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#1 Posted by VineC1993 (230 posts) - - Show Bio
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#2 Posted by JOVIOLMA (7095 posts) - - Show Bio

D4mn, I was about to make this thread.

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#3 Posted by VineC1993 (230 posts) - - Show Bio
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#4 Posted by InvadedTBD (1705 posts) - - Show Bio

Probably Ichibe, because his hax is super broken.

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#5 Posted by Consciouskeeper (2594 posts) - - Show Bio

Ichibe his showing vs ywach was better although I think it is implied yamamoto put ywach down at some point earlier in the lore.

I could be remembering things wrong though but yamamoto not having his Bankai really nerfed him

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#6 Posted by BrownZeus (980 posts) - - Show Bio

Ichibei without question 10/10, Yamamoto has great attack potency but Ichibei can literally just neutralize anything his ink touches or that has "darkness". Ichibei's power is fundamentally on another level and the only way I see Yamamoto winning is Ichibei allowing Yamamoto to win.

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#7 Edited by PhantomRant (1435 posts) - - Show Bio

Note: Remember when Yhwach fought Ichibei, he had already absorbed the souls of a dozen more Sternritters who died since he fought Yamamoto along with fragments of his own soul. Strongest he absorbed were people like Gremmy and Royd Llyod. That means he was much stronger.

Speed: Ichibei is much faster based on his 1000 Ri feat and matching Yhwach's speed who blitzed Yamamoto twice.

Physical Strength/hakuda: Ichibei is much stronger based on how he smacked a half-powered Yhwach 1000 Ri away (1000 Ri = 3927 km = Continental distance), then crushed his reishi attack with his palm, chopped through Blut Vene Anhaben with the help of a Hidden Hado, and then flexed his arm so hard that it overpowered Blut Vene and broke Yhwach's face.

Reiatsu: Ichibei doesn't really have reiatsu feats, but his physical stats should tell you that he's not weaker than Yamamoto in that regard.

Durability: ichibei's durability is proportional to his physical strength, and he could crush Yhwach's reishi with no injury and resist Anhaben.

Endurance: Ichibei's endurance isn't any less than Yamamoto, since he took being stabbed by Almighty Yhwach's sword (that one-shotted Yamamoto) and could still fight on.

Kido: Ichibei's Kido prowess is superior to Yamamoto because of 1000 Ri Palm and Hado chop, the latter of which broke Yhwach's strongest defense while Aizen tanked Yamamoto's forbidden Hado.

Zanjutsu: Ichibei doesn't use a sword, but his cqc skill isn't any less than Yamamoto since he was trading blows with a much stronger Yhwach.

Zanpakuto: Ichibei wins because his hax outclasses Yamamoto's raw power. Even in its sealed state, Ichimonji can create barriers and cut names. In Shikai, Ichibei can control all the black in the world and turn it into its ink weapon. Since Yamamoto wears a black kosode, all Ichibei has to do is pull out the black on his clothes like he did with Yhwach and instantly drench Yamamoto and his zanpakuto in it. Since black is just a color it cannot be burned away (and it's immune to Zanka no Tachi heat anyway). Ichibei can also use Futen Taisatsuryō.

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#8 Posted by KingGuinness (1916 posts) - - Show Bio

Ichibe quite decisively. Superior stats + Ichimonji = GG.

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#9 Posted by ourmanuel (12308 posts) - - Show Bio

Ichibe slaps him to another continent

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#10 Posted by diydeath (2554 posts) - - Show Bio

Ichibei decisively. If Yana's bankai even looks like a threat Ichibei will just use his bankai.

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#11 Posted by Earendill (1367 posts) - - Show Bio

Ichibei wins.

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#12 Posted by TheVivas (19582 posts) - - Show Bio

Ichibei.

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#13 Posted by VineC1993 (230 posts) - - Show Bio

Looks like I made a mismatch

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#14 Posted by Thoromdil (1887 posts) - - Show Bio

Yamamoto stomps. People who think Ichibe is stronger are just wanking. First it's a common missconception that Ichibe is the strongest shinigami. Actually, Yamamoto IS the strongest and this much was made clear.

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Next, Ichibe participated in 1 fight and won a total of 0 fights in Bleach. Yamamoto has a few arcs, manga chapters and fillers worth of great feats including many spectacular wins.

Because of that Yamamoto has very well rounded and well GROUNDED stats.

We know his physicals are absolutely monstrous (can shatter a high tier arrancar level soul with one H2H technique)

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We know he has so much spirit energy that even without going into shikai he is passively reiatsu-crushing vice captain level shinigamis around him.

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We know he is one of the fastest characters in the series, much faster then the likes of Kyoraku.

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We know he is a high tier kidou master

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we know he is so durable he can tank his own multi-city level explosion without even being critically injured.

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What exactly do we know about Ichibe in comparison? From his one, short fight? Little to nothing that's the truth.

Even if we compare the feats they have in common, which is their showings against Yhwach, it's clear that Yamamoto did a lot better in the end.

First of all Yamamoto WON a fight against Almighty mode Yhwach in the prime and absolutely raped Lloyed version of Yhwach in his far weaker EOS version which was basically the exact same power level as regular Yhwach without the almighty. The only reason why he lost was because Yhwach used a Lloyed as a decoy, luring Yamamoto into revealing his entire bankai and then he could seal it while the decoy died in the process. If Yamamoto fought with Yhwach directly he would kill his ass, which is something Ichibe could not do. Ichibe was winning the fight against non-almighty Yhwach, but he still didn't even come close to killing him. And then when Yhwach entered almighty mode he one shot Ichibe.

So comparing their feats against Yhwach Yamamoto clearly was far more impressive.

As for their bankai powers specifically... well Yamamoto's is clearly more deadly if you ask me. He can create an army of summons, surround himself with impenetrable shield and create both short and long range attacks that literally erase anything they touch. Ichibe's bankai is much more centered around hax that required specific conditions. He can rename you and depower you, but only if you allow him to shower you with ink or straight write a new name on your body. He can control reality, but only the "darkness". Well neither will be really effective against Yamamoto. Because Yamamoto's bankai surrounds him with fire, there will be literally no darkness or shadows in direct contact with Yamamoto and because Yamamoto has range advantage he doesn't have to ever come close to Ichibe to allow him to shower him with ink or write anything on him in the first place.

In other words, Yamamoto has every advantage.

1. He has more onscreen feats and wins

2. Has high tier and well rounded stats in comparison to Ichibe's mostly unknown stats.

3. He has better showings against both Almighty and non-Almighty Yhwach if you think about it.

4. His bankai is more direct and more deadly

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#15 Posted by TheEmperor95 (1701 posts) - - Show Bio

@thoromdil: 1. Ichibei was born far before yama so his statement means nothing when he is but a child to ichibei.

2. Ichibei was sending yhwach 1000 ri with physical strength alone that's better that battering wonderweiss (which is a great feat don't get me wrong) and he did it casually multiple times

3. Yama while serious soul crushed nanao... ichibei while casual and relaxing was accidentally crushing renji and rukia.

https://www.mangareader.net/bleach/545/8

https://www.mangareader.net/bleach/545/14

4. Yhwach blitzed yama and then yhwach got blitzed by ichibei. That makes ichibei faster than yhwach

5. Yhwach didn't have the almighty in his last fight with yama. He wasn't even activated in any of the times we saw him. Not to mention the fight happened off panel so we don't even know how yama won but judging from yhwach comments on him I doubt it was a 1v1 anyway

https://www.mangareader.net/bleach/631/17

You can see the almighty not activated

https://www.mangareader.net/bleach/633/9

Even in this panel the almighty isn't active yet. He only has one set of pupils which means his eyes aren't open yet.

6. Yama was casually one shot by yhwach. A stronger yhwach was getting his attacks palmed and getting completely overpowered by ichibei.

7. Yama doesn't have better feats against yhwach???? He got one shot by him and used bankai on a regular sternritter not even an elite. Royd isn't close to yhwach in power.

8. Ichibei is zanpaktuo is much better. It can argued whether the ink will evaporate or touch yama but since it's essentially darkness that he is throwing it would still depower yama imo. Not like he needs it anyway. He can just stomp on yama and be done with him. Or slap him away 1000 ri.

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#16 Posted by TheEmperor95 (1701 posts) - - Show Bio

Ichibei stomps. The royal guard as a whole are much stronger than the entire gotei. Yama is honestly like kirinji level imo. I think he would beat kirinji in fight but he is still around that level

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#17 Posted by deactivated-5d065fa72d466 (2222 posts) - - Show Bio

Ichibei godstomps

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#18 Posted by Gilateen (4375 posts) - - Show Bio

Ichibei Stomps

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#19 Posted by GateOfBabylon (4601 posts) - - Show Bio

Ichibei easily. He fared so much better against a stronger Yhwach.

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#20 Posted by LeoTheGreatest (5029 posts) - - Show Bio

Ichibei, this should be obvious.

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#21 Posted by Herald_Gospel (21 posts) - - Show Bio
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#22 Posted by AlexTheBoss (18612 posts) - - Show Bio

Ichibei low to mid dif. The only thing he needs to watch out for is Yamamoto’s bankai, but his superior stats and hax should be enough to overcome it.

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#23 Posted by FaradaySloth (10738 posts) - - Show Bio

Ichibe mid diff

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#24 Posted by PhantomRant (1435 posts) - - Show Bio

I always inferred that Ichibei was part of the original squad. Am I wrong?

He was not. That was the theory before the second invasion, but the novels refute it. Ichibei existed before Soul Society was even formed and named everything in SS, so he would have been a Royal Guard a long time before the Gotei was formed 1000 years ago. Same for Nimaiya, both Ichibei and he were the original RG which predated the Gotei. When Ikomikidomoe attacked Soul Society millennia ago back when Yamamoto was young and there wasn't a military organization, it was Ichibei & Nimaiya that defeated it when it infiltrated the Royal Realm.

The rest of the RG did come from the original Gotei.