How fast was Kizaru's accelerated kick on Luffy ? (Chapter 1092)

Now that the hullabaloo has died down and both raws and official ViZ translations are out that confirms Kizaru accelerated aka he can indeed go FTL, I want to get some thoughts on how impressive exactly Kizaru's accelerated kick was.

To put into perspective it somewhat overwhelmed Luffy from at least multiple km away, when Luffy moments ago was fighting Kizaru in cqc and handling his point blank laser spams with no issue.

Discuss.

Gallery

It's LS. Plain and simple.

Sub FTL

@cosmicemperor: how can it be just LS if Kizaru's base attacks are LS and he is clearing accelerating pass his base speed?

Kizaru's attacks becomes LS when he turns intangible, the way it's shown on panel.

I'm not a One Piece guy, but I'm gonna give my 2 cents on this debate. If Kizaru was already capable of LS speeds and he accelerated even further then logically he should indeed be FTL, since that's what acceleration is. Though not massively FTL it seems.

Either LS or Low FTL

Either way Luffy was combated by attacks that are blow the general consensus for his speed on comic vine.

Pretty much. Kizaru is already casually capable of LS as shown in his first interaction with the supernova but here he is accelerating while in his light form, it's clear-cut FTL movement albeit to an unknown degree; wouldn't go as far saying it's MFTL.

To the people saying Kizaru only increased his speed to LS, I guess Kizaru is the same speed as when he doesn't require his acceleration theatrics to attack AT LS(Kizaru's own admission)? I mean let's apply simple logic here and drop the OP bias

.....lmao. It's always the same people who actively hate on OP and don't even know the scaling or are not caught up always making stupid comments.

Luffy is not getting blitzed by ls or low ftl attack.... Especially considering Kizaru spammed light speed attacks by dozens which were intercepted at close distance by Snakeman Luffy.

Kizaru was firing is laser and blocking with Advanced Haki at the same time.

Yasakani no Magatama

The technique Kizaru used on Snakeman from close range. Same stance.

Which was being intercepted by Snakeman punches which by default have Armament Haki an accelerate the longer it goes on.

Not saying it's this many light beams as the gif exactly but it's very clear what Kizaru is doing with his stance and very clearly what Luffy is doing with his. Obviously way more then what is shown in the panel. It's meant to depict high speed combat at close range which leads to Kizaru being impressed by Snakeman and calling him "formidable."

If said attack was "LS" or " slightly ftl" Luffy would have been overwhelmed with singular light beam at close distance let alone several...

Also being disingenuous to the scaling. Mid tiers like Germa 66 are already light speed and have been utterly blitzed by YC1 tier characters (who I would say can keep up with top tiers for the most part albeit, slightly slower)

That's reasonable take from the outside looking in if you have never read One Piece before or don't know full context of the scaling. Way more reasonable then Ruined_King who actively hates on One Piece every single day and not even past the Pre-Time Skip.

Luffy had already intercepted a bunch of LS attacks from close range prior to Kizaru accelerating and kicking him. He basically did the equivalent of dodging an intercepting several Madara Light Fang speed attacks at point blank range which is already faster then light combat and reaction speed from Luffy. So Kizaru would have to accelerate to the point where his singular attack from much further away is harder to evade then spammed point blank ls ones. He'd have to be significantly faster the 2nd time around.

Also, mid tiers of the series are already capable of LS attacks. Like mid tiers who scale below even base Luffy.

How?

we have seen many times that Kizaru can attack at light speed from the point blank distance with no effort.

Yet this time he felt compelled to create a distance so he would have the space to build up the momentum.

What would be the point of that, if he's limited to LS, and he can achieve it effortlessly from no distance.

Then we saw him turning into light.

And as he is traveling in a form of a light beam, he yells "acceleration is power", acceleration being the increase in speed.

The we see the beam changing, looking like it's speeding up.

If he's already flying at light speed, which is something he does causally, he must have been able to go beyond the LS here

Then we see him flying back at the island

And landing a kick on a G4 Luffy, who has already demonstrated to be able to block or dodge LS attacks, and not just him, many other character far slower than him.

.

This.

sigh

in this attack Kizaru does not use the speed of his own physical body but directly attacks Luffy while speeding up using his Devil Fruit think of it as Might Guy Dynamic entry, the other time he use it on Hawkins he stop half way and use his own physical speed to kick him, two different concepts of use.

lastly people are really under the assumption that Kizaru always travels at LS, do people understand that he is the Light man he can control Light from Min to Max, it means he can control the speed he is moving from the slowest to fastest of Light, is just like any other devil Fruit ability. Kizaru Limit is the Limit of Light however his lower limit is what ever he wants it to be or what he can control.

Wushu is making things up to push a narrative idk why this behavior is normal for OP fans.

It's normal for the fans atp

OT: The guy is really inconsistent like the rest of the verse but in consideration it's LS at best

It's clearly FTL. How much? I'm not sure yet, I'll wait for the fight to end to have a more consistent opinion.

MFTL+

@mortein: don’t @ me for wank pls

Stfu

Clearly FTL-FTL+

Could be 2c or even 200c ..no way to know for now.

The best speed feat on HST without scaling

at least ftl.

I see no reason to think that it wasn't just a regular lightspeed kick. And even if for some reason it was ftl, just how much faster than light cannot be determined based on this chapter alone.

This is probably one of the more reasonable replies I have seen on the subject so far.

Lightspeed until we get some kind of explanation

FTL+ to a great degree I'd reckon as it bull dozed Snakeman Luffy from a great deal away.

Kizaru standing with NO run up with just the movement required to send a casual kick is LS and that's with just a couple meters of movement needed to throw that kick...

Gallery

Now Kizaru with a multi kilometer run up specifically accelerating like I said bulldozed G4 Snakeman Luffy.

Now ofc it's FTL at minimum but if we compare the distance for Kizaru to do a LS kick the fact he moved that far back and was accelerating in my mind means like I said the kick was FTL+ to a great degree.

At least LS

Possibly FTL but unknown for now until next chapter

Also might I add even if it was FTL that Luffy in Snakeman got straight blitzed and felt the need to enter Gear 5 afterwards

And before people say bUt LuFfY wAs BlinDeD by ThE lighT thOugH

I love how we forget this man even before he advanced his Haki further in Wano can fight with his eyes clothes or even just straight up blindfolded

So regardless of how fast you think the kick was, without Gear 5 Luffy wouldn't scale to it...especially given Kizaru literally was far away from the island when he started to move 💀

Lmao. A guy turns into light, speeds up and yet there are people saying it’s only light speed and might be slower even because “reasons” lmao. This is actually hilarious asf to watch. This denial has been happening since the germa brothers had LS feats.

FTL

Either LS or sub FTL.

Gotta love all the downplayers.

It is clearly FTL++.

Kizaru and Luffy were already exchange attacks at LS when Luffy was G4. That alone says plenty.

Scaling tells you many times more as past characters against actual laser weapons have dodged them, repeatedly. There's tons of threads and evidence everywhere. Anyone who still disagrees is in denial for the sake of their own favorite fandom; is ignorant and not read the series or just plain trolling.

This isn't really that complicated.

Kizaru's base is lightspeed. His weakest, most generic attack is going to be a beam of light energy.

He then becomes even faster.

So now he is faster than light to an unknown degree.

I have already talked about this on Discord, but allow me to be the devil's advocate and push down as many notions as I can about Kizaru doing an FTL attack. Note that my arguing this does not necessarily make Kizaru not FTL since we do not know for sure what happened, but merely my reasoning can be used as reasonings to shoot down some of the responses that have already been given.

.....lmao. It's always the same people who actively hate on OP and don't even know the scaling or are not caught up always making stupid comments.

Luffy is not getting blitzed by ls or low ftl attack.... Especially considering Kizaru spammed light speed attacks by dozens which were intercepted at close distance by Snakeman Luffy.

Kizaru was firing is laser and blocking with Advanced Haki at the same time.

Yasakani no Magatama

The technique Kizaru used on Snakeman from close range. Same stance.

Which was being intercepted by Snakeman punches which by default have Armament Haki an accelerate the longer it goes on.

Not saying it's this many light beams as the gif exactly but it's very clear what Kizaru is doing with his stance and very clearly what Luffy is doing with his. Obviously way more then what is shown in the panel. It's meant to depict high speed combat at close range which leads to Kizaru being impressed by Snakeman and calling him "formidable."

If said attack was "LS" or " slightly ftl" Luffy would have been overwhelmed with singular light beam at close distance let alone several...

Observation Haki. It has been said before that with Observation Haki great gaps in speed can be overcome, this being a possibility means Luffy merely set up his defenses beforehand, much like how he could dodge the Pacifista beams with haki at the beginning of the post-time skip.

This can be considered either flawed scaling or a retcon since the basis for Kizaru performing so oppressively against Luffy with his basic LS moves makes Germa being LS a ridiculous preposition given that by now Snakeman would turbo blitz the twins in G4.

we have seen many times that Kizaru can attack at light speed from the point blank distance with no effort.

Yet this time he felt compelled to create a distance so he would have the space to build up the momentum.

What would be the point of that, if he's limited to LS, and he can achieve it effortlessly from no distance.

There is one point worth mentioning here, and that is how Kizaru when using LS kick is way different from using his whole weight as momentum. the mass of Kizaru's kick and the mass of Kizaru's body are both very different and at LS would lead to vastly different potencies and DC, This is the first time we have seen Kizaru ever putting his whole body into an attack, and given how much more insane the potencies of his attacks would be if he got to do the same move at point blank like his LS kicks it would make the Railegh stopping him kind of weird assuming basically that Kizaru lets the Strawhats go even though we can conclude from this most recent arc that Kizaru is quite the tryhard at his missions, even against his closest acquaintances/friends.

I wanted to make another point here but I forgot.

Then we saw him turning into light.

And as he is traveling in a form of a light beam, he yells "acceleration is power", acceleration being the increase in speed.

The we see the beam changing, looking like it's speeding up.

If he's already flying at light speed, which is something he does causally, he must have been able to go beyond the LS here

Then we see him flying back at the island

And landing a kick on a G4 Luffy, who has already demonstrated to be able to block or dodge LS attacks, and not just him, many other character far slower than him.

I may be crazy, but Luffy could clearly see the attack coming, he was just blinded by the intense light coming off from Kizaru's attack... Now many would say this is Luffy clearly being FTL in perception, I would say this is Kizaru not going as fast as we'd like to think. (Now this is interesting.. Luffy had to cover his eyes from light? I do ask myself: How can someone who is FTL not outspeed the very light they are faster than? 🤔)

there are also alternate translations:

meaning Kizaru is just repeating his saying from saobody archipelago.

Then again, the scan could very well still be Kizaru speeding up past the point of Light Speed, and though many who hate on One Piece would bar the feat at LS that does not mean that all who still hold the feat as possibly LS hate on One Piece.

I personally for example hold this as potentially FTL, I would not call it out as faster than LS just yet without further clarification which puts me in the LS camp, then again my stance on OP can be considered a lowball by the standards of many so hey just take my points with a big grain of salt.

Still lightspeed.

@brownzeus: That's not the correct translation bro. Both Raws and Official ViZ translations say Acceleration.

Its LS.Nothing less,nothing more

And Ruffy is Relativistic.

Slower than Yuno

Sorry copers if Kizaru uttered:

Hi, I don't know much about One Piece either.

I'm a bit confused by the "acceleration is... 'power'!" panels, because it looks like the LS he's supposed to be accelerating beyond with the bulge-then-burst was already passed by the beam of light itself.

It looks to me (and again, not a lot of OP knowledge) more like a concentration of all his "mass" (the other part of the equation that he seems to be referencing: Force = Mass x Acceleration) over a shorter period of time - if OP has a lot of LS reaction times, then lasers with any length of time end up DoT that can be dodged or distributed, and having most of the oomph of a DoT happening instantly could be a good force multiplier.

The only reason I say that is the bulging - like a cartoon fire house blocked up and bulging out, then bursting after a suitable buildup as a massive, overwhelming burst.

I feel like the general sentiment is that Luffy was blitzed, but given how Kizaru emphasizes power and Luffy is shown seemingly looking at him with a hand raised above his face I think it's possible that he reacted in time and tried to block it but got pushed back due to the generated force being too great.

Since he was accelerating the attack scales above Kizaru's more basic attacks, but it does not necessarily scale above Snakeman in speed or blitz him.

@brownzeus:

I have already talked about this on Discord, but allow me to be the devil's advocate and push down as many notions as I can about Kizaru doing an FTL attack. Note that my arguing this does not necessarily make Kizaru not FTL since we do not know for sure what happened, but merely my reasoning can be used as reasonings to shoot down some of the responses that have already been given

That's cool I guess though I view it as a waste of time as what is shown is pretty explicit even to non-readers in the thread.

Observation Haki. It has been said before that with Observation Haki great gaps in speed can be overcome, this being a possibility means Luffy merely set up his defenses beforehand, much like how he could dodge the Pacifista beams with haki at the beginning of the post-time skip.

If you haven't heard, there is a meta that the Admirals are capable of using Adv CoO themselves as they are able to warp their bodies around the attacks of haki users similar to what Katakuri did in WCI. I find it to be very credible given that Katakuri says such an ability if only possible with FS/Adv CoO:

In which case, two FS users fighting would be the same as two normal people fighting; they simply cancel out each other out and if one person is showing equal or better reaction in an exchange then the conclusion can be made that they are just more or equally as proficient in Adv CoO than their opponent as we saw in Luffy's exchange with Kaido in Snakeman as well.

This can be considered either flawed scaling or a retcon since the basis for Kizaru performing so oppressively against Luffy with his basic LS moves makes Germa being LS a ridiculous preposition given that by now Snakeman would turbo blitz the twins in G4.

I doubt it's a retcon. I think having lower tier characters be able to achieve LS(specifically Niji), buttresses the point that a higher tier character like Kizaru should be capable of more(as he has now shown) which is the norm of the hierarchy of power in your standard manga verse. Plus, as I explained above Kizaru would be able to contend with Luffy with basic LS by simply having better Adv CoO than Luffy(much like Kaido).

I may be crazy, but Luffy could clearly see the attack coming, he was just blinded by the intense light coming off from Kizaru's attack... Now many would say this is Luffy clearly being FTL in perception, I would say this is Kizaru not going as fast as we'd like to think. (Now this is interesting.. Luffy had to cover his eyes from light? I do ask myself: How can someone who is FTL not outspeed the very light they are faster than? 🤔)

If he can speed up his photons to FTL, what says the residual light coming off him can't be FTL too by virtue of blasting off his body as he explodes towards Luffy? Besides Kizaru is always releasing residual light whenever he uses his ability even while stationery or at a distance so obviously those would travel ahead of him in a concurrent manner given he will always continously emit "free" photons while using his powers.

there are also alternate translations:

meaning Kizaru is just repeating his saying from saobody archipelago.

Wrong translation. Raws themselves say "Acceleration...IS POWER!!!"

Then again, the scan could very well still be Kizaru speeding up past the point of Light Speed

It's very blatant even without the statement that he's speeding up.

and though many who hate on One Piece would bar the feat at LS that does not mean that all who still hold the feat as possibly LS hate on One Piece.

The only reason someone wouldn't see the feat for what it was or even give it a chance is bias imo because as we see in the thread, even non-readers can easily pick up what's going on much less people who are somewhat grounded on the series.

I personally for example hold this as potentially FTL

That's perfectly fine, even if you're skeptical this should be the worst case scenario for any who are using logic to observe what happened.

I would not call it out as faster than LS just yet without further clarification which puts me in the LS camp, then again my stance on OP can be considered a lowball by the standards of many so hey just take my points with a big grain of salt.

W for good faith.

No interest in the topic, but for anyone who wonders the translation, here's the raws(even if Eazy alreay posted)

2 translators got the same result, "Acceleration is... ”Power,,(in hiragana, Kasoku ha... Chikara!!!)

Mine and Jovy's translation(granted, my Japanese is still some ass)

Links for each of the Kanji for those interested, "Acceleration" and "Power"

@yray: 2c is low FTL (most accurate) 200c is MFTL (delusional)

Some degree of FTL