Tsuna vs Adult Gon

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BoltDDarkKing

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No prep time

Kite and Kyoko are at stake

They are both at full power Natsu is in E.N.D mode and Tsuna is using Oath Flame mode

Victory is attained by complete Subgujation, Death or K.O

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BoltDDarkKing

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Nen and Dying will, will be considered as parallel abilities, so tsuna does automatically die from being in contact with nen

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ProfessorRespect

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wrong thread

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Streak619

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The Kengan's Ashura: Tokita Ohma

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Ohma, the protagonist of Kengan Ashura, a martial arts centric shounen manga. The best part about Kengan Ashura is its detailed, various and creative take on martial arts as well as h2h fights. This obviously makes for great skill and Sandrovich, the author, is no slouch either. I requested for this match as I thought it would be quite the interesting debate and by the time I'm done, you should see why.

Now, Ohma practises a martial art called Niko style. An extremely effective and OP martial art that occasionally borders on hax. Niko style consists of 4 "katas", which are 4 types of skill that culminates to the entire style. You'll be gaining an understanding on all of them as we delve into them one by one.

Personally I'm extremely hyped for this match, hope you enjoy reading my opener as much as I enjoyed writing it

Spoilers if you're not updated.

Foundations and elaborations: General skill

Unfortunately, Ohma isn't a simplistic character. His skill is multi-faceted and multi-variabled. I can't be short and sweet while going deep into Ohma's skill simultaneously. For now, perhaps I'll begin by establishing the basics to dump on you the big guns further down the post.

Laying out general groundwork:

I point you in the direction of the first Kengan match that Ohma participated in chapter four, against Rihito. Despite being utterly fodder compared to the top tiers at that time, this battle between two fodder characters was still at an extremely high level, such that as soon as the match began we see what would otherwise be a normal scene actually be revealed to be indirect and passive psychological battle;

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Capable of keenly observing and processing body language to infer the absolute ideal moment for attack even before the match actually even began, while they were trash talking each other. As the fight began, we see him dominating Rihito despite the latter being quite skilled himself as well as being a tier above Ohma in stats. Demonstrating that even the fodderest versions of him are capable of extremely high level psychological analysis and engagement, as well casually overcompensating for for the stat disadvantage against quite skilled opponents with pure technical skill.

In the next immediate fight, we see Ohma being completely blinded by poison as well as being utterly disoriented due to high frequency noises that messed with his brain. However Ohma overcomes these obstacles by singularly focusing on the sounds of his opponents' movements and shutting out all other sounds from his mind and fighting purely with his ears, to then begin dominating him by estimating all his movements just from sound alone. In the same fight, it was noted that his opponent went through the trouble of poisoning his eyes because Ohma's vision was godly, capable of seeing the flow of power in a person's movements;

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Kengan Ashura chapter 11
Kengan Ashura chapter 11

From the flow of power, Ohma's eyes allow him to predict the movements of his opponents accurately to upto one move based on the flow of power, as was confirmed by the author. In addition possessing precog however, Ohma also has Ultra Instinct, something he achieved with concentrated and sheer mentral training;

Kengan Ashura chapter 117
Kengan Ashura chapter 117

Possessing both, an immense amount of insight into his opponents' movements as well as the ability to move without thinking, Ohma most certainly has a solid and drastic reaction speed and overall maneuvering advantage against Mori, while also being an incredble boost to both offense and defense. Not only does Ohma have a high technical skill, but he also fights with efficiency and adaptability with the prime core of his fighting style.

It should be noted, that unlike most shounens, Kengan Ashura stresses application of skill being just as much, if not more, important as skill itself. This is demonstrated in his fight against Raian as well. Initially, Ohma's skill, though quite high level was scarcely effective against Raian, however later on as he regains his memories of him in his prime, we see him become an entirely different person in his fighting, something Raian himself notices this, and comments as much;

Kengan Ashura chapter 135
Kengan Ashura chapter 135

So while Ohma's skills themselves are really incredible, his application is so great that it couldn't be compared to even his half decent previous self(which was still really impressive in and of itself. Ohma also remembered to always make his rythm irregular and ever changing to make them much harder to predict, while also making sure to not let attacks go to waste.

With this, I should have given you a basic, general idea of what Ohma is like. Without further ado; let's finally delve into why Ohma beats the snot out of Mori;

The big guns

In this section, I'm actually going to be talking about the Niko style, something I avoided doing to the best of my abilities in the previous section. The Niko style is the biggest contributer to Ohma's skill. The Niko style is an incredible versatile style that include all manners of actions and movements that can be used in battle. In this section we'll be going through all of them to a decent amount of detail and depth. Without further ado;

Maneuvering and footwork:

In Kengan, the effect and importance of maneuvering is honestly ridiculous, such that good footwork is on an entirely different level to someone with inefficient footwork, causing substantially large differences in effective speed as well as effective output. This is succinctly demonstrated to us when Koga comes across a thug with bad footwork, after having mastered elementary footwork/maneuvering himself, and is now able to casually troll him;

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Kengan Omega chapter 28
Kengan Omega chapter 28

While noting how he used to be like the thug just a while ago himself. However, Ohma is on an entirely different level of ridiculousness altogether;

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Kengan Ashura chapter 59
Kengan Ashura chapter 59

Ohma's footwork is so fancily good that he can create blurry after images all around his opponent as visible above, with pure skill alone. Flame Kata: Flashfire was stated to be far superior his Inaba's maneuvering, which is pretty insane because Inaba's maneuvering was good enough to close the vast speed gap between them, while also being extremely agile and unpredictable. This clearly illustrates how Ohma is capable of closing a massive, massive speed gap with pure technical skill alone, should there exist one and would also utterly dominate someone with equal speed as him, who cannot compensate for Ohma's maneuvering in anyway.

Full contact/Grappling/Close quarters combat:

I'm going to be talking about Ohma's engagement in full contact combat where opponent's are at the closest range possible and are often physically in contact with each other. This is another area where Ohma is incredibly amazing at, largely because the last 2 remaining katas have a lot to do with this range. And one of them is entirely dedicated to grappling. Without further ado, introducing to you the Water kata;

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The water kata is a collection of soft techniques that are counter striking based and rely on grappling, holds and throws to deal damage than striking like Adamantine kata mostly does. Over the course of the series we see a lot of versatility in the maneuvers that the water kata allows for. To briefly demonstrate several;

  • Scan 1-2: Water kata: Jellyfish Hold, meant to crush the throat and carotid arteries with one's muscles and put their bodies in a helpless positions
  • Scan 3-4: Water Dragon's Vein, meant to snap the spine and KO the target after 7 seconds of no blood flow to the brain.
  • Scan 5: Guillotine, crush the victim's throat and arteries while putting them in a position unable to do anything.
  • Scan 6: Seagrass Hold, meant to intercept weapons and strikes with one arm while leaving the other feee for striking

There are several moves that would capacitate their opponents, especially if the opponents are weaker. It should be noted, that Ohma can use his grappling along with Admantine Kata: Iron Finger for holds as well, like so;

Breaking stuff by applying Adamatine kata at the point of contact. Extremely brutal and effective when used in combination with the Water kata, it was an elementary combination of these that allowed Ohma to beat the best grappler in the world, someone who would be heads and shoulders above anybody else in this regard with some crazy stuff going on for him.

However this still isn't everything, not even the best of what Ohma has to offer. I present to you, the final kata and Ohma's personal forte;

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Now, as for what Redirection actually is? Redirection kata is a collection of formless movements used to redirect the flow of power. Atleast that is the basic application. A clear demonstration of what that looks like would be well demonstrated in Ohma's fight against Rihito;

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When in contact, Ohma is capable of completely throwing off a person's flow of power by applying a few milligrams of weight in the right place, direction and time in order to completely send their motions berserk. He can do this repeatedly in rapid succession and with casual ease. Once you're off-balance and flying all over the place he could swoop in with any of the other katas, including Water kata's grappling and finish his opponent off.

But Ohma can step it up a notch, should he want to. Instead of simply throwing Mori's flow of power berserk, he can use it against Mori to deal damage;

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Kengan Ashura chapter 1
Kengan Ashura chapter 1

And note, this is also the worst version of Ohma in technical skill as well as application, drastically inferior to EoS Ohma. In summary, Ohma is such a freaking monster when it comes to super close quarters that even so much as touching is an extreme blunder of an idea unless you're a crazy grappling god yourself. It should be noted, at this point, that Elektra seems to be primarily a striker and not grappler, she definitely loses to Ohma in this regard.

Conclusion

Don't know much about Elektra but simply based off of the equal stats condition, I can say;

  • Ohma is capable oneshotting Elektra with Adamantine kata, since it increases his effective striking to a whole nother level, while his raw stats, the power of his muscles remains the same.
  • Ohma is capable of blitzing Elektra and casually avoiding all of her strikes with flame kata, Ultra Instinct and FoP based precog.
  • Ohma is capable of no-selling Elektra's blows with adamantine jata as nobody with his normal striking power can put a scratch on him while he uses Adamantine kata.
  • I doubt Elektra has grappling feats as good as Ohma so Ohma will likely dominate her with water and redirection if she tries getting into full contact wrestling or even otherwise. Redirection flip with some brutal neck or spine snap should do the trick, or redirection into a dislocation.

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defiant_will

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huh?

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Edgelord91

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Interesting

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Co-Boss

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#7  Edited By Co-Boss

This thread is gon vs Tsuna, the rules has Natsu in it and someone posted their tokita CAV post in here

wild

Oh and its also a battle in contests

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Bink_69

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I just stumbled upon this thread and have never been more confused ever.

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rawsos

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Foodtastegood

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Tsuna and Gon aren’t in the same verse, Nen wouldn’t affect Tsuna at all.

Anyways, Tsuna blitz Gon with his superior speed and strength.

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DRdaddy

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Isn't tsuna like the strongest anime fire user? At least that is what I've heard

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Lilbroomstick

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lol what is this thread?

OT: Tsuna washes with ease

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exauce

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@drdaddy said:

Isn't tsuna like the strongest anime fire user? At least that is what I've heard

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CocaColaMan

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This is great

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Koays

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E!

Now before i reply, i need to say that...everyone is entitled to their opinion.

But as I say that I think you need to really ask yourself: Is it worth the time and energy that you put into it?

Now-

While your not wrong that the current Omega list is an awkward fit for Jean that doesn't address things like Nate and Cable.....your argument is also filled with a major inaccuracy: Jean wasn't Phoenix when the term Omega Level was invented.

This actually hits at a larger problem with your beef. Your going out of your way to make Jean the problem.

I mean your mad about Jean and Cyclops having character arcs in the 90s about them....but not about Rogue and Gambit dragging out their "will they/won't they/Ooops she's banging Joseph" love triangle?

Not mad at Angel literally stealing screentime being a poor excuse for an edge lord?

Not mad at Jubilee spinning off into her own book where she arguably isn't in the top 5 in terms of interesting characters?

Not mad at Wolverine for literally doing absolutely nothing to advance his own character or to express a personality beyond "growl berserker" for almost 10 years straight in the 90s main series books?

I'm not saying your wrong, it just seems like you picked one person you didn't like already and decided to focus ALOT of energy on that.

************************************************************************

Being objective, even though i LOVE everything to do with the Summers/Grey arcs in the early 90s. I can see why if it's not your thing it would bug you.

But look a it from my perspective. I personally think Storm is one of the worst parts of Claremont's X-Men run.

She is a Mary Sue in the worst possible way with her 7 different backstories that don't contribute anything to her character in the present. Is hailed for her leadership in this Era despite the fact that she flat out LOST like 7 different teammates and didn't bother to look for them. Has the worst writing for dialogue in the 80s. And headlines the most boring part of Claremonts run during the late 80s.

And this only got worse because everytime Claremont touches her he has to bend over backwards to make characters bow down to her to make her seem more interesting. BISHOP's most frequent role on teams seems to be as Storm's yes man, to the point that he doesn't fit well on any team roster without her.

My real belief though is that if Storm continued being written in the 90s the way she was written in the 80s she would be hated. Because Her character's shallowness was beginning to peak through...

This bugs me as an X-Men fan because Claremont's Storm is so revered but in context doesn't really earn her growth or infamy.....but that's just a critical observation.

I'm not going to up end my life because during maybe 2 eras she's becomes a Mary Sue and people clap for it.

********************************************************************

Now when it comes to your statistics.....your not really proving anything.

The Phoenix Saga is more popular then ANY X-Men character barring Captain Canada Claws .

It is one of the highest selling Storylines in comic history.....the idea that your trying to say that adaptations of that saga were brought down because movies go-ers were "tired of Jean"....and not because those movies are some of the worst written and Superhero movies of their time....that's nutso.

I get it, Storm is popular and you'd like to see more of her then you are.....but that crap doesn't have nearly as much to do with Jean as you make it out to.

She was given the best story arc she'd had since the Phoenix Saga....an then they killed her and kept her dead for almost 15 years......but some how she was in Storms way?

Dude....I'm a Rachel Grey fan. Every 10 years she gets weaker and less competent and loses screen time to creators pets and assclowns like Quire and Fantomex.

That doesn't mean I don't want to see any other characters get shine or that everything needs to stop so that Rachel can get her turn.... I'm not gonna start hating everyone who gets attention who isn't her.

It f%$@ing franchise, eventually it's gonna be someone elses turn to shine!

*********************************************************************************************

If Storm wants to be "Queen of the X-Men", she has to get around Jean, Rogue and Emma...who despite all of your love, have just as much right to that title do to their popularity at their peaks and relevance in the fandom.

But whining and stalking this character and trying to downplay everything they've ever done, everything that's ever been said, and everything that's ever been interesting about them.....that's where you lose credibility.

You have an agenda. And unfortunately it makes it so that nothing you say can be taken seriously because you've spent too long hating something to even know how to do something different. There is no point in having a discourse with you because a discourse requires an exchange of information...you dont want to receive anything new or to be moved in your ideas....it's kinda disgusting that you are dug in this deep with this much unflinching dedication, and yet all that energy is being used to be mad at a drawing in a comicbook.

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Earendill

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#17  Edited By Earendill

Tsuna is a very strong character with city-level feats and a few times faster than the speed of light. This is massive mismatch.

Really, isn't HxH characters as strong as like Avatar or FMA characters? Compare them with these two series characters.

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deactivated-5f3e77b525b0a

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Lmao.

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deactivated-5f3e77b525b0a

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Haha.

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peyef87634

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https://facebook.com/events/1299298860418380/

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https://facebook.com/events/344655140129777/

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finalbeta

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@foodtastegood:

I wonder how nen would work in other verses. I think for sure enhancement would still work out since it's just about powering themselves.

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peyef87634

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peyef87634

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https://www.dailymotion.com/video/x7xh6zp