Batman v. Superman: The Best Superhero Film Since 2008?

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saint_samantha

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Edited By saint_samantha
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Recently, I told a friend of mine "I feel like I've discussed and thought about Batman v. Superman in three days... more then I have Man of Steel in three years." It's mentally exhausted me, but at this point, it's the only thing I've got. And it's best for me to get in soon and share my opinion about this movie before it gets to late and people'll respond to my blog with a "ugh we've heard enough about this movie."

Therefore, before fatigue reaches 11, here is my review of Man of Steel.

When I say that Batman v. Superman is potentially the best superhero film since 2008, I don't mean that Batman v. Superman is a masterpiece. I do not mean that Batman v. Superman is art. I do not mean Batman v. Superman is perfect. I mean that Batman v. Superman is the best superhero film since 2008. Hell, I do not mean that Batman v. Superman is definitely the best in the genre since 2008. I mean that it is a contender for the best superhero film since 2008. Plain and simple.

It's easy to point to The Avengers and call it great. It's easy to look at the first Iron Man and call it the best superhero movie. It's easy to look at Guardians of The Galaxy and say "this is the best superhero film Marvel has produced." This movies were fun, entertaining, fan pleasing, surprising and action filled. But what does the best superhero movie really mean?

We can pretend that all of our "best superhero films" are the pinnacle of the genre because they're critically and commercially successful popcorn flicks that we enjoy. They're simple, but effective. Then we can point to a movie like Batman v. Superman, which attempts to communicate something, and nitpick it for every story detail that it did wrong (there are a lot of story details that are wrong in this movie). But by doing so, you're merely focusing on what the film did wrong, not what it did right.

But take a second and look at where Batman v. Superman succeeds. In succeeds in areas most other movies in the genre do not succeed in. At the end of the day, we do not share mind, body, and, above all, experience. And my personal experience is as a film fan. Batman v. Superman is strong through the lens of a film fan. And I don't mean that it's an amazing movie.

This is indeed a very flawed movie, but what I mean is that as a superhero movie in the eyes of a film fan, Batman v. Superman is what I want out of a superhero movie. A lot of the critiques flung against this movie are actually why I love it.

Batman v. Superman is dark, and gritty. It is The Empire Strikes Back of superhero films. I remember before I entered the movie I promised myself to make a mental note of whenever the movie blew my mind. The first mental note I made was roughly 2 minutes into the movie. It happened again, and again, and again and again. I don't mean to say this movie will blow your mind, put by personal experience with this movie set it apart from every other superhero movie. There were literally moments in this film which shocked me that they went that dark for a superhero movie.

I don't want to spoil it for the people who haven't seen the movie, so I'll put it in a spoiler mark:

Martha Kent's photos when her mouth was tied up, for example. Straight out of a horror film O.o

It has a tone that sets it apart from other superhero movies. Not to mention that the darkness in this film is genuinely dark, not pseudo dark. In Man of Steel, Superman snaps Zod's neck, but in the next scene he doesn't give a crap about it. That isn't dark. That's pseudo dark. Batman v. Superman didn't suffer from that problem, IMO.

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What else surprised me about Batman v. Superman is that it treats it's subject like a real life matter. You've probably seen it mentioned in the official review of the movie on this site that the movie brings you down even when characters are doing heroic things, and yes, that happens in the movie. But they do it to make a point. People are questioning Superman's place in the earth. If you don't like this style of filmmaking for a DC movie, if you want superheroes that inspire people, this film is horrible for that. But my the end of the movie, I couldn't help but feel that Snyder brought his realistic viewpoint of superheroes full circle. That said, this movie is being panned by critics and fans, which is a shame because I can't help but feel that even if it isn't your cup of tea, it is by no measure a bad movie, and this movie opens up room for heroes to be "inspiring" and "heroic."

That said, the movie is far from perfect. Zack Snyder is a master and substance and there are a lot of scenes in this movie that will bring me back again and again. But he needs strong writing to balance him out. The plot holes in this movie are criminal. You might've heard from critics and fans that you'll be pondering on a lot of "how's, why's and what's" after you leave the theatre.

Unfortunately, yes, that is true. It hampers what could've been an amazing movie.

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Visually, this is a beautifully realised film. It's beautifully shot and a lot of the cinematography cemented it as the best looking superhero film.

As expected from a Zack Snyder film, the action sequences are beautiful, & although many have panned Snyder's tendency to use CGI instead of practical effects, watching the trinity fight side by side, as well as the amazing cinematography, far outmatched Snyder's penchant towards computer generated action sequences. However, a lot of editing choices in this film were very wonky, to say the least. I noticed a lot of cuts were made too soon. Occasionally, the movie played out like a trailer (in more ways then one. Occasionally poor editing, as well as playing out like a trailer for The Justice League).

Ben Affleck is the best live action Batman and made his way into my favourite castings in a CBM. I'll need to let the movie sink in more to know where I'd rank him exactly, though. But he was a badass. The first time he shows in this movie felt a lot like a horror movie. Wonder Woman stole the show in the third act of the movie, and Henry Cavill again, did a good job as Superman. And brought a lot of emotion to the table.

EDIT: Batman v. Superman is also a strong superhero film because it isn't created to appeal to the masses. It's a film with a lot of originality that had the balls to go that dark. If all they hoped for is pleasing the masses, I wouldn't have had someone in the theatre behind me crying, goddamn it!

Verdict: 7.5/10

Batman v. Superman is the occasional comic book movie that I would call strong as a standalone film. It falters in the writing aspect of the movie: the amount of plot holes in the movie are hard to measure, but this movie actually made me think. That's not something you can say about every other superhero movie. The movie is being panned by critics and fans. And although I understand their complaints to an extent, a 31% on Rotten Tomatoes proves that, that site isn't for me.

And the fans are making it out to be a travesty when it isn't. It's a really good movie. It should've been better in areas of the movie such as the writing, but the critics are not recommending it.

Which doesn't make much sense to me. A critic's job isn't just to tell you if he liked the movie, but if he would recommend it. At the end of the day, that's the point of a critic, IMO. I'd recommend this movie to DC fans. But I wouldn't recommend it to people looking for merely superhero escapism.

This movie almost made my cry, though.

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RavenVice01

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Personally, I thought the movie was good despite its flaws. It could hav been way better. The Batman references like Joker, two-face and jason todd were my favorite tidbits. Check out my latest list for how this movie should hav been done. The plot is simple but effective.

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buildhare

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There was the odd scene that was awesome (Batman rescuing Martha is basically it) but they were few and far between with way more openly cringe moments.

The fights weren't even good! And the dream sequences. Oh god. The dream sequences.

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MadeinBangladesh

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No way Jose!

~MiB

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deactivated-5c901e667a76c

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saint_samantha

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@xwraith said:
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I honestly find it hard to take people seriously when they use a gif as an argument. It's as if you want to use a gif for the sake of it and don't want to make a valid point. As a matter of fact, it's insulting considering how much effort I put into this.

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There was the odd scene that was awesome (Batman rescuing Martha is basically it) but they were few and far between with way more openly cringe moments.

The fights weren't even good! And the dream sequences. Oh god. The dream sequences.

How does that make it non-compatible for one of the best superhero movies?

I can point out flaws about almost any superhero movie. Because The Avengers didn't have a generic story, villain that lost all his value last minute when he is degraded to a joke. Messy first half.

But if I call that a great superhero movie, it's all cool.

Personally, I thought the movie was good despite its flaws. It could hav been way better. The Batman references like Joker, two-face and jason todd were my favorite tidbits. Check out my latest list for how this movie should hav been done. The plot is simple but effective.

What references? I must've missed them!

Am I the only one that had a Dark Knight flashback when Superman said "WHERE IS SHE?" to Lex in a Baleman like voice?

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deactivated-5c901e667a76c

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#7  Edited By deactivated-5c901e667a76c  Moderator

@saint_samantha: In that case, I can name at least four superhero films released in the past seven years that were better (Cap 2, GotG, X-Men First Class, and DoFP).

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saint_samantha

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@xwraith said:

@saint_samantha: In that case, I can name at least four superhero films released in the past seven years that were better (Cap 2, GotG, X-Men First Class, and DoFP).

That's fine: three of those movies I completely understand why someone would call them some of the best from the past seven years. What I hate is when people crucify Batman v. Superman for being flawed, when in reality, GoTG is just as, if not more flawed, then Dawn of Justice.

Think about it, GoTG is a fairly generic, predictable story with a weak villain, weak story, average acting etc. yet if I call GoTG the best superhero movie of the past few years, much less people will detest me.

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black_wreath

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Nice job, this actually helped me re-evaluate what I feel about the film.

I like the darkness, I'm actually extremely glad it was dark. I get enough one-liners and slapstick from the MCU, an alternative is needed (show me the comic book where a genocidal cosmic threat is foiled by a dance-off because I can't seem to find it anywhere). I respect the studio for having the balls to be gritty in the face of criticism, this movie was daring and the performances are great.

I also felt it tried to do too much and while the CGI wasn't a problem for me I wasn't a fan of the overuse of slow motion. My least favourite scene was when Lois was looking for the kryptonite spear, I thought hooray, she's going to prove her worth and justify her place here but then I was let down when she just needed saving yet again.

RT is a dumb site, with a rating formula far more flawed than anything in this movie. But of course as a horror fan I was already accustomed to holding film critics in contempt. ;)

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buildhare

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@saint_samantha:

How does that make it non-compatible for one of the best superhero movies?

Having sup-bar action, story and characterization? Fairly obvious how.

I can point out flaws about almost any superhero movie. Because The Avengers didn't have a generic story, villain that lost all his value last minute when he is degraded to a joke. Messy first half.

Not sure why you wanted to make this Marvel vs DC already.

It didn't have nearly as many problems as BvS does. Batman literally teleports into his armor, there's no real insight into his plan to fight superman beyond getting Krypotnite and some weight training. All of the JL cameo's felt crammed. None of the dream sequences served any real purpose (the desert one comes close) and some of them were actively cringe worthy (vampire jump scare, dream within a dream "we have to go back Marty").

Lex Luthor's speech at the dinner party. Come on. There isn't any justification for that.

The final fight scene could've redeemed the movie for some fans, including me, but we barely got to see it. Doomsday did nothing beyond roar and stand majestically in the background towards the end of it.

But if I call that a great superhero movie, it's all cool.

Because while that movie had issues it still managed to achieve what it set out too. BvS is crippled for the entire run time.

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LarryAshlynn

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definitely not bad like people make it out to be. I'd give it a 7.5 out of 10 as well.

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saint_samantha

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Nice job, this actually helped me re-evaluate what I feel about the film.

I like the darkness, I'm actually extremely glad it was dark. I get enough one-liners and slapstick from the MCU, an alternative is needed (show me the comic book where a genocidal cosmic threat is foiled by a dance-off because I can't seem to find it anywhere). I respect the studio for having the balls to be gritty in the face of criticism, this movie was daring and the performances are great.

I also felt it tried to do too much and while the CGI wasn't a problem for me I wasn't a fan of the overuse of slow motion. My least favourite scene was when Lois was looking for the kryptonite spear, I thought hooray, she's going to prove her worth and justify her place here but then I was let down when she just needed saving yet again.

RT is a dumb site, with a rating formula far more flawed than anything in this movie. But of course as a horror fan I was already accustomed to holding film critics in contempt. ;)

Yes! Why do we need two companies that produce the same tone of movies but with interchangeable characters?

That said, there are people who are fans of DC but not fans of Marvel, therefore they need their heroes on screen to inspire them. As for me, I'm a fan of both companies (I don't read much comics, in all honesty), so the Marvel films offer the inspiring, colourful superhero and Warner Bros should offer the dark, realistic superhero breed.

This year has been a breath of fresh air already. Deadpool was an R-Rated superhero movie, and Batman v. Superman was dark as [frick].

RT is very dumb. I'm not trusting that damned site again. Superman Returns at 76% and Batman v. Superman at 30%. LOL.

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deactivated-5c901e667a76c

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@saint_samantha: Guardians being ranked so high on my list has a lot to do with my personal feelings. I'd read the original comics shortly before the film was announced, and spent two years hoping I'd like it.

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saint_samantha

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#14  Edited By saint_samantha

@buildhare:

Having sup-bar action, story and characterisation? Fairly obvious how.

You managed to sum up most superhero movies with that statement. Because Marvel's The Avengers has great story and characterisation, as did Deadpool, as did Guardians of The Galaxy... but they are still considered great :)

You're not going to convince me that it had sup-bar action, and I'm not going to convince you that it had good action. I personally loved the action. You didn't. That's like arguing whether or not a food tastes nice.

Writing isn't the single factor that defines a story. Batman v. Superman had below average script, but the execution far exceeded the writing. I actually felt emotion towards the story. I almost cried.

Someone else in the theatre actually burst into tears.

Besides, the script was far better then most other superhero movies. The movie asked questions and made me think.

Not sure why you wanted to make this Marvel vs DC already.

You're missing the point, which is that all of these superhero movies - The Avengers, Captain America: The Winter Soldier and Guardians of The Galaxy are treated like cinematic masterpieces, when they're flawed too.

Marvel's The Avengers is also one of my favourite superhero movies, but it's asinine to pick apart BvS for it's flaws as if they make it invalid of contending for best superhero movie in 8 years. But other movies that are equally flawed and less achieved are put on a pedestal.

Lex Luthor's speech at the dinner party. Come on. There isn't any justification for that.

You get a sense of his character. It's that simple.

Because while that movie had issues it still managed to achieve what it set out too. BvS is crippled for the entire run time.

Yes, Marvel's The Avengers achieved everything it set out to do. That's why they crippled the villain they built up for the entire movie into a gag.

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saint_samantha

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@xwraith said:

@saint_samantha: Guardians being ranked so high on my list has a lot to do with my personal feelings. I'd read the original comics shortly before the film was announced, and spent two years hoping I'd like it.

That sounds cool, man! I've always hoped that a comic book movie would be announced and that I'd spend time reading comics in preparation for it. I've attempted it before but I always get too busy hah.

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MasterKungFu

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There was the odd scene that was awesome (Batman rescuing Martha is basically it) but they were few and far between with way more openly cringe moments.

The fights weren't even good! And the dream sequences. Oh god. The dream sequences.

the fight scenes not good? what the hell were you watching? TDKR bane vs batman?

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saint_samantha

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#17  Edited By saint_samantha

@masterkungfu said:
@buildhare said:

There was the odd scene that was awesome (Batman rescuing Martha is basically it) but they were few and far between with way more openly cringe moments.

The fights weren't even good! And the dream sequences. Oh god. The dream sequences.

the fight scenes not good? what the hell were you watching? TDKR bane vs batman?

This. The movie was visually stunning.

EDIT: Don't remind me of the choreography from the Dark Knight trilogy O.o

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wished they would have used DOS for a man of steel sequel

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saint_samantha

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wished they would have used DOS for a man of steel sequel

What's DOS?

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kevinwalsh

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"if you want superheroes that inspire people, this film is horrible for that". Oh so these characters aren't actual heroes then? Very good base to build a universe of children's characters on. Very glad to not be seeing this.

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saint_samantha

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@psychopinata: might want to spoiler mark that.

"if you want superheroes that inspire people, this film is horrible for that". Oh so these characters aren't actual heroes then? Very good base to build a universe of children's characters on. Very glad to not be seeing this.

It's called looking at the subject matter in a realistic light. And perhaps my review was slightly misleading. The entire film isn't inspiring throughout, but by the time the credits rolled, I was very inspired.

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deactivated-5967bf6197d40

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Lol seems like you've got some backlash on your hands XD

Well, we knew from the start that we weren't going to agree on this, but while I have some qualms with your opinion, I respect it and I'm glad you got what you wanted out of it. Overall, that's what matters most, right?

It is a bit jarring to have you say that this is a contender for one of the best superhero films in years and then see you give it a 7.5 though. I kind of hope we're doing better than that D:

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saint_samantha

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Lol seems like you've got some backlash on your hands XD

Well, we knew from the start that we weren't going to agree on this, but while I have some qualms with your opinion, I respect it and I'm glad you got what you wanted out of it. Overall, that's what matters most, right?

It is a bit jarring to have you say that this is a contender for one of the best superhero films in years and then see you give it a 7.5 though. I kind of hope we're doing better than that D:

I honestly don't think the genre is that great from a filmmaking standpoint.

I hate to look at it pessimistically because I love superhero movies. We need superhero movies. You know, sometimes I'm bored or sick and all I need is a superhero film. But I've seen much better filmmaking in other genres.

Batman v. Superman was objectively one of the strongest superhero movies I've seen. Bring up issues with the script but a movie is more then script - technicality, visuals, cinematography, acting, emotion, execution, originality all matters. I've actually got more to say, so I might edit my review at the moment!

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deactivated-5d2b83d5a0d79

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Imma watch it tomorrow. All the negative reviews are actually making me want to see it more xD To watch this train-wreck unfold with my very own eyes.

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saint_samantha

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@farkam said:

Imma watch it tomorrow. All the negative reviews are actually making me want to see it more xD To watch this train-wreck unfold with my very own eyes.

IMO, it's not a train-wreck. It's a really good movie in a saturated market.

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righteous300

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#27  Edited By righteous300

I give it the same score. It was a very ambitious film, took a lot of risk and didn't play it safe. I think I love this movie.

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saint_samantha

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#28  Edited By saint_samantha

@righteous300 said:

I give it the same score. It was a very ambitious film, took a lot of risk and didn't play it safe. I think I love this movie.

I love it too. So glad to here someone else did <3

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deactivated-5d2b83d5a0d79

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@farkam said:

Imma watch it tomorrow. All the negative reviews are actually making me want to see it more xD To watch this train-wreck unfold with my very own eyes.

IMO, it's not a train-wreck. It's a really good movie in a saturated market.

Not that I care, as I can enjoy train-wrecks. I enjoy several stupid movies as well as universally despised ones.

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saint_samantha

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@farkam said:
@saint_samantha said:
@farkam said:

Imma watch it tomorrow. All the negative reviews are actually making me want to see it more xD To watch this train-wreck unfold with my very own eyes.

IMO, it's not a train-wreck. It's a really good movie in a saturated market.

Not that I care, as I can enjoy train-wrecks. I enjoy several stupid movies as well as universally despised ones.

I take it you're not artsy? You don't analyse movies?

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deactivated-5d2b83d5a0d79

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@farkam said:
@saint_samantha said:
@farkam said:

Imma watch it tomorrow. All the negative reviews are actually making me want to see it more xD To watch this train-wreck unfold with my very own eyes.

IMO, it's not a train-wreck. It's a really good movie in a saturated market.

Not that I care, as I can enjoy train-wrecks. I enjoy several stupid movies as well as universally despised ones.

I take it you're not artsy? You don't analyse movies?

I watch movies for enjoyment. If a movie is sh*t (like MOS for example) I can recognize and admit that, unlike most other people. Just because a movie is sh*t doesn't mean I have to stop enjoying it though.

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saint_samantha

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@farkam said:
@saint_samantha said:
@farkam said:
@saint_samantha said:
@farkam said:

Imma watch it tomorrow. All the negative reviews are actually making me want to see it more xD To watch this train-wreck unfold with my very own eyes.

IMO, it's not a train-wreck. It's a really good movie in a saturated market.

Not that I care, as I can enjoy train-wrecks. I enjoy several stupid movies as well as universally despised ones.

I take it you're not artsy? You don't analyse movies?

I watch movies for enjoyment. If a movie is sh*t (like MOS for example) I can recognize and admit that, unlike most other people. Just because a movie is sh*t doesn't mean I have to stop enjoying it though.

I understand you. Because some people like a movie less as a result of plot holes and poor character development to a point where they can't enjoy the film.

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Deathstroke52

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#33  Edited By Deathstroke52

Yes.

I waited 5 hours at the theater and it was all worth it.

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DeathpooltheT1000

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Whut?
Whut?

Heck no, this movies is flawed as hell.

That people wants to love a movie doesnt mean is a good movie.

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ganon15

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Lol these threads

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CWChandler

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What is this, an exercise in playing devil's advocate? It's a really long defense of a blatantly wrong thesis.

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buttersdaman000

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Oh sh*t.....this is gonna be more divisive than MoS isn't it??

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w0nd

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@xwraith said:

@saint_samantha: In that case, I can name at least four superhero films released in the past seven years that were better (Cap 2, GotG, X-Men First Class, and DoFP).

That's fine: three of those movies I completely understand why someone would call them some of the best from the past seven years. What I hate is when people crucify Batman v. Superman for being flawed, when in reality, GoTG is just as, if not more flawed, then Dawn of Justice.

Think about it, GoTG is a fairly generic, predictable story with a weak villain, weak story, average acting etc. yet if I call GoTG the best superhero movie of the past few years, much less people will detest me.

but it wasn't sloppy. They took the easy way out for sure, but they didn't try to do too much and fail. SO it comes down to, do you give extra points for someone for trying and not pulling it off.

at the end of the day I do not, they are professionals who make millions.

Here have a safe cheese burger that is done amazingly, or have this steak that i tried to pull off but didn't quite know what to do with it.

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iSoupreme

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I wouldn't go so far as to call it "the best" movie, but definitely up top.

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AkshSarpanch

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Definatly my fav. Superhero movie of all time. But saying its best movie for other people is kinda stratch.

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youknowwhattodo

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It's the second best superhero I've seen in theaters for 2016.

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I haven't seen it yet, but I doubt it.

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BatWatch

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#43  Edited By BatWatch

It's the second best superhero I've seen in theaters for 2016.

Wow! That's impressive. 8D

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wrucebayne

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#44  Edited By wrucebayne

I haven't seen Fant4stic, so I can't comment on that. BvS is the worst comic book movie since X-Men Origins Wolverine. I'm honestly astonished at how bad it was.

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SinisterSoul

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It was terrible. It managed to fall under the already incredibly low bar that was Man of Steel. It was like DC didn't learn nothing from watching fox fail in 2004-2008.

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DarthAznable

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That title belongs to Winter Soldier.

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deactivated-5c9535a734784

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Opinions are a hell of a thing. But we all should respect them. My favourite superhero film since 2008 is tied between Avengers: AOU and TWS. Yes, I'm ready for the angry comments. Come at me.

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saint_samantha

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Opinions are a hell of a thing. But we all should respect them. My favourite superhero film since 2008 is tied between Avengers: AOU and TWS. Yes, I'm ready for the angry comments. Come at me.

I hope you won't berate me for my opinion then. After all, AoU being the best since 2008 is also an opinion you'd be hard pressed to find :)

That title belongs to Winter Soldier.

Winter Soldier is also good. 5/7.

It was terrible. It managed to fall under the already incredibly low bar that was Man of Steel. It was like DC didn't learn nothing from watching fox fail in 2004-2008.

Agree to disagree, then. IMO, this movie was an improvement in everything from Man of Steel with the exception of a weak villain, and doubling on the amount of plot holes that movie had.

I haven't seen Fant4stic, so I can't comment on that. BvS is the worst comic book movie since X-Men Origins Wolverine. I'm honestly astonished at how bad it was.

It's almost as if Green Lantern and Ghost Rider: Spirit of Vengeance don't exist.

Definatly my fav. Superhero movie of all time. But saying its best movie for other people is kinda stratch.

At the end of the day, art is subjective. If we sat looking at movies how the "rest of the people" look at it, then we'd be getting nowhere.

@w0nd said:
@saint_samantha said:
@xwraith said:

@saint_samantha: In that case, I can name at least four superhero films released in the past seven years that were better (Cap 2, GotG, X-Men First Class, and DoFP).

That's fine: three of those movies I completely understand why someone would call them some of the best from the past seven years. What I hate is when people crucify Batman v. Superman for being flawed, when in reality, GoTG is just as, if not more flawed, then Dawn of Justice.

Think about it, GoTG is a fairly generic, predictable story with a weak villain, weak story, average acting etc. yet if I call GoTG the best superhero movie of the past few years, much less people will detest me.

but it wasn't sloppy. They took the easy way out for sure, but they didn't try to do too much and fail. SO it comes down to, do you give extra points for someone for trying and not pulling it off.

at the end of the day I do not, they are professionals who make millions.

Here have a safe cheese burger that is done amazingly, or have this steak that i tried to pull off but didn't quite know what to do with it.

Right, then I guess you'd prefer a movie that is essentially a 2 hour black screen because it accomplished everything it set out to? I see.

Yes.

I waited 5 hours at the theater and it was all worth it.

Holy shit. Longer then the campaign for the Godzilla game! (and much, much longer then Ground Zeroes).

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JediXMan

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#49 JediXMan  Moderator

Not even the best comic book movie so far this year.

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Deathstroke52

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@deathstroke52 said:

Yes.

I waited 5 hours at the theater and it was all worth it.

Holy shit. Longer then the campaign for the Godzilla game! (and much, much longer then Ground Zeroes).

lol