Grimderp-How dark is too dark?

Avatar image for guardian_of_gravity
Guardian_of_Gravity

3000

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

Most works seem to try and seek out a balance between light and dark to attract an audience. In some eras light is favored and in others dark is the flavor of the month. However, much as there is a point where things are too lighthearted to take seriously, there is also a point where something can be so over the top dark that it wraps it's way around to being goofy or losing the interest of the reader because there's no one to root for as everyone is terrible.

So what dear viners, is your limit for how dark a fictional work can get before it starts getting into the "why should I care, they're all worse than Hitler" territory or the "You know, when everyone eats babies and kicks puppies and laughs about it it's actually kind of funny" zone?

Avatar image for deactivated-5e8a1f5fafc4e
deactivated-5e8a1f5fafc4e

26473

Forum Posts

2126

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 4

The "Hitler eating babies and kicking puppies, who doesn't care because it's kind of funny" zone.

Avatar image for guardian_of_gravity
Guardian_of_Gravity

3000

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

I think this topic is more than worth a bump.

And I do seriously believe there is a darkness event Horizon before most audiences stop caring because you cannot root for anyone because everyone in the setting is one abominable shade of evil or another.

Avatar image for hart7668
hart7668

2334

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 1

User Lists: 0

#4  Edited By hart7668

Would Gantz be a good example of kinda being too dark? I've never read it, so I suppose my opinion is moot, but it always seemed so.....grim

Avatar image for guardian_of_gravity
Guardian_of_Gravity

3000

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

@hart7668: Has it gotten to the point where you find yourself wondering "Why should I care?" or finding it unintentionally hilarious?

Avatar image for hart7668
hart7668

2334

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 1

User Lists: 0

#6  Edited By hart7668

I suppose not but it is a horror manga.

Avatar image for sc
SC

18454

Forum Posts

182748

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 25

User Lists: 0

#7 SC  Moderator

As far as myself personally, and with no parody, non satirical works, my tolerance for grim dark is relative to how original and fresh it is. So I can find Adventure Time doing grim and dark sort of endearing but I probably won't pick up a book about a lonely obsessive newbie detective who patrols the streets with every step he takes requiring him to wipe the scummy residue of a society of his torn and weathered shoes. His city and society is a corrupt one and everyone including his wife and newborn child are out to get him. When he comes home from work he finds everyone he loves in a mini refrigerator and he has tattoos of obscure Japanese poems and riddles all over his body. Actually I would probably read that because it sounds like a parody. Usually I like variety though, so that affects my tolerance too, I wish the New 52 had a bit more variety as far as light heartedness.

Avatar image for guardian_of_gravity
Guardian_of_Gravity

3000

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

@hart7668: Horror does have different standards, but generally even then the audience/player still needs someone to identify with or look up to.

Avatar image for neonpheonix
NeonPheonix

798

Forum Posts

89

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 6

When you see joker paralyzing Barbara Gordon I say that's on the line, anything darker is too dark

Avatar image for deactivated-5a162dd41dd64
deactivated-5a162dd41dd64

8662

Forum Posts

2294

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 100

User Lists: 6

I'm all for any level of 'darkness' as long as it serves a purpose. If it's there just because, it's unnecessary, and therefore too dark.

Avatar image for blackwolf0925
blackwolf0925

161

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

To answer that question seriously I have to go back and remember a series called Zetman. The point for me that told me I did not like the series is when a boy who was hailed as a hero was force into a situation where his admirers were trap with him in a building and he had to try to save them. Let just say that none but the boy made it out there alive. I understood why the direction the event taken place happen but to me that was why I drop the series completely. It went to dark for me because of the fact the could not save one single person there.

Avatar image for bruxae
Bruxae

18147

Forum Posts

11098

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 6

There is no limit, for me atleast.

Avatar image for decoyelite
DecoyElite

4021

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 36

User Lists: 2

So dark that it become an unintentional parody.

Avatar image for wolverine008
Wolverine008

51027

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 3

#14  Edited By Wolverine008

So dark that it become an unintentional parody.

This reminded me of Ultimates 3 and Ultimatum by Jeph Loeb.

Avatar image for decoyelite
DecoyElite

4021

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 36

User Lists: 2

@russellmania77: You are just terrible.

@decoyelite said:

So dark that it become an unintentional parody.

This reminded me of Ultimates 3 and Ultimatum by Jeph Loeb.

Yeah, good examples. It stops being tragic and starts being stupid.

Avatar image for wolverine008
Wolverine008

51027

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 3

Avatar image for thatguywithheadphones
thatguywithheadphones

19859

Forum Posts

1872

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 1

To answer that question seriously I have to go back and remember a series called Zetman. The point for me that told me I did not like the series is when a boy who was hailed as a hero was force into a situation where his admirers were trap with him in a building and he had to try to save them. Let just say that none but the boy made it out there alive. I understood why the direction the event taken place happen but to me that was why I drop the series completely. It went to dark for me because of the fact the could not save one single person there.

... But it got SOOOOO much after that

Avatar image for thatguywithheadphones
thatguywithheadphones

19859

Forum Posts

1872

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 1

ugh

Wolf Guy, when a woman is raped for 20 chapters,for the sole purpose of her boyfriend powering up, a series become too dumb to handle.

Avatar image for roboadmiral
roboadmiral

577

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 6

Dark becomes too dark when it becomes a cause for events rather than a product of them. Even when darkness is used as an aesthetic choice, it is a product of the story, not a cause of it. For example, stories involving vampires have a tendency toward the gothic, but this choice is not for its own sake. Vampires are dangerous, mysterious, shadowy, and encounters with them should be reflected as such. Buildings become looming and ominous, shadows deepen, making every darkened corner fraught with peril.

Darkness becomes problematic when it is inserted unnecessarily, simply to appease some taste for morbidity. It no longer serves a narrative or aesthetic function. To capture the idea as succinctly (but unfortunately, somewhat circularly) as possible: it is problematic when a thing is made dark so that it can be dark.

Avatar image for yokergeist
Yokergeist

12483

Forum Posts

2126

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

My Parents keep saying that the Dark Knight Trilogy was really dark and too violent for Batman even though I keep telling them that Batman is supposed to be dark. But then again, they never read comics and they grew up watching the Adam West Batman.

-$NG

Avatar image for blackwolf0925
blackwolf0925

161

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

@thatguywithheadphones: I could not swallow it all, I guess I am one of those that needs a happy ending and that scene just stop me flat. It could get better afterwards but for me that was my line. Wolf Guy I'd stopped when the rape part started. I just did not think it would last that long. The main character was douchey anyways, I really wanted a good werewolf story too. Sigh

Avatar image for blackwolf0925
blackwolf0925

161

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

Avatar image for jedixman
JediXMan

42943

Forum Posts

35961

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 16

#24 JediXMan  Moderator

Dark for the sake of dark is lazy, borderline insulting to the audience, uninspired.

A good story that is dark for the sake of plot is good.

I, personally, enjoy dark and serious fiction. I dislike gratuitous gore for the sake of gore, but I enjoy dark stories.

Avatar image for god_spawn
god_spawn

46734

Forum Posts

34624

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 43

User Lists: 10

#25 god_spawn  Moderator

@jedixman:

I, personally, enjoy dark and serious fiction. I dislike gratuitous gore for the sake of gore, but I enjoy dark stories.

Good...Good.

Avatar image for jedixman
JediXMan

42943

Forum Posts

35961

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 16

#26 JediXMan  Moderator


Good...Good.

It's funny how you use that picture when mocking me... but I take that as a compliment in this context. So... thanks...

Heh, Darth Plagueis is probably my favorite Star Wars novel... speaks volumes, that.

Avatar image for jointron33
jointron33

2107

Forum Posts

69

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 3

User Lists: 12

NEVER

Avatar image for guardian_of_gravity
Guardian_of_Gravity

3000

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

ugh

Wolf Guy, when a woman is raped for 20 chapters,for the sole purpose of her boyfriend powering up, a series become too dumb to handle.

...Did the rapist have super endurance or something because I can't imagine how someone could maintain coitus for that long.

Avatar image for thatguywithheadphones
thatguywithheadphones

19859

Forum Posts

1872

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 1

@thatguywithheadphones said:

ugh

Wolf Guy, when a woman is raped for 20 chapters,for the sole purpose of her boyfriend powering up, a series become too dumb to handle.

...Did the rapist have super endurance or something because I can't imagine how someone could maintain coitus for that long.

Gang rape, *sigh*

Avatar image for guardian_of_gravity
Guardian_of_Gravity

3000

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

Avatar image for roboadmiral
roboadmiral

577

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 6

#31  Edited By roboadmiral
Avatar image for marionettegeist
Marionettegeist

1936

Forum Posts

1

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

@jedixman said:

Dark for the sake of dark is lazy, borderline insulting to the audience, uninspired.

A good story that is dark for the sake of plot is good.

I, personally, enjoy dark and serious fiction. I dislike gratuitous gore for the sake of gore, but I enjoy dark stories.

Sums up my thoughts as well.