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#51 Posted by jeanroygrant (20442 posts) - - Show Bio

Wonder Woman BFR's him.

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#52 Posted by comic_book_fan (7833 posts) - - Show Bio

juggernaut

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#53 Posted by Valdemocnij (953 posts) - - Show Bio
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My vote go for WW...

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#54 Edited by TifaLockhart (18770 posts) - - Show Bio

Giving him all her abilities in addition to his own makes this a pointless thread.

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#55 Posted by crest (431 posts) - - Show Bio

gf but jugs takes it even without here powers, well ww is smarter and faster jugs just can be put down by here, as someone said he's tanked the sorcerer supremes attacks, Dians magic isnt up to that lvl by a long shot

as for the lasso, even if she can get it on him (that dome) he will just rip it right out of her hands and it will trail behind him like some unbreakable string, hell she could tie it to a mountain and he would just drag that around aswell

do agree a small chance to bfr tho so if they have there own powers then i say jugs 8/10

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#56 Posted by TifaLockhart (18770 posts) - - Show Bio

Shatterstar must be more powerful than Thor and Strange then. Cause he made Juggernaut scream and bleed.

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#57 Edited by I_am_Warlock (293 posts) - - Show Bio

Shatterstar must be more powerful than Thor and Strange then. Cause he made Juggernaut scream and bleed.

Other have done too.

But making Juggernaut scream is one thing taking him out is another.

Thor failed, Captain Britian got walked all over, Hulk failed, Cyclops who was getting the hell wanked out of him during his solo series failed, X men together failed.

Physically he is as big a tank as it gets (perhaps barring Thanos and Mangog) he probably is one of the most durable hero/ villian without including cosmic beings.

It would have been an awesome battle had the creator not gone bat sh*t crazy and given Juggernaut abilities he doesnt even need.

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#58 Posted by TifaLockhart (18770 posts) - - Show Bio

Thor had the 60 second weakness otherwise he would've won. X-Men have multiple wins over Juggernaut. And Hulk, a purely physical being, knocked the wind out of Juggernaut.

Also Venom made him see stars. VENOM. For every high there is a low.

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#59 Posted by hyperbertha (1363 posts) - - Show Bio

@omegadynasty: Depends on what you mean by ALL his opponent's abilities. If he has all of Wonderwoman's abilities he wins mostly. But wonderwoman may still outsmart him.

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#60 Posted by charlie_shipman (34 posts) - - Show Bio

wonder woman as she killed the god of war

has strength that can rival superman

and she can do magic which will not help juggernaut in this fight

winner is wonder woman

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#61 Edited by BRAX (1914 posts) - - Show Bio

Juggernaut gets Wonder Woman and his own powers as well? How the hell does Wonder Woman stand a chance?

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#62 Posted by DrF8 (3309 posts) - - Show Bio

Juggernat has obtained his opponents abilities, among his own.

So...It's WW vs WW?

Anyway, Juggernaut may be powerful but Wonder Woman is waaay smarter and has her weapons. She can incapacitate him with her lasso or just BFR him into outer space.

Juggernaut, thanks to WW powers, might be capable of taking one or two wins but certainly not the majority.

WW 8/10

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#63 Edited by BappyRonChantin (2772 posts) - - Show Bio

Only thing going for wonder woman is her lasso and weaponry, which is not gonna matter much due to juggernaut being incapable of harmed or injured and his force-field. Normal Juggernaut is a pretty fair match up against WW. In this fight along with WW's abilities he certainly takes the cake.

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#64 Posted by JimboBchez (476 posts) - - Show Bio

ww gets stomped. WW apparently has alot of fanboys.. juggs might not be smart but i dont see WW hurting him.. and as far as some low levelers managing to do little things here and there to juggs is purely PIS. just about every character gets PIS'd on here and there lol. doesnt mean u can bank on 1-2 far fetched things happening to some one and use that to say they lose.. juggs ftw

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#65 Posted by KingOfKings1 (2093 posts) - - Show Bio

Juggernaut wrecks her so badly and it's not even funny .

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#66 Posted by GoldKing (885 posts) - - Show Bio

She puts up a good fight, but in the end, Juggernaut wrecks her.

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#67 Posted by those_eyes (16769 posts) - - Show Bio

horrible thread.

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#68 Posted by OOCMikey (1396 posts) - - Show Bio

Doesn't matter how strong Juggernaut is Wonder Womans lasso is unbreakable. So she could just hog-tie him up. Plus she is smater and can fly.

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#69 Posted by Dygoboy (4134 posts) - - Show Bio

Neck feats?

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#70 Posted by AcroKat (6708 posts) - - Show Bio
Online
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#71 Posted by marvelfan123 (582 posts) - - Show Bio

Juggs

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#72 Posted by RisingBean (9314 posts) - - Show Bio

@jashro44 This isn't fair for Diana. Juggernaut's a guy who is only going to lose to BFR to begin with, and now he has her power set to boost his own.

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#73 Edited by jashro44 (40745 posts) - - Show Bio

@jashro44 This isn't fair for Diana. Juggernaut's a guy who is only going to lose to BFR to begin with, and now he has her power set to boost his own.

Eh, I'll just remove that from the OP to make things more fair....I doubt the OP would care at this point.

Moderator
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#74 Posted by RisingBean (9314 posts) - - Show Bio

@jashro44: Fair enough.

In that case, Diana gets pummeled awhile and ultimately takes it via BFR.

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#75 Posted by GoldKing (885 posts) - - Show Bio
@jashro44 said:
@risingbean said:

@jashro44 This isn't fair for Diana. Juggernaut's a guy who is only going to lose to BFR to begin with, and now he has her power set to boost his own.

Eh, I'll just remove that from the OP to make things more fair....I doubt the OP would care at this point.

Even still, the only way for Diana to win is via BFR. Without that, he'll eventually KO her.

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#76 Posted by never give up (25000 posts) - - Show Bio

@dygoboy said:

Neck feats?

His neck is well protected.

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#77 Posted by Nerevarine_11 (9700 posts) - - Show Bio

WW can only win with BFR. She's more skilled but Juggs outclasses her in durability and strength. She's got this.

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#78 Posted by termiteone4ever (11093 posts) - - Show Bio

Wonder woman got this.

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#79 Posted by MichaelJulius (715 posts) - - Show Bio

She wins based on pure speed alone and it would end in a stalemate, or Wonder Women figuring out that removing the latches of his helmet might allow her to toss the rope around his neck, forcing him to admit defeat. She is not strong enough to push him back, but she could run or fly circles around him easily. She is more than capable of handling a hit from Juggernaut. If Hulk and other Marvelers can handle a straight punch from him, she can as well. Odds are good Juggernaut is not physically strong enough to really deal her much damage, but she isn't even remotely close to strong enough to even phase Juggernaut much either. Speed is the deciding factor and WW has that covered.

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#80 Posted by Outside_85 (17073 posts) - - Show Bio

How to beat Jugs if you have the right tools... and aren't a pillock.

Method 1: Use your superspeed along with your unbreakable lasso to tie him up before he starts moving.
Alternative to M1 if he gets going, tie him up sufficiently and then get him to stop on his own, then tighten.

Method 2: Utilize your superstrength along with his much greater size, and get behind him and simply pick him up by the neck and waist. His arms are so big he cant reach you back there. Just hold him there till he says uncle, or just throw him far away, alternatively, take him into orbit and just leave him there.

Method 3: Use your strength and speed to get around him and turn his own momentum against him by pushing him forwards. Eventually you just make a sudden stop and see him dissapear into the distance propelled by the momentum you gave him.

Method 4: Just break out the magical atom slicing sword and go bananas till he stops moving.

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#81 Posted by RisingBean (9314 posts) - - Show Bio

She wins based on pure speed alone and it would end in a stalemate, or Wonder Women figuring out that removing the latches of his helmet might allow her to toss the rope around his neck, forcing him to admit defeat. She is not strong enough to push him back, but she could run or fly circles around him easily. She is more than capable of handling a hit from Juggernaut. If Hulk and other Marvelers can handle a straight punch from him, she can as well. Odds are good Juggernaut is not physically strong enough to really deal her much damage, but she isn't even remotely close to strong enough to even phase Juggernaut much either. Speed is the deciding factor and WW has that covered.

Super speedsters can still make mistakes and once Cain gets a hold of her, there isn't much she can do if decides to not let go.

I wonder if her lasso would affect him. It's not technically psionics, and Cain is sorta hit and miss with magic. I wouldn't count it out entirely as a possible gain ender. I also wouldn't put all of Diana's eggs in this one basket.

While one hit may not end her, Juggernaut is more then certainly capable of dealing damage. It wouldn't take more then a handful of punches, either.

How to beat Jugs if you have the right tools... and aren't a pillock.

Method 1: Use your superspeed along with your unbreakable lasso to tie him up before he starts moving.

It works until he turns on his forcefield.

Alternative to M1 if he gets going, tie him up sufficiently and then get him to stop on his own, then tighten.

Same as above.

Method 2: Utilize your superstrength along with his much greater size, and get behind him and simply pick him up by the neck and waist. His arms are so big he cant reach you back there. Just hold him there till he says uncle, or just throw him far away, alternatively, take him into orbit and just leave him there.

And because he won't job on the battle forums, more of the above.

Method 3: Use your strength and speed to get around him and turn his own momentum against him by pushing him forwards. Eventually you just make a sudden stop and see him dissapear into the distance propelled by the momentum you gave him.

Not really a win, but a nice way to get a breather. I feel bad for anybody if he ends up someplace inhabited.

Method 4: Just break out the magical atom slicing sword and go bananas till he stops moving.

And unless Cain was depowered (he isn't btw), Diana can go banana's wondering why that sword does absolutely zero damage.

I'm still backing Diana, but BFR is really her best hope.

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#82 Edited by Outside_85 (17073 posts) - - Show Bio

@risingbean: I'm curious to know why him 'turning on' a force field would do him any good after being tied up?

Secondly, why would he be immune to being grabbed by turning it on? Since I dont recall it being an invisible-woman type of bubble that surrounds him.

Well if she goes fast enough they will eventually hit escape velocity, so the inhabited area he might hit would be a distant planet :)

Depends on the power DC Hephaestus has invested in his work is enough to penetrate or negate Cyttorak's blessings. Considering how easily Magik broke the enchantment, it's obviously not impossible.

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#83 Posted by BloodBlunts (614 posts) - - Show Bio

Juggernaut will win. Hed knock her out lol.

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#84 Posted by RisingBean (9314 posts) - - Show Bio
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@outside_85:

Juggernaut can turn it on, and it is a sort of invisible field. A Juggernaut who doesn't forget he has it (and battle forums Cain, won't.) has some degree of versatility.

If Diana gets him off planet, that is the best option, and the one Thor used in both of their classic encounters.

As far as swords, it's possible Diana may do cosmetic damage. (Shatterstar managed it with his magic swords), but Juggernaut healed so fast the damage may as well not have occurred.

If you have a scan of the Magik instance, I'd love to see it as I haven't before.

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#85 Posted by Outside_85 (17073 posts) - - Show Bio

Juggernaut can turn it on, and it is a sort of invisible field. A Juggernaut who doesn't forget he has it (and battle forums Cain, won't.) has some degree of versatility.

If Diana gets him off planet, that is the best option, and the one Thor used in both of their classic encounters.

As far as swords, it's possible Diana may do cosmetic damage. (Shatterstar managed it with his magic swords), but Juggernaut healed so fast the damage may as well not have occurred.

If you have a scan of the Magik instance, I'd love to see it as I haven't before.

I have to add that I did know he had this forcefield, but I have always simply considered it like second layer of skin that he can thank for his massive durability. Still, it doesn't really answer what good it will do against the lasso.

Off planet or just far away is normally considered a win.

Well, Diana is after all much faster than Shatterstar and much stronger, so I am counting on her being able to do a little more than just cosmetic damage. You are ofc correct it might take some time to wear him down though.

Unfortunately not any more, but I know how it panned out:

  • Illyana seeks out Pete in the ruins of his AvX farm after the dust had settled and goads him into getting the Juggernaut out.
  • Takes him to Limbo and hits him over the head with her sword, removing the Juggernaut and takes him back to the farm.
  • States she could have done it any time she wanted, but left him with it because she wanted him to know what it was like to be her, living in hell.
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#86 Posted by MichaelJulius (715 posts) - - Show Bio

I don't think Cain is anywhere near as physically strong as Wonder Women. He rumbled with a beefed up Hulk and didn't manhandle him, and I think WW would 1 hit KO hulk if she punched him in the face. But, thats totally my opinion. I don't think Juggernaut and Hulk were anywhere near WW, Superman and some other DC'ers physical strength levels. Juggernaut grabbing her would do no good, she would pry him off easily. The problem happens when he charges at her and she charges back, or try's to physically stop his movements or strikes.

I have no clue if her Rope can compare with Cyttoraks power or if it qualifies as psychic power. If so, then Juggernaut is at risk. If not, then he is likely immune to it if she can remove the helmet. It is fun to think about though.

I mean, guys like Gladiator giggle at the amount of physical strength Juggernaut has and I truly don't believe his physical strikes would do much to her. He can flat out kill her if she meets a very tough wall or something that can be used to brace her back while Juggernaut punched her in the front. If that situation happened, Juggernauts hand would go through her and she would die instantly and explode. So long as there is nothing behind her after Juggernaut scores a very slow strike on her that would be like a snail trying to hit a viper, she will just be tossed backwards. If something is behind her that is technically equal or stronger than she is that can prevent her from moving backward, his fist goes through her and she dies because I don't think she is durable enough to stop his fist's momentum. Like a rock and a hard place type thing, thats the only way I can see Juggernaut winning. Just my 2c though.

@michaeljulius said:

She wins based on pure speed alone and it would end in a stalemate, or Wonder Women figuring out that removing the latches of his helmet might allow her to toss the rope around his neck, forcing him to admit defeat. She is not strong enough to push him back, but she could run or fly circles around him easily. She is more than capable of handling a hit from Juggernaut. If Hulk and other Marvelers can handle a straight punch from him, she can as well. Odds are good Juggernaut is not physically strong enough to really deal her much damage, but she isn't even remotely close to strong enough to even phase Juggernaut much either. Speed is the deciding factor and WW has that covered.

Super speedsters can still make mistakes and once Cain gets a hold of her, there isn't much she can do if decides to not let go.

I wonder if her lasso would affect him. It's not technically psionics, and Cain is sorta hit and miss with magic. I wouldn't count it out entirely as a possible gain ender. I also wouldn't put all of Diana's eggs in this one basket.

While one hit may not end her, Juggernaut is more then certainly capable of dealing damage. It wouldn't take more then a handful of punches, either.

@outside_85 said:

How to beat Jugs if you have the right tools... and aren't a pillock.

Method 1: Use your superspeed along with your unbreakable lasso to tie him up before he starts moving.

It works until he turns on his forcefield.

Alternative to M1 if he gets going, tie him up sufficiently and then get him to stop on his own, then tighten.

Same as above.

Method 2: Utilize your superstrength along with his much greater size, and get behind him and simply pick him up by the neck and waist. His arms are so big he cant reach you back there. Just hold him there till he says uncle, or just throw him far away, alternatively, take him into orbit and just leave him there.

And because he won't job on the battle forums, more of the above.

Method 3: Use your strength and speed to get around him and turn his own momentum against him by pushing him forwards. Eventually you just make a sudden stop and see him dissapear into the distance propelled by the momentum you gave him.

Not really a win, but a nice way to get a breather. I feel bad for anybody if he ends up someplace inhabited.

Method 4: Just break out the magical atom slicing sword and go bananas till he stops moving.

And unless Cain was depowered (he isn't btw), Diana can go banana's wondering why that sword does absolutely zero damage.

I'm still backing Diana, but BFR is really her best hope.

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#87 Edited by RisingBean (9314 posts) - - Show Bio

@outside_85:

He can expand the field to quite an extent. As far as the lasso, Diana can't hit him with it at all if he has it on, and my guess is if she tied him up with it he can force the lasso away from himself. Just expand the field out until the lasso no longer has him bound.

In this case, Off planet is her best bet. While sure, we can be pedantic and say that knocking him out of the city is a win, Juggernaut isn't really defeated (merely stalled) and now is just going to have to walk back. Off planet may keep him stalled long enough and keep innocent life safe to merit a real win.

Diana may be able to do more damage then Shatterstar but It's speculation. Strength probably doesn't weigh into it. Juggernaut is pretty much immune to physical harm. It's how potent her magic is that matters. I don't see her lopping off limbs or anything, and even if she did, on the few times Juggernaut has been harmed physically, that didn't really stop him, either.

Ooooook. It's Collosusnaut. Now I know why I missed the instance. I'd be careful about attributing feats from one character to another. We all know how characters sometimes have high and low showings on their own, without even tying other characters into those feats. I'd gather a similar concept would be trying to attribute Silver Surfer to Firelord, Clark to Zod or Donna Troy to Diana. They may have similar power sources (Gem of Cyttorak, Power Cosmic, Kryptonian heritage, Magic), but feats show them to be different nonetheless.

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#88 Posted by Trust_This_786 (947 posts) - - Show Bio
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#89 Posted by MaZeRaIII (4726 posts) - - Show Bio

Juggernaut.

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#90 Posted by RisingBean (9314 posts) - - Show Bio

I don't think Cain is anywhere near as physically strong as Wonder Women. He rumbled with a beefed up Hulk and didn't manhandle him, and I think WW would 1 hit KO hulk if she punched him in the face. But, thats totally my opinion. I don't think Juggernaut and Hulk were anywhere near WW, Superman and some other DC'ers physical strength levels. Juggernaut grabbing her would do no good, she would pry him off easily. The problem happens when he charges at her and she charges back, or try's to physically stop his movements or strikes.

Juggernaut manhandled Prof Hulk once he got a hold of him. He lost later to a psychic backlash that knocked out Cain, and most of an Avengers team. He wasn't going to lose to savage Hulk until Prof X and crew, who just happened to be walking by, put the psychic whammy on him. And he got BFR'ed by WWH. He simply decided not to come back and continue the fight. The one Hulk to do Cain badly was War Hulk who was amped with Celestial tech by Apocalypse.

Also if you see Diana one shotting Cain, you need to read up more on him. She isn't punching him out, regardless if she is stronger or not. Dude tanked one of Thor's Godblasts. I'm also curious to what strength feats she has to outdo Hulk. Any scans you want to show to back up the argument?

I have no clue if her Rope can compare with Cyttoraks power or if it qualifies as psychic power. If so, then Juggernaut is at risk. If not, then he is likely immune to it if she can remove the helmet. It is fun to think about though.

Well I don't think it's a psychic lasso so much as it magically compels truth, but if anybody has scans to show otherwise, I'd be willing to look at them.

I mean, guys like Gladiator giggle at the amount of physical strength Juggernaut has and I truly don't believe his physical strikes would do much to her. He can flat out kill her if she meets a very tough wall or something that can be used to brace her back while Juggernaut punched her in the front. If that situation happened, Juggernauts hand would go through her and she would die instantly and explode. So long as there is nothing behind her after Juggernaut scores a very slow strike on her that would be like a snail trying to hit a viper, she will just be tossed backwards. If something is behind her that is technically equal or stronger than she is that can prevent her from moving backward, his fist goes through her and she dies because I don't think she is durable enough to stop his fist's momentum. Like a rock and a hard place type thing, thats the only way I can see Juggernaut winning. Just my 2c though.

Gladiator. You are not bringing up the X-Men 90's cartoon are you? If so it has no bearing on the comics versions. As far as Diana against a wall, the wall would explode before she would. She has fantastic (though not infinite) durability vs blunt objects. Personally, I see this fight being more like the one she had with Mongul in the old Pre-Crisis Superman story "For the man who has everything." She can't do much to injure Cain but she has speed, and the means to rocket him off the planet.


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#91 Posted by Outside_85 (17073 posts) - - Show Bio

@risingbean: That might work, but only if we assume his forcefield is stronger than the Lasso, like despite it's elastic nature, it's not like people are known for being able to extend it unless Diana wants it to. And the only one thats ever been able to break it was a guy who basically warped reality into fitting his idea of truth.

Well, by the usual battle forum rules, he has effectively left the battlefield anyways. Also she could just throw him into the sea, I recall that someone did that once and it took him more than a month to walk back up to the surface.

I figure that if she can chop off fingers, she can probably also take off a leg. But true enough, it depends on whenever her magic trumps his or not.

The thing is that the Juggernaut enchantment is the same regarless of who it's applied to, what isn't is how the bearer uses it, Cain uses it one way, Pete another and Abel grew into a giant. But none of that matters when in this case is about what others can do to the enchantment. She could do this to Pete, she probably could do it to Cain as well (but I dont know if she's ever fought him as the ruler of Limbo outside of his Kuurth appearance). As far as this goes it's about what Magik did, not what the Juggernauts are capable of... like does it matter if it's Frank Castle or a GCPD pointing the M16 at Batman's chest when the result is always going to be with them disarmed? :)

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#92 Posted by kindofcomicdaniel (549 posts) - - Show Bio

Juggernaut will win. Hed knock her out lol.

agree.

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#93 Edited by GoldKing (885 posts) - - Show Bio

Wait, so how did Juggernaut get her powers? Was that just something the TS added or is it a legitimate power Juggernaut has, where he can copy other people's power?