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#1 Edited by Subbat321 (251 posts) - - Show Bio

Mainly due to skill regeneration and zenkai

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#2 Posted by EmperorThanos- (16058 posts) - - Show Bio

Buu is better. Choclate beam and absorption. Plus with better regen.

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#3 Posted by APEX_pretador (19723 posts) - - Show Bio

Goku almost defeated cell despite being much weaker. Current goku is much more skilled.

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#4 Posted by JohnCena69swag (3803 posts) - - Show Bio

I agree. Cell is the most versatile character in the series.

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#5 Posted by buttersdaman000 (22677 posts) - - Show Bio

You can't equalize stats then allow for his Zenkai boost. It completely defeats the purpose of equalizing the stats.

Buu is better. Choclate beam and absorption. Plus with better regen.

^

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#6 Posted by ChubbyGeorge (18 posts) - - Show Bio

Strongest villain with equalized stats? Wouldn't that suggest that every other villain would be just as powerful as him? I suppose you mean that he would be the most formidable opponent due to his vast array of techniques. However, even this isn't accurate. Let's run down the facts:

Cell:

  • Has almost every fighters fighting techniques that were show cased before Goku went to Namek.
  • Can regenerate. However, doing so requires time and it does not regenerate his Ki.
  • Is good in hand to hand combat, although not quite as good as Goku.
  • Can receive Zenkai's if he regenerates from a near death experience.
  • Energy based attacks seem to affect his Ki.

Majin Buu:

  • Can instantly learn any opponents fighting technique simply from seeing it from the first time.
  • Can regenerate instantaneously and doing so doesn't affect hi Ki.
  • Was able to fight Goku in hand to hand combat, however, he is not quite as good as Goku.
  • Using energy based attack doesn't seem to affect his Ki.

Everything seems to favor Majin Buu as being the greater threat. Cell has more techniques than Buu but Buu can counter act this by learning his techniques instantly, and since the only way to defeat Majin Buu is to completely destroy every cell in his body, the chances are pretty small that Cell would recognize this quickly: Vegeta didn't. Furthermore, Ki based attacks will weaken Cell, hindering his performance.

Cell would also be completely unaware of Majin Buu's ability to turn his opponent into candy and would likely fall victim to this attack due to his own confidence about his own abilities.

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#7 Posted by RukelnikovFTW (6131 posts) - - Show Bio

Buu is better. Choclate beam and absorption. Plus with better regen.

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#8 Posted by Beast_mode999 (2588 posts) - - Show Bio

Buu says hello

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#9 Edited by MetalJimmor (6166 posts) - - Show Bio

As much as it pains me to admit it Buu is a lot stronger than Cell even with equalized power levels. Buu can do everything Cell can do to a greater extent on top of having an instant win hax beam attack. Cell does have a few small advantages but nothing he was known to exploit in a 1v1 fight due to his pride. Cell IS the most powerful science based character however. The reason Buu is so OP is because he's a giant wad of magic bubble gum given life. However I feel Cell has a shot of pulling some wins with his own advantages.

Cell's Advantages:

1. Much better martial artist. Kid Buu especially was just a brawler with an insane and unpredictable style. The only martial arts skills he had was gained by absorbing other fighters. Cell however was programmed with the fighting skill of those he's composed of, which includes Goku, Vegeta, Piccolo, Krillin, and Tien. All without a doubt among the best martial artists in the world. So even before absorbing people he's a high end martial artist.

2. Far more intelligent. Kid Buu wasn't smart, nor were any of the Buus aside from Super Buu who got all his smarts from absorbing Piccolo. Cell demonstrated a good degree of intelligence, and was arguably the smartest villain we've seen in the Z era due to him starting out weaker than the main cast and needing to sneak around and evade them to gather his power. He also proved good at exploiting the personality flaws of the heroes, chiefly Vegeta.

3. Zenkai Boost. Unlike Buu, when Cell gets completely destroyed and regenerates he comes back even more powerful than before. That combined with his self destruct is actually a pretty potent tool in his arsenal.

4. Drain Cell Absorption. When Buu wants to absorb someone he needs to completely consume them. Cell can do the same, or he can stab his opponent with his tail and drain their ki and life energy to add to his own. This has the added bonus of leaving his opponent severely weakened.

5. Cell Juniors. Creating them didn't seem to cost Cell much, if any, energy the way it does for Namekians to create babies, and each Cell Junior was equal to high end Super Saiyan fighters. Similarly in the anime filler he was able to use the multi-form technique without the forms losing power. So in effect he can create multiple fighters of similar ability (albeit seemingly less intelligent and without his regen), which is something I do not believe Buu can do (outside of some games).

So Cell does have some tools to work with. They just aren't enough to compensate for Buu having near endless stamina and regen, where as Cell's regen exhausts him and he has finite energy. Still, if Cell plays it smart and abuses his Cell Juniors he might be able to pull a win. Keep in mind though that Cell is my favorite Dragonball character, so I am a bit biased. lol

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#10 Edited by deactivated-5a2b0053414c5 (8165 posts) - - Show Bio

Nah, Buu is still one of the best people to be in a fight even at equalized power.

Cell is the most skilled of the villains though imo

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#11 Posted by ChubbyGeorge (18 posts) - - Show Bio

1. Much better martial artist. Kid Buu especially was just a brawler with an insane and unpredictable style. The only martial arts skills he had was gained by absorbing other fighters. Cell however was programmed with the fighting skill of those he's composed of, which includes Goku, Vegeta, Piccolo, Krillin, and Tien. All without a doubt among the best martial artists in the world. So even before absorbing people he's a high end martial artist.

Within the original Manga it is made rather clear that Goku is a better fighter than both Pure Buu and Perfect Cell. He was able to keep up with both despite the constraints of Super Saiyan 3, limited stamina, and being inferior to either fighter in terms of overall strength. Therefore, I'd argue that both Pure Buu and Perfect Cell are around the same in terms of hand to hand combat prowess, they were both inferior to Goku, but only to a small degree.

What we do know is that other fusions, such as Gotenks, were the product of Goten and Trunks: in the same way that Cell is the product of all the best fighters in the Universe: however, he wasn't capable of even transforming into a Super Saiyan at will, he only demonstrated that he could do so after entering the Room Of Spirit And Time. Therefore, one could argue, to a reasonable degree, that Perfect Cell wouldn't be as good in martial arts as, Piccolo, Vegeta, Goku, Krillen and Tien combined, he's not. His own abilities are tailored towards his own experience.

2. Far more intelligent. Kid Buu wasn't smart, nor were any of the Buus aside from Super Buu who got all his smarts from absorbing Piccolo. Cell demonstrated a good degree of intelligence, and was arguably the smartest villain we've seen in the Z era due to him starting out weaker than the main cast and needing to sneak around and evade them to gather his power. He also proved good at exploiting the personality flaws of the heroes, chiefly Vegeta.

Super Buu was an intelligent fighter, even without Piccolo. He orchestrated Ultimate Gohan's defeat before Gohan even showed up. Furthermore, Cell is far more intelligent than Majin Buu but it doesn't really matter because Vegeta and Goku were as well, and both of them were incapable of besting Majin Buu. His regenerative capabilities and techniques over ride whatever he lacks in intelligence.

3. Zenkai Boost. Unlike Buu, when Cell gets completely destroyed and regenerates he comes back even more powerful than before. That combined with his self destruct is actually a pretty potent tool in his arsenal.

Incorrect. Cell has to have one Cell remaining in order to return, otherwise he is finished for good. You are also forgetting that both Goku, Vegeta and Gohan are all capable of receiving Zenkai's but they never helped them in their battles against Majin Buu, why would they help Cell?

4. Drain Cell Absorption. When Buu wants to absorb someone he needs to completely consume them. Cell can do the same, or he can stab his opponent with his tail and drain their ki and life energy to add to his own. This has the added bonus of leaving his opponent severely weakened.

Perfect Cell lost his tail which would make draining his opponent completely impossible. The point is, Cell achieved his Perfect form, he can't get more powerful that way.

5. Cell Juniors. Creating them didn't seem to cost Cell much, if any, energy the way it does for Namekians to create babies, and each Cell Junior was equal to high end Super Saiyan fighters. Similarly in the anime filler he was able to use the multi-form technique without the forms losing power. So in effect he can create multiple fighters of similar ability (albeit seemingly less intelligent and without his regen), which is something I do not believe Buu can do (outside of some games).

The Cell Junior's were roughly half of Perfect Cell's total battle power, which isn't too shabby of a feat, however, they would probably serve as more as a handicap as opposed to an advantage. They are too weak to be effective against Majin Buu and they would likely just be absorbed and they would ultimate only serve the purpose of powering up Buu, which coincidentally, turns the tables even more against Cell.

So Cell does have some tools to work with. They just aren't enough to compensate for Buu having near endless stamina and regen, where as Cell's regen exhausts him and he has finite energy. Still, if Cell plays it smart and abuses his Cell Juniors he might be able to pull a win. Keep in mind though that Cell is my favorite Dragonball character, so I am a bit biased. lol

Most of his techniques wouldn't be effective against Majin Buu. That, and Majin Buu would learn them instantly if he used any of them. For example, if Cell created nine Cell Junior's what's to stop Majin Buu from learning that technique and creating 9 himself? He learned Kibito's teleporting technique, Vegeta's energy based attacks and even the Kamehameha from seeing them one time. He's a stupid villain but he's also a genius in combat.

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#12 Posted by Perethorn (6289 posts) - - Show Bio

If we are talking about equalized stats, Cell would bite the dust HARD vs Hit and Boo (Too much hax)

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#13 Posted by MetalJimmor (6166 posts) - - Show Bio

Within the original Manga it is made rather clear that Goku is a better fighter than both Pure Buu and Perfect Cell. He was able to keep up with both despite the constraints of Super Saiyan 3, limited stamina, and being inferior to either fighter in terms of overall strength. Therefore, I'd argue that both Pure Buu and Perfect Cell are around the same in terms of hand to hand combat prowess, they were both inferior to Goku, but only to a small degree.

Do you have any proof Kid Buu was a skilled fighter? I am near 100% sure what made him dangerous was his lack of actual style or tactics and the fact that Goku and Vegeta couldn't predict what he did next. Cell has actual technical skill that is the product of being born of some of the greatest martial artists in the world's history.

What we do know is that other fusions, such as Gotenks, were the product of Goten and Trunks: in the same way that Cell is the product of all the best fighters in the Universe: however, he wasn't capable of even transforming into a Super Saiyan at will, he only demonstrated that he could do so after entering the Room Of Spirit And Time. Therefore, one could argue, to a reasonable degree, that Perfect Cell wouldn't be as good in martial arts as, Piccolo, Vegeta, Goku, Krillen and Tien combined, he's not. His own abilities are tailored towards his own experience.

Fusion isn't the same thing as being a clone that was programmed by a machine with data.

Super Buu was an intelligent fighter, even without Piccolo. He orchestrated Ultimate Gohan's defeat before Gohan even showed up. Furthermore, Cell is far more intelligent than Majin Buu but it doesn't really matter because Vegeta and Goku were as well, and both of them were incapable of besting Majin Buu. His regenerative capabilities and techniques over ride whatever he lacks in intelligence.

It's been a while since I saw Super Buu vs Gohan, but I am pretty sure he wasn't able to manipulate Gohan until after he absorbed Piccolo and learned about Gohan's emotional shortcomings. And while Goku and Vegeta were also smarter than Buu and failed, that doesn't stop this from being a clear advantage in Cell's favor. There is no scenario in which being more intelligent and tactically sound is a bad thing.

Incorrect. Cell has to have one Cell remaining in order to return, otherwise he is finished for good. You are also forgetting that both Goku, Vegeta and Gohan are all capable of receiving Zenkai's but they never helped them in their battles against Majin Buu, why would they help Cell?

The difference between Cell and the other saiyans should be quite clear. They can't regenerate instantly from near death, but Cell can. That is what makes it such a huge asset for Cell. Goku nearly dies and he's out of comission until he can get a senzu bean or recovers in the hospital. Cell nearly dies and he regrows his body back to normal within seconds and is fully ready for a second round more powerful than ever.

Perfect Cell lost his tail which would make draining his opponent completely impossible. The point is, Cell achieved his Perfect form, he can't get more powerful that way.

Perfect Cell's tail is internal now, but it can extend when he needs it. He pooped the Cell Juniors out of it when he birthed them. While it isn't canon he also used his tail in GT to try and absorb Goku.

The Cell Junior's were roughly half of Perfect Cell's total battle power, which isn't too shabby of a feat, however, they would probably serve as more as a handicap as opposed to an advantage. They are too weak to be effective against Majin Buu and they would likely just be absorbed and they would ultimate only serve the purpose of powering up Buu, which coincidentally, turns the tables even more against Cell.

That depends on how they are used. Buu's absorption also isn't instant, so if he went to eat one he might open himself up to an attack. Or the Cell Junior could detonate itself once Buu tries to eat one. Or they could keep their distance and distract Buu long enough for Cell to charge a spirit bomb, but that's a risky maneuver that could easily backfire.

Most of his techniques wouldn't be effective against Majin Buu. That, and Majin Buu would learn them instantly if he used any of them. For example, if Cell created nine Cell Junior's what's to stop Majin Buu from learning that technique and creating 9 himself? He learned Kibito's teleporting technique, Vegeta's energy based attacks and even the Kamehameha from seeing them one time. He's a stupid villain but he's also a genius in combat.

Cell creating Cell Juniors isn't a technique, it's a biological process unique to his physiology. I doubt Buu can really copy it, and he's never copied an ability quite like it before.

Anyway, I acknowledge that Buu is stronger. I am just pointing out areas were Cell has the advantage that could potentially give him a win or two if he played all his cards right.

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#14 Posted by ChubbyGeorge (18 posts) - - Show Bio

Do you have any proof Kid Buu was a skilled fighter? I am near 100% sure what made him dangerous was his lack of actual style or tactics and the fact that Goku and Vegeta couldn't predict what he did next. Cell has actual technical skill that is the product of being born of some of the greatest martial artists in the world's history.

You shouldn't claim to be 100% certain about anything within a debate as it defeats the whole purpose of being involved in one.

Pure Buu had Goku on the ropes at times and forced him to use his instant transmission to avoid his Ki attacks. The two also exchanged blows in a rather even fight. In terms of actual technique, they appeared to be more-or-less even.

The only thing that is stated within the Manga about Majin Buu being dangerous is his randomness and careless behavior. He would destroy planets without thinking twice, it had nothing to do with his technique in hand to hand combat.

Cell's fighting techniques are a step below Goku's, who actually bested him in their final show down. Arguing that Cell is comprised of the combined fighting ability of Goku and the Z Fighters isn't supported by the Daizenshuu or the Japanese Manga. He is capable of using their energy based attacks but has never demonstrated that he is in a league of his own in terms of hand to hand combat efficiency.

Fusion isn't the same thing as being a clone that was programmed by a machine with data.

It most certainly is. Both Cell and Gotenks are comprised of a number of beings with both of their techniques and fighting abilities tailored towards their own experiences that are not dependant on the experiences of the fighters they are the product of. For example, Imperfect Cell's Kamehameha against Kamiccolo was considered sloppy by the admission of Piccolo, this most certainly invalidates your claim because it shows that just because Cell has the genetic components of Goku, doesn't mean he is as efficient as him with his own techniques of fighting ability. Actually, this renders your argument completely invalid.

It's been a while since I saw Super Buu vs Gohan, but I am pretty sure he wasn't able to manipulate Gohan until after he absorbed Piccolo and learned about Gohan's emotional shortcomings. And while Goku and Vegeta were also smarter than Buu and failed, that doesn't stop this from being a clear advantage in Cell's favor. There is no scenario in which being more intelligent and tactically sound is a bad thing.

You clearly have only watched the Anime and haven't read the Japanese Manga. Super Buu began to orchestrate Gohan's defeat when he first arrived on the look-out.

The difference between Cell and the other saiyans should be quite clear. They can't regenerate instantly from near death, but Cell can. That is what makes it such a huge asset for Cell. Goku nearly dies and he's out of comission until he can get a senzu bean or recovers in the hospital. Cell nearly dies and he regrows his body back to normal within seconds and is fully ready for a second round more powerful than ever.

Cell's regenerative capabilities only replenish his physical body and not his Ki, which is why, when he regenerated against Goku he required a Senzu bean to restore his power. Furthermore, Cells regeneration takes time, as does Piccolo's, Majin Buu, particularly Pure Buu, wouldn't give him those important moments that he needs to complete his regeneration process. The only reason why he completed his first two is because Goku forgot about Piccolo's genetic capabilities and Cell being located in another dimension altogether. His Zenkai and regeneration combo would require time, and against an opponent like Majin Buu, he wouldn't have that.

Perfect Cell's tail is internal now, but it can extend when he needs it. He pooped the Cell Juniors out of it when he birthed them. While it isn't canon he also used his tail in GT to try and absorb Goku.

This is never supported in the Japanese Manga. GT is completely non canon.

That depends on how they are used. Buu's absorption also isn't instant, so if he went to eat one he might open himself up to an attack. Or the Cell Junior could detonate itself once Buu tries to eat one. Or they could keep their distance and distract Buu long enough for Cell to charge a spirit bomb, but that's a risky maneuver that could easily backfire.

Majin Buu's absorption process has always been instant within the Japanese Manga. Furthermore, your arguments are not very sound, they require a lot of what if's, et cetera.

Arguing that the much weaker Cell Junior's could actually hold off Pure Buu while Cell charges a Genki Dama is kind of hilarious. The only reason this actually occurred within the Manga is because Good Buu was strong enough to hold him off. If Perfect Cell is equal to Pure Buu and the two are fighting, than the much weaker Cell Junior's would be completely incapable of doing this, they are simply too weak. It would look a lot like Kid Gohan SSJ2 vs the Cell Junior's all over again.

Cell creating Cell Juniors isn't a technique, it's a biological process unique to his physiology. I doubt Buu can really copy it, and he's never copied an ability quite like it before.

It would still be an irrelevant alternative.

  1. They are too weak to pose a threat.
  2. They would be absorbed.

Anyway, I acknowledge that Buu is stronger. I am just pointing out areas were Cell has the advantage that could potentially give him a win or two if he played all his cards right.

The point of the thread isn't to discuss who is stronger, it is to discuss who is the more formidable opponent on even ground. In this scenario Majin Buu wins it hands down.

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#15 Edited by MetalJimmor (6166 posts) - - Show Bio

@chubbygeorge:

I think you are mistaking this for a debate. I never intended to get into a debate, I was only pointing out areas where Cell has the advantage, and even admitted that it wouldn't be enough to beat Buu for the majority.

For the record though, it's not so much I don't know the events of the manga and more that between the dub, DBZ Kai, and the manga it's hard to keep track of exactly what went down in each version and how, which is exactly why I usually don't get involved in Dragonball debates.

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#16 Posted by Thedarkpaladin (22886 posts) - - Show Bio

@emperorthanos said:

Buu is better. Choclate beam and absorption. Plus with better regen.

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#17 Posted by RehBeh (170 posts) - - Show Bio
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#18 Posted by JohnCena69swag (3803 posts) - - Show Bio

@rehbeh: Buu isn't smart enough and doesn't have access to the techniques cell has. Even the smarter super buu almost lost to gotenks at equal power levels. Buu's only ace is his stamina, and that's null against someone like cell.

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#19 Posted by RukelnikovFTW (6131 posts) - - Show Bio

For some reason it hasn't been mentioned yet, but not only Buu is above Cell, Zamasu is too

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#20 Posted by SeyWhat (7 posts) - - Show Bio

@rehbeh: Buu isn't smart enough and doesn't have access to the techniques cell has. Even the smarter super buu almost lost to gotenks at equal power levels. Buu's only ace is his stamina, and that's null against someone like cell.

Super Buu orchestrated Gohan's defeat before his fight with Gotenks, he had no reason to defeat him.

Cell:

  • Has almost every fighters fighting techniques that were show cased before Goku went to Namek.
  • Can regenerate. However, doing so requires time and it does not regenerate his Ki.
  • Is good in hand to hand combat, although not quite as good as Goku.
  • Can receive Zenkai's if he regenerates from a near death experience.
  • Energy based attacks seem to affect his Ki.

Majin Buu:

  • Can instantly learn any opponents fighting technique simply from seeing it from the first time.
  • Can regenerate instantaneously and doing so doesn't affect hi Ki.
  • Was able to fight Goku in hand to hand combat, however, he is not quite as good as Goku.
  • Using energy based attack doesn't seem to affect his Ki.

Everything seems to favor Majin Buu as being the greater threat. Cell has more techniques than Buu but Buu can counter act this by learning his techniques instantly, and since the only way to defeat Majin Buu is to completely destroy every cell in his body, the chances are pretty small that Cell would recognize this quickly: Vegeta didn't. Furthermore, Ki based attacks will weaken Cell, hindering his performance.

Cell would also be completely unaware of Majin Buu's ability to turn his opponent into candy and would likely fall victim to this attack due to his own confidence about his own abilities.

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#21 Posted by JohnCena69swag (3803 posts) - - Show Bio

@seywhat said:

Super Buu orchestrated Gohan's defeat before his fight with Gotenks, he had no reason to defeat him.

Until Gohan showed up, Buu's only opponent was Gotenks, and Gotenks was kicking his ass.

@seywhat said:
  • Has almost every fighters fighting techniques that were show cased before Goku went to Namek.
  • Can regenerate. However, doing so requires time and it does not regenerate his Ki.
  • Is good in hand to hand combat, although not quite as good as Goku.
  • Can receive Zenkai's if he regenerates from a near death experience.
  • Energy based attacks seem to affect his Ki.

  • Don't forget that he picked up on IT after he exploded. Not to mention he improved upon most of these techniques.
  • Doesn't require that much time. It's quick enough that he would be able to use it in a fight.
  • How is he not as good as Goku in H2H? He has access to all Goku's techniques, as well as frieza's, vegeta's, piccolo's, and several others. He was surpressed to Goku's level and still would have destroyed Goku if they continued. Goku had one trick up his sleeve which didn't even work.
  • Ok but this probably won't happen.
  • Not sure what you mean there? As in he will get hurt from a kamehameha? Yeah sure but so would Buu.
@seywhat said:

Majin Buu:

  • Can instantly learn any opponents fighting technique simply from seeing it from the first time.
  • Can regenerate instantaneously and doing so doesn't affect hi Ki.
  • Was able to fight Goku in hand to hand combat, however, he is not quite as good as Goku.
  • Using energy based attack doesn't seem to affect his Ki.

  • This is said to be true but he literally only did this once. He never learned to sense power levels as fat buu (less than Vegeta), and he didn't learn instant transmission until he was kid buu (which happens to be the mindless freak who doesn't learn anything anyway). Honestly, more often than not he comes off as an idiot.
  • His regen is not instantaneous. Depending on the severity of his injuries and his ki levels it could take as long as or longer than cell's.
  • Both times he fought Goku Goku said he could have beat him with more time. Once as fat Buu and once as kid Buu. They were each close to if not a little higher than Goku's power level.
  • Again, if by energy attacks affecting him you mean would a kamehameha hurt him then the answer is yes it would. Goku claimed he could have beaten him on his own. Fat Buu literally got beat to near death by kid buu (and Beerus), and Vegito nearly beat Buuhan to death.

He can be beaten to death like anyone else. The candy beam is a good point, but it is debatable whether or not that would even work at equal power levels. Cell is smarter, he's a better fighter, and he is not losing to any incarnation of Buu at equal power levels.

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#22 Posted by SeyWhat (7 posts) - - Show Bio

@seywhat said:

Super Buu orchestrated Gohan's defeat before his fight with Gotenks, he had no reason to defeat him.

Until Gohan showed up, Buu's only opponent was Gotenks, and Gotenks was kicking his ass.

@seywhat said:
  • Has almost every fighters fighting techniques that were show cased before Goku went to Namek.
  • Can regenerate. However, doing so requires time and it does not regenerate his Ki.
  • Is good in hand to hand combat, although not quite as good as Goku.
  • Can receive Zenkai's if he regenerates from a near death experience.
  • Energy based attacks seem to affect his Ki.
  • Don't forget that he picked up on IT after he exploded. Not to mention he improved upon most of these techniques.
  • Doesn't require that much time. It's quick enough that he would be able to use it in a fight.
  • How is he not as good as Goku in H2H? He has access to all Goku's techniques, as well as frieza's, vegeta's, piccolo's, and several others. He was surpressed to Goku's level and still would have destroyed Goku if they continued. Goku had one trick up his sleeve which didn't even work.
  • Ok but this probably won't happen.
  • Not sure what you mean there? As in he will get hurt from a kamehameha? Yeah sure but so would Buu.
@seywhat said:

Majin Buu:

  • Can instantly learn any opponents fighting technique simply from seeing it from the first time.
  • Can regenerate instantaneously and doing so doesn't affect hi Ki.
  • Was able to fight Goku in hand to hand combat, however, he is not quite as good as Goku.
  • Using energy based attack doesn't seem to affect his Ki.
  • This is said to be true but he literally only did this once. He never learned to sense power levels as fat buu (less than Vegeta), and he didn't learn instant transmission until he was kid buu (which happens to be the mindless freak who doesn't learn anything anyway). Honestly, more often than not he comes off as an idiot.
  • His regen is not instantaneous. Depending on the severity of his injuries and his ki levels it could take as long as or longer than cell's.
  • Both times he fought Goku Goku said he could have beat him with more time. Once as fat Buu and once as kid Buu. They were each close to if not a little higher than Goku's power level.
  • Again, if by energy attacks affecting him you mean would a kamehameha hurt him then the answer is yes it would. Goku claimed he could have beaten him on his own. Fat Buu literally got beat to near death by kid buu (and Beerus), and Vegito nearly beat Buuhan to death.

He can be beaten to death like anyone else. The candy beam is a good point, but it is debatable whether or not that would even work at equal power levels. Cell is smarter, he's a better fighter, and he is not losing to any incarnation of Buu at equal power levels.

In the Japanese Manga Super Buu states that he was planning Gohan's defeat long before he showed up. So your first comment is debunked.

Don't forget that he picked up on IT after he exploded. Not to mention he improved upon most of these techniques.

  • Doesn't require that much time. It's quick enough that he would be able to use it in a fight.
  • How is he not as good as Goku in H2H? He has access to all Goku's techniques, as well as frieza's, vegeta's, piccolo's, and several others. He was surpressed to Goku's level and still would have destroyed Goku if they continued. Goku had one trick up his sleeve which didn't even work.
  • Ok but this probably won't happen.
  • Not sure what you mean there? As in he will get hurt from a kamehameha? Yeah sure but so would Buu.

Goku was using Instant Transmission during his battle with Cell, there is no reason to believe that Cell didn't pick up on it beforehand, he just had no reason to use it up until he was stuck in the world of the dead.

Despite being behind Cell in both power and speed, Goku nearly emerged victorious due to his fighting instincts and capability of adapting to any situation.

Cell does not have the combined hand to hand fighting capabilities of all the fighters that you listed, he merely has their biological capabilities and techniques. His own efficiency in hand to hand combat is tailored towards his own experiences.

I am ignoring your last two statements because I do not know what you are commenting on. You failed to include it in a quote.

This is said to be true but he literally only did this once. He never learned to sense power levels as fat buu (less than Vegeta), and he didn't learn instant transmission until he was kid buu (which happens to be the mindless freak who doesn't learn anything anyway). Honestly, more often than not he comes off as an idiot.

  • His regen is not instantaneous. Depending on the severity of his injuries and his ki levels it could take as long as or longer than cell's.
  • Both times he fought Goku Goku said he could have beat him with more time. Once as fat Buu and once as kid Buu. They were each close to if not a little higher than Goku's power level.
  • Again, if by energy attacks affecting him you mean would a kamehameha hurt him then the answer is yes it would. Goku claimed he could have beaten him on his own. Fat Buu literally got beat to near death by kid buu (and Beerus), and Vegito nearly beat Buuhan to death.

Fat Buu instantly learned Vegeta's Ki attacks and Goku's Kamehameha, even after only seeing it once. Sensing power levels isn't a technique that can be show-cased for him to learn. You are grasping at straws with this one.

His regen is not instantaneous. Depending on the severity of his injuries and his ki levels it could take as long as or longer than cell's.

Incorrect.

Pure Buu's regeneration abilities are far superior to any other version of Majin Buu. He recovered instantaneously from every attack within the Japanese Manga, and as a result, his regeneration capabilities are far superior to Cells by default.

Both times he fought Goku Goku said he could have beat him with more time. Once as fat Buu and once as kid Buu. They were each close to if not a little higher than Goku's power level.

Goku believed that he could have defeated Pure Buu but later retracts this statement when he realizes that Super Saiyan 3 is too difficult to maintain in the world of the living.

Again, if by energy attacks affecting him you mean would a kamehameha hurt him then the answer is yes it would. Goku claimed he could have beaten him on his own. Fat Buu literally got beat to near death by kid buu (and Beerus), and Vegito nearly beat Buuhan to death.

Goku required time to charge a fully powered Kamehameha at full power. Doing so would result in every cell in his body being destroyed. Anything less doesn't work because Majin Buu can recover instantaneously with no loss of Ki.

Fat Buu literally got beat to near death by kid buu (and Beerus), and Vegito nearly beat Buuhan to death.

It was stated in the Japanese Manga that a Majin can only lose power if they fight against another Majin.

Vegito nearly beat Buuhan to death.

In the Japanese Manga it is never stated that Buuhan's Ki ever decreased, no once.

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#23 Posted by JohnCena69swag (3803 posts) - - Show Bio

@seywhat:

In the Japanese Manga Super Buu states that he was planning Gohan's defeat long before he showed up. So your first comment is debunked.

I suppose you're referring to this? He never said he was planning for Gohan's defeat, nor did he ever imply anywhere that he wasn't taking ssj3 Gotenks seriously.

No Caption Provided

Goku was using Instant Transmission during his battle with Cell, there is no reason to believe that Cell didn't pick up on it beforehand, he just had no reason to use it up until he was stuck in the world of the dead

Whether this is true or not is irrelevant. I just wanted to make sure you knew Cell had IT and it wasn't just pre-namek skills as you stated.

Despite being behind Cell in both power and speed, Goku nearly emerged victorious due to his fighting instincts and capability of adapting to any situation.

1. Cell was supressed.

2. Goku did not nearly emerge victorious lol. He had one trick and after it didn't work he handed it off to Gohan.

Cell does not have the combined hand to hand fighting capabilities of all the fighters that you listed, he merely has their biological capabilities and techniques. His own efficiency in hand to hand combat is tailored towards his own experiences.

Not really what I said at all but ok.

I am ignoring your last two statements because I do not know what you are commenting on. You failed to include it in a quote.

Erm... that's cool I guess... One bullet point for each bullet point I quoted. I didn't think it was that hard to follow.

Fat Buu instantly learned Vegeta's Ki attacks and Goku's Kamehameha, even after only seeing it once.

That's all he ever learned. Just the kamehameha and how to spam ki blasts like Vegeta. He witnessed a ton more and never picked up on them.

Sensing power levels isn't a technique that can be show-cased for him to learn. You are grasping at straws with this one.

It was for Vegeta lol. Guess Vegeta is just a better fighter than Buu.

Incorrect.

Pure Buu's regeneration abilities are far superior to any other version of Majin Buu. He recovered instantaneously from every attack within the Japanese Manga, and as a result, his regeneration capabilities are far superior to Cells by default.

It takes him until 2 pages later to come back from this. That's not instantaneous. Besides, there is absolutely no reason to believe that his regeneration works any differently than the other two. He just never had an opponent overwhelm him in the same way as the other two.

No Caption Provided

Goku believed that he could have defeated Pure Buu but later retracts this statement when he realizes that Super Saiyan 3 is too difficult to maintain in the world of the living.

At least you agree with me. Like I said, Goku at a somewhat equal level of power could have beaten him if not for the difference in stamina. Cell at equal power levels would not have the same issue.

It was stated in the Japanese Manga that a Majin can only lose power if they fight against another Majin.

That is not at all what the manga said. It said that that he can get hurt from fighting another buu. What we have here is "If buu fights buu then buu gets hurt" not "If and only if ..." The difference is that there are other options, just as the series has told us and outright shown us on numerous occasions.

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No Caption Provided

In the Japanese Manga it is never stated that Buuhan's Ki ever decreased, no once.

It also never explicitly said the earth was round but if we see it enough times we may be able to pick up on it. You can actually see in the last scan I posted that Buuhan is visibly hurt and is struggling to heal himself.

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#24 Posted by LE0NHART (2063 posts) - - Show Bio

Super 17 is stronger

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#25 Edited by RukelnikovFTW (6131 posts) - - Show Bio

@le0nhart said:

Super 17 is stronger

Becuase of the energy absorption? IDK... I would put Cell above him because of summons and regen

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#26 Posted by Sam90A (222 posts) - - Show Bio

@subbat321: Forget cell for now. I do not think for 1% cell has chance against goku now. If goku sneezes cell disappears. He was at SSJ1 level when goku just newly started controlling SSJ. Then after many more years of fight. Even buu can defeat cell without problem.

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#27 Posted by RukelnikovFTW (6131 posts) - - Show Bio

@sam90a said:

@subbat321: Forget cell for now. I do not think for 1% cell has chance against goku now. If goku sneezes cell disappears. He was at SSJ1 level when goku just newly started controlling SSJ. Then after many more years of fight. Even buu can defeat cell without problem.

Its stats equalized

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#28 Posted by Kute (1772 posts) - - Show Bio

being able to pump out a team of 80%'ish fighters is kind of op

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#29 Edited by LE0NHART (2063 posts) - - Show Bio

@le0nhart said:

Super 17 is stronger

Becuase of the energy absorption? IDK... I would put Cell above him because of summons and regen

Once 17 absorbs a few ki blasts, it's game over

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#30 Posted by Gaoron (8325 posts) - - Show Bio

Hit should be the strongest with time stop, phasing and ability to grew stronger mid battle but he doesnt have counter for high regen like Buu have. So the strongest would be Buu, Beerus with hakai and sealing or angels but we never saw their full potential.

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#31 Posted by RukelnikovFTW (6131 posts) - - Show Bio

@le0nhart said:
@rukelnikovftw said:
@le0nhart said:

Super 17 is stronger

Becuase of the energy absorption? IDK... I would put Cell above him because of summons and regen

Once 17 absorbs a few ki blasts, it's game over

I dont think a few ki blasts will give him enough stats to put down Cell for good, much less Buu. And of course Zamasu is immortal...

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#32 Edited by LE0NHART (2063 posts) - - Show Bio

@rukelnikovftw said:
@le0nhart said:
@rukelnikovftw said:
@le0nhart said:

Super 17 is stronger

Becuase of the energy absorption? IDK... I would put Cell above him because of summons and regen

Once 17 absorbs a few ki blasts, it's game over

I dont think a few ki blasts will give him enough stats to put down Cell for good, much less Buu. And of course Zamasu is immortal...

Cell's regen uses Ki, 17 is an android and will not run out of ki, and Cell will at least throw a few stolen signature moves, so 17 will easily take this, same applies to Buu and even Zamasu, he won't be able to finish Zamasu though, but that doesn't matter lol

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#33 Posted by RukelnikovFTW (6131 posts) - - Show Bio

@le0nhart said:
@rukelnikovftw said:
@le0nhart said:
@rukelnikovftw said:
@le0nhart said:

Super 17 is stronger

Becuase of the energy absorption? IDK... I would put Cell above him because of summons and regen

Once 17 absorbs a few ki blasts, it's game over

I dont think a few ki blasts will give him enough stats to put down Cell for good, much less Buu. And of course Zamasu is immortal...

Cell's regen uses Ki, 17 is an android and will not run out of ki, and Cell will at least throw a few stolen signature moves, so 17 will easily take this, same applies to Buu and even Zamasu, he won't be able to finish Zamasu though, but that doesn't matter lol

How will he beat Buu exactly? By hitting? Buu doesn't tire unless fighting another Buu

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#34 Posted by Exodus101 (10 posts) - - Show Bio

@seywhat:

In the Japanese Manga Super Buu states that he was planning Gohan's defeat long before he showed up. So your first comment is debunked.

I suppose you're referring to this? He never said he was planning for Gohan's defeat, nor did he ever imply anywhere that he wasn't taking ssj3 Gotenks seriously.

No Caption Provided

Goku was using Instant Transmission during his battle with Cell, there is no reason to believe that Cell didn't pick up on it beforehand, he just had no reason to use it up until he was stuck in the world of the dead

Whether this is true or not is irrelevant. I just wanted to make sure you knew Cell had IT and it wasn't just pre-namek skills as you stated.

Despite being behind Cell in both power and speed, Goku nearly emerged victorious due to his fighting instincts and capability of adapting to any situation.

1. Cell was supressed.

2. Goku did not nearly emerge victorious lol. He had one trick and after it didn't work he handed it off to Gohan.

Cell does not have the combined hand to hand fighting capabilities of all the fighters that you listed, he merely has their biological capabilities and techniques. His own efficiency in hand to hand combat is tailored towards his own experiences.

Not really what I said at all but ok.

I am ignoring your last two statements because I do not know what you are commenting on. You failed to include it in a quote.

Erm... that's cool I guess... One bullet point for each bullet point I quoted. I didn't think it was that hard to follow.

Fat Buu instantly learned Vegeta's Ki attacks and Goku's Kamehameha, even after only seeing it once.

That's all he ever learned. Just the kamehameha and how to spam ki blasts like Vegeta. He witnessed a ton more and never picked up on them.

Sensing power levels isn't a technique that can be show-cased for him to learn. You are grasping at straws with this one.

It was for Vegeta lol. Guess Vegeta is just a better fighter than Buu.

Incorrect.

Pure Buu's regeneration abilities are far superior to any other version of Majin Buu. He recovered instantaneously from every attack within the Japanese Manga, and as a result, his regeneration capabilities are far superior to Cells by default.

It takes him until 2 pages later to come back from this. That's not instantaneous. Besides, there is absolutely no reason to believe that his regeneration works any differently than the other two. He just never had an opponent overwhelm him in the same way as the other two.

No Caption Provided

Goku believed that he could have defeated Pure Buu but later retracts this statement when he realizes that Super Saiyan 3 is too difficult to maintain in the world of the living.

At least you agree with me. Like I said, Goku at a somewhat equal level of power could have beaten him if not for the difference in stamina. Cell at equal power levels would not have the same issue.

It was stated in the Japanese Manga that a Majin can only lose power if they fight against another Majin.

That is not at all what the manga said. It said that that he can get hurt from fighting another buu. What we have here is "If buu fights buu then buu gets hurt" not "If and only if ..." The difference is that there are other options, just as the series has told us and outright shown us on numerous occasions.

No Caption Provided
No Caption Provided

In the Japanese Manga it is never stated that Buuhan's Ki ever decreased, no once.

It also never explicitly said the earth was round but if we see it enough times we may be able to pick up on it. You can actually see in the last scan I posted that Buuhan is visibly hurt and is struggling to heal himself.

I suppose you're referring to this? He never said he was planning for Gohan's defeat, nor did he ever imply anywhere that he wasn't taking ssj3 Gotenks seriously.

Wrong:

Chapter: 499 (DBZ 305), P12.2-4

Gohan: “…That was dirty, you bastard…You ingested the two of them into yourself…”

Boo: “It’s your fault. You were stronger than I, who should have been the absolute strongest…When I sensed your distant presence, I started up on this strategy…In case maybe, just maybe, there was anyone stronger than myself…Then I hit upon it: if I absorbed that ‘Super Gotenks’ squirt I was fighting at the time, then no matter what kind of guy appeared, my throne as the strongest would not be shaken…”

Whether this is true or not is irrelevant. I just wanted to make sure you knew Cell had IT and it wasn't just pre-namek skills as you stated.

IT wouldn't do anything. The second Cell uses it Majin Buu would make it his own technique.

1. Cell was supressed.

Cell was stronger and faster than Goku and Goku still bested him:

Chapter: 402 (DBZ 208), P10.1

Vegeta: “It drives me crazy, but I’ll admit it…Despite doing all that special training, I didn’t surpass Kakarot…Th-that bastard’s a genius…But Cell is 1 or 2 steps above even him…”

2. Goku did not nearly emerge victorious lol. He had one trick and after it didn't work he handed it off to Gohan.

Goku bested Cell during their first bout. Without regeneration Cell would have lost.

Not really what I said at all but ok.

You said that Cell was as good at fighting as all the other fighters combined, Lol. He isn't.

That's all he ever learned. Just the kamehameha and how to spam ki blasts like Vegeta. He witnessed a ton more and never picked up on them.

Wrong. Pure Buu learned Kibitoshin's teleportation technique after only seeing it once, he also learned Goku's Kamehameha a second time after only seeing it once.

It was for Vegeta lol. Guess Vegeta is just a better fighter than Buu.

Being able to sense power levels has no correlation towards someone's fighting technique.

It takes him until 2 pages later to come back from this. That's not instantaneous. Besides, there is absolutely no reason to believe that his regeneration works any differently than the other two. He just never had an opponent overwhelm him in the same way as the other two.

Incorrect.

Fat Buu took a lot of time to regenerate from Majin Vegeta's self destruction attack.

Super Buu took a lot of time to regeneration from Gotenks' Super Ghost Kamikaze attack.

Meanwhile Pure Buu instantly recovers from Goku's Kamehameha technique as soon as Goku drops his arms after finishing the blast.

At least you agree with me. Like I said, Goku at a somewhat equal level of power could have beaten him if not for the difference in stamina. Cell at equal power levels would not have the same issue.

Despite being stronger and faster than Goku, Cell was overwhelmed, and had he not had his regeneration ability to save his ass, he would have died. Therefore, Goku is a better fighter than Cell is. Even without an issue of stamina, Cell wouldn't have the experience needed to finish Majin Buu since he really knows nothing about him.

That is not at all what the manga said. It said that that he can get hurt from fighting another buu. What we have here is "If buu fights buu then buu gets hurt" not "If and only if ..." The difference is that there are other options, just as the series has told us and outright shown us on numerous occasions.

Please list a Japanese quote where it is stated that Majin Buu's Ki decreased from fighting anybody but another Majin Buu, otherwise you are simply incorrect.

It also never explicitly said the earth was round but if we see it enough times we may be able to pick up on it. You can actually see in the last scan I posted that Buuhan is visibly hurt and is struggling to heal himself.

Majin Buu has been visibly battle damaged on several occasions but his Ki never actually decreases, unless he fights against another Majin Buu. You're reaching at straws.

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#35 Edited by Psy4 (320 posts) - - Show Bio

First fact, Pure Buu is superior to Cell. Period. They are different classes of creature even with stats equalized.

However, Perfect Cell is the most powerful purely organic individual they've ever fought. By this I mean a living creature constrained by organic life requirements like most animals and the Z fighters themselves.

  • Unrivaled survivability for any living creature:
    • Highest durability at the time. He could tank quite a bit like no other creature ever had.
    • Powerful and complete regenerative ability. The only way to kill him was to eradicate him in totality.
    • Massive vitality to survive in any environment including space like Frieza could and inability to die even when reduced to a single clump of cells. (Vitality is an important aspect to mention because while Piccolo is the source of that regenerative ability, he lacks the ability to survive such grievous bodily harm, like Frieza is able to, long enough for the regeneration to works its magic. Frieza is the opposite, he has the exceptional cellular vitality and energy to continue living after catastrophic injury but not the ability to regenerate lost tissue. Cell has both.)
  • Unceasing power source and rose above the need for sustenance. Once he had absorbed the two androids his nutritional energy requirements outright disappeared. This was the first time he really rose above an organic organism's constraints and what really pushed him towards the undefeatable end. With limited energy even his regeneration and vitality didn't matter if he didn't keep eating/absorbing to maintain those powers. If more organic androids with power sources like 17 and 18 had been made by Dr Gero, it's quite possible that Cell could have continued to rise in power.
  • Highly intelligent. He was also quite the genius and capable of rapidly learning and using new abilities.

Buu was a magic mass with inexhaustible power so he's not even comparable to organic entities like the Z fighters, saiyans, Frieza etc because he lives above the constraints that most living things are bound by. You couldn't exhaust his energy nor could he be killed through obliteration. Literally the only way his evil side (Kid/Pure Buu) was defeated was by purification from the global spirit bomb and obviously it's fair to assume that gods like Beerus can press the delete button and destroy even his magic existence at a fundamental level, I reckon even Goku/Vegeta's godly ki can now actually hurt and make short work of him too since it is now at a higher level of existence. I never put Cell and Buu in the same category for those reasons alone. I don't hold it against Cell for not being able to defeat Buu. No living creature alone can. He's still my favourite villain.

After Buu came gods. Again, they live in another tier compared to living beings so I maintain Cell as the strongest purely organic creature ever to test the Z fighters.

In fact that's what the Z fighters struggle with the most. Opponents with unyielding power that live outside their own constraints.

  • Frieza was just so much higher in every aspect/stat than any earthling at the time.
  • Cell had unlimited energy and higher output as well as unfairly powerful survivability as mentioned above.
  • Buu was an unceasing magic mass of goop that couldn't be killed or exhausted by any typical worldly or physical means.
  • The gods like Beerus don't even have ki that they could initially sense and are just a tier(s) above in quality.

Z fighters on the other hand, need food and rest or senzu after using two or three big attacks or getting hit by a big attack. Sucks to be a living thing that needs to rest and heal haha.

TL;DR. Stats equalized, against any other organic being Perfect Cell is absolutely superior due to his combination of abilities and unlimited ki generation. Once you go to magic (Buu) and beyond though there is no way for him to end a fight. Even if he can regenerate ceaselessly he'll just be in a war of attrition forever.

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#36 Posted by RukelnikovFTW (6131 posts) - - Show Bio

@psy4: You are probably forgetting Frieza... even first form could be arguably at or above SPC

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#37 Posted by LordWhiskers (731 posts) - - Show Bio

Buu

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#38 Posted by dbzaota482 (534 posts) - - Show Bio

Majin Boo is stronger.

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#39 Posted by Bardock52 (262 posts) - - Show Bio

Cell has the most POTENTIAL,but if he DOES return (cuz MONEY) he'll never train...