This isn't going to be a traditional respect thread, in the sense that I'm not going to list every single bit of information about Tenebrous. This thread is meant for those with prior knowledge of Star Wars lore. To that end, it's going to provide a list of Tenebrous's most impressive moments, as well as a short analysis of what those moments signify with regards to his power level and combative ability in comparison to a few other well-known characters. To minimize distractions, I'll be placing the actual sources in spoiler blocks so they don't impede the flow of the thread.
We first see Tenebrous in the novel Darth Plagueis, in which he's investigating a lode of cortosis ore with his apprentice, Plagueis, on the world of Bal'demnic.
Endangered by the possibility of an explosion from a pocket of lethane gas, Tenebrous uses Force Speed to return to shallower levels of the cavern system they're in, where their ship is docked. Even though Tenebrous catches Plagueis off-guard with the speed of his departure, Plagueis manages to keep up (though he has to draw deeply on the Force to do so).
Nearly knocked over by the swiftness of Tenebrous’s departure, Plagueis had to call deeply on the Force merely to keep up. Retracing the inclined path they had taken from the grotto in which their starship waited, they fairly flew up the crystal-studded tunnel they had picked their way through earlier.
-- Darth Plagueis
Even with their Force-enhanced speed, the duo are too slow to escape the explosion. Tenebrous is forced to conjure a Force shield to contain the fireball. However, his Force shield is incapable of absorbing the concussive force of the explosion, which hurls Plagueis to the ground.
Tenebrous conjured a Force shield with his waving arms that met the fireball and contained it, thousands of flaming hawk-bats spiraling within the tumult like windblown embers. A few meters away Plagueis, hurled face-first to the ground by the intensity of the vaporizing blast, lifted his head in time to see the underside of the domed ceiling begin to shed enormous slabs of rock.
-- Darth Plagueis
This isn't impressive at all, considering Jacen Solo deflected cannon fire with no visible effort years before his prime.
Jaina spun away from another attack and glimpsed Jacen and Tahiri standing back-to-back, Jacen holding his hand above their heads, cannon fire ricocheting away as though he held a deflector shield in his palm. That was something Jaina and Zekk had never seen before.
-- Dark Nest: The Swarm Wars
And nearer to (but still before) his prime, Jacen managed to wrap an entire taxicab in a Force shield that tanked an explosion powerful enough to blow hundred-meter-wide holes in buildings along both sides of a Coruscant speeder route.
Jacen jerked his head around, suddenly seized by such a powerful sense of immediate danger that his instinct was to fling himself on Niathal and wrap the taxi tight in a Force shield. The vessel bucked hard as if it had been hit by a tidal wave. There was a second of silence before a deafening whump shook it like a box and they were caught in an instant blizzard of what seemed to be glittering snow. It hammered the hull as Jacen fought to hold the taxi steady, oblivious of the pilot’s efforts.
Shattered transparisteel.
It seemed to go on for minutes. The pilot was shouting. Jacen straightened up, staring into the rapidly blinking eye of a shaken Niathal, and knew that they had caught the tail end of a huge explosion.
“Ohhh…just look at that…, ” said the pilot. He seemed to be holding the taxi stationary now without Jacen’s unseen assistance.
Niathal swallowed hard. “Well, this changes everything.”
Jacen could feel what had happened, but it was still a shocking sight. Ahead of them, the skylanes seemed to be a gaping hole of nothing—as if a whole mass of speeders had fallen out of the sky, which they clearly had—and for a hundred meters the buildings on either side were like jagged, open mouths. Each transparisteel frontage had been blown out. The Force was torn with anger and fear and shock. The unnatural silence was broken by emergency klaxons and echoing shouts. Jacen realized the taxi’s screens had collapsed into the cabin, although still in one piece.
-- Legacy of the Force: Bloodlines
Clearly, Tenebrous at his prime is less powerful than Jacen Solo during the events of the Dark Nest crisis, years before his prime.
After the explosion has dissipated, Tenebrous is occupied holding up several slabs of stone that are capable of crushing their ship. Plagueis describes their ship as 'small'.
Close to the jumble of stones the collapse had piled on the grotto floor sat Tenebrous’s small but priceless starship—a Rugess Nome design—alloy wings and snubbed nose poking from the artless mausoleum the explosion had fashioned.
-- Darth Plagueis
Given this information and the knowledge that the ship carried only Plagueis and Tenebrous to Bal'demnic, we can reasonably assume that the ship is no larger than a Lambda-class shuttle. Since a Lambda-class shuttle is 20 meters long and there were several slabs of stone threatening to crush the ship, we can assume that each slab was a few meters long. Assuming (generously) that each slab weighs a few tons, we see that Tenebrous needs to focus so heavily on holding these slabs aloft that he can't sense Plagueis's intentions to kill him.
Now, though, it was Tenebrous who was positioned beneath the fall. And in that instant Plagueis perceived the danger Tenebrous had foreseen earlier: his death. His death at Plagueis’s hands. While Tenebrous was preoccupied holding aloft the slabs that threatened to crush the ship, Plagueis quickly reoriented himself, aiming his raised hands at the plummeting slabs above his Master and, with a downward motion of both arms, brought them down so quickly and with so much momentum that Tenebrous was buried almost before he understood what had hit him.
-- Darth Plagueis
After Tenebrous's death, Plagueis telekinetically lifts and rearranges those same slabs, indicating that he's fairly close to Tenebrous's level of power already. Note that this is decades before Plagueis's prime.
From a spot mid-distance between the ship and rubble pile beneath the oculus, he immersed himself in the Force and, with gestures not unlike those he and Tenebrous had used in arresting the ceiling collapse, began to levitate slabs from the ship and add them to the rubble heap, stopping only when he had both exposed the hatch of the ship and was confident he could Force-leap through the oculus from atop the augmented pile.
-- Darth Plagueis
For additional comparison, Darth Malgus (years before his prime), managed to telekinetically blow several tons of rubble off him after holding it up and preventing it from crushing him.
Malgus stood in a pocket under a mountain of rubble, legs bent, the power from his upraised hands preventing several tons of duracrete and steel from crushing him. Dust made his already troubled breathing more difficult. He coughed as the words of his father echoed in his mind.
He'd been sloppy, so lost in his need for revenge that he'd failed to properly evaluate the Jedi's power. He'd surrendered his reason to bloodlust. But no more. With an effort of will, he contained his anger, controlled it, made it a whetstone against which he sharpened his power. Using the Force, he blew the rubble up and away from him. It fell with a crash into the adjacent buildings. A Force-augmented leap carried him out and over the heap. The Jedi's eyes widened as Malgus hit the street. Malgus sneered and charged.
-- The Third Lesson
This clearly shows that Tenebrous is at best equal to Malgus at that time (during the events of the Hope trailer), and a more realistic appraisal would be that he's slightly below Hope Malgus.
We now turn to the events surrounding Tenebrous's death, which are detailed in The Tenebrous Way.
Tenebrous is capable of sensing each individual midi-chlorian in his body die.
His Force-perception was even more acute than the magnifying powers of his enormous eyes; in the Force, he could feel each individual midi-chlorian wink out in turn, a spreading wave of darkness, like stars eclipsed by the silhouette of an approaching ship.
-- The Tenebrous Way
However, Plagueis can perceive them dying as well. He actually perceives them 'winking out', the exact term Tenebrous uses, indicating that he can also perceive them individually.
The Bith’s moribund midi-chlorians were winking out, like lights slowly deprived of a power source, and yet Plagueis could still perceive Tenebrous in the Force.
-- Darth Plagueis
Tenebrous also manages to make a retrovirus propagate with incredible speed using the Force.
Driven by the dark side-powered will of the Sith Master, the retrovirus propagated with incredible speed.
-- The Tenebrous Way
However, this feat isn't all that impressive considering that cells replicate insanely fast of their own volition.
Finally, Tenebrous states that he's 'by far the most powerful Force-user whose death Plagueis had the opportunity to observe'.
Tenebrous was by far the most powerful Force-user whose death Plagueis had the opportunity to observe, and he had known all along that his apprentice would apply all his physical, mental, and Force capabilities - pitiful as they might be - to witness each slightest detail.
-- The Tenebrous Way
While seemingly impressive, this quote means nothing in reality, since Plagueis hasn't been shown to interact with any powerful Force-users before this.
To summarize what we've seen so far:
Tenebrous in his prime (at the time of his death) is slightly above Plagueis at that time, who is decades before his prime. He's below pre-prime Malgus (as of the Hope trailer), and vastly below pre-prime Jacen Solo (as of the Dark Nest trilogy).
Next, I'm going to debunk a few theories people use to scale Tenebrous to a much higher placement.
First, the argument that Tenebrous predicted his own death, something even Sith such as Darths Sidious and Caedus were unable to do.
Tenebrous predicted his death through Bith Science and mathematical equations, not through his use of the Force.
His own death was clearly foretold, entirely inevitable, and it would precede the rise of the shadow by decades. His fate was explicit in the numbers, and numbers do not lie.
-- The Tenebrous Way
The future was always in motion, and while other Sith struggled to foresee the faintest, least specific hints of what was to come, Tenebrous had no need to see the future. He could calculate it.
-- The Tenebrous Way
Once his analysis had been parsed to its nth degree, polished into a gem perfect beyond the possibility of flaw, Tenebrous had devoted every second of every day of his life to fulfilling his plan. Nothing would be left to chance.
-- The Tenebrous Way
Clearly, this does not elevate his placement with regards to his Force power, only with regards to his intellect.
Second, the idea that Tenebrous's Master was able to shrink the light-side bubble surrounding the galaxy. Since this is a galactic-scale event and because Tenebrous defeated his Master, this seems to indicate that Tenebrous would be capable of such feats as well.
In a sense, the Jedi Order had done the same on a galactic scale, Plagueis believed, by bathing the galaxy in the energy of the light side of the Force; or more accurately by fashioning a Force bubble that had prevented infiltration by the dark side, until Tenebrous’s Master had succeeded in bursting the bubble, or at least shrinking it.
-- Darth Plagueis
However, this quote provides no context whatsoever for how Tenebrous's Master actually performed this feat. Given Tenebrous's demonstrated power level and the fact that his Master was weaker than him, it's clear that this wasn't done through his raw power. The most reasonable conclusion is that he used a Sith ritual to shrink the influence of the light side on the galaxy.
For further context, it took Sidious and Plagueis months of intense meditation to shift the balance of the Force from the light to the dark.
All that mattered was that, almost a decade earlier, they had succeeded in willing the Force to shift and tip irrevocably to the dark side. Not a mere paradigm shift, but a tangible alteration that could be felt by anyone strong in the Force, and whether or not trained in the Sith or Jedi arts. The shift had been the outcome of months of intense meditation, during which Plagueis and Sidious had sought to challenge the Force for sovereignty and suffuse the galaxy with the power of the dark side.
-- Darth Plagueis
Both of them were vastly more powerful than Tenebrous's Master, lending further support to the idea that Tenebrous's Master used a ritual of some sort to accomplish his feat. Clearly, this doesn't scale Tenebrous any higher, since rituals allow weaker Force-users to accomplish things far beyond their actual power level.
To conclude:
While Tenebrous, as a Sith of the Banite line, is indeed powerful, he's not nearly as powerful as some make him out to be. His apprentice, Plagueis, grew vastly more powerful than him over the years. So respect Darth Tenebrous...but not too much.
@necromancer76: Not so sure Plagueis is > Valkorion, besides the novel blurb, there's nothing suggesting that's accurate. But I digress, not trying to start a shitstorm.
Also yeah, Az will probably have some choice words here, lmao.
Yeah, huge lol at that because comparing Hope Malgus to AoTC Anakin is spite in favor of Anakin. Stopped reading right there. I mean, A for effort and all and efforts are always appreciable, but Tenebrous's placement is exactly as he deserves.
Yeah, huge lol at that because comparing Hope Malgus to AoTC Anakin is spite in favor of Anakin. Stopped reading right there. I mean, A for effort and all and efforts are always appreciable, but Tenebrous's placement is exactly as he deserves.
AOTC Anakin> Tenebrous :) He's on the scale of Yoda after all.
Yeah, I don't see anything showing AotC Anakin can tank a grenade to the face, being crushed into a mountain, and blowing several tons of debris off him with a Force wave.
@thevioletsaber: sigh. Read the full passage. They are deflecting fire from the dropship after running from the turbolasers. The book goes out of it's way to call them different things. Jacen is not deflecting turbolasers. Just normal cannon fire.
@greysentinel365: Oh, THAT's what you mean. I thought you were implying that Jacen didn't actually deflect anything...or something. Thanks for catching that.
Tenebrous would absolutely curbstomp Return Malgus.
And Tenebrous's cave feat is very impressive, lowballing it is just stupid. Tenebrous is vastly more powerful than folks like Bane and Maul, and still more powerful than Vader or Dooku.
I don't know why this thread exists, but it surely isn't going to have any effect.
[[Tenebrous would absolutely curbstomp Return Malgus.]]
-- Got any proof to back that up?
[[And Tenebrous's cave feat is very impressive, lowballing it is just stupid.]]
-- I proved that it isn't impressive, considering VASTLY pre-prime Plagueis was capable of lifting those rocks as well.
[[Tenebrous is vastly more powerful than folks like Bane and Maul, and still more powerful than Vader or Dooku.]]
-- First, it seems like you think Bane and Maul are on the same tier. Second, it seems like you think Vader and Dooku are on the same tier. Third, it seems like you think Dooku is above Bane? Where do you come up with this stuff?
-- Again, got any proof to back up this claim? If so, I'll listen, otherwise your opinion is meaningless.
-- Again, got any proof to back up this claim? If so, I'll listen, otherwise your opinion is meaningless.
You're asking @thesithmaster: provide you proof, which's going to result in him spamming long walls of texts with feats that take up half a page and are almost impossible to get through.
I entered this thread expecting another wall of "scaling" bullshit, depicting Tenebrous the Featless as above Revan/Caedus despite no evidence to back it up.
-- Again, got any proof to back up this claim? If so, I'll listen, otherwise your opinion is meaningless.
You're asking @thesithmaster: provide you proof, which's going to result in him spamming long walls of texts with feats that take up half a page and are almost impossible to get through.
Given that dooku is factualy beyond yoda's ability to outright ragdoll, is superior to a force user in Kenobi who can wreck an entire formation of 500 m megaliths, and is factually the third most skilled swordsman in the order's history even a decade pre-prime, I'm not sure where you're getting Bane>Dooku from.
@kbroskywalker: AFAIK Dooku doesn't have lightning powerful enough to incinerate living beings on contact, and he's not fast enough to prevent any raindrop in a rainstorm from hitting him by dodging/blocking them.
@necromancer76: Ah. Fair enough I suppose. Personall, I hold Valkorion above most versions of Sidious even. Which may sound fallacious, but it's really not that outlandish. But I digress, this is neither the time or place for that shit storm of a debate, haha.
Dooku doesn't have lightning powerful enough to incinerate living beings on contact
Given dooku shares loose parity with force users vastly more powerful than bane(banite scaling), I think we can assume his lightning's more powerful.
Dooku doesn't have lightning powerful enough to incinerate living beings on contact
Given that he's faster than ROTS Kenobi, who's fast enough to deflect/avoid omnidirectional blasterfire from then thousands, I think he's fast enough for Bane tbh.
I'm not even backing up my claims because Pre Prime Malgus>Tenebrous is so ridiculous it shows you actually need to learn Tenebrous, who is vastly more powerful than Darth Bane via RoT Scaling, lifted an entire mine, and created a Force barrier capable of repelling the explosion that completely collapsed the mine.
RoT scaling that's flawed. While the Sith after Bane grew more powerful in accordance with scaling, Gravid set the Order back CENTURIES. That reset the baseline power level to SOLIDLY below prime Bane.
[[lifted an entire mine]]
-- An entire mine? The mine he was IN? Come on, at least make your claims a TINY bit logical. Tenebrous lifted SLABS OF STONE falling from the CEILING of the mine, NOT the mine itself.
[[created a Force barrier capable of repelling the explosion that completely collapsed the mine.]]
-- Proof that it completely collapsed the mine?
Come up with more substantial arguments, mate. You have nothing but a flawed interpretation of scaling on your side.
I'm not even backing up my claims because Pre Prime Malgus>Tenebrous is so ridiculous it shows you actually need to learn Tenebrous, who is vastly more powerful than Darth Bane via RoT Scaling, lifted an entire mine, and created a Force barrier capable of repelling the explosion that completely collapsed the mine.
Gravid set the Order back CENTURIES. That reset the baseline power level to SOLIDLY below prime Bane.
Quote?
In knowledge. Not in power or in ability. Gean still managed to defeat him, and she would have obviously grown in power later on and replaced by an even more powerful apprentice and so on. Not to mention, each successive apprentice is "canonically" more powerful than their predecessors. That's how the rule of two worked. And by Gravid's time, Bane would be nothing more than an insect.
I suggest you give up. The ROT scaling is pretty firm and conclusive in the regard that each successive apprentice is more powerful, and better than the master. Denying this is utterly pointless.
Gravid set the Order back CENTURIES. That reset the baseline power level to SOLIDLY below prime Bane.
Quote?
I suggest you give up. The ROT scaling is pretty firm and conclusive in the regard that each successive apprentice is more powerful, and better than the master. Denying this is utterly pointless.
Kek, I have no interest in he rule of two scaling being bunk or not. I was just curious what he was talking about. Thanks for the info though.
And yea, bane's an insect to Sids, that was never in doubt
I was talking to him. It is canonical that each apprentice of the Banite lineage is more powerful than their masters, which he was somehow attempting to deny.
And yea, bane's an insect to Sids, that was never in doubt
Forget Sidious, he would be an insect to someone like Gravid. And someone like Gravid would be an insect to someone like Plagueis/Tenebrous.
It is true that a Sith apprentice destroyed much of what the Banite line had worked to, and much information was lost. So at that point, it really would have been a reset. But, we know nearly nothing of the Banite line after Zannah took Cognus. We have a few names and some vague info, and then we pick back up with Tenebrous and Plagueis, who regard Darth Bane's powers as "legendary."
This should imply that even they were impressed by Bane's powers, so it actually would be natural to assume that at the time the order was thrown off track, they were set back quite a bit.
I actually do have Bane and Maul in the same tier.
@bigsambino87: A reset in knowledge doesn't equate to a rese power. Regardless of whether the knowledge is reset, the power isn't being lost here and banite apprentinces canonically surpass their masters. There's no way to circumvent banite scaling
@thevioletsaber Alright, I'll respond now. In your analysis you had two main points that you used to claim Tenebrous wasn't a very impressive Force user: the fireball and the falling rocks. I'll address both of them and explain why your reasoning is flawed, and that they place no limitations upon Tenebrous that'd put him below Hope Malgus.
Even with their Force-enhanced speed, the duo are too slow to escape the explosion. Tenebrous is forced to conjure a Force shield to contain the fireball. However, his Force shield is incapable of absorbing the concussive force of the explosion, which hurls Plagueis to the ground.
Nowhere in the text does it state Tenebrous failed to absorb its concussive force. Plagueis was far behind Tenebrous, so obviously the explosion would hit and knock him to the ground before Tenebrous could contain it, but it states nothing about Tenebrous getting knocked to the ground.
Second, it'd be asinine to assume Tenebrous couldn't contain it anyway, considering what a 10-year-old Zannah could do:
Gallery
The fires had killed most of the other bouncers. The survivors had all gone mad. All except Laa. Somehow Rain had saved her. She'd used the Force, shielding them both from the burning death and destruction, though she wasn't quite sure how she'd done it. It had just sort of ... happened. Now she and Laa had nobody left but each other.
--Darth Bane: Path of Destruction
He knew that the first army to truly unite as one would be victorious, and he eventually brought the Sith Lords together and showed them how to focus their dark side energy into a lethal blast of power that scoured the surface of Ruusan. Most of the Jedi and the Sith were utterly destroyed, but the war was far from over.
--The Official Star Wars Fact File #22
The explosions above were the result of a Sith ritual performed by the Brotherhood of Darkness. It featured the combined power of hundreds Sith Lords and utterly annihilated an army ofJedi and other Sith. Yet little Rain, with no training whatsoever, created a Force bubble that successfully shielded her and Laa from it.
Given this information and the knowledge that the ship carried only Plagueis and Tenebrous to Bal'demnic, we can reasonably assume that the ship is no larger than a Lambda-class shuttle. Since a Lambda-class shuttle is 20 meters long and there were several slabs of stone threatening to crush the ship, we can assume that each slab was a few meters long. Assuming (generously) that each slab weighs a few tons, we see that Tenebrous needs to focus so heavily on holding these slabs aloft that he can't sense Plagueis's intentions to kill him.
There is a difference in needing to focus on a task, and whether that task actually requires effort. An example would be the Emperor’s death in Return of the Jedi, where he is intensely focused on Luke and thus fails to sense Vader’s intentions of killing him. I hope you don’t think that Palpatine actually required any kind of effort in shooting basic level Lightning at Luke, since he obviously didn’t.
There are more examples of this, but just one is enough for now. You can’t lowball Tenebrous with this feat; the text implies no real effort on his part at all, and the entire sequence of events from the rocks falling to Tenebrous holding them to Plagueis killing him all happened in a matter of seconds anyway, given the text uses words such as ”in that instant,” ”quickly,” and ”so quickly” to describe Plagueis’ line of thought and his actions.
Lastly, Tenebrous had not only foreseen his death – which you acknowledged in your post – but also planned it from the start, indicating that he allowed himself to get crushed by the rocks.
Dying, Tenebrous observed with mild surprise, was turning out to b enot only pleasant, but wholly wonderful; had he ever suspected how much he’d enjoy the process, he wouldn’t have wasted all those decades waiting for his foolish apprentice Plagueis to do him in.
So, even as he lay gasping around the icy barbs that pierced his lung, Tenebrous smiled. Even with the jerking and convulsing in his body’s last reflexive rebellion against the fall of eternal night, even as organ systems shut down one by one to maintain the last shreds of light and life withing the vast intricacies of his brain—massive beyond even those of other Biths, a people justly legendary for their intellectual prowess—Tenebrous found himself particularly enjoying the incremental disappearance of his own midi-chlorians.
His Force-perception was even more cuate than the magnifying powers of his enormous eyes; in the Force, he could feel each individual midi-chlorian wink out in turn, a spreading wave of darkness, like starts eclipsed by the silhouette of an approaching whip.
Or falling through the event horizon of a black hole.
Ah, darkness. Darkness at last. The darkness he had dreamed of. The darkness he had planned for. The darkness that was his one true love. The darkness he hadtaken as his name.
Was he not Darth Tenebrous?
His vision dimmed. His hearing became a rish of wind like static on an electrodriver – and the silence. The sole sensation registered by his quivering flesh was the rip of shattered bone and slow suffocation choking his consciousness, as his shredded lung could only supply only a fraction of the oxygen required by his massive brain.
It hardly mattered. Shielded from suffering by his command of the Force, Tenebrous observed the death agony of his physical form with appropriately Bithan dispassion. And now his impossibly refined perceptions detected the birsh of Plagueis’ mind, as the apprentice probed the vanishing midi-chlorians of his dying master with his own use of the Force, as Tenebrous had known he would. Tenebrous had spent decades makig sure Plagueis would be unable to resist doing exactly that.
Everything was proceeding according to plan.
--The Tenebrous Way
Although you did not bring this up your initial analysis, you also professed your belief that the Banite scaling doesn’t work, due to the setback Darth Gravid dealt to the Order, If this were the case, if Darth Gean were truly ”solidly below prime Bane,” then how could she have succeeded in overpowering Gravid’s Force field, indicating superior strength in the Force, and the proceeding to kill Gravid with her bare hands?
Barricaded within the walls of a bastion he and his Twi’lek apprentice, Gean, had constructed on Jaguada, he had attempted as much, and was thought to have destroyed more than half the repository of artifacts before Gean, demonstrating consummate will and courage, had managed to penetrate the Force fields Gravid had raised around their stronghold and intercede, killing her Master with her bare hands, though at the cost of her arm, shoulder, and the entire left side of her face and chest.
--Darth Plagueis
Furthermore, canonical sources have repeatedly proven your claim to be false. Banite scaling’s been a thing since 1999, and was reaffirmed in the same novel Gravid was introduced in, and later in 2015, several years after Gravid’s introduction as well.
For a millennium, the Sith maintained the order in secrecy, passing down their evil heritage. As they gained knowledge of the dark side of the Force, their powers increased with each generation.
--Episode 1: The Phantom Menace Scrapbook
Ultimately, Bane's plan produced more powerful Sith Lords with every generation.
--Force and Destiny
For a thousand years we continued to follow Bane's Rule of Two, existing in the shadows, biding our time, growing in power, feeding our hatred. Darth Sidious proved to be the splendid culmination of a thousand years of Sith philosophy and teachings.
--Insider #88: Heritage of the Sith
"Bane's power has been passed down for a thousand years. I vow to be its last recipient."
--Darth Sidious, Book of the Sith
"How often you said that the old order of Bane had ended with the death of your Master. An apprentice no longer needs to be stronger, you told me, merely more clever. The era of keeping score, suspicion and betrayal was over. Strength lies not in the flesh but in the Force."
--Darth Sidious, Darth Plagueis
With that; I believe I have addressed all the points relevant to your ranking of Tenebrous. As you can see, he is far from the weakling you argued he was. For a detailed case for Tenebrous that showcases his true strength in the Force, click here
@greysentinel365: Yes, my bad. It's not actually my case, but a fellow PT supporter's. It's very good nonetheless, so it'd make no sense for me to just repeat his arguments.
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