Avatar image for almanimecomics
#1 Posted by ALManimecomics (60 posts) - - Show Bio

Xeno Goku: http://vsbattles.wikia.com/wiki/Son_Goku_(Xeno)

No Caption Provided

Pegasus Seiya: http://vsbattles.wikia.com/wiki/Pegasus_Seiya

No Caption Provided

Rules:

  • Morals Off
  • No Prep and No Prior Knowledge
  • The fight takes place on a random planet in The Milky Way Galaxy
  • The Starting Point is 200 meters apart
  • Standard Equipment for both characters
  • Win by KO and Death but win by BFR is not allowed
  • Pegasus Seiya cannot use his Matter Manipulation Power
Avatar image for joviolma
#3 Posted by JOVIOLMA (5560 posts) - - Show Bio

Seiya blitz.

Avatar image for jman88933
#4 Posted by Jman88933 (1185 posts) - - Show Bio

"Pegasus Seiya cannot use his Matter Manipulation Power"

That's literally a key factor into how the Saint's Cosmo works but oh well, Seiya still blitzes.

Avatar image for uzuchiha
#5 Posted by UzuChiha (68 posts) - - Show Bio

@jman88933: @joviolma:

Xeno Goku is comparable to Xenoverse Vegeta who can physically fly to other timelines. So speed is not the problem

Avatar image for deactivated-5ae6527167c26
#6 Posted by deactivated-5ae6527167c26 (2058 posts) - - Show Bio

I think if you can destroy or are at a universal level and resist absolute zero. This whole "he can destroy atoms' thing is irrelevant

Avatar image for godren
#7 Posted by Godren (3652 posts) - - Show Bio

Seeing as how he is Multiversal with a vast array of hax Seiya dies to him powering up, he can even alter time or use the power of Super Shenron himself lol.

Avatar image for elderelijah190
#8 Posted by ElderElijah190 (2029 posts) - - Show Bio

Xenoverse goku stomps easily. He has basically battled outside of time and space itself,"this is a midget feat to what he has actually done" who knows what the comments here, would be like though.

Avatar image for cryomodeste
#9 Posted by CryoModeste (1344 posts) - - Show Bio

Saint

Avatar image for emanresu_20
#10 Posted by Emanresu_20 (2699 posts) - - Show Bio

@03s7:

That’s absolutley not true. Being frozen at absolute Zero is not the same thing of having your atoms destroyed. Neither is being universal level.

Seiya still wins.

Avatar image for joviolma
#11 Posted by JOVIOLMA (5560 posts) - - Show Bio

Still Seiya.

Avatar image for cerberus369616
#12 Posted by Cerberus369616 (2174 posts) - - Show Bio

isn't Xeno Goku weaker than Main Timeline Goku? If Main Timeline Goku get's bodied by Pegasus according to like 75% of the Vine how is this any different?

Avatar image for joviolma
#13 Posted by JOVIOLMA (5560 posts) - - Show Bio

isn't Xeno Goku weaker than Main Timeline Goku? If Main Timeline Goku get's bodied by Pegasus according to like 75% of the Vine how is this any different?

Well... People said that Xeno Goku is Multiversal so by logic he is stronger than MT Goku.

Avatar image for cerberus369616
#14 Posted by Cerberus369616 (2174 posts) - - Show Bio

@joviolma said:
@cerberus369616 said:

isn't Xeno Goku weaker than Main Timeline Goku? If Main Timeline Goku get's bodied by Pegasus according to like 75% of the Vine how is this any different?

Well... People said that Xeno Goku is Multiversal so by logic he is stronger than MT Goku.

Goku:Xeno lost to a Post Universe Survival Arc SSB Goku during the Prison planet Saga and even admitted Goku was a step ahead to my knowledge. So Either main Timeline Goku is also Multiversal and is being underestimated or Goku:Xeno is being over hyped.

Avatar image for joviolma
#15 Posted by JOVIOLMA (5560 posts) - - Show Bio

@cerberus369616: As far as I know SSB Goku is Multi-Galaxy or Universal. I need to read more about Xenoverse to understand that thing.

Avatar image for cerberus369616
#16 Posted by Cerberus369616 (2174 posts) - - Show Bio

@joviolma: It's in Dragon Ball heroes not Xenoverse where they fight. And i agree that Main line Goku is Universal at best, but that the point I'm making. Goku:Xeno isn't as strong as he is being construed to be unless the info I'm aware of is wrong, and that Info says Goku:Xeno is almost but not quite as strong as SSB Goku Post Universal Survival.

Avatar image for deactivated-5ae6527167c26
#17 Posted by deactivated-5ae6527167c26 (2058 posts) - - Show Bio

@emanresu_20: what are you talking about lmfao if you can survive a universe being destroyed or RESIST hakai then your atoms are going to be fine. That shit is just using scientific terms to make it sound cooler then it is. First time he did he created a small crater. Saiyans have been vaporizing cities to ashes for years.

Avatar image for emanresu_20
#18 Edited by Emanresu_20 (2699 posts) - - Show Bio

@03s7:

No that isn’t true an you clearly don’t know what it means to destroy atoms.

You’re confusing it with atomizing someone which is destroying someone to such and extent that they are nothing but atoms.

Goku reguardless of how durable he is is always going to be composed of atoms. Seiya like all other seint seiya characters have the ability to destroy atoms directly. Not separate the atoms or destroy their bonds...they destroy the Atom.

Avatar image for deactivated-5ae6527167c26
#19 Edited by deactivated-5ae6527167c26 (2058 posts) - - Show Bio

@emanresu_20: and what do you think hakai does? If you destroy a universe there aren't atoms left floating around because atoms make up a universe. You follow?

Avatar image for joviolma
#20 Posted by JOVIOLMA (5560 posts) - - Show Bio

@03s7 Did Hakai already erased a Universe ?

Avatar image for elderelijah190
#21 Posted by ElderElijah190 (2029 posts) - - Show Bio

@emanresu_20: Seiya found it hard to oneshot the mainstay by oneshotting its atom with his sole effort even though the durability of said mainstay was only universal.

Avatar image for emanresu_20
#22 Edited by Emanresu_20 (2699 posts) - - Show Bio

@03s7:

What do YOU think Hakai does? It’s never been stated to destroy someone’s atoms directly. In fact it was never made clear what Hakai does.

It depends on what you mean by destroying the universe. Destroying everything in the universe Sloar systems, Galaxies, etc. or on a reality warping scale. Neither of which Goku has tanked btw.

Avatar image for elderelijah190
#23 Posted by ElderElijah190 (2029 posts) - - Show Bio

@joviolma: It warped an infinite void from its after effects though.

Avatar image for joviolma
#24 Posted by JOVIOLMA (5560 posts) - - Show Bio

@joviolma: It warped an infinite void from its after effects though.

The WoV is not Infinite is only filled with Infinite Nothingness.

Avatar image for deactivated-5ae6527167c26
#25 Edited by deactivated-5ae6527167c26 (2058 posts) - - Show Bio

@joviolma: not saying that, I'm saying hakai is beyond destroying atoms and if you can destroy a universe its beyond destroying atoms

WOV is infinite, if it's filled with infinite space that makes it infinite in size

Avatar image for emanresu_20
#26 Posted by Emanresu_20 (2699 posts) - - Show Bio

@elderelijah190:

Everything reguarding Saint Seiya from attacks to durablility is centered around the destruction of atoms. That would me the atoms that made the main stain were just to much for Seiya to destroy.

Avatar image for deactivated-5ae6527167c26
#27 Edited by deactivated-5ae6527167c26 (2058 posts) - - Show Bio

@emanresu_20: it erases someone completely from existence(beyond atoms), and can erase souls and ghosts both are which beyond the atom spectrum

Beerus was stated to be capable of destroying a universe then it was supported via fight against Goku and Champa.

Avatar image for elderelijah190
#28 Edited by ElderElijah190 (2029 posts) - - Show Bio

@joviolma: stop contradicting what the show has specifically made clear with substantial statement. There's nothing in said space, which is why the nothingness that is independent in its size is infinite lol. Did you even read meaning to what you said? You literally said it isn't infinite because it is filled with infinite nothingness lol. You basically quoted the reason why it's infinite.

Avatar image for joviolma
#29 Posted by JOVIOLMA (5560 posts) - - Show Bio

@joviolma: stop contradicting what the show has specifically made clear with substantial statement.

The world of Void was stated to be filled with Infinite Nothingness, that was the exactly word that Beerus used, how this is contradicting anything ?

There's nothing in said space which is why the nothingness that is independent in it is infinite lol.

Don't get it.

Did you even read meaning to what you said?

Yeah

You literally said it isn't infinite because it is filled with infinite nothingness lol.

Exactly, no Matter, no Time, no Space, not sure how this is something that can be used in battles

ou basically quoted the reason why it's infinite.

Because don't have nothing ?

Avatar image for emanresu_20
#30 Edited by Emanresu_20 (2699 posts) - - Show Bio

@03s7:

1. Where was this ever stated or explained in super? Destroying ghosts and spirits isn’t destroying something on an atomic level that is an entirely different category of attack.

2. Whis also stated Beerus and Goku would die if the universe was destroyed. Not only that but the closer you were to the initial strikes the weaker the force was.

Avatar image for elderelijah190
#31 Posted by ElderElijah190 (2029 posts) - - Show Bio

@emanresu_20: The fact that he couldn't destroy the mainstay is because its atom is too durable for him to destroy. That's basically it,i don't get where the just to many is coming from considering the size of the mainstay in the first place. Dbs high tiers has tanked hakai which is an existence erasure and kept their average shape/form. This is brought about by their durability so i don't see how seiya is successfully destroying goku here.

Avatar image for deactivated-5ae6527167c26
#32 Posted by deactivated-5ae6527167c26 (2058 posts) - - Show Bio
Avatar image for emanresu_20
#33 Posted by Emanresu_20 (2699 posts) - - Show Bio

@elderelijah190:

The Mainstay has atomic resistance feats...Goku doesn’t. If seiya attacks Foku Goku’s atoms are getting destroyed because Goku doesn’t have atomic resistance feats.

Getting erased from existence is a different domain reguarding durability to begin with. Also where in Dragonball did it say Hakai erased someone from existence?

Avatar image for elderelijah190
#35 Posted by ElderElijah190 (2029 posts) - - Show Bio

@joviolma:

(The world of Void was stated to be filled with Infinite Nothingness, that was the exactly word that Beerus used, how this is contradicting anything ?)

A void means nothing to cut a long story short. You can't say the part of our universe that is filled with a void is infinite as there's a limited size for said aspects. The void which is nothing is literally the factor that was stated to be infinite. Infinite nothingness means the void that is nothing at its own ends is infinite. Take note again that if our universe was covered in a void of nothingness,it still won't be infinite considering our universe is limited to a systematic size. The fact that dbs referenced the nothingness that filled the WoV to be infinite means the WoV itself is infinite.

(Exactly, no Matter, no Time, no Space, not sure how this is somethi)

Exactly, it was filled with nothingness before toppo warped it and created the nebulae we saw. The act of it being 0d is already contradictory as GP could warp its space,matter and physics as well b4 toppo feat came to play.

Hope you got me this time.

Avatar image for joviolma
#36 Edited by JOVIOLMA (5560 posts) - - Show Bio

@elderelijah190 said:

Not sure why you don't tag me but okay

The World of Void has no stated size. It's a Dimension without matter or space-time and it's filled with infinite nothingness. Toppo's Hakai changing the background and ''possibly'' producing some stars and nebulae isn't proof for a universal feat(Ignoring that Beerus already stated in Champa's Tournament Arc that a GoD can't create nothing).

Avatar image for elderelijah190
#37 Posted by ElderElijah190 (2029 posts) - - Show Bio
Avatar image for jman88933
#38 Posted by Jman88933 (1185 posts) - - Show Bio

@elderelijah190:

"Dbs high tiers has tanked hakai which is an existence erasure and kept their average shape/form. This is brought about by their durability so i don't see how seiya is successfully destroying goku here."

I don't think tanking Hakai means that your immune to having your soul or body erased, just resistance. In fact, there's quite a few evidence showing that the power of Hakai is successful on opponents that are weaker than the user. And even taking that into account, none of that is a confirmation that Goku can defend his atoms from being harmed or destroyed. I also don't see in terms of speed how the results will change from previous threads. And I have Xenoverse lol.

Avatar image for dession_viper
#39 Posted by Dession_Viper (742 posts) - - Show Bio

Seiya wins and always will win.

Avatar image for elderelijah190
#40 Posted by ElderElijah190 (2029 posts) - - Show Bio

@emanresu_20: Mate,you don't get it do you? The factor of seiya not being able to destroy the mainstay is as a result of him not being able to destroy an infrastructure with a universal durability,that's precisely my point.

Barring hakai,vegeta earlier bypassed absolute zero for a while,he then broke free by going ssj which means he bypassed it by an increase in power level. This is an atomic level durability feat. The aspect of hakai been an existence erasure was stated by sindra when he handed over his said destruction energy to one of the assassin he sent for an assassination in universe 7.

Avatar image for joviolma
#41 Edited by JOVIOLMA (5560 posts) - - Show Bio

@emanresu_20:

Barring hakai,vegeta earlier bypassed absolute zero for a while,he then broke free by going ssj which means he bypassed it by an increase in power level. This is an atomic level durability feat.

Bypass Absolute Zero is not the same as have your atoms destroyed by sheer force, Absolute Zero is simple stop the motion of the atoms.

Avatar image for emanresu_20
#42 Edited by Emanresu_20 (2699 posts) - - Show Bio

@elderelijah190:

Your point is based off of a misconception and a lack of context for the entirety of the series. Seiya attacked it’s atoms and failed to drestroy it. Not because of its “universal durability” but because of the durability and resistance of the mainstays atoms. And once again Whis stayed Beerus would die if the universe was destroyed.

Absolute zero has nothing to do with destroying atoms. It freezes atoms together and stops them from moving. This is again your misinterpretation of what it means to destroy atoms.

Existence erasure is a reality warping feat. It’s not a physical durability feat. Neither feat goes hand and hand.

Avatar image for elderelijah190
#43 Posted by ElderElijah190 (2029 posts) - - Show Bio

@jman88933: well,saying hakai doesn't erase the body and soul from existence means you're contradicting what the show has made clear to be honest. The fact that some systematic level of tiers has bypassed it is what brings about an existence erasure resistance feat to the table of a debate. What am saying is resisting hakai is a plus 1 for those said tiers that have replicated it. Also,erasing the soul and physical body from existence means the entirety of the component that formed your being won't be in reality anymore. If your atoms are still there,you can't say such a being has been erased from existence as that part of him still exists. It's literally a factor like you weren't born in the first place.

Avatar image for elderelijah190
#44 Edited by ElderElijah190 (2029 posts) - - Show Bio

@emanresu_20: Am not on a PC right now but lets see how well i can debunk your claims to. Lets see then.....

(Your point is based off of a misconception and a lack of context for the entirety of the series. Seiya attacked it’s atoms and failed to drestroy it. Not because of its “universal durability” but because of the durability and resistance of the mainstays atoms. And once again Whis stayed Beerus would die if the universe was destroyed.)

What do you mean by lack of context smh? The Libra weapons are stated to have the potency of destroying a star not its atoms but they could still destroy the prior average pillars but failed to destroy the mainstay,this means said Libra weapons and seiya couldn't bypass its universal durability potency. Its universal durability was high end above seiyas league,which was why he couldn't destroy its atoms. My point exactly.

(Absolute zero has nothing to do with destroying atoms. It freezes atoms together and stops them from moving. This is again your misinterpretation of what it means to destroy atoms.)

Yes,it successfully stops them from moving but with an estimated time vegeta engaged in,it starts destroying your atoms. You also sound to rude for my liking.

(Existence erasure is a reality warping feat. It’s not a physical durability feat. Neither feat goes hand and hand.)

Just going to quote this again. Erasing the soul and physical body from existence means the entirety of the component that formed your being won't be in reality anymore. If your atoms are still there,you can't say such a being has been erased from existence as that part of him still exists "same could be said for electrons and neutrons as well which are smaller than atoms also." It's literally a factor like you weren't born in the first place.

Avatar image for elderelijah190
#45 Posted by ElderElijah190 (2029 posts) - - Show Bio

@joviolma:

(Bypass Absolute Zero is not the same as have your atoms destroyed by sheer force, Absolute Zero is simple stop the motion of the atoms.)

I'm currently debating this now.

Avatar image for joviolma
#46 Posted by JOVIOLMA (5560 posts) - - Show Bio

@joviolma:

(Bypass Absolute Zero is not the same as have your atoms destroyed by sheer force, Absolute Zero is simple stop the motion of the atoms.)

I'm currently debating this now.

Fair enough, good luck.

Avatar image for emanresu_20
#47 Edited by Emanresu_20 (2699 posts) - - Show Bio

@elderelijah190:

No you are still proving that you have a lack of contexts for Saint Seiya Characters. Yes they were stated to be capable of destroying stars but again Saint from the time they are trained as Bronze saint are trained to destroy atoms. The fact that you are saying they weren’t targeting atoms when destroying the pillars goes against how saints were explained to fight in the manga and anime.

Absolute Zero does not destroy your atoms that I just straight up incorrect.

And as I stated before this is reality warpsing and soul destruction. This has nothing to do with your physical durability.

So my point stands. Goku doesn’t have feats to prove he could resist having his atoms destroyed.

Avatar image for godren
#48 Posted by Godren (3652 posts) - - Show Bio

I don't think people understand how strong Xeno Goku is lol, Super Shenron is his god damn pet and he is pretty much composite Goku.

Avatar image for godren
#49 Posted by Godren (3652 posts) - - Show Bio

Goku Black in DBH by feats is stronger than canon Zeno lol.

Avatar image for uzuchiha
#50 Posted by UzuChiha (68 posts) - - Show Bio

@emanresu_20: Goku can survive atom destruction. Even Frieza could survive it. Look at that episode when an assasin from Universe 4 attacks Frieza with Hakai. He survive it. Ultra Blue Vegeta has also punched through Hakai Ball. They can resist it. When Toppo uses a Hakai Ball on rocks, the rocks are destroyed.