you’ve tried to deny Spidey overpowering WS(you said WS was holding back like Spidey wasn’t), webbing Wanda in CW (you said Wanda was holding back like Spidey wasn’t), webbing strange(you said Strange was holding back Spidey wasn’t), Thanos feats(you said everyone did it), Overpowering cull in 2 movies(you said doesnt count cuz outlier)..

…like I said you just can’t seem to accept what the Spider has done onscreen…man can’t have a feat I swear.

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KryptonianKing88

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@kryptonianking88:

Ofc I’m not conceding Wanda.. I already said he was holding back too… and webbed her hands while she was throwing cars at the kid.. his attack landed hers did not.. both holding back but one throwing cars one shooting webs and being agile and fast.

So? Are you saying there's a greater power gap between suppressed/bloodlusted Wanda and suppressed/bloodlusted Spider-Man?

Same with strange and Spidey, Strange was throwing trains at him Spidey was webbing him up.

As I've said, throwing trains is nowhere near the full extent of Strange's power.

I showed multiple times Spidey and his webs outpaced strange not just that one(and he webbed in twice in the first gif, guess you think strange wasn’t paying attention for the second webbing too.

Webbed the box..”Don’t”…then webbed again ^

Tried to reason with him. Reaching really hard for a "blitz" here.

Hit by a train, greater distance away.. ^^ still gets the box first.

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And we already saw a web incap is good to beat Strange, left him hanging over the Grand Canyon for 8 hours.

——

You are denying Spidey > Cull in strength tho.

Yes. I'm not denying feats, I'm denying consistency.

Even after this.

And this.

And Spiderman redirecting the thrown taxi and sone more.

2 showings of Cull vs literally every other Spidey fight having him get bodied by wall to cityblock level attacks.

Building level bombs hurt him, Cap gives him a black eye, bullets hurt him while wearing armor, trains hurt him, etc.

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Because you told me not to comment if I couldn’t beat Cull high ends with Spidey highends.. here^^ I can.. go ahead and call outlier.

Fair, but I hope you don't mind if I call universal Spider-Man an outlier.

Strength Pulls down Thanos arm..........Grabs Thanos head and bends him over.........

Striking Staggers Thanos with a kick......Staggers Thanos 3 more times

Dura Takes a viscous clothesline from Thanos .... Slammed by Thanos cracking the ground

Here are sone more to ignore^^

Prove Thanos was going all out. I'm not gonna post gifs, but we all know everyone from Cap to Thor has staggered Thanos back.

You listed 2 Cull feats, he was also stepped on by Giantman,

And what anti feats does Giant Man have that makes losing to him a bad showing?

floored by Panther,

floored =/= hurt. Peter got floored by a bullet. Goblin who broke Peter's ribs got floored by a wall. Not an anti feat.

and blew up against wakandas barrier.. and

Feat for the barrier.

I guess all but Spidey is now island level? Sorry I don’t accept a high tier that dies by getting stepped on by Giantman…

Yes, I don't get the Giant Man disrespect.

…plus all the feats you listed for Cull who Spidey directly overpowered are scaling feats

lmao like "scaling feats" are any less valid.

You listed 2 good feats for Cull

Tanking Mjolnir from cap and Ironman blasts are dura not strength(Spidey also took shot strait from a arc reactor)

For simplicity sake, I just went with feats for a general tier.

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Ripping up HB 2 was accomplished by outriders.

Feat for them.

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So in this thread alone you’ve tried to deny Spidey overpowering WS(you said WS was holding back like Spidey wasn’t),

already conceded that

webbing Wanda in CW (you said Wanda was holding back like Spidey wasn’t),

no, there's a much bigger power jump from holding back to bloodlusted Wanda than holding back to enraged Peter.

webbing strange(you said Strange was holding back Spidey wasn’t),

ditto. Post #42

Thanos feats(you said everyone did it)

Yes. Almost everyone affected Thanos one way or another. Drax knocked him down. Cap staggered him. Nebula ragdolled him. And all of them "vicious" attacks from Thanos while he was holding back.

, Overpowering cull in 2 movies(you said doesnt count cuz outlier)..

…like I said you just can’t seem to accept what the Spider has done onscreen…man can’t have a feat I swear.

I don't deny he did it, I'm just denying consistency. I've said this like twice now.

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death4bunnies

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#47  Edited By death4bunnies  Moderator
@kryptonianking88 said:
@death4bunnies said:

@kryptonianking88:

Ofc I’m not conceding Wanda.. I already said he was holding back too… and webbed her hands while she was throwing cars at the kid.. his attack landed hers did not.. both holding back but one throwing cars one shooting webs and being agile and fast.

So? Are you saying there's a greater power gap between suppressed/bloodlusted Wanda and suppressed/bloodlusted Spider-Man?

Im saying they were both holding back and Spidey tagged Wanda with webs..while Wanda was trying to hit with cars and he dodged.. he gets that feat…and web incap a ok win condition.

Same with strange and Spidey, Strange was throwing trains at him Spidey was webbing him up.

As I've said, throwing trains is nowhere near the full extent of Strange's power.

You literally only mentioned shields..he doesn’t have to match thier raw power…but again doesn’t matter, they both have win conditions, but Spider man has pulled his off.. webbing Strange up.. he gets the feat.

I showed multiple times Spidey and his webs outpaced strange not just that one(and he webbed in twice in the first gif, guess you think strange wasn’t paying attention for the second webbing too.

Webbed the box..”Don’t”…then webbed again ^

Tried to reason with him. Reaching really hard for a "blitz" here.

Got webbed twice.

Hit by a train, greater distance away.. ^^ still gets the box first.

Gonna ignore this…again..???kek

——

And we already saw a web incap is good to beat Strange, left him hanging over the Grand Canyon for 8 hours.

——

You are denying Spidey > Cull in strength tho.

Yes. I'm not denying feats, I'm denying consistency.

Sure, he has consistently webbed up magic users who need their hands.

Even after this.

And this.

And Spiderman redirecting the thrown taxi and sone more.

2 showings of Cull vs literally every other Spidey fight having him get bodied by wall to cityblock level attacks.

All Cull has is scaling and scales below Spiderman, plus spider has ton more than Cull, both scaling and raw feats, you just refuse to accept the feats.

Building level bombs hurt him, Cap gives him a black eye, bullets hurt him while wearing armor, trains hurt him, etc.

*Caps shield.

*Bomb after he fights his equal that punches him a bunch of times and power bombs him through six stories,, he tanked the bomb later.

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Because you told me not to comment if I couldn’t beat Cull high ends with Spidey highends.. here^^ I can.. go ahead and call outlier.

Fair, but I hope you don't mind if I call universal Spider-Man an outlier.

I don’t, but you seem to dismiss all Spidey feats in favor of Cull feats, I wonder if Cull is allowed to have outliers, or if his 2 impressive feats solo everything Spidey has done(better scaling feats, directly overpowered Cull, and better raw non scaling lifts)

Strength Pulls down Thanos arm..........Grabs Thanos head and bends him over.........

Striking Staggers Thanos with a kick......Staggers Thanos 3 more times

Dura Takes a viscous clothesline from Thanos .... Slammed by Thanos cracking the ground

Here are sone more to ignore^^

Prove Thanos was going all out. I'm not gonna post gifs, but we all know everyone from Cap to Thor has staggered Thanos back.

Thats like me saying prove cap was going all out against Cull,.. you’ve claimed everyone was holding back against Spidey so he can’t get a feat.. you said the exact same about winter soilder, Muh holding back.

You listed 2 Cull feats, he was also stepped on by Giantman,

And what anti feats does Giant Man have that makes losing to him a bad showing?

He only weighs so much.. island level stomp? Mjolnir +++ level stomp?

floored by Panther,

floored =/= hurt. Peter got floored by a bullet. Goblin who broke Peter's ribs got floored by a wall. Not an anti feat.

Bruh, cull was down.. you think panther reps on Hulk?

and blew up against wakandas barrier.. and

Feat for the barrier.

That outriders crawled through.

I guess all but Spidey is now island level? Sorry I don’t accept a high tier that dies by getting stepped on by Giantman…

Yes, I don't get the Giant Man disrespect.

Its not disrespect, but hes not stepping on Hulk like that, Cull is not a high tier.. high tiers don’t die to barriers and footsteps.

…plus all the feats you listed for Cull who Spidey directly overpowered are scaling feats

lmao like "scaling feats" are any less valid.

They are fine, but you refuse to give Spidey his scaling feats..I show Spidey overpower cull in 2 movies.. he scales above..that’s how scaling works…Spidey can’t get his scaling feats while Cull lives off his.

You listed 2 good feats for Cull

Tanking Mjolnir from cap and Ironman blasts are dura not strength(Spidey also took shot strait from a arc reactor)

For simplicity sake, I just went with feats for a general tier.

2 decent feats against Spidey overpowering him twice, dying twice in ways high tiers wouldn’t, getting floored by panther…etc etc.

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Ripping up HB 2 was accomplished by outriders.

Feat for them.

Spidey took out 20+ in seconds.. one he killed by just jumping on it.. consistent with spidey being on the level of people who can harm HB2.

——-

So in this thread alone you’ve tried to deny Spidey overpowering WS(you said WS was holding back like Spidey wasn’t),

already conceded that

My point is there is a pattern of you not accepting clear cut Spidey feats.

webbing Wanda in CW (you said Wanda was holding back like Spidey wasn’t),

no, there's a much bigger power jump from holding back to bloodlusted Wanda than holding back to enraged Peter.

So? He can dodge and web her hands, he doesn’t need to match her raw power to win.. he has that feat(dodging and webbing) against at least CW Wanda…factually

webbing strange(you said Strange was holding back Spidey wasn’t),

ditto. Post #42

Again so what if Strange has more raw power? Spidey has the speed and ability to win via incap..we saw him do it, he has that feat against at least NWH Strange ..factually

Thanos feats(you said everyone did it)

Yes. Almost everyone affected Thanos one way or another. Drax knocked him down. Cap staggered him. Nebula ragdolled him. And all of them "vicious" attacks from Thanos while he was holding back.

Seem like good feats, I wonder if they also get another dozen onscreen fights/feats ignored.

, Overpowering cull in 2 movies(you said doesnt count cuz outlier)..

…like I said you just can’t seem to accept what the Spider has done onscreen…man can’t have a feat I swear.

I don't deny he did it, I'm just denying consistency. I've said this like twice now.

Yeah in this thread you’re denying half a dozen on screen Spidey fights, I’ve legit never seen another character treated this way. .. I really need to just make a video of people calling every Spidey fight an outlier.

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Justaxviel

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AngelJax

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In the eyes of Incels, yes

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rajjarsalt

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@rajjarsalt: whatever to make you sleep thor fanboy

Atleast I am sleeping, whereas Wanda's wishes keep thee e'er awake!