Is Hunter X Hunter Overrated?

@gearsecond659: No, 3 months is not that long. And he wasn't alone/by himself for that time, he followed ace and sabo. Even if they found him as a nuisance, he was still there. I am not saying that was lonely but not as bad as you are making it out to seem.

Perhaps I should clarify. Luffy following Ace and Sabo around is his desperate attempt to escape loneliness. BEing abused by Ace and Sabo was nothing compared to being alone, so that's why Luffy followed Ace and Sabo. So, while I can concede Luffy wasn't alone for the three months, initially he was lonely as he wasn't familiar with anyone and, in an effort to stop being alone, Luffy followed Ace.

Compassion for becoming a pirate and to prove himself to shanks. Asset his pride? He was a small kid. When ace spat on him, why didn't he exert his pride there? When Dadan didn't give him proper food, why didn't he exert his pride there? He was too young for that. It was more about proving yourself to shanks.

First of all, there is a between pride and entitlement. Pride is "a becoming or dignified sense of what is due to oneself or one's position or character." Entitlement is the "belief that one is deserving of or entitled to certain privileges." Luffy doesn't share the ladder mentality, as if he did, he wouldn't feel the need to prove himself. He would feel that he just deserves to be a pirate, end of story, no questions asked. On the other hand, Luffy believes himself to be worthy of being a pirate, but that's a feeling he himself as and as such, he feels the need to prove himself to show Shanks how strong he is from both a physical and mental standpoint. In other words, he is asserting his pride.

The scenarios you bring up are a prime example of you taking out context. As I said before, Luffy was more than willing to be abused by Ace, let alone spat on. Luffy letting this takes place is purely an example of how far he is willing to go to stay away from being lonely.

In regards to Dadan... WTF?! Do you think Luffy some spoiled rich kid? Luffy would eat anything as long as it puts food in his stomach. What you listed an example of entitlement, feeling deserving of privileges, such as 'proper food.'

Dude, I did read what you said. And I also said he threw away that pride for his friends. Now, if a man like Zoro can do that, then why won't luffy who was already more forgiving and loving, won't do it. As I have been saying before, Luffy will always throw his pride away when his friends are in danger/in trouble.

Don't jump the gun on that one. Zoro only threw away his pride for LUFFY. Not Sanji or Nami or any other Straw Hat. Just LUFFY, and that's because Luffy gave him a purpose. Zoro was ready to accept his death, but Luffy freed him and reignited his dream of becoming the greatest swordsman. In my eyes, I see this as Zoro paying Luffy back more than anything. Zoro isn't exactly the sentimental type anyway.

I didn't even deny Zoro threw away his pride but for what? His friends. Luffy did the same thing for Sanji. The difference between the 2 instances is that for Luffy, it is not about pride but for Zoro it was.

First off, no. Zoro threw away his pride purely for Luffy's sake and I've explained this wasn't exactly out of friendship. And yes, Luffy threw away his pride for Sanji. You admitting that just proves my argument, but I digress.

Oh and it was about pride with Luffy as I've already established.

Lol, this is now you assuming what hurt his pride and what didn't. His fight with Ussop, he did fight back but Ussop still raised his hand on his captain. In the Sanji fight, he didn't fight back but Sanji still hurt him. And do you know why he hit Ussop? As you said, he hit Ussop because Ussop challenged him and he respected that. In the sanji fight, Sanji just attacked him from nowhere. Why would he hurt a dear friend for nothing? LUFFY IS NOT LIKE THAT.

This is not the same thing. Usopp fighting back against Luffy isn't disrespectful because Usopp asked for a duel, and in a duel all bets are off. In a duel, it doesn't matter if one is the captain and the other is the lowest tier of the crew, in a duel, they are equals. Two men fighting over what they believe is right. That's what a duel is. And in a duel setting, Usopp has the right to hit Luffy, and in a duel setting, Luffy can hit Usopp without guilt because he asked for this to take place, and Luffy must protects his pride as captain. If Luffy lost the fight, imagine how that would have affected the Straw Hats. They would have lost faith in him. So Luffy fighting back and Usopp hitting Luffy are both justified by the fact that it took place in a duel setting.

With Sanji, he didn't ask for a duel, so right off the bat, him attacking Luffy is a sign of disrespect to the captain. And Luffy isn't exactly the person to just fight his friends if they attack him without reason. This is why Nami gets away with hitting him all the time. So, because it wasn't a duel, Sanji attacking Luffy was a sign of disrespect and Luffy wouldn't attack because it's his friend, and only under specific circumstances, such as a duel, would Luffy fight his own friend.

For evidence, just look at Luffy's fights with Ace and Sabo. After befriending them, Luffy would always fight Ace and Sabo in a duel setting. This was the only setting Luffy would try and best his friends. Outside of that, they had each others backs and would give their lives for each other.

And Luffy wsn' knocked out, he was knocked down. Luffy has amazing pain tolerance and has taken worse before and not been knocked out. if he was serious knocked out, he wouldn't have been able to get back up on his feet and yelled to Sanji that he knew that Sanji never meant what he said. Luffy declared that he would wait for Sanji and would gladly starve to death if he does not return. Luffy went on saying that he would not eat any food unless it is made by Sanji's hand.

Luffy did in fact briefly lose consciousness, so take that and phrase that as you will. And even if he didn't knock Luffy out, the fact still stands that he disrespected Luffy as I've explained above.

You are generalizing it as well. fyYou want it to hurt his "pride" so you keep saying it did. When even luffy didn't feel it hurt his pride. He knew something was wrong with his brother and took that punishment quietly.

I don't understand what you mean by this. Elaborate please.

Lol, Luffy follows his heart when it comes to doing the right thing. As I told you before, he was going to accept Ussop as soon as possible but still took Zoro advice about waiting until Ussop apologizes. He didn't follow his heart there, he followed his friends advice.

NO! N to the friggin O. Luffy does follow his heart. Are you joking? There are millions of times where Nami has suggested that they goto a safer island than the one Luffy chose or where one of the smarter Straw Hats tried to talk Luffy out of making an irrational decision, and Luffy didn't listen to any of it. You know why? Because he followed his friggin heart! It's not as simple as taking advice from a friend because Luffy doesn't just follow advice without seeing its justifiability in his own mind. So no, no NO! This is not true.

I know what character development is. Calm down. Character development also means growth and changes in a character. Luffy hasn't had many of these changed and it has been 20 years of one piece. What development has he had?

Really? I mean really?

Luffy has had plenty of development. Luffy doesn't kill his enemies, because as Oda puts it, letting his enemies see their dreams die is a far more fitting punishment. He is prideful, overconfident, and follows his heart, all of which are too his detriment because of he disregards logic and just follows his emotions. Luffy's backstory paints him as someone who surrounds himself with a lot of people as human shields against loneliness. Luffy is someone who, will risk his life for his friends, but who values pride and dreams above even his own life. I can go on and on. Luffy is truly a well crafted character.

And before you say"everyone feels loneliness so it's not legitimate," there are very few people who would be willing to get beaten to a bloody pulp in order not to sell out there friends and be alone. So consider that.

It is not mainly about pride but adventure. If Oda revealed to us that One Piece actually exists, which no one does, then it will take away from the excitement of the story. That is what Oda confirmed there. I am not saying it isn't at all about pride as well but not as much as you think it is.

It is about pride. The whole goddamn story is about pride. Ace's death was fueled by pride for his crew. Sengoku and Akainu both feel an intense pride for the Marines. I mean you can't tell me this story is more about adventure than pride when not just Luffy, but every damn character such as Zoro and Shanks feels an intense sense of pride. One Piece isn't as much a story about adventure, but a story about pride, about how far people are willing to protect that pride, such as with Sengoku fighting off Blackbeard, with Akainu killing Ace and trying to kill Luffy, with Luffy not sacrificing his pride for a close friend.

Show me again please? Please, go ahead. Or are you talking about the Rayleigh moment again wich you keep assuming is about pride when it is not?

Okay this is what I mean by you disrespecting Luffy. Are you so serious as to just chalk up Luffy's character development to just being an energetic fun loving kid with a sense of adventure? That's how low you think of him? I mean you have to be able to read in between the lines, my dude. I mean when you examine what Luffy says, it is clearly about pride. I mean do you need Oda to spell it out for you?

How are you equating the 2 here? Luffy didn't follow his heart when he fought Ussop? He followed his heart when he saved Ace, sure. And even after he beat Ussop, he wanted to bring him back but why didn't he? He didn't follow his heart there, he followed logic. When he wanted to bring Ussop back after the cp 9 arc, he didn't immediately bring ussop back, he waited because of advice.

*face palms*

If Luffy followed logic over his heart, how would you explain him fighting Zoro in Whiskey Peak. Through logic, I would think Luffy would listen to what Zoro had to say before attacking him as Zoro has proven himself to be a worthy crewmate. But, because Zoro attacked the people who fed him delicious food, Luffy followed his emotions and attacked Zoro.

Again, getting beaten is not the problem, getting hit is. It doesn't matter how far Sanji took it, he hit him and that was wrong. That is what Ussop did as well. To the point where luffy was injured as well. Both instances, his pride was hurt.

I've already countered this above. But I have to say, you really are taking out the context here.

I am not the one making theories here, you are. So why would I need Oda approval when I am not the one doing that? And credible by who? Fans like you? Lol, that is not proof, that is an opinion. Significant evidence? Maybe you mean you have your OPINION of that evidence. Just like I would have mine.

Have you watched the friggin video? Joy Boy presents multiple pieces of evidence from the manga. That's what I friggin mean. I mean you are so stubborn that you won't even watch a 15 minute video. That's insane.

Watch the video and actually acknowledge the evidence I've given you, then we'll talk.

And "perceived"? Lol, no wonder you have no proof.

I have no proof?

Okay dude. Keep telling yourself that.

Ussop hit him for pride, Sanji hit him for his family. In both cases, Luffy was hurt. Why can't you see this? In both cases, his pride was hurt. And in both cases, he easily forgave his friends.

Why can't you generalize the situation and take the context of both fights into account before universally labeling them, "the same."

@blacklegraph: Not really , HxH (anime , don't know about the manga cause I haven't read it ) has better pacing than One piece .

Not having an overarching story is not bad (it could be taken as one of the suspense of the series) . Though currently it has an overarching story which is exploring the dark continent and uncovering its secrets which is the current arc . And it does have story progression even though it doesn't have an overarching plot . It has good pacing , important things happen in the arcs . One piece has an overarching story but never touches it .

All the arcs are connected and have importance . The main characters develop a lot . Not having screen time does not equate to character development . Characters in HxH have ample of character development .

I like HxH because of the reasons I told you . I don't like One piece because of the reasons I told you . You think differently then me , maybe you have a different definition for story progression , either way , the reasons I don't like one piece do not exist in HxH (at least for me) . And even if they do , they are not as severe as what One Piece has .

Why is there a one piece discussion here?

@gearsecond659: Did I deny that? I am just saying that to say his loneliness was "bad" is a stretch. It was lonely for him but not as much as you have been claiming. So you concede - thanks.

Don't get carried away now. My argument still stands as Luffy was lonely for a few days, but, because he absolutely hated the feeling, he decided to follow Ace, despite being abused. So you haven't won yet :).

Edita: Your welcome

Again, I am not denying there is no pride in what he did but pride wasn't on his mind at the time. He wanted to prove how strong and brave he was and that was it. Lol, that spit incident proved my point - pride was not on his mind when HE WAS A CHILD. And yes, he wanted to be ace friend but if he was as prideful as you claimed, even as a child, he would have fought back like when he told dadan and the bandits he hates them.

Pride most certainly was on his mind. Proving how strong and brave you are is asserting your pride. And the spat incident doesn't prove your point. I already established that Luffy responding to that would be as a result of entitlement, which Luffy does not have. Moreover, Luffy doesn't care if he's disrespected. He gets insulted all the time by villians, and he just disregards it. And those are from VILLIANS. Luffy doesn't care if he is insulted, so no, he would not fight back against Ace and Sabo.

The food incident was to show you that he didn't care about back when he was young. He even told dadan why ace had a bigger piece and Dadan told him because ace caught it and that is all he will get, he shut up and ate it. There was no sign of pride there.

First of all, Luffy asking why he had less food than Ace was purely because of the fact that Luffy likes food, and since he was hungry, he wanted more food. And, again, this is not a good example. Luffy didn't complain not because he has no pride but because, in his mind, that made since. Ace getting more food was justified in his eyes. As I said before, I think you are getting confused between entitlement and pride. IF Luffy were to complain after this, it would suggest that he feels, despite Ace catching the animal, that he deserves more food, which is entitlement.

Accprfn to what did he only do it for Luffy? Where are you getting this garbage from? He is good friends with all his crewmates, maybe except sanji and trusts them fully. This is why he said that they all promise to meet after 2 years. HE DID IT FOR ALL OF THEM. This is you making this up, if you have proof, show me? Coming back to my point - if zoro was able to do that, why won't someone who is much more sympathetic, caring and loving than he won't? This is what you are not getting - Luffy will throw away his pride if his friends are in danger or need help.

As I've said before, Zoro is doing this for Luffy. Even when he was defeated by Mihawk, he didn't promise to never lose to Nami or Usopp. He promised Luffy that he'd never lose, which to me, highlights that Luffy is the one he is willing to make the most sacrifices for. Sure, he'd make sacrifices for the rest of the crew, but at the end of the day, Zoro would make the most for Luffy. And no, before Totoland, I don't think Luffy would sacrifice his pride as captain to save his friends. Think about it this way. Do you think, if Nami was about to be executed and the only way out was to join another crew, that Luffy would do the ladder. I think Luffy would try to find another way before giving up on his pride as captain of his own crew.

So, asking you captain in a serious duel isn't bad? Infact, it is worse because you go up to their face and tell them they want to fight and leave the crew. That will not only hurt someone feeling but their pride as well. And do you even remember how rude Ussop was to luffy before they fought or did that somehow skip your mind? He didn't only insult luffy but the whole gang. That is literally worse than what Sanji did.

No it is not. In the One Piece world, duels are honorable matches between two or more men. From Luffy vs Foxy to Ace vs Sabo vs Luffy, and to Luffy vs Usopp, duels are a respected and honorable way of settling the differences between two or more parties, or sometimes, they can be used to measure one's strength against another. In a setting such as this, attacking your captain is allowed. As for insults, like I said before, Luffy is even insulted by his crewmates so insults don't even matter.

And please, Luffy's feelings are going to get hurt...

The difference between Usopp's and Sanji's fights with Luffy are simple. One took place in a duel setting where such actions are allowed, the other was not and therefore, was a prime example of a crewmate stepping out of line and not recognizing Luffy as an authoritative figure.

Again, calling your captain out like that is worse than what sanji did. Sanji hurt luffy physically, Ussop hurt him emotionally and physically.

Again, Sanji and Usopp attacking Luffy are different because of the context in which they fought their captain.

As for Luffy getting hurt emotionally...

The ace and Sabo reference doesn't make sense. Luffy didn't insult ace and sabo like Ussop did and in that fight, things weren't as serious as it were with Ussop. So I don't understand why you made this reference.

You are missing the point. I wasn't suggesting that the level of intensity was the same when Luffy would fight Ace and Sabo and when Luffy fought Usopp. No, not at all. However, what I am saying is that Luffy was friends with Ace, Sabo, and Usopp, and outside of a duel setting, Luffy never fought either of them. Outside of duels, Ace, Sabo, and Luffy always had each others back. Same with Usopp, outside of duels, Luffy and Usopp were essentially family, always looking out for another. This harkens back to the concept of the duel, a place where you can fight in a fair one on one match, with no hard feelings, or if you decide, very hard feelings, but no matter the outcome, it was done in a respectful manner. Sanji was the only one of Luffy's friends to fight Luffy outside of a duel setting, and as such, it is a sign of disrespect. To put it even more into perspective. when Luffy fights people such as Crocodile, he doesn't ask for a duel. He just fights him, which shows how little Luffy thinks of Crocodile and vice versa. Asking Crocodile for a duel, while probably not changing their relationship, would still be a gesture of respect to one another.

How do you know he lost consciousness? He might have been tired. We don't know what happend so how can you claim that? Luffy has one of the highest pain tolerance we have seen so far. Do you forget his fight with Rob, where he was battered worse than this and was still awake? And that was pre-time skip.

What? So Luffy just went to sleep in the middle of a fight? Okay... (NOPE!)

In regards to Luffy's pain tolerance, yea he has high pain tolerance, but not even he could tank multiple kicks from Sanji. Sanji's kicks are hella powerful, so it is reasonable to conclude that this would do some serious damage to Luffy.

And Luffy's high pain tolerance was shown in the fight. Before being knocked out, Luffy held his ground. He was determined, trying to power through the pain. But, there is only so much that one can do before their bodies give out, so pain tolerance will only carry you so far.

Also, are you saying that Rob Lucci is more powerful than post timeskip Sanji? Sanji's kick can oneshot a Pacifista, which can casually tank attacks from Gear Second Luffy, which is on the same level as Rob Lucci. Sanji deals out more damage than Rob Lucci, and this can not be contested.

What I meant by that was you want things to hurt luffy's "pride" so you can use that as facts.

I don't want it to hurt Luffy's pride. It does hurt Luffy's pride. If anything, I think you don't want it to hurt Luffy's pride.

Lol and there are times as well where he follows advice as well. And how are comparing things related to his friends to a safe/unsafe island? How do the 2 things colorate? As I said, he wanted to being Ussop back as immediately as possible after they rescued Robin but Zoro told him to wait and let Ussop apologize. As I said, he follows his heart but he takes advice as well. THIS IS NOT THAT HARD.

There is a correlation. Luffy disregarding rational advice to not goto an unsafe island is proof that Luffy follows his hearts and desires. I mean during the Doflamingo fight, Luffy disregarded Law's advice, who is a friend of Luffy's, and launched an assault on Doflamingo with his Red Hawk.

For Luffy, following advice and taking advice have a direct correlation. He won't follow advice just for the sake of following it. If he decides to follow advice, then he knows in his heart that that is the thing he wants to do. As such, it is basically fact that Luffy shared the same mindset as Zoro. THIS IS NOT THAT HARD.

To further prove my point, Chopper was trying to get Luffy to acknowledge Usopp's pleads, but Luffy didn't listen because he shared the same opinion as Zoro.

Lol, he has been doing that since he was a child. But I admit, let me say he has character development but that he is a static character. Is that fine with you?

He does have character development, but I just can't agree that he is a static character. The thing is that most people agree with you because, as much as I love Oda, he is very subtle with his character development. But, once you realize what Oda has established, you just find that Luffy is a very complex character.

Of course, there is the pride factor int he story but that is true WILL ALL STORY, to a degree. But that instant was not all about pride as well. it was about finding out/figuring out something yourself. THAT IS THE SENSE OF ADVENTURE and that is why oda does such good world building.

The same could be said about the sense of adventure. You see that theme in all kinds of mediums from movies to cartoons to comics to even other Shounen. And, if you're talking about the Rayleigh scene, I don't think that it was about finding yourself. What did Luffy find out about himself from shutting down Usopp? The scene was really about Luffy asserting his pride to Rayleigh and Usopp, telling them that their journey holds no meaning to them if he becomes Pirate King through "cheating."

That is the main premise of luffy's character though - an energetic fun loving kid with a sense of adventure. That is his main basis. I know he has all those other emotions but that statement you just made - described luffy perfectly. And that hasn't changed much till now.

There is so much more to Luffy than just an energetic fun loving kid. I mean couldn't you say the same thing about Gon. That he's a "energetic fun loving kid?" Now look what he turned into. He turned into a heartless murder with a twisted sense of morality. You are looking at things at face value, and in the process, are missing all of the other great qualities about Luffy.

So you are saying luffy WANTED TO FIGHT USSOP? Wanted to hurt his best friend? What is what his heart wanted? When luffy fought zoro in whisket island, it was more due to rage and hatred. He thought that Zoro had killed everyone in the town because they did not make his favorite food. And as you said before, Luffy don't kill and he doesn't like people who hurt/kill the innocent.

Luffy didn't want to fight Usopp. Out of respect for his friend and to maintain his pride as captain, Luffy fought Usopp. Not because he wanted to. If he wanted to, he wouldn't have cried at the end of the fight.

What was so hard for you to understand here? Luffy not wanting to hear is because he is a knucklehead and at the time, he was filled with rage. People, even in the real world, do stupid shit in rage that they will NEVER do. So does that mean their heart wants to do that?

Luffy has never jumped to conclusions like this before. And Luffy also trusted Zoro, as at this point, they were truly forming a captain-vice captain bond. I don't think you can just make that leap of logic to justify Luffy attempting to knock out his own friend. I mean, he essentially chose the people of Whiskey Peak over his own friend just because the people of Whiskey PEak fed him delicious food.

I did watch him and in the comment section of one of his video, he says that IT IS ONLY A THEORY, NOT A FACT. He is not actual proof and for you to be using him as "evidence" shows that you have NO ACTUAL PROOF. Theories are NOT PROOF.

Just because Joy Boy said the theory was a theory doesn't mean the evidence is not true. Evidence is evidence, plain and simple. And I was not using him as evidence. I was simply using him as a way of giving you perspective. And please, the fact that you are looking to the comment section and not at the actual video as a counter argument shows that you have no answer for the evidence that he has presented.

In the end, I think you looking at Luffy at face value has prevented you from gaining full insight into his character.

@gearsecond659:Never said I won. My point was to prove he was never that alone and that is STILL RIGHT. Luffy making friends is his nature, that is why he made friends with shanks and his crew. That and he loved their pirate ways.

I never said pride was not on his mind but he was trying to prove himself, not show how much pride he has. He was desperate to go on an adventure with them so it was more of a desperate move than anything.

Now the ace thing. When ace first spit on him, they looked at each other angrily. On after ace left, luffy followed because he wanted to be friends. Now, you can look at this in 2 ways - Luffy didn't have pride back them or, he threw away his pride to be friends with ace as he wanted to be on ace's good side. Either way, this proves my point to a degree - Luffy is more lenient when it comes to his friend and doesn't let things hurt his pride (as easily) when his friends are involved.

Another thing you forget - when luffy was trying to be Ace's friend, ace did horrible things to him. He knocking a tree down at Luffy. Knocked Luffy off the bridge. Tied Luffy to a tree and tried to kill him. If you don't understand what point I am trying to make - Luffy is much more forgiving of people he cares about.

First of all, Zoro wants to be the best swordsman for himself. Now, you are talking about the past when they had just started. Now, Zoro has very good friends who are his family. That is why, before the time skip, when Luffy and Brooks are carrying Zoro to safety after him getting beat by Kizaru, he tells them to leave him and save themselves because the Pacisfista were coming. Again, he has loyalty to Luffy, like all the other straw hats do. But, he bows his heads to near let what happened at Sabaody with Kizaru.

If Nami were to be killed, how do you know he wouldn't? Heck, because of Nami, he attacked Arlong even though she was about to leave the crew. If she was about to be killed, you never know what he would have done. He was risking his life to free her from Arlong and on that fight, he did suffer many injuries.

Insults don't matter? Why are you downplaying this? This duel between Ace and Sabo or Luffy were not as serious as it was with Ussop. How are you not seeing this? Ussop challenged Luffy's authority, hurt his feeling by saying that luffy just uses and abandon people/friends and then asked for a duel. THIS WAS NOT A FRIENDLY DUEL, IT HAD LOTS OF EMOTIONS BEHIND IT. He didn't duel luffy for fun, he literally dueled him to tell him that he was leaving the crew because he thought less of luffy.

Lol, sanji attacking him was disrespectful, I am not denying that but what Ussop did was equally as worse if not more. You don't seem to understand - once you call your caption out like ussop did and fight him all out, you do disrespect him. Because you are telling him that you want to leave as he was not a good leader. Especially the way Ussop did with Luffy. That is what I am trying to explain to you - he hurt luffy both emotionally/psychologically while Sanji only hurt him physically. Do you get it now?

He was literally crying after the fight and heartbroken.... It is like you don't even know what you are talking about.

Again, Luffy and Ussop duel was about breaking off their friendship and going their own ways. Sabo/Ace didn't fight luffy for that reason, it was to get better/fun. This fight wasn't - it was about Luffy's decision about the boat and Ussop calling his captain's order and asking him for a fight. Do you see the difference?

Here. Luffy says he is fine with Sanji hitting him. He even tells Nami to shut up:

http://www.mangabb.co/one-piece/chapter-844/12

Luffy saing he is not moving an inch. He is doing WHAT HE WANTS AND THIS HAS NOT HURT THIS PRIDE AS YOU KEEP CLAMING. Ironically, this is after sanji calls them trash and thugs. Are you seeing similarities with the Ussop thing now? Infact, the Ussop thing was worse BECAUSE USSOP MEANT ALL HE SAID, SANJI DIDN'T:

http://www.mangabb.co/one-piece/chapter-844/14

Now for the KO part. Luffy was not sleeping, he was beaten and tired. You know, how someone is beaten and can't move so they lay there for a while. or have you never seen this before? Did you also forget that he was tired from the cracker fight? If he did actually pass out, he would have been GONE. We have seen this many times after his big fights and this was after one of his biggest fight. As I said before, he was done for ONLY A FEW PANELS, and then gets back up.

http://www.mangabb.co/one-piece/chapter-844/15

http://www.mangabb.co/one-piece/chapter-844/16

http://www.mangabb.co/one-piece/chapter-844/17

And no one is comparing anything. But you seem to forget that the luffy who fought Rob was MUCH MUCH WEAKER than the luffy now. Heck, that luffy had just developed gear 2 and 3 and didn't have fully mastery of them yet. Yet, he fought and beat blueno and then fought Rob, who destroyed him in their fight. And he still didn't pass out until the end. And that was a pre-time Luffy.

I have proven you WRONG with proof from the manga. Luffy knew what he was doing full well. HE WAS FOLLOWING HIS HEART. It did disrespect him but didn't hurt his pride.

Wrong again. Luffy wanted to bring Ussop back AS SOON AS POSSIBLE. Maybe proof from the manga will help:

Now, he does follow his heart but that is when he sees people in distress or mistreated. That is why he attacked Doffy, because he saw him getting treated like dirt. Now for the Ussop thing. Luffy, Nami, and Chopper wanted him to rejoin immediately and planned to invite him back but Zoro insisted that Luffy should be a firm captain on his position, and Usopp shouldn't return so easily as he should return on their terms, not his. Zoro even threatened to leave the crew if Usopp was allowed to rejoin without asking for forgiveness for his behavior. Luffy understood this message and agreed with Zoro's view of the situation.

http://www.mangabb.co/one-piece/chapter-438/4

http://www.mangabb.co/one-piece/chapter-438/5

In his heart, he wanted Ussop back. Most of the crew did. But he listened to Zoro. They all did. You keep saying he felt the same deep in his heart - that excuse is bullshit and not supported by anything but your OWN logic. Luffy does follow his heart, we all know that but in that instance, HE FOLLOWED LOGIC AN ADVICE.

When Ussop challenged Luffy, he wouldn't listen to anyone because HE WAS CHALLENGED. Ussop challenged his leadership and insulted his decision. And it wasn't a fake thing, HE MEANT IT, UNLIKE SANJI. Luffy didn't want to fight Ussop but he had no choice.

I find his character very static but I respect your opinion. Let's leave it at that.

But it wouldn't be cheating. If he had told him that the One Piece was ACTUALLY REAL, it would take the fun out of the adventure. That was the main point here. There was no need to insert his pride there, it doesn't make sense. What he did shows Rayleigh that he is a man who wants to find out things on his own, on his own ability. This is why I keep saying that it was more about adventure/learning the truth for yourself than about pride.

Gon is the same and I don't like his character as well. I find him as the same generic characters we have seen. And when he turned adult gon, there was context behind it. In fact, if you put Luffy in his place, the same could have happened. Luffy would have been broken to see one of his best friends as a puppet.

He never jumped to a conclusion like that before because he didn't think anyone murdered a whole village like he thought Zoro did. He though Zoro had killed everyone and that is what made him do what he did. He was in rage, didn't want to listen to a thing and acted on his emotions. This is the same thing when he didn't listen to Law and attacked doffy. Luffy is a very emotional person and will act on them without thinking about it. Sometimes, it is not about following your heart, it is doing a rash thing on impulse.

Lol, just because 1 person sees something as 1 way, doesn't mean another person will. You keep saying evidence, evidence - that is his interpretation of the evidence. And his interpretation of that evidence is STILL HIS OPINION. IT IS NOT A FACT.

@gearsecond659: PM as in private message? Cool and yeah, we were writitng quite alot, not to mention it has nothing to do with the subject matter.

@blacklegraph: Anime and manga are literally the same . But ok . I just want to say one thing cause I have derailed a lot from the topic .

Volume 22 of one piece and we just enter alabasta . Volume 22 of HxH and we literally have meruem on the cover . I think that should be enough to say about pacing .

And one piece has little to no character development . The straw hats are underdeveloped with the main 3 being the exact same they were when in the beginning of the series .

@blacklegraph: The significance is that Alabasta is the FIRST MAJOR arc in the entire series . While all the arcs in HxH were very important . The main three are Luffy , Zoro and Sanji to me .

Well , i already said , I am derailing from the thread therefore I am not arguing about character development in one piece . I am just gonna stop and I still stand by my statement on the character development of one piece.Ican explain what I mean't but i don't want to and this is not the thread for that . Character development is one of the reasons why I dropped it after Zou arc .

@pipxeroth: Something like this. There are some good anime, not all though,

The manga list is honestly much better

I don’t see why it gets all of the positive feedback that it does.