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#1 Edited by Jeepeh (6134 posts) - - Show Bio

Hey there. I've had to re-type arguments many times over just how powerful Bleach characters are and how I come to such a conclusion. I decided I'll make a general post with everything I can think of in it, so I can just come back here and copy/paste, and hopefully some of you will be more knowledgeable of the power levels of Bleach by the end. Obviously everything may not be right, but you can observe and make your own choice at the end of it. Here we go!

DISCLAIMER: Don't read this, and then say "No, stop wanking fanboy". If you want to do that then leave the thread now, either prove me wrong or agree with me.

1. Speed.

Lets get this straight, By the SS arc, Bankai Ichigo is Lightning speed,

1. Databook proof

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Top left. This is rather different from comic book databooks as I understand it, since Mangas are written by one person only, and Author intent > pretty much everything.

2. Shikai Ichigo Blitzed Chojiro, who he himself had a lightning Bankai,

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whether or not this makes Chojiro lightning speed in Reaction time is up to you, but it is possible. You don't have a sword that's faster than you can swing, right?

Jump ahead to Ulquiorra

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To the point that Ichigo needs his unconscious reactions to survive the speed, but even that isn't a help once Ulquiorra uses his second release. Although Ichigo isn't masked in this feat

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I would put Ulquiorra, at this point, near Mach 500, perhaps even more. More on that subject in a second though.

We all know how much Hollow Ichigo trumps him by that point, so it goes without saying that Hollow Ichigo is far better than that. After the Hollow Ichigo ordeal, Aizen says that Ichigo has unlocked a new kind of power, so he has upgraded once again, although his fear of his hollow form is throwing that out of wack

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Now to the Mach 500 thing, Ulquiorra was capable of blitzing a masked Ichigo to the point that it wasn't even funny anymore. After that upgrade, he was capable of dodging Mach 500, in a depressed state

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Hollow Ichigo should be > FKT arc Ichigo, especially un-masked. So it's very plausible to say that Hollow Ichigo > Ulquiorra > Unmasked-FKT arc Bankai Ichigo = Mach 500

Now before you all say the obvious thing that I know you're going to, "Gin lied about his Bankai!" I will say this,

NO.

He did not lie to ICHIGO about his Bankai, he lied to AIZEN.

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"I told you a while back". As in a long time ago, as in, before the series started. Likely near the time that Aizen told him of his

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It's as if everyone saw the words "I lied" and jumped on the bandwagon to downplay Bleach without considering the context.

Okay, we have that crap storm out of the way, and Ichigo is now PROVEN (whether you agree on the lightning speed SS arc Ichigo or not) that he is Mach 500 without the mask.

Now this, new and enhanced (?) Ichigo (before he got depressed, and he's masked, so likely higher than Mach 500 speeds) was being dodged almost effortlessly by base Aizen

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Now pay attention to this part, this will be very important in this thread.

we must examine what it means to be "transcendent". As Aizen called it

Ganju and Hanatoro (a 7th seat) were able to feel the Reiatsu of Kenpachi, who is considered a very powerful Captain. But they could still feel him, but powerhouses like Isshin, Yoruichi, and Urahara were incapable of feeling Aizen's Chrysalis form. Thus, in order to be considered "transcendent" to someone, the gap in your power must be more than that of the gap between a 7th seat of the Medical Division and Captain of the Battle Division. Another example would be that Orihime, who couldn't even stand up to a 4th seat was capable of feeling Gin's power, and Gin was one of the high tier captains along with Aizen. So again, the power gap must be far greater than it was in those cases. Yet another, far greater example would be Rukia, who had been exposed to the Sekki Sekki for so long that her Reiatsu level was practically nothing, could still feel Ichigo, Byakuya, and Ukitake.

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So captain level is still not enough to be transcendent when compared to almost no power.

So keeping that in mind,

FGT >Transcendent> Monster Aizen = Dangai Ichigo >Transcendent> Butterflaizen > MulletZen > Chrysalis Aizen >Transcendent> Kenpachi probably > Normal Aizen.

So now, how fast do you think the god tiers of Bleach (Dangai Ichigo, Monster-Aizen, Juha) are, considering the immense gap between them, and someone who can dodge Mach 500 like nothing? It's bloody ridiculous is what it is.

Also, lets put some speed feats for other characters,

Rukia: Blitzing captain level opponents

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That's all I can think of at the moment, aside from this.

Modern Rukia, Renji, Byakuya, Kenpachi, and Ichigo, all fall into the transcendent category along with Post-Hogyoku Aizen, Why?

Shinji said "According to the Reiatsu, no-one's here who can put up a fight anymore". But Rukia, who could one shot sternritters, Renji, who could kill Sternritters that are Multiple x Captain level, and Byakuya, who could off-screen 5 sternritters at once, were all present. He couldn't feel their Reiatsu? So as far as I'm concerned, Rukia, Renji, Byakuya, and Ichigo are all transcendents now.

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I don't know what level of transcendence, but they are transcendents, so I'd say that Kubo is still paying attention to it, he put a rather large emphasis on it. No-one else mentioned Ichigo arriving via Reiatsu until he was seen.

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After he was visible, THEN everyone saw him. But the ones that Shinji couldn't feel were the ones to sense him before he was visible. So I'd say the entire RR group are Transcendents.

This is even further enhanced by Juha's statement

That Ichigo is now again his Post-Dangai Self

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Kenpachi is a transcendent because of the 11th Divisions member's statement

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Kenpachi's upper limits are not known, because 1. He lowered his Reiatsu for the fight with Gremmy, 2. His Eyepatch is still on. But it doesn't matter, because he lowered his Reiatsu to the point it was feel-able by the random 11th division members, THEN he blew up the meteor, so if he is a transcendent, that only means that Meteor busting is the very BASE of his power level. But it doesn't change anything for powerscaling the other characters from him.

So basically, this means that All the RG trainees are so fast that Mach 500 isn't even on their radar.

Alright, that ends the Speed I think

2. Strength

Lets start with Masked shikai Ichigo, this is where you're all going to start hating on me.

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From this, we can get two things: The total weight Ichigo lifted and the overall compressive strength required to collapse the iron pillars as he did.

As you can see there are five iron pillars in pentagon shapes, but for the sake of simplicity (And being conservative), I'll be treating them as rectangular prisms instead. To start, I'll get the weight of each pillar by scaling them.

As we can see here and here, one pillar's width is somewhat close to the length of Ichigo's wingspan. A man's wingspan is generally equal to their total height, if not more. http://hypertextbook.com/facts/2006/...portions.shtml

From there, it's an easy scaling.

Ichigo's height is stated to be 1.74 m by some databooks, so I'll use that (It's about average height anyway). That also gets applied to his wingspan, keep in mind.

Ichigo's wingspan is at 62 pixels compared to the pillar's 39. 62 / 39 = 1.59. 1.74 / 1.59 = 1.09 m, the width of the pillars.

Next, we see the height is measured at 392 pixels. 392 / 62 = 6.32 * 1.74 = 11 m, the height of each pillar.

Now, with a height and width of 11 m and 1.09 m respectively, I can get the weight using this calculator by setting the material to cast iron, cross section to square bar, and entering the width and lengths.

This gives us a weight of 93,462.36 Kg, or 93.46 tons Since he lifted up five of those, the total weight would be 467.3 tons.

But that's only half of the calculation, we can go a step further by getting the compressive force required for Ichigo to collapse those iron pillars by pushing them against Hachi's barrier.

Here's an article on compressive strength for reference: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Compressive_strength

Gray cast iron (Which coincidentally are used as pillars for support on occassion) has a compressive strength of 827 MPa. 827 MPa = 827,000,000 N/m^2.

Next I need to find the total area of the pillar.

Surface area of a rectangular prism = 2ab + 2bc + 2ac

2 * 1.09 * 11 = 29.98

+

2 * 11 * 1.09 = 29.98

+

2 * 1.09 * 1.09 = 2.38

= 62.34 m^2, the total area of one pillar.

Compressive strength = Load (What’s pushing up against the pillar, in this case) / Total area. So going by this, we need to multiply our given compressive strength by the total area, giving us the force in Newtons.

827,000,000 N/m^2 * 62.34 m^2 = 51,555,180,000 N, but Ichigo did this for five pillars at once, so naturally we multiply this by five to get: 257,775,900,000 N

Gravity applies that much force on 26,276,850 Tons

Shocked yet? That's only shikai Ichigo,

x10 for Bankai, with Yoruichi's statement that Bankai is 5-10x stronger than Shikai on average.

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Now 26,000,000 (rounding) x 10 = 260,000,000 tons.

This would mean that Grimmjow is about that, considering the things he was doing to Bankai+Masked Ichigo in their final fight,

This would, of course, scale to the other characters just like the speed did.

Then run that through the transcendent scaling

FGT >Transcendent> Monster Aizen = Dangai Ichigo >Transcendent> Butterflaizen > MulletZen > Chrysalis Aizen >Transcendent> Kenpachi probably > Normal Aizen >>>> Masked Ichigo > 260,000,000 tons.

Does Dangai Ichigo scare you yet? Because he should.

3. Attack strength

If the last part didn't make you hate me, then this part will.

Alright, so lets start this. I'll start with how big the Seireitei is

1.

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In 10 days, if you walk for 16 hours a day you can walk for 160 hours.

160 hours x 5 km/h = 800 km

Yep. Seireitei is easily over 800 km in diameter (which is 200 spirit miles, given Yamamoto's numbers that he gave during the Orihime discussion)

2.

According to the Bleach Movie "Fade to Black" Seireitei is 400 spirit miles for it's diameter

Kubo over saw the production of this movie by the way

http://bleachness.livejournal.com/219899.html

1 spirit mile=2.4 spirit miles

400x2.4=960 miles

This is the diameter of soul society

All of these things end up saying 800 to 1,000 miles.

1,000 miles = 1/7th of earth's width.

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Now lets put this into Las Noches to be used for feats in FKT arc

Nel said that they were 3 days away from the nearest gate

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So lets say 1/3rd of the Seireitei for a low end, that's about 300 miles. It could be that, although most people believe Las Noches to be as big as the Seireitei, I'm not sure why, I can't find it. Probably some databook somewhere. Yes, we don't know how many gates there are, but I'm trying to lowball it as much as possible,

But even so, this is Ulquiorra's Lanza compared to Las Noches

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About 1-2 times as big. So that's about 300 to 600 miles. What's 600 miles on a map?

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Small country level, and that's lowballing the numbers. Now this relates to hollow Ichigo

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Because he caught that sucker in his freaking hand and crushed it like it was pathetic. And this is only Hollow Ichigo at 1/3rd power, with what he told Unohona later about his Reiatsu gague

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It says half, but that makes no sense with how big his coat is. It's more like 1/3rd to 1/4th. Translation error perhaps?

This relates to Grimmjow in the way that, Gran Rey Cero as well as Espada 4+ releasing are disallowed to be used within Las Noches because they could destroy it, as said by Aizen himself. Are you one to tell Aizen that he's wrong? lol

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Good thing Ichigo blocked it, I guess

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Masked Bankai Ichigo can stop country level attacks in Hueco Mundo Arc apparently.

Okay, so now we have Country level Ulquiorra + Grimmjow + Ichigo and Country+++ level hollow Ichigo.

Now lets go back to the Seireitei comparable feats

We've established the Seireitei's size as roughly 1,000 miles wide, well Gremmy has a meteor that he says will "Crush" the Seireitei, and Kenpachi destroys it while still patched

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Gremmy’s meteor calc

Radius = 0.3 the size of seirietie

= 533.333 km

Volume = 4/3 * 3.14 * R^3

=1.3*3.14*(533,333)^3

= 6.19253357E+17

mass = volume*Density

= 6.19253357E+17*2500

= 1.54813339E+21

Velocity = 2km/s (minimum ablation velocity)

KE = 0.5m(v)^2

= 0.5*1.54813339E+21*(2000)^2

= 3.09626678E+27 joules

Which is equals to 740 petatons.

...

Ah I messed up

The radius is 266km not 533km (that is the diameter)

So the final yield is 90 petatons

Continent+ level.

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And no, this is not disprovable via Reiatsu scaling as some people have tried to do, Gremmy's Meteor, if it even was made of Reishi, would not be giving off Reiatsu at all, that's not how it works. But even if it was, Gremmy would've had to use that much Reiatsu to make it, so Kenpachi's Reiatsu would have to be Continent level anyway. Also disproven by the fact that Hashwalth is worried about the meteor, Juha's obviously more powerful than gremmy, So why would Hashwalth be worried if it's Reiatsu vs Reiatsu?

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So now there's Continent+ level modern Kenpachi, now put that back into the transcendent scaling

FGT >Transcendent> Monster Aizen = Dangai Ichigo >Transcendent> Butterflaizen > MulletZen > Chrysalis Aizen = Rukia = Renji = Byakuya >Transcendent> Kenpachi = Continent busting.

Continent busting shouldn't even be on the RG trainee's radar, much less Dangai Ichigo. The only thing that caused problems for Rukia in her fight was As Nodt's ability, not his power. Renji had minor problems with Mask after he upgraded like 3 times.

And while we're on the subject, hax powers are not negate-able via Reiatsu, the only time such a thing was ever observed was with Aizen and Soi Fon

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But, as shown seconds later, that was an illusion.

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This is further backed up by Askin affecting RG members,

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This shows that Rukia having difficulty with As Nodt's ability is not disproving her transcendence. Soi Fon's ability could kill Dangai Ichigo if she succeeds in getting two hits. And it was clearly shown that Renji was on another level than Mask, Mask had to upgrade 2 or 3 times, then go Volstandiig just to make Renji even a little worried. Whereas Byakuya off-screened 3 sternritter

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Now, I'd like to spend a moment on Ichigo's "hill busting".

"He vaporized a mountain not even swinging. he just kinda rose his hand up to block aizen's swing. pure air waves from a deflected slash.

People are doing their absolute best to dispute this feat, even going so far as to claim that the mountain was a “hill”, but I think that it’s fairly clear that, hill or not, this is a feat that far surpasses the level that it has been assigned.

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First of all, hill vs. mountain. Author exposition, folks. All of you debaters always say “author’s word >>> what you think”. Well, then, Kubo stated via both Ichigo and Aizen that that “hill” was a mountain. So that theory goes out the window.

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If you're still trying to say it's a hill, then Renji >>Jackie > Dangai Ichigo,

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If you believe that, Get out. Right now.

Conversely, even generous Bleach fans are labeling Post-Dangai Ichigo as a casual mountain-buster. He’s far above that, actually. You see, when something directly impacts something else, no energy is lost in the transfer; all of the kinetic force contained in the original object is released into the second object.

However, when something impacts from far off and has to rely on AIR PRESSURE to get to its target, energy is lost as the air molecules bump into each other. Quite a lot of energy, in fact.

The inverse square law states that if you double the distance between two things, the forces between them decrease in strength exponentially. So basically, whatever distance was between Ichigo and the mountain should be squared. That’s how much energy was lost from the original slash.

Let’s choose a totally arbitrary distance, say, 200 meters."

(*Cough*

it's natural for a mountain to be about a 4th of a mile to a mile wide.

And If we look here assuming said mountain is a fourth of mile to a mile wide, which isn't a crazy assumption, 200 meters is possible since we can see the area around the mountain and Ichigo and Aizen aren't visible and there are 1,609.34 meters in a mile. So 200 meters wouldn't be very far when looking at the scan.)

"Square that. We get 40,000 newtons of energy lost. That means that Ichigo’s original slash was AT LEAST 40,000 times greater than the amount of energy needed to vaporize that mountain.

So, yeah, casual mountain-busting? Ridiculous. Casual mountain-vaporizing? Closer, but still light-years away. Try casual mountain-vaporizing times 40,000, or casual county-busting."

Now let's think for a second..... if it's enough to vaporize 40,000 mountains, and it's not insane to believe said mountain was a fourth of a mile to a mile wide, that would mean 10,000 to 40,000 miles. And... how wide is the earth?

*cough*

7,918 miles. So Ichigo hitting the earth would cause the earth to be vaporized.Then add Getsuga Tenshou which increases his power and AoE by a LOT. And what do we get? We get a "Come at me DBZ, I'm ready for yah."

Btw, Ichigo didn't use his Hollow Mask either

and Ichigo did a parry, not an attack. That wasn't even close to his full attack power, especially when he can augment his sword swings with Getsuga Tenshou.

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Much less GETSUGA JUUJISHOU!

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So he should be capable of planet busting, at bear minimum via damaging the core would make the planet explode.

Ichigo only needs to destroy 3,000 miles, in fact not even because

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Most of the Earth's mass is Magma, so busting via core should be rather easy. The crust takes a total 1% of Earth's volume. I don't see liquid giving Ichigo's Getsuga a rough time. Can you even stop energy with heat?

So how much energy does it take to pierce about a dozen or so miles of rock and then breeze through a bunch of Magma? My guess is that Kurosaki-San has enough xP

So then add FGT onto that, and Aizen's final form was him merging with his powers, just like Ichigo was.

So basically, what I'm saying is, the reason that fight didn't last long and Ichigo barely tried, is because if Ichigo did try he'd have caused more damage to SS and Karakura town than anything.

And actually, now that I think about it, the mountain he destroyed was in SS, which means that it was made of Reishi, not natural matter. Which probably only cranks the feat up even more.

Now, if you STILL don't consider him to be on this level, let's compare him to Yamamoto, who's Bankai makes him the temperature of the sun

Yamamoto's the heat of the sun.

Look at this video

Raise the size of that pin a few hundred times to a size of a person,

And you want to tell me no-one is multi city level. xD And since Yamamoto's flame is his Reiatsu, and Aizen's Reiatsu > Yamamoto's Reiatsu = According to your own beliefs about how Reiatsu clases work, Aizen could walk straight through Yamamoto's fire and cut him to pieces. And we've already been through the transcendence scaling

FGT >Transcendent> Monster Aizen = Dangai Ichigo >Transcendent> Butterflaizen > MulletZen > Chrysalis Aizen = Rukia = Renji = Byakuya >Transcendent> Yamamoto = Killing everyone within 1/7 of Earth's diameter just by standing x100 or so due to his Size compared to what a pin would do at his temperature.

4. Miscellaneous

First, lets see Dangai Ichigo's greatest durability feat.

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Warping Space-time with gravity? Interesting, what does that mean? Well first of all, it sounds like a black hole to me. Although plenty of people say no, so fine. Lets take a stroll to the Gurren Lagann series, and see what Space-time level attacks can do.

Impressed yet?

But now, this tells us something interesting of the Attack Potency (NOT THE AOE) of Aizen's Fraggor.

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But then Ichigo backhands 6 of them

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Now you're saying "But you're trying to say that they're capable of planet busting, yet they fought on a planet and nothing happened to it!"

My response is, what's Dragonball's excuse? Bills is an accepted Solar System buster but he and Goku fought and did the same amount of damage that Ichigo vs Aizen did.

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next 2 points will be small, but interesting.

First, Aizen can teleport

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Next, just a cool little thing, Ichigo's human form is above peak-human. He can injure Hollows, with Hierro (Super Durability), and that's not even going into his durability/reaction time feats.

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Next I'd like to touch upon Modern Rukia, and give some thoughts on her ability.

How Absolute 0 works/what it does, taken from this site

Classically, everything stops at absolute zero, but in reality, quantum mechanics once again rears its ugly head. One of the predictions of quantum mechanics is that you can't ever measure the exact position or momentum of a particle with perfect certainty. This is known as the Heisenberg Uncertainty Principle.

If you could chill a sealed room down to absolute zero, some very strange things would happen (though more on that in a bit). The pressure in the air would drop to essentially zero, and since it's air pressure that normally resists gravity, the air would collapse to a very thin layer on the floor.

But even so, if you were able to measure the individual molecules, you'd find something surprising: they're still vibrating and rotating, but just by a tiny, tiny amount — quantum uncertainty at work. To make things concrete, if you were to measure the rotation of a Carbon Dioxide molecule at absolute zero, for instance, you'd still find that the oxygen atoms are flying around the carbon at a few miles per hour — probably faster than you would have guessed.

Again, I have to make with the lawyer-talk. When talking about the quantum world, it becomes a bit nonsensical to even talk about motion. After all, everything on those scales is governed by uncertainty, so it's not so much that the particles have motion, it's more that you can't ever measure them as not having motion.

How low can you go?

Getting down to absolute zero has essentially the identical problem with getting up to the speed of light. Getting to the speed of light requires an infinite amount of work, while getting down to absolute zero requires extracting an infinite amount of heat. Just to make it clear, both of these are impossible.

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Okay, so Absolute 0 forces your molecules to lose all of their energy and stop moving. You can't survive that, sorry. As shown above, reaching absolute 0 would require taking infinite amount of heat, and (for example, not trying to cause a fanboy war) Hulk, Goku, Batman, Superman, Wonder Woman, Ichigo, DO NOT HAVE INFINITE ENERGY TO HEAT BACK UP. Thus, if they were to be hit with Rukia's Bankai, (which turns you to absolute 0) you would be dead, no exceptions for characters beneath cosmic-y characters that can ignore physics and stuff.

Now, to do some disproving.

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"But Jeepeh! He survived it so that's hyperbole! See? And the world wasn't frozen, so she still can't be absolute 0!"

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To which I say, bull crap, son. As she explains, her Shikai allows her to lower her own body temperature. It's just straight up PIS/Plotkai that SS isn't frozen from her existing, that'd be bad, ya know? Same reason Iceman can go to absolute 0 on Juggy's helmet but nothing bad happened

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But if you want an in-universe excuse, then lets just say that she has a barrier around her to keep the coldness contained or something, her shikai froze him from contact, but he must not've been frozen to Absolute 0.

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Now her Bankai allows her to freeze OTHER THINGS,

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This, you're not coming back from.

Last thing I'll be going over is a few reasons why Ichigo will be amped from even these levels I've shown.

assuming he has re-learned FGT to re-enter his post-Dangai form,

  1. I believe that Dangai Ichigo was still being limited by Quincy-Getsu.
  2. he has a true Asauchi to help his power,
  3. he ate the Super Reiatsu,
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    Top left. A level that you have NEVER FATHOMED.

    I highly doubt that the RG don't know about Dangai Ichigo, everyone does. :P So if we go by that, Modern Ichigo >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Dangai Ichigo.

  4. the fact that he's likely been trained in his quincy and hollow aspects more by the individual Zangetsu(s),
  5. I'm expecting a Resurreccion+Volstandiig+Bankai form myself. ^_^

And with this, I bid you all good day. If you have finished reading this, and you have decided that you hate me, then fine. If you decided I'm the coolest person ever, then you're awesome. You should pm me. xD

Individual character respect threads/calcs:

Kenpachi:

How about destroying a 5-10 story platform just from air pressure of hitting something else?

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Now that I look at it he may have actually hit it, it's very difficult to tell. Either way it's impressive when he's just in his sealed form and while he's restricted by the eyepatch.

Still while sealed and patched, cut's something that a reality warper made that "can't be cut"

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Cutting through a wave of lava, still sealed and patched.

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Still sealed, still patched, tanking hundreds of bullets and missiles like absolutely nothing.

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Still Sealed, still patched, tanking getting slammed into the rock by an enormous hand.

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Still patched, still sealed, blitzing said Reality warper, though it's partly his own fault.

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Now he releases his sword, though he's still patched, and destroys a 300 mi+ Meteorite. If you want explanation on why it's 300 mi.+ let me know and I'll find the calc.

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"There's nothin' I can't cut."

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This is sort of proven when he cuts through a replica of space/vacuum. And tanks being in said vacuum, though is very weakened by it. Still patched btw,

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While patched and weakened from the Vacuum, survives an enormous explosion. Though it did damage his internal organs.

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And after this, he then gets struck by electricity multiple times, and punched by a woman that is strong enough to lift and throw an enormous piece of rock and buildings that we calc'ed to weigh 36,790.6 tons with one arm effortlessly. He also surprised a girl with lightning reaction speed,

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Still patched btw. Also with having multiple organs ruptured, imagine how fast he is normally.

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Only now is he paralyzed, (Likely from Electricity, not damage) and he's still patched btw, why didn't he take off his eyepatch? I don't freaking know. But he's still conscious.

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And if you're wondering how much more powerful he is without the eyepatch, in his first appearance it took him from being a strong dude with a sword,

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to then being able to one-shot a tall building in half without actually touching it,

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and leveling multiple buildings, perhaps a city block, from the energy release of his clash with Ichigo

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So take that kind of amp, then add it to shattering a 300 Mile+ Meteor. :D (which is continent busting btw)

This is all cranked up even more so when you consider that, before his battle he lowered his Reiatsu, whereas before the 11th division members couldn't sense it. This likely means that he is a transcendent. What does this mean?

we must examine what it means to be "transcendent". As Aizen called it

Ganju and Hanatoro (a 7th seat) were able to feel the Reiatsu of Kenpachi, who is considered a very powerful Captain. But they could still feel him, but powerhouses like Isshin, Yoruichi, and Urahara were incapable of feeling Aizen's Chrysalis form. Thus, in order to be considered "transcendent" to someone, the gap in your power must be more than that of the gap between a 7th seat of the Medical Division and Captain of the Battle Division. Another example would be that Orihime, who couldn't even stand up to a 4th seat was capable of feeling Gin's power, and Gin was one of the high tier captains along with Aizen. So again, the power gap must be far greater than it was in those cases. Yet another, far greater example would be Rukia, who had been exposed to the Sekki Sekki for so long that her Reiatsu level was practically nothing, could still feel Ichigo, Byakuya, and Ukitake.

No Caption Provided

So captain level is still not enough to be transcendent when compared to almost no power.

Kenpachi is a transcendent because of the 11th Divisions member's statement

Gallery image 1Gallery image 2

So keeping that in mind,

Kenpachi probably >transcendent> Kenpachi Shown = Continent busting > Normal Aizen > FKT arc Ichigo in a normal state of mind and masked > Depressed unmasked Ichigo = Mach 500.

Meninas:

Calc:

No Caption Provided
No Caption Provided

TL;DR: FINAL NUMBERS AT THE BOTTOM

I have a few small, but important detail: We can't see all of the doors, at least it doesn't look like we can. There appears to be and edge on the rock, and the door is far enough away that at this angle that edge covers the base of the entrances. I also need to know what material the building and rock is made of. I'd just assume it's concrete, and the the building is made of concrete as well for simplicity. I'll make some assumptions to compensate:

  • assume we can see all of the door
  • assume the rock is uniform in mass
  • assume the building is uniform in mass
  • assume both are concrete
  • We can see all of the building and the roofs are squared off

Starting with the second scan, the door is approximately 28.3 pixels tall and 29.8 pixels wide (both are rough estimations, but accurate). The rock, from the base of the floor to the bottom is about 241.4 pixels tall, and about 564.4 pixels wide. The windows are (assuming they're uniformly cut) 42.8 tall by 9.1 wide. The building, including the roof, is 159.7 pixels tall by 377 pixels wide. The offshoot of the house is 77.1 pixels tall by 137.8 The tower, or what we can see of it, is 234.2 tall by 126.4 wide.

from here, we move onto the first scan, where the rock is shown to be 356.7 pixels wide, and 69 pixels deep. In other words, the ratio of width to depth is (69/356.7), or .193. This means the depth in the first pixel is approximately 108.93 pixels. ( .193 * 564.4 = 108.93)

Now discounting the actual jagged parts, we can see that the tower takes up this entire space, and is 50.3 pixels deep in the second scan. The house's entire side can't be seen, but what we can see is 49.2 pixels. Thus, we can assume both share a depth or 108.93 pixels

Now we can calculate the area of all of this:

  • Tower : 108.93 * 234.2 * 126.4 = 3224641.72 pixels cubed
  • House, main part: 108.93 * 159 * 377 = 6529591 pixels cubed
  • House, offshoot : 108.93 * 77.1 * 137.8 = 1157313.7 pixels cubed
  • The rock itself : 108.93 * 241.4 * 564.4 = 14841294.21 pixels cubed

Now, using the average height of a door (2.3 meters) and our measured height (28.3 pixels) we find that it's about .08 m/px, which we now square to find m^3/px^3, so 0.00054 m^3/px^3.

thus all of our volumes in meters are:

  • Tower : 3224641.72 * 0.00054 = 1741.31 m^3
  • House, main part: 6529591 * 0.00054 = 3526 m^3
  • House, offshoot : 1157313.7 * 0.00054 = 625 m^3
  • The rock itself : 14841294.21 * 0.00054 = 8014.3 m^3

now, we just multiply each one by the average density of concrete:

  • Tower : 1741.31 * 2,400 = 4179144
  • House, main part: 3526 * 2,400 = 8462400
  • House, offshoot : 625 * 2,400 = 1500000
  • The rock itself : 8014.3 * 2,400 = 19234320

Then just add up all the weight for a grand total of

33375864 Kg, or 36790.6 tons

Hope that holds some water ^_^

Ichibei

Back in the Arrancar Saga, Yamamoto described the Jureichi as having a radius of one "spirit ri". Given that Karakura Town is situation on that Jureichi and contains roughly 100,000 people, there's no way it can simply be 1 kilometre.

A Japanese ri is 3927 metres (3.927 kilometres), so when Ichibei is saying 1000 Ri he is most likely saying 3927 kilometres.

Gallery image 1Gallery image 2Gallery image 3

Let's turn the Kilometers into an easier to understand distance

No Caption Provided

So Ichibei slapped Juha 2 1/2 Thousand miles away, in BASE.

Juha + Ichibei speed

As far as speed goes

This shows Juha's attacks reaching Ichibei, 1,000 Ri away, in a second

No Caption Provided

Ichibei is drawn so large in that panel so that we know where he is. Ichibei hasn't moved since last chapter, and he even rockets towards Juha, implying he was still far away. And even if Ichibei did move, that just means he got that close that quickly anyway, Now, how far is 1,000 Ri?

No Caption Provided

3927 meters = 12883.86 feet,

12883.86 feet x 1000 = 12,883,000 feet

12883000 feet = 2439 miles

2439 miles per second = Mach 11,534. And still not in Volstandiig or using the A.

This also goes for Ichibei since he caught those attacks, obviously being able to react to that speed.

No Caption Provided

Juha:

Moon level.

Relativistic speed at least.

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#2 Posted by Jeepeh (6134 posts) - - Show Bio
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#3 Posted by Malachi_Munroe (3798 posts) - - Show Bio
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#4 Posted by ssj3gohan007 (1972 posts) - - Show Bio
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#5 Posted by The_Legendary_SuperSaiyan_Hulk (17515 posts) - - Show Bio

-Sees statement saying he could destroy the planet via core-

Yah had me until that part lol

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#6 Edited by DarthVxder (1034 posts) - - Show Bio

@the_legendary_supersaiyan_hulk:

Meh. I dont consider that planet busting but it is possible. Vegeta at the beggining of DBZ was able to destroy planets because of that and Ichigo>>>>>>>>>>>>>SSVegeta

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#7 Posted by The_Legendary_SuperSaiyan_Hulk (17515 posts) - - Show Bio

@darthvxder: Okay, now you're getting out of hand lol. Ichigo would be lucky to beat Raditz, let alone SS Vegeta...

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#9 Posted by DarthVxder (1034 posts) - - Show Bio

@the_legendary_supersaiyan_hulk: Also let me add that Current Ichigo is massively hypersonic and DBZ characters have yet to reach light speed. Sure theyre faster than bleach but not in the beggining of the series lol.

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#10 Edited by The_Legendary_SuperSaiyan_Hulk (17515 posts) - - Show Bio

@darthvxder: The highest amount of destructive capacity actually shown is the meteor that Gremmy summoned. Anime Saiyans would murk Bleach with the utmost ease. Even manga saiyans stomp with Nappa's two-finger treatment.

But enough of that, wouldn't want this to be locked.

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#11 Edited by Jeepeh (6134 posts) - - Show Bio

@darthvxder: Thanks for helping me, Although I'm pretty sure DBZ has reached Light Speeds.

@the_legendary_supersaiyan_hulk said:

@darthvxder: The highest amount of destructive capacity actually shown is the meteor that Gremmy summoned.

If you think that, then you didn't read the thread, lol. Oh and, I mentioned busting via core after him vaporizing the planet, why is the core thing what you had the problem with?

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#12 Edited by Jeepeh (6134 posts) - - Show Bio
@ssj3gohan007 said:

Nice work, pal :)

Thanks. :P Hopefully we won't be considered "wankers" anymore, and this will save me a lot of time when people are trying to debate against me, I can just copy and paste. xD

Oh and, sorry guys, the post keeps removing the vid on the Space+Time subject, here it is

Loading Video...

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#13 Posted by ssj3gohan007 (1972 posts) - - Show Bio

@jeepeh said:
@ssj3gohan007 said:

Nice work, pal :)

Thanks. :P Hopefully we won't be considered "wankers" anymore, and this will save me a lot of time when people are trying to debate against me, I can just copy and paste. xD

Oh and, sorry guys, the post keeps removing the vid on the Space+Time subject, here it is

Loading Video...

We can only hope, pal. :)

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#14 Posted by PrinceAragorn1 (31807 posts) - - Show Bio

@jeepeh:

1. 'lightening speed' is something used in any versatile anime/manga. It doesn't imply mach 300 at all. Here's a peak human, directly reacting to lightening from the sky:

Loading Video...

Note that this is actual lightening from the sky, not used by some lightening control, and not a statement like ichigo's.

So where you start for the speed is peak human unless shown otherwise.

2. Ichigo blitzed shikai chojiro: His shikai doesn't use lightening at all:

ichigo vs chojiro

So the part till gin is pretty much unsupported.

I'll go through the other sections later.

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#15 Posted by The_Legendary_SuperSaiyan_Hulk (17515 posts) - - Show Bio

@jeepeh Gremmy's meteor was going to destroy Soul Society, which should be considerably larger than Los Noches(which is in turn being used as a base for Lanza's damage, which was crushed in Ichigo's hand but made nowhere near the previous sized explosion)

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#16 Edited by Jeepeh (6134 posts) - - Show Bio

@princearagorn1: I said Mach 300 is the AVERAGE lightning speed, also, it doesn't matter much because later on Ichigo reacted to Mach 500 in a depressed state. Had he been masked and resolved, he'd be FAR higher than Mach 500. So Ulquiorra + Grimmjow should still be somewhat accurate. Base human? Are you seriously calling Bankai Ichigo base human? What the heck. xD I'll give you the Chojiro thing,

@the_legendary_supersaiyan_hulk said:

@jeepeh Gremmy's meteor was going to destroy Soul Society, which should be considerably larger than Los Noches(which is in turn being used as a base for Lanza's damage, which was crushed in Ichigo's hand but made nowhere near the previous sized explosion)

What are you trying to say? Ulquiorra's feat wasn't scaled to Gremmy's feat, they were seperate. Seireitei was used for Gremmy, and Las Noches was used for Ulquiorra. And

No Caption Provided

The SEIREITEI will be destroyed, Seireitei =/= Soul Society

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#17 Posted by The_Legendary_SuperSaiyan_Hulk (17515 posts) - - Show Bio

@jeepeh: Eh, I refer to the main area as Soul Society as the districts aren't really that important. Sorry for the confusion.

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#18 Posted by PrinceAragorn1 (31807 posts) - - Show Bio

@jeepeh:

I said Mach 300 is the AVERAGE lightning speed, also, it doesn't matter much because later on Ichigo reacted to Mach 500 in a depressed state. Had he been masked and resolved, he'd be FAR higher than Mach 500. So Ulquiorra + Grimmjow should still be somewhat accurate. Base human? Are you seriously calling Bankai Ichigo base human? What the heck. xD

I'm questioning the average you're presenting. Peak humans like iroh have reacted to lightening before, and they have nowhere near mach 300 reflexes. I don't see any basis that the 'lightening quick' puts him at mach 300. You'll need some kind of quantfication from the author.

I actually didn't call bankai ichigo base human, but that the feat (statement, actually) doesn't imply mach 300 in any way.

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#19 Edited by Jeepeh (6134 posts) - - Show Bio

@princearagorn1 said:

@jeepeh:

I said Mach 300 is the AVERAGE lightning speed, also, it doesn't matter much because later on Ichigo reacted to Mach 500 in a depressed state. Had he been masked and resolved, he'd be FAR higher than Mach 500. So Ulquiorra + Grimmjow should still be somewhat accurate. Base human? Are you seriously calling Bankai Ichigo base human? What the heck. xD

I'm questioning the average you're presenting. Peak humans like iroh have reacted to lightening before, and they have nowhere near mach 300 reflexes. I don't see any basis that the 'lightening quick' puts him at mach 300. You'll need some kind of quantfication from the author.

I actually didn't call bankai ichigo base human, but that the feat (statement, actually) doesn't imply mach 300 in any way.

Quantification of lightning speed or of Mach 300? The lightning speed thing was given to you via the Databook, which is from the Author. But if you want to question the ''average", then lets take a stroll to google,

No Caption Provided

No Caption Provided

I heard that Lightning varies from Mach 3 to Marginal light speed.

That video that you posted, is it filler? Did it happen in the Manga?

Oh and I just thought about the Chojiro thing, Chojiro's Bankai was Lightning, although he was in Shikai, but we're talking Ichigo's Bankai speed and Ichigo was in Shikai too.

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#20 Posted by PrinceAragorn1 (31807 posts) - - Show Bio

@jeepeh said:

@princearagorn1 said:

@jeepeh:

I said Mach 300 is the AVERAGE lightning speed, also, it doesn't matter much because later on Ichigo reacted to Mach 500 in a depressed state. Had he been masked and resolved, he'd be FAR higher than Mach 500. So Ulquiorra + Grimmjow should still be somewhat accurate. Base human? Are you seriously calling Bankai Ichigo base human? What the heck. xD

I'm questioning the average you're presenting. Peak humans like iroh have reacted to lightening before, and they have nowhere near mach 300 reflexes. I don't see any basis that the 'lightening quick' puts him at mach 300. You'll need some kind of quantfication from the author.

I actually didn't call bankai ichigo base human, but that the feat (statement, actually) doesn't imply mach 300 in any way.

Quantification of lightning speed or of Mach 300? The lightning speed thing was given to you via the Databook, which is from the Author. But if you want to question the ''average", then lets take a stroll to google,

No Caption Provided

No Caption Provided

I heard that Lightning varies from Mach 3 to Marginal light speed.

In fiction, peak humans can react to lightening as shown above, and peak human reflexes are below mach 1.

There's nothing putting the 'lightening' ichigo is compared to as fast you're saying it is.

That video that you posted, is it filler? Did it happen in the Manga?

What?

Oh and I just thought about the Chojiro thing, Chojiro's Bankai was Lightning, although he was in Shikai, but we're talking Ichigo's Bankai speed and Ichigo was in Shikai too.

So? Lightening isn't involved there at all..

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#21 Posted by The_Legendary_SuperSaiyan_Hulk (17515 posts) - - Show Bio

@princearagorn1: D-did he just ask if that Avatar video happened in the manga? lolwut

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#22 Edited by Jeepeh (6134 posts) - - Show Bio

@princearagorn1: Not all fiction is the same, thinking it is is rather insane.

But he does control lightning, it's his weapon. You didn't try to disprove his reaction speed, you just said that Ichigo defeated him in Shikai instead of his lightning Bankai. But Ichigo was in Shikai as well, also, his shikai must be lightning based, we just haven't seen it. lol. A zanpakuto doesn't change powers.

Comicvine is glitching out for me, I'll reply again tomorrow or Saturday

@the_legendary_supersaiyan_hulk said:

@princearagorn1: D-did he just ask if that Avatar video happened in the manga? lolwut

Well excuse me for not knowing anything about Avatar, sheesh.

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#23 Posted by The_Legendary_SuperSaiyan_Hulk (17515 posts) - - Show Bio

@jeepeh: Lol, Avatar was originally, and currently, western animation only. It has since gotten comic adaptations, but it was originally animation first.

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#24 Edited by Jeepeh (6134 posts) - - Show Bio

@the_legendary_supersaiyan_hulk said:

@jeepeh: Lol, Avatar was originally, and currently, western animation only. It has since gotten comic adaptations, but it was originally animation first.

I see. Thanks.

Comicvine is glitching out for me, I'll reply again tomorrow or Saturday

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#25 Edited by PrinceAragorn1 (31807 posts) - - Show Bio

@jeepeh said:

@princearagorn1: Not all fiction is the same, thinking it is is rather insane.

Nothing in my post suggested all fiction is same.. I'm asking for author-given proof of the 'mach 300', because fictional lightening can be below mach 1. Kubo has never referenced lightening as mach 300 in the manga, you're directly assuming that it is mach 300.

But he does control lightning, it's his weapon. You didn't try to disprove his reaction speed, you just said that Ichigo defeated him in Shikai instead of his lightning Bankai. But Ichigo was in Shikai as well, also, his shikai must be lightning based, we just haven't seen it. lol. A zanpakuto doesn't change powers.

1. 'disprove' his reaction speed? For that, it'll have to be proved first. He has no speed/reaction feats to begin with.

2. Yes: He was defeated in a shikai, which wasn't utilizing lightening to begin with.

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#26 Posted by Jeepeh (6134 posts) - - Show Bio

@jeepeh said:

@princearagorn1: Not all fiction is the same, thinking it is is rather insane.

Nothing in my post suggested all fiction is same.. I'm asking for author-given proof of the 'mach 300', because fictional lightening can be below mach 1. Kubo has never referenced lightening as mach 300 in the manga, you're directly assuming that it is mach 300.

But he does control lightning, it's his weapon. You didn't try to disprove his reaction speed, you just said that Ichigo defeated him in Shikai instead of his lightning Bankai. But Ichigo was in Shikai as well, also, his shikai must be lightning based, we just haven't seen it. lol. A zanpakuto doesn't change powers.

1. 'disprove' his reaction speed? For that, it'll have to be proved first. He has no speed/reaction feats to begin with.

2. Yes: He was defeated in a shikai, which wasn't utilizing lightening to begin with.

I'll admit that I'm wrong about the Mach 300 thing, I confused "mach 300 is the average" for "Mach 300 is the default" that is used on another debating site, my bad. I'll edit it out of the OP. However Rukia/Renji/Byakuya/Ichigo's scaling still stands.

Although Chojiro should still be lightning speed in Shikai, just because he wasn't seen using it, it still has to do with lightning because otherwise it wouldn't have a lightning Bankai. He was just one-shotted before using it.

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#27 Posted by Jeepeh (6134 posts) - - Show Bio
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#28 Posted by boschePG (6319 posts) - - Show Bio
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#29 Posted by Jestersmiles (9826 posts) - - Show Bio

So respect Threads can include assumptions now? LOL


How about you show me a scan of said feat, or you just w@^%$^.

Scans>"Calculations"

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#30 Posted by A1l_S2a3m4E5N (2159 posts) - - Show Bio

@jeepeh:

Ichigo aint a planet buster.

And one of your own pics said lightning is.

Mach 17,498.52.

Stop raising bleach tiers to levels they havent attained.

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#31 Posted by A1l_S2a3m4E5N (2159 posts) - - Show Bio

@jeepeh:

Ichigo aint a planet buster.

And one of your own pics said lightning is.

Mach 17,498.52.

Stop raising bleach tiers to levels they havent attained.

Assumptions arent proof of anything, it basically portrays you as a bleach wanktard.

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#32 Posted by Jeepeh (6134 posts) - - Show Bio

So respect Threads can include assumptions now? LOL

How about you show me a scan of said feat, or you just w@^%$^.

Scans>"Calculations"

It's feats that need some math to put them in proper perspective. Even comic characters have them, now disprove it or get out.

@boschepg said:

@jeepeh:

good stuff. just saw it

Thanks.

@jeepeh:

Ichigo aint a planet buster.

And one of your own pics said lightning is.

Mach 17,498.52.

Stop raising bleach tiers to levels they havent attained.

Assumptions arent proof of anything, it basically portrays you as a bleach wanktard.

Great argument.

That's what science is, but based on his later feats he's obviously not that fast at that point in the story. Lightning varies from Mach 3 to relativistic I believe.

Or you could actually disprove me instead of raging at me.

Assumptions? What assumptions? Let the insults roll.

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#33 Posted by PrinceAragorn1 (31807 posts) - - Show Bio

Ah. I keep forgetting about that calc. Bookmarking the thread for when I'm back.

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#34 Posted by boschePG (6319 posts) - - Show Bio

@jeepeh:

could you PM me scans of the Bleach handbook

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#35 Posted by Jeepeh (6134 posts) - - Show Bio

@boschepg said:

@jeepeh:

could you PM me scans of the Bleach handbook

Sorry, I don't have it. I found it on the internet, I could try googling things that you want though, what do you need?

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#36 Posted by rick014292 (70 posts) - - Show Bio

@darthvxder: omg SUPER SAIYAN VEGETA??? Are you insane? Maybe Vegeta SCOUTER at Saiyan saga but DEFINITELY not SUPER SAIYAN LMAO!!

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#37 Posted by DarthVxder (1034 posts) - - Show Bio

@rick014292: If you would have any reading comprehension you would know its Sayian Saga Vegeta. Also Super Sayian is spelled SSJ not SS. Next time learn how to read. Also considering Vegeta got cut by a weakling, Ichigo should beat him. This is 1st season Vegeta im talking about just incase so you dont get confused.

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#38 Posted by kuroimugetsu (1439 posts) - - Show Bio

@jeepeh: I recently participated in a debate about kenpachis reaction time while inside tozens bankai. I pretty much speculated that in order to react to, a blade (even at human level) at that speed with no sight or hearing would take supersonic reactions at least. So would kenny being able to react to a captain level sword swing in complete darkness would put him safely at around hypersonic to hypersonic + reactions no?

Just a little bit I wanted to add here. I like this thread. Many people downplay bleach alot. Possibly because the series isn't on as much as naruto anymore. anyways I'll be observing the thread.

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#39 Edited by Jeepeh (6134 posts) - - Show Bio

@kuroimugetsu said:

@jeepeh: I recently participated in a debate about kenpachis reaction time while inside tozens bankai. I pretty much speculated that in order to react to, a blade (even at human level) at that speed with no sight or hearing would take supersonic reactions at least. So would kenny being able to react to a captain level sword swing in complete darkness would put him safely at around hypersonic to hypersonic + reactions no?

Just a little bit I wanted to add here. I like this thread. Many people downplay bleach alot. Possibly because the series isn't on as much as naruto anymore. anyways I'll be observing the thread.

I can do you one better, Ichigo was doing Mach 500 things, and Kenpachi is hinted at being capable of transcendence. Which would put him far far far beyond FKT arc Ichigo. Copy and paste the relevant parts from the OP to prove that point in your debate. The only thing that they could possibly say to you to try to disprove you is that Kenpachi hasn't used Shunpo, and power level doesn't have to mean his speed goes up too. But all you have to do to counter that is tell them that Kenpachi has always had slower Travel speed, but he's always been good with combat speed, he's never truly been blitzed. Shunpo is just taking a step, it has nothing to do with fast reactions. Kenpachi kept up just fine with Gremmy, who dodged Yachiru's "undodgeable" shikai.

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#40 Posted by Jeepeh (6134 posts) - - Show Bio

@rick014292: If you would have any reading comprehension you would know its Sayian Saga Vegeta. Also Super Sayian is spelled SSJ not SS. Next time learn how to read. Also considering Vegeta got cut by a weakling, Ichigo should beat him. This is 1st season Vegeta im talking about just incase so you dont get confused.

May I ask you guys what's going on? O.o

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#41 Posted by WELLDONE (263 posts) - - Show Bio

Ichigo a planet buster LOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOL

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#42 Posted by kuroimugetsu (1439 posts) - - Show Bio

Interesting. .. i would love to infer to an actual scientist about these calculations.about the amount of energy ichigo is outputting. In real life if a casual sword block (not even a swing) completely vaporized a mountain from a distance, how much energy would be at the actual sword collision? Considering th byproduct shock wave just vaped A mountain (from distance). A lot of people (naruto fans especially) are quick to say things like "all ichigo did was bust a mountain or hill" or whatever ... the convinientely choose to forget that ichigo wasn't even trying to destroy those things and was only blocking. Yet displayed more destructive force than ps sword slash.

For example. Ps slash cut the tops of mountains (this was an intentional slash)

Ichigo completely vaporized a mountain (un intentional sword parry) see the difference. people also seem to forget that aizen was clashing with a sword (at point blank, sword to sword) with a blade that vaped said mountains from a distance, putting aizen (butterfly aizen) at multi mountain level casually.

Why people choose to ignore this i don't know. u know what u also brought up a few good points. Ichigo still has hollow mask. And wasn't even using normal getsuga. A getsuga at dangai ichigo level is at least island level.

Finally there is one more thing I wanted to point out here. When naruto characters use their shunshin no doubt they move very fast. However their speed on traverses short distances. I think you brought that up at one point. On the other hand bleach characters can move miles in the time it would take any naruto characters to move the distance of a rooftop. Yet naruto fanboyz love to say that bleach speed is unqualifiedable ...

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#43 Posted by I_Am_Lightning (3496 posts) - - Show Bio

I always wondered how shinigamis look like outside of Japan.

Imagine a badass european shinigami on full steel armor, wielding a giant claymore.

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#44 Edited by Jeepeh (6134 posts) - - Show Bio

@welldone said:

Ichigo a planet buster LOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOL

Call it a High end assumption. But it's clear that he's downplayed far too much.

@kuroimugetsu said:

Interesting. .. i would love to infer to an actual scientist about these calculations.about the amount of energy ichigo is outputting. In real life if a casual sword block (not even a swing) completely vaporized a mountain from a distance, how much energy would be at the actual sword collision? Considering th byproduct shock wave just vaped A mountain (from distance). A lot of people (naruto fans especially) are quick to say things like "all ichigo did was bust a mountain or hill" or whatever ... the convinientely choose to forget that ichigo wasn't even trying to destroy those things and was only blocking. Yet displayed more destructive force than ps sword slash.

For example. Ps slash cut the tops of mountains (this was an intentional slash)

Ichigo completely vaporized a mountain (un intentional sword parry) see the difference. people also seem to forget that aizen was clashing with a sword (at point blank, sword to sword) with a blade that vaped said mountains from a distance, putting aizen (butterfly aizen) at multi mountain level casually.

Why people choose to ignore this i don't know. u know what u also brought up a few good points. Ichigo still has hollow mask. And wasn't even using normal getsuga. A getsuga at dangai ichigo level is at least island level.

Finally there is one more thing I wanted to point out here. When naruto characters use their shunshin no doubt they move very fast. However their speed on traverses short distances. I think you brought that up at one point. On the other hand bleach characters can move miles in the time it would take any naruto characters to move the distance of a rooftop. Yet naruto fanboyz love to say that bleach speed is unqualifiedable ...

The 1st paragraph is nothing but truth.

What's Ps? You said cut the tops of mountains, I'm assuming you mean the Madara giant thing?

I wish Kubo was clearer with power levels, we have Naruto fans saying hill level, you saying Island level, and me saying multi-continent or higher. xD

I didn't mention Naruto characters at all in this post IIRC.

I don't see how they can claim it to be unquantifiable, when Ichigo CLEARLY dodged a Mach 500 sword, while depressed, without his Mask. Base Aizen was faster than him when he had his mask on.

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#45 Posted by Jeepeh (6134 posts) - - Show Bio

I always wondered how shinigamis look like outside of Japan.

Imagine a badass european shinigami on full steel armor, wielding a giant claymore.

Random comment, but okay.

I doubt the Shinigami would look any different. Soul Society itself is based on Japan. Thus all Shinigami should be wearing Kimonos, interesting concept though.

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#46 Posted by rick014292 (70 posts) - - Show Bio

@jeepeh: Jesus Christ are you having a heart attack or what? You're seriously crying so much you have to insult me? Hahaha that's pretty funny maybe you need a pinky to suck on bro

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#47 Edited by Jeepeh (6134 posts) - - Show Bio

@rick014292 said:

@jeepeh: Jesus Christ are you having a heart attack or what? You're seriously crying so much you have to insult me? Hahaha that's pretty funny maybe you need a pinky to suck on bro

... I didn't say anything bad about you. I asked what your conversation in the middle of my thread was about. And watch your language.

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#48 Posted by Blackout046 (34 posts) - - Show Bio

Considering the fact that H2 Ichigo crushed a Lanza Del Relampago which unleashed an explosive force that dwarfed Las Noches, and Dangai Ichigo is leagues above even that feat. Current shikai Ichigo being above or Equal to Dangai Ichigo, I'd say new unknown bankai Ichigo should casually be above large Island level.

And I don't even think that'd be his last form. I assume that Ichigo will have two bankai releases, or one bankai and one vollstandig with a full hollowfication.

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#49 Posted by MrDevil (3092 posts) - - Show Bio

@jeepeh thanks for the inv.

The Ichigo that crushed the lanza it can be said that it was crushed by Ichigo's reiatsu. and to know how much is the Kenpachi feat.

In the movie Bleach: Fade To Black. According to the Bleach Movie "Fade to Black" Seireitei is 400 ri for it's diameter. Kubo over seed the production of this movie by the way.

Bleachness - Kubo Interview from FTB movie guide!

1 ri = 2.44 miles

Calculating the Area:

400 diameter = 200 radious.

Pi = 3.14

No Caption Provided

A≈1.26×105

or 126 000 miles approximately.

This is the diameter of soul society

Now that makes Gremmy's meteor which is close to the size of seireitei that large. Then you have to factor in density and the fact it was moving at hypersonic speeds given it's flames.

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If a 23 miles in diameter minimum meteor that wiped out the dinosaurs was country level then something close to 126 000 miles is easily continental to planet lv.

If You Think That Dino-Killing Asteroid Was Big, Wait Till You Hear About This Whopper

and to actually know how big is Las Noches.

How big is Las Noches?

nell says to get to the closest Door is 3 days walking, let's say there is only one door in Las Noches that i doubt it, so the long way to get to that door would be 4 days.there is a gate at 3 days from here so it can easily be around 6 to 7 remember is a circunference if they were in the middle which they weren't Las Noches would 6 days in diameter.

No Caption Provided

A normal person walks 2.5 miles per hour. let's say they walk 12 hours on the days which i doubt that's their limit. at the week (7 days) it would be a 82 hours of walk.

2.5 x 82 = 210 miles around the domo of Las Noches minimum. so it has a diameter of 210 miles ^2 approximately this

Ulquiorra said that Aizen had forbidded the ressurection of 4 to 1 Espadas (yammy becomes 0 when in resurrection) and the use of Oscuras Cero inside Las Noches bc they would destroy it.

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Ulquiorra was the only one that used the King Cero and was destroying it.

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Ulquiorra is No. 4 and the others are minimum just as powerful. They were destroying the entire city just with physical power. Yammy's normal cero was more powerful than the rest of the espada's basic ceros even byakuya and kenpachi were impressed by it. So yeah minimum small country lv.

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And that would only be if it was one gate domo. so is minimum 210 mi2.

Too bad there is only a few Bleach fans in this place.

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#50 Edited by Thekillerklok (9977 posts) - - Show Bio

Bleach gets downplayed pretty hard around here.

Then again "Sasuke would speed blitz Haruhi" was a thing...