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#51 Posted by MetalJimmor (5951 posts) - - Show Bio

@tyger said:

Aquaman is a bad character too. All I see is discount MCU Thor

Arthur and Thor have almost nothing in common personality wise. Thor is an optimistic hero who had to learn humility so he could become the leader his people deserve in his movie while Arthur was a pessimistic layabout who had to learn to accept his responsibility toward a people he didn't know or want to know.

Simply being royalty doesn't make two characters the same.

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#52 Posted by modernww2fare (6889 posts) - - Show Bio

Neither was the highlight of their solo movie. That goes to their supporting casts

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#53 Edited by Tyger (308 posts) - - Show Bio

@tyger said:

Aquaman is a bad character too. All I see is discount MCU Thor

Arthur and Thor have almost nothing in common personality wise. Thor is an optimistic hero who had to learn humility so he could become the leader his people deserve in his movie while Arthur was a pessimistic layabout who had to learn to accept his responsibility toward a people he didn't know or want to know.

Simply being royalty doesn't make two characters the same.

Nothing in common? Either biggest lie I have ever heard or biggest case of ignorance. Also Arthur only had resentment and a bad opinion for Atlantis and the throne so your faulty point on him being pessimistic is also moot. They are essentially the same.

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#54 Posted by rem (1996 posts) - - Show Bio

@tyger said:
@metaljimmor said:
@tyger said:

Aquaman is a bad character too. All I see is discount MCU Thor

Arthur and Thor have almost nothing in common personality wise. Thor is an optimistic hero who had to learn humility so he could become the leader his people deserve in his movie while Arthur was a pessimistic layabout who had to learn to accept his responsibility toward a people he didn't know or want to know.

Simply being royalty doesn't make two characters the same.

Nothing in common? Either biggest lie I have ever heard or biggest case of ignorance. Also Arthur only had resentment and a bad opinion for Atlantis and the throne so your faulty point on him being pessimistic is also moot. They are essentially the same.

Arthur has been stubborn ever since JL and absolutely did not want the throne but was forced to get it and lived with it. Thor is literally the exact opposite. They have nothing in common.

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#55 Posted by MetalJimmor (5951 posts) - - Show Bio

@tyger said:

Nothing in common? Either biggest lie I have ever heard or biggest case of ignorance. Also Arthur only had resentment and a bad opinion for Atlantis and the throne so your faulty point on him being pessimistic is also moot. They are essentially the same.

I can't help but notice the lack of examples you've given. Just saying "they are the same" doesn't make it true.

You're also wrong. Arthur had a bad opinion of himself too. He expresses a few times in the film that he is not the right person to lead. His speech to the Karathen at the end sums it up perfectly. He doesn't think he is worthy of being the king of Atlantis, but he had to take up the mantle to stop the war.

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#56 Posted by Tyger (308 posts) - - Show Bio

@tyger said:

Nothing in common? Either biggest lie I have ever heard or biggest case of ignorance. Also Arthur only had resentment and a bad opinion for Atlantis and the throne so your faulty point on him being pessimistic is also moot. They are essentially the same.

I can't help but notice the lack of examples you've given. Just saying "they are the same" doesn't make it true.

You're also wrong. Arthur had a bad opinion of himself too. He expresses a few times in the film that he is not the right person to lead. His speech to the Karathen at the end sums it up perfectly. He doesn't think he is worthy of being the king of Atlantis, but he had to take up the mantle to stop the war.

Well you aren't the brightest lightbulb it would seem. I literally just negated your claims in my last post, saying that the only bad judgements Arthur harbored were Atlantis and Throne related, meaning him because he's royalty, and you go on to just co-sign what I said by kindly giving examples of Arthur only being negative about being the canidate for king of a nation he doesn't/didn't care about.

Also I don't need to provide examples because it's clear they are too similar in personality. I even described a little earlier

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#57 Posted by MetalJimmor (5951 posts) - - Show Bio

@tyger:

Man, you have a poor disposition. You might want to reconsider your tendency of throwing insults around, it's against the forum rules.

You didn't say "throne related", you said "and the throne", which most English speakers would take as meaning the royal family or the government of Atlantis itself. Arthur's pessimism in this case is directed toward himself, not Atlantis and not the throne. He doesn't believe he is good enough.

If you want another example of his pessimism re-watch Justice League where he confessed under the effects of the Lasso of Truth that he believed they were all going to die fighting Steppenwolf. Before that he also believed that bringing back Superman would be a mistake. Arthur is consistently a pessimistic person who assumes failure but keeps fighting regardless.

But hey, if you don't feel like you need to give any examples to back up your claim that is fine by me. At this point I am not convinced you actually watched the movie anyway.

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#58 Edited by Tyger (308 posts) - - Show Bio

@metaljimmor: You knew exactly what I meant. Don't make up excuses trying to get technical. You're wrong.

Failed examples. He thought there was a chance they would die, against seemingly impossible odds, ok and this proves that he still went through with the mission and had fun (screaming and body surfing)? Like how Thor was unsure he would survive against Hela, Thanos, and forging Stormbreaker (Thor being Thor in all instances). Not pessimistic, neither of them, they jump at fights and the thrill of action. Stupid examples of him having doubts like all people do.

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#59 Posted by MetalJimmor (5951 posts) - - Show Bio

@tyger:

No, you phrased it entirely differently than what you apparently meant. That mistake is on you.

Thor has his doubts from time to time but he's also a cheery and optimistic person. He was the one talking Loki into going to face Hela after their first defeat. He was the one who organized the escape from Sakaar and through his optimistic charisma convinced Valkyrie to come with him. After being crushed by Thanos Thor immediately got up and went on a journey to forge Stormbreaker to get his revenge. When told he'd die forging Stormbreaker he replied "Only if I die", showing that he believed he had the strength to pull through despite everyone telling him otherwise. Thor is constantly reassured by his own greatness and believes he can do the impossible.

Arthur is the one who needs cheering up. He needed Mera to force him into his Hero's Journey because he had no interest in it. He needed Mera to talk him into believing he could be king after getting beaten up by Orm and Black Manta. Before that in Justice League his reasoning for fighting on despite believing he'd die was because he wanted to go down fighting, not because he thought they could win. Aquaman doesn't believe in his own abilities and is prone to giving up hope after a major defeat as seen with Black Manta and Steppenwolf, but his courageous nature makes him refuse to go down without a fight.

Optimistic characters can have doubts and pessimistic characters can keep going despite their doubts. Thor and Aquaman are both heroes who throw themselves into incredible danger but they operate on very different internal logic.

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#60 Edited by TheAmazingSpidey (17229 posts) - - Show Bio
@emanresu_20 said:

Yes because he has a personality.

This.

Cavill's Superman is so bland and difficult to get attached to.

And before someone tells me "just because he isn't joking around, doesn't mean he doesn't have a personality", let me stop you right there. Affleck's Batman (BvS) was serious, and he had 10 times more personality than DCEU Superman.

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#61 Posted by Rebake (3795 posts) - - Show Bio

Aquaman's more relatable imo...

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#62 Posted by DarkPsychicLord_Prime (3799 posts) - - Show Bio

Having watched the scene multiple times, it still bothers me how during and after Zod gives him the speech of how he was created to protect krypton, Superman just stands there with a bored expression, he never gives him a response, saying what Zod did was wrong or something like that, he just says to him after Zod hits him "you're a monster Zod, and i'm going to stop you".

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#63 Edited by Geraldofvengerberg (502 posts) - - Show Bio

@supermanforever said:
@mickey-mouse said:

@supermanforever: I disagree. I think after decades of having Supes and Bats hog the spotlight people clearly want something different. Which is why SS, WW, And Aquaman all made more money than MOS and JL. Also no Synder...

I would make people wait for another Supes and Bats solo. Make them super thirsty for it and start with a new actor in each role as a soft reboot.

Batman v a Supes, MOS, And JL made small profit margins. JL was a straight up flop. Batman v Supes in total profit made the same as Antman.

https://www.comicbookmovie.com/batman_vs_superman/batman-v-superman-final-profits-tallied-how-much-did-it-really-earn-a149858

We keep seeing no one cares about; GOTG, SS, Venom, Aquaman...yet these characters keep proving us wrong. People ultimately want good movies and new interesting characters and stories.

Mos made less money because it was released at a time were China and Asia was not very strong market. Secondly it was first movie of dceu and had mixed reviews.

Jl was just bad movie, it has nothing to do with Batman or Superman.

Just because they dont make as much money does not mean they dont sell. If they make proper movie. Both of those characters will easly gross shit ton of money. Literaly in every aspect of dc comics those two are by far the most popular and by far the best selling characters.

If they make proper movie they will sell. Batman was making billion dollar movies 10 years ago were the cbm movied never heard of billion dollar

Ironman 3 which released at the same time as Man of Steel made 1.3 billion dollars. It made 121 million in China.

One if the main reason WB was disappointed with Man of Steel was because it lacklustre performance compared to Ironman 3 and Dark knight rises

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#64 Posted by Morgatu (274 posts) - - Show Bio

@jayc1324: I agree with this, unlike the comic Superman, DCEU Superman did not seem nearly as passionate or charitable, he just wants to get the job (which he doesn't seem all enthused about) done and go home.

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#65 Edited by Mekboy (2622 posts) - - Show Bio

Aquaman by a mile.

Liked Superman too though.

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#66 Edited by thatduderox (972 posts) - - Show Bio

Yes. Arthur character is at least consistent. Superman's character development from MoS to JL makes little sense, largely due to execs seemingly giving the mandate to make him smile more because stoic Superman was turning off the general audience. The problem is that we never see Clark transition to the man who inspires hope he's portrayed as in the beginning of Justice League, especially since it seemed like a chunk of the population was still pretty divisive about him before his death. It almost seems like there's a movie missing between BvS and JL the change is so drastic. The character just wasn't handled well.

One thing that really impressed me about Arthur was his innate heroism. He may comes across as a brash dude bro, but Arthur does genuinely care about people. The scene when he stops fighting Black Manta momentarily to make sure the civilians got to safety spoke volumes about his character as a person. Also how he spent hours with fans in that bar having a good time, despite being seemingly annoyed by them in the beginning when they asked for pictures, though alcohol likely paid a crucial role in that. Despite his hard demeanor, and not often showing his softer side, he does care. One image I feel really hurt MoS was them not showing Superman helping civilians during the fight with Zod. I think showing him at trying to get to the people, even if Zod didn't allow him, would have cushioned the blow from critics, if only a little bit.

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#67 Posted by Supermanforever (7518 posts) - - Show Bio

@supermanforever said:
@mickey-mouse said:

@supermanforever: I disagree. I think after decades of having Supes and Bats hog the spotlight people clearly want something different. Which is why SS, WW, And Aquaman all made more money than MOS and JL. Also no Synder...

I would make people wait for another Supes and Bats solo. Make them super thirsty for it and start with a new actor in each role as a soft reboot.

Batman v a Supes, MOS, And JL made small profit margins. JL was a straight up flop. Batman v Supes in total profit made the same as Antman.

https://www.comicbookmovie.com/batman_vs_superman/batman-v-superman-final-profits-tallied-how-much-did-it-really-earn-a149858

We keep seeing no one cares about; GOTG, SS, Venom, Aquaman...yet these characters keep proving us wrong. People ultimately want good movies and new interesting characters and stories.

Mos made less money because it was released at a time were China and Asia was not very strong market. Secondly it was first movie of dceu and had mixed reviews.

Jl was just bad movie, it has nothing to do with Batman or Superman.

Just because they dont make as much money does not mean they dont sell. If they make proper movie. Both of those characters will easly gross shit ton of money. Literaly in every aspect of dc comics those two are by far the most popular and by far the best selling characters.

If they make proper movie they will sell. Batman was making billion dollar movies 10 years ago were the cbm movied never heard of billion dollar

Ironman 3 which released at the same time as Man of Steel made 1.3 billion dollars. It made 121 million in China.

One if the main reason WB was disappointed with Man of Steel was because it lacklustre performance compared to Ironman 3 and Dark knight rises

Thats because Iron man was already a popular character when it came out.

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#68 Posted by LeonardSnart (2485 posts) - - Show Bio

@supermanforever: the name superman still holds way more weight than ironman tho

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#70 Posted by MICKEY-MOUSE (36295 posts) - - Show Bio

@supermanforever: Deadpool 1 and SS didn’t even get released in China. So the MOS China thing is a poor excuse, you don’t have to have the Chinese always come to the rescue if you have a solid product that’s well marketed.

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#71 Posted by Supermanforever (7518 posts) - - Show Bio

@supermanforever: Deadpool 1 and SS didn’t even get released in China. So the MOS China thing is a poor excuse, you don’t have to have the Chinese always come to the rescue if you have a solid product that’s well marketed.

I again repeat, it was first movie of dceu. Just because one movie makes less money in the first run does not prove anything. Iron man 1 made shitty 500 million yet iron man 3 made billion. It does not matter. Batman begins made 370 milion globaly. Dark knight made 1 billion, rises made a billion. Just because first movie did not make alot of money, does not mean sequel wont.

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#72 Posted by Supermanforever (7518 posts) - - Show Bio

@supermanforever: the name superman still holds way more weight than ironman tho

The name itself is not a big factor when it comes to average movie goer. Also first iron man movies did garbage at box office. lesser than man of steel. Yet third one made much more.

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#73 Posted by ganon15 (7008 posts) - - Show Bio

I guess Aquaman has more presence

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#74 Posted by LeonardSnart (2485 posts) - - Show Bio

@supermanforever: I was just saying, kids around the world want to go watch superman more than a lot of other characters

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#76 Posted by Helloman (26744 posts) - - Show Bio

Maybe.

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#77 Posted by Subline (5110 posts) - - Show Bio

Superman is less charismatic, but has more better character development imo.

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#78 Posted by Doomsguy (132 posts) - - Show Bio

Superman is far better than Aquaman.The problems that his power causes and the fear that some of the people has towards him its interesting.Aquaman its just another ``badass'' character who does things because its cool.

If you are a kid you will like Aquaman, if you are an adult you will like Superman

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#79 Posted by just_sayin (3088 posts) - - Show Bio

I thought Aquaman had a lot more personality and more interesting.