Is Captain America a cheater for taking Super Soldier Serum?

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Gokluma

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I'm just wondering after so many claims of Steve Rogers as a cheater/loser/many more insults for taking Super Soldier Serum at becoming into The super soldier in world war 2 against nazis/hydra.

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kgb725

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Cheating at what

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deactivated-61215780523f9

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It was more to do with ''his fighting spirit'' than his physical capabilities, which is part of the reason he was chosen iirc. He didn't really ''cheat'' in any sort of way imo.

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KingOfWakanda

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He did it to serve his country. The man is a patriot.

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Yassassin

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Is Steve trying to qualify the Olympics or something?

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deactivated-5d6b913edbeeb

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I think his wish was to serve his country,not to get stronger.I felt his character was always be admired by many superhumans

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SeaGod

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Alls fair in love and war

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samhmd1

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He earned the right to the treatment after beating those other soldiers in intelligence, dedication and bravery. They all had the chance to earn the treatment and all failed.

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TheInsufferable

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#9  Edited By TheInsufferable

Well, "cheating" was a rather common practice in War. For instance, amphetamine and methamphetamine were both used extensively in WWII to enhance soldiers' performance. In a situation where killing people is the norm, it's kind of hard to define something as cheating and therefore more immoral than the norm.

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Veshark

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I think some people accuse Steve Rogers of “cheating” because they think he’s peak human and that his physical abilities can also be earned through extensive training a la Batman. Which they can’t....

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depinhom

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He would have fought and died for his country with or without the serum. Because he was a good and honorable man he was chosen for the project.

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depinhom

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But just imagine how huge the super soldiers would be if the serum was given to guys who were already 6 foot 200 pounds. Damn.

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Mekboy

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Yes. Without it he's nothing.

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Quinlan58

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Cheating in a war? OUTRAGEOUS!

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KrleAvenger

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@mekboy: Except that moment when he humiliated a bunch of other Super Soldiers with skill alone, when he lost his own super soldier enhancements. Or when he defeated Crossbones in similar condition. Or fighting multiple Shang Chi clones as an old man without SSS. Or leading the Avengers and being one of the best tacticians on the planet. Or when Marvel made it pretty clear that it is Rogers' intelligent and skill that makes him so dangerous and not SSS which was backed up by actual feats.

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mrmonster

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He was fighting a war, not playing poker, "cheating" doesn't even apply here.

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TheIncredibleSuperHulk8642

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@mekboy: Except that moment when he humiliated a bunch of other Super Soldiers with skill alone, when he lost his own super soldier enhancements. Or when he defeated Crossbones in similar condition. Or fighting multiple Shang Chi clones as an old man without SSS. Or leading the Avengers and being one of the best tacticians on the planet. Or when Marvel made it pretty clear that it is Rogers' intelligent and skill that makes him so dangerous and not SSS which was backed up by actual feats.

QFT

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felgrim

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Lol. I'd cheat for the SSS.

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deactivated-5d6b913edbeeb

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I think some people accuse him c'ause they were jealous to see that there so many other fictional marvel characters who respect him of what he represents i.e " a leader ".

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ANTHP2000

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#20 ANTHP2000  Online

... what? Lol.

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deactivated-5d6b913edbeeb

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ANTHP2000

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#22 ANTHP2000  Online

@biswaboxz: No, I'm just questioning the idea that he somehow "cheated". If so half the MU has cheated lol.

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Wut

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Cheating at what? Being a super hero? No. He could have used his new abilities for many things, he decided to help people.

Now, if he joined the Olympics.... then I'd say yes, that'd be cheating but that'd never happen because that'd be state sponsored doping and he's Captain America not Captain Russia.

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Batvibe12

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In war, no.

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slimj87d

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He did go through basic training with dozens of diseases before he took the serum.

Imagine making it through basic training with the diseases he had.

Had astigmatism - so he’d’ve had poor eye sight. I’ve also seen sources that say Steve is colour blind although I couldn’t find them again for writing this or to check what kind of colour blind Steve could be - it could be anything from red-green colour blindness to trichromatic colour blindness, but I’m not sure.

Had scoliosis - this is where the spine bends in a way that isn’t part of the typical S-shaped curve, so his spine would’ve bent to the side. It’s not a life threatening condition but it can be quite noticeable and I’ve not seen a single fic that’s taken it into account.

Was partially deaf. Again, I’ve never read a fic that mentions anyone speaking up for Steve to hear.

Had arrhythmia, an irregular heartbeat; he also had heart palpitations, high blood pressure and the more generic heart trouble. I’ve also seen something saying he had angina, chest pain caused by restricted blood supply to the heart muscles.

He also had rheumatic fever at some point which causes red ring-like rashes on the limbs and can affect the brain, joints and heart - which given Steve already had heart problems is not a good thing. It affects older children up to the mid teens. It is treated with aspirin - which is hard on the stomach and unfortunately for little Steve, he also has:

Stomach ulcers. These are extremely painful and can be caused or made worse by drugs like aspirin. Stomach ulcers can be very dangerous if complications arise.

Another stomach complication Steve had was pernicious anaemia, which until the 20s was basically a death sentence. It’s a condition where an enzyme necessary to absorb vitamin B12 is not produced and the patient becomes progressively more anaemic until they suffer complications such as neurological damage or simply die (hence the word “pernicious”). Until 1928 the only treatment was to drink copious quantities of the juice from raw liver (more than a pint a day) or eat half a pound of raw liver a day, which contains the enzyme (cooking would destroy the enzyme). From ‘28, Steve was presumably relieved to hear, a liver extract was produced so that the quantity of liver juice one had to drink was 50x less and was also cheaper. The other symptoms were pretty much the same as other kinds of anaemia.

External image

What do you mean you aren’t hungry?

Steve also had flat feet (less serious but with everything else this kid isn’t running anywhere)

He had scarlet fever as a child, which causes a sore throat, bright red rash, and can kill - especially as it can cause heart complications.

Steve’s mother was diabetic- his admission form states that he has a parent or sibling with diabetes, and since it’s automatic disqualification from the army and he has no siblings, that means it must be his mother (unless you don’t think Steve’s dad served in the army at all and he’s just lying to serve with Bucky.) Steve has a higher risk for diabetes. This in itself isn’t going to limit him at this stage in the proceedings, but it doesn’t make him popular with eugenicists either.

Generally his respiratory system is struggling - he gets sinusitis and frequent colds to go along with his…

Asthma.

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slimj87d

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Michaelbn

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The thing is cheater at what.

If it's physics then no, Cap is the perfection and the ultimate limits of humans, we cannot reach them now neither " THE BAT-GOD" with the hardest and heaviest training but we will in future.

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Emperorb777

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Steroids are steroids.

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samhmd1

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Steroids are steroids.

And yet there's nothing wrong with being born with Alien DNA or being Half-God or any other "cheats"?

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Emperorb777

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@samhmd1: of course being born a certain way isn't cheating that's fu*king stupid.

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Bag_ass

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Gosh darn it rogers stop cheating in war!

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Wolfrazer

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#33 Wolfrazer  Online

@slimj87d said:
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This makes me extremely annoyed for personal reasons...and I get it, it's fiction...but still.

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Gokluma

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@kirkseven: I just saw lot of people said oh cap is a wimp for taking it from whole comparison of him and batman

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Gokluma

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@wutWell i just remeber lot of people said he is not a handworker for not training like batman did or compared his SSS as drugs

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Wut

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@gokluma: The SSS is a massive boost. Anyone who says otherwise is lying, but on that same note, anyone who says Captain didn't work hard to overcome his illnesses and doesn't train and practice to further his own skills post SSS is also a liar.

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Gokluma

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@wut: Good point and i'm thankful for your comment

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DarkPsychicLord_Prime

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Is Green Lantern a cheater for using a Green Lantern ring? No because the ring chooses it's owner based on his/her willpower and capacity to overcome great fears. Not everyone can wear one and make the right use out of it. Is Tony Stark a cheater because he uses the Iron Man armors? No, because he builds them himself, and again, not everyone can make the right use out of them. The same goes for Cap. His willpower, morals, altruism and intelligence made him the better choice for the SS serum than a well trained soldier with a better physical condition.

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deactivated-61215780523f9

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@gokluma said:

@kirkseven: I just saw lot of people said oh cap is a wimp for taking it from whole comparison of him and batman

Bruce Wayne is superhuman by feats, even if we ignore that... he is blessed with perfect genetics. Cap isn't like that, and needed to get an upgrade.

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Veshark

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@gokluma said:

@kirkseven: I just saw lot of people said oh cap is a wimp for taking it from whole comparison of him and batman

Bruce Wayne is superhuman by feats, even if we ignore that... he is blessed with perfect genetics. Cap isn't like that, and needed to get an upgrade.

Bruce also inherited wealth that he didn't earn himself to travel the world during his learning years, and finance his crime-fighting operation and equipment. Steve had no one and grew up the sickly child of poor Irish immigrants during the Great Depression, aka one of the worst financial periods of modern America.

Point being that life (even the fictional comic-book variety) isn't fair, but it doesn't matter where we start out in life but where we finish. And I'd say both Steve and Bruce did the best with what they had.

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Gokluma

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@kirkseven: I agree with that and i'm thankful for your comment

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samhmd1

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#42  Edited By samhmd1

@samhmd1: of course being born a certain way isn't cheating that's fu*king stupid.

Then Steve EARNING his treatment because he competed with others and won shouldn't be held against him any more. He did more to earn his powers than Superman or Wonder Woman did.

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deathstroke512

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Say no to drugs

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brucerogers

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By that logic, all super powered characters are cheaters.

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LDM

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No. It doesn't truly matter where or how you receive the power, it matters only what you do with it. In this case, he selflessly used it to save live of millions of people instead of making easy money from Olympics and competition. Tbh, this is like asking if Spider-Man cheated because he was beaten by a radioactive/magical spider, even though that would be completely ignoring his character arcs and all the struggle he has been through. Or asking if Thor cheated because he was born a god. Compared to them, Steve may as well be considered nothing. But like them, Steve has his own struggle, own pain and ways to make peace with all the bad and horrible things in his life. That is why these characters are so compelling. Because no matter how powerful they are, they still have that "human weaknesses", be it physically or emotionally that the readers can sympathise with

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Rustlingjimmy

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@seagod said:

Alls fair in love and war

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Mekboy

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@krleavenger: My bad, for some reason I assumed this was MCU Cap.

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Penguin-Dust

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Only if it helps him win at cards...personally, I wouldn't want to go up against Daredevil in a game of Liar's Poker.

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helloman

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No.

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deactivated-63b5d986098dd

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@mekboy: Except that moment when he humiliated a bunch of other Super Soldiers with skill alone, when he lost his own super soldier enhancements. Or when he defeated Crossbones in similar condition. Or fighting multiple Shang Chi clones as an old man without SSS. Or leading the Avengers and being one of the best tacticians on the planet. Or when Marvel made it pretty clear that it is Rogers' intelligent and skill that makes him so dangerous and not SSS which was backed up by actual feats.

Muh Featz