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Posted by SWA2point0 (189 posts) 3 months, 2 days ago

Poll: WoC&daemons/Elves/Skaven vs Lizardmen/Dwarfs/O&G (4 votes)

WoC&daemons/Elves/Skaven easily wins 25%
WoC&daemons/Elves/Skaven barely wins 0%
Lizardmen/Dwarfs/O&G barely wins 50%
Lizardmen/Dwarfs/O&G easily wins 0%
Could go either way/stalemate 25%

Team 1 - Warriors of Chaos/Daemons of Chaos, Elves ( united ), and Skaven

Image result for Warriors of chaos warhammer fantasyRelated imageImage result for Elves warhammer fantasy all threeRelated image

Team 2 - Lizardmen, Dwarfs, Orcs and Goblins

Image result for Lizardmen warhammer fantasyImage result for Dwarfs warhammer fantasy wallpaperImage result for Orcs and goblins warhammer fantasy wallpaper

Rules

  • No in fighting; all sides have agreed to work together the best they can in order to defeat the other. If that means grimgor is told these daemons think they're better than him, then so be it and so on. ( skaven being skaven can always backstab themselves and others but nothing huge, just really low end )
  • All factions are at their height of power ( elves are united and both wood elves, dark elves, high elves are fused together but given a mixture of all their forces )
  • All lore allowed; End Times versions for all characters and leaders unless they're not alive during the end times then height of power.
  • No outside interference.
  • Both sides have 1 month of prep
  • Win by closing the tear/destroying the other.
  • No Gods allowed. ( they can't directly interfere )

Landscape - All three factions have had their kingdoms, population, forts, etc. transported to both of these landscapes. Daemons get a warp rift ( massive ) at the top of Naggaroth.

Image result for Warhammer Naggaroth mapImage result for Warhammer lustria

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#2 Edited by Killerwasp (17444 posts) - - Show Bio

While the Skaven are the weaklink, the strongest here is prolly the chaos daemons due to their unlimited numbers so to speak. That and the Elves are actually a very solid force here considering ure adding in both the wood elf and dark elf factions into the high elven faction and that's a pretty deadly combo.

However, dwarfs and lizardmen have the weapons to deal with it and the greenskins give the numbers and cushion to absorb most of team 1's forces.

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#5 Posted by MErulezall (3784 posts) - - Show Bio

Lizardmen can chill, while the Dwarfs and Greenskins give the elves, chaos, and skaven the big D.

@wut Tell me I'm wrong Lol.

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#6 Posted by Wut (7056 posts) - - Show Bio

@merulezall: You're wrong. :P

Chaos Daemons overwhelm everyone if it is at their peak. The Dwarfs got stomped, the Lizardmen got stomped, and the Elves got stomped so hard that Slaanesh [of all the gods] got bored of beating them up so messed around elsewhere allowing them to rally and make the vortex.

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#7 Edited by IPvMan (866 posts) - - Show Bio

Lizardmen are probably my favorite faction but I don't see team two taking out the combined Chaos factions and united Elves with all dragons woke.

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#8 Posted by MErulezall (3784 posts) - - Show Bio

@wut: sorry can't hear you over the fact the Green tide was wiping the floors against the forces of chaos in the End times! :)

I thought Lizardmen at their prime with 1st Gen Slaan were giving the chaos daemons a fight?

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#9 Posted by Wut (7056 posts) - - Show Bio

@merulezall: End Times Chaos =/= Polar Gates Collasping Chaos. End Times Chaos was still primarily mortal warriors. Polar Gates Collapsing Chaos was the world drowned in Daemons to the point Lizardmen put up forcefields around their cities and dwarfs left the server by collapsing the mountains.

Nada, the Daemons vs Lizardmen was the Lizardmen putting forcefields around their cities and just trying to wait it out.

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#10 Posted by Killerwasp (17444 posts) - - Show Bio

@merulezall:

Don’t listen to wut mera he’s just mad that lizardmen are the mvps! Xd

@wut: wut why do you gotta lie to mera!? Chaos couldn’t even defeat the lizardmen they had to have plot save them considering the lizardmen matched them in full force solo for like what... 300 years?! Xd

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#11 Posted by MErulezall (3784 posts) - - Show Bio

@wut said:

@merulezall: End Times Chaos =/= Polar Gates Collasping Chaos. End Times Chaos was still primarily mortal warriors. Polar Gates Collapsing Chaos was the world drowned in Daemons to the point Lizardmen put up forcefields around their cities and dwarfs left the server by collapsing the mountains.

Nada, the Daemons vs Lizardmen was the Lizardmen putting forcefields around their cities and just trying to wait it out.

Warriors of Chaos and Daemons of Chaos, what's the difference they all die the same? :)

I thought the Dwarfs were giving the Daemons the beat down while the elves got spanked? Just because the dwarfs hid they were far from their height of power though?

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#12 Edited by MindingMuffin (350 posts) - - Show Bio

I'm not up to date on warhammer Lore bu shouldn't prime Lizardmen with the Slanns utterly curb? I remember Kroak was capable of moving entire continents and only the High Elves had mages with comparable power. Plus Kroak himself was capable of soloing the entire Chaos forces for some time.

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#13 Posted by Wut (7056 posts) - - Show Bio

@mindingmuffin: High Elves have never had comparable magic to First Gen. Even Teclis, one of the strongest, touched the mind of a lower Slann once and went, 'Nope, never want to meet that thing.'

But Daemons, in their prime, are what broke the Lizardmen empire.

@merulezall: :P Cause Daemons of Chaos don't tend to die, they just go home and come back for round 2. Warriors of Chaos tend to die and stay dead.

Nah, the Dwarfs dropped a mountain on the.. Nurgle daemon [Cause, IIRC, Tzeentch's daemons were the main ones against Lizardmen, Slaanesh against Elves and Nurgle against Dwarfs], and then just hid in their holds behind their wards. They are more, or less, at their peak as this was the time they had their gods walking around.

@killerwasp:Lol which of the two had to hide in their cities via forcefields? Forcefields that didn't work perfectly as Tzeentch figured out a way around them for awhile causing a bunch of cities to fall.

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#14 Posted by MErulezall (3784 posts) - - Show Bio

@wut:

:P Cause Daemons of Chaos don't tend to die, they just go home and come back for round 2. Warriors of Chaos tend to die and stay dead.

When you say round two, you mean when they get an choppa put into their head for the second time? :)

Nah, the Dwarfs dropped a mountain on the.. Nurgle daemon [Cause, IIRC, Tzeentch's daemons were the main ones against Lizardmen, Slaanesh against Elves and Nurgle against Dwarfs], and then just hid in their holds behind their wards. They are more, or less, at their peak as this was the time they had their gods walking around.

Ah good to know, what about Khorne? What if the Op made it Warriors of Chaos and removed 1st gen slann?

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#15 Posted by Wut (7056 posts) - - Show Bio

@merulezall:

Khorne wasn't super mentioned [Off of memory, I can grab my rule books and look through it again], but the three 'main host' were those three. I assume Khorne was just everywhere, killing stuff, doing what Khorne does.

Then I'd 100% back team 2.

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#16 Posted by Killerwasp (17444 posts) - - Show Bio

@wut: That happened after decades of war and that was being waged on a continent level. The Lizardmen fell back into their cities put up the FU ward, and it took a chaos god to crack the code you ape XD, and this time you got the dawi in their prime all put into lustria along with the lizardmen and greenskins, all the lizardmen or dawi have to do is tell the greenskins that chaos thinks it's number one and let them go crazy, and then the other two begin putting up big FU wards everywhere and i mean EVERYWHERE! XD

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#17 Posted by MErulezall (3784 posts) - - Show Bio

@wut: Ah okay, I wasn't sure. Also would team 1 have to work for it though since lizardmen got first gen slann? I mean isn't runic armor pretty broken as well?

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#18 Posted by Killerwasp (17444 posts) - - Show Bio

@wut: khorne had some of his best daemons in lustria the lizardmen fought all four for a long ass time I mean lord kroak died thanks to khorne bloodthirsters

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#19 Edited by Wut (7056 posts) - - Show Bio

@merulezall: They'd work as hard as they did the first go around, I'd assume. Dwarfs of that period were nasty, Gha'Maraz wasn't some super hammer, it was just a hammer. They also had their gods, like Grimnir, who held off a gate by himself.

@killerwasp: Didn't take a Chaos God. XD Just a greater daemon of tzeentch who would 'attack' the perimeter to pull guards away then teleport in a strike team to kill the Slann in a 'GOTCHA BITCH!' move that worked for awhile before the Slann figured it out.

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#20 Posted by MErulezall (3784 posts) - - Show Bio

@wut: If they had Grimnir couldn't he just hold off then while his pals slowly push and cover the landscape? I mean we're talking... 1000's of years tbh for this to really work, but couldn't he?

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#21 Edited by Wut (7056 posts) - - Show Bio

@merulezall: Multiple gates. Grimnir wasn't holding off the north or south polar gate, he was holding off one that opened much closer to home and it is there that Gotrek and Felix found him [he was still alive and had spanked the Daemons so much that they had given up coming through it until he was weakened enough].

Grimnir, at the end of the day, is one dwarf, he can't be everywhere at once.

EDIT: Unless you mean here, I get you, like in this scenario, he holds them off long enough for the Slann to seal it? That'd be a possibility.

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#22 Posted by MErulezall (3784 posts) - - Show Bio

@wut: True, of course of course. Weren't dwarf clansmen better at fighting daemons though than elves?

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#23 Posted by Killerwasp (17444 posts) - - Show Bio

@wut:

As their portals collapsed, the Old Ones disappeared, their fate unknown. Yet the disaster could have been worse, if the Old Ones’ most powerful servants, the Slann, had not staved off complete destruction by sealing much of the rent in reality. So great was the strain of that undertaking that half of their number were slain — their brains melted by the incongruity of Chaos. Despite their sacrifice, the Slann could only shrink the gap; they could neither close it nor stem the tide of magical energy that swept the planet. The Old Ones were gone, and the Lizardmen and the fledgling races were now abandoned before a new and diabolical foe.

-Warhammer Fantasy: Lizardmen 8th Edition

This means half of the slann were wiped before the war even began, in this case he's giving us the prime, so that half wiped out force would put some real work in along with the fact that despite half of the slann no instantly dead the lizardmen did exactly this

Faced with annihilation, the remaining Slann rallied, mustering armies the sizes of which have never been seen in the world since. The Daemons attacked everywhere, but the Lizardmen bore the brunt of the attack. What followed was a series of terrible wars, titanic clashes that spanned continents, lasted centuries and claimed untold lives.

-Warhammer Fantasy: Lizardmen 8th Edition

Multiple Continents clashing outside of the cities and waging it for centuries. I'd like to note the lizardmen BORE the BRUNT of the attack, meaning the dwarfs and elves faced jack when it came to the lizardmen, but as I've pointed out the elves at their height was after this not during or before and im no dawi expert, but I'd like to imagine the dwarfs once chaos was defeated grew in power as well and their height of power came after since we both know the height of their power for both elves and dwarfs was right before the War of the Beard right?

sorry had to find old quotes as I'm mobile right now be home in like an hour or so and then maybe after ill leave again for a while and won't be on for a bit XD

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#24 Posted by MErulezall (3784 posts) - - Show Bio

@wut:

@wut:

As their portals collapsed, the Old Ones disappeared, their fate unknown. Yet the disaster could have been worse, if the Old Ones’ most powerful servants, the Slann, had not staved off complete destruction by sealing much of the rent in reality. So great was the strain of that undertaking that half of their number were slain — their brains melted by the incongruity of Chaos. Despite their sacrifice, the Slann could only shrink the gap; they could neither close it nor stem the tide of magical energy that swept the planet. The Old Ones were gone, and the Lizardmen and the fledgling races were now abandoned before a new and diabolical foe.

-Warhammer Fantasy: Lizardmen 8th Edition

This means half of the slann were wiped before the war even began, in this case he's giving us the prime, so that half wiped out force would put some real work in along with the fact that despite half of the slann no instantly dead the lizardmen did exactly this

Faced with annihilation, the remaining Slann rallied, mustering armies the sizes of which have never been seen in the world since. The Daemons attacked everywhere, but the Lizardmen bore the brunt of the attack. What followed was a series of terrible wars, titanic clashes that spanned continents, lasted centuries and claimed untold lives.

-Warhammer Fantasy: Lizardmen 8th Edition

Multiple Continents clashing outside of the cities and waging it for centuries. I'd like to note the lizardmen BORE the BRUNT of the attack, meaning the dwarfs and elves faced jack when it came to the lizardmen, but as I've pointed out the elves at their height was after this not during or before and im no dawi expert, but I'd like to imagine the dwarfs once chaos was defeated grew in power as well and their height of power came after since we both know the height of their power for both elves and dwarfs was right before the War of the Beard right?

sorry had to find old quotes as I'm mobile right now be home in like an hour or so and then maybe after ill leave again for a while and won't be on for a bit XD

Image result for hes right you know

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#25 Edited by Wut (7056 posts) - - Show Bio

@merulezall: Depends on the time, if you mean like.. war of the beard era, I don't really think either is far better then the other enough to make a difference, when Chaos first came, the Elves weren't warriors. The Elves, as the glimmering silver host, didn't arise until Aenarion and the reforms.

@killerwasp:They were wiped out just by Chaos coming into the world and trying to close it, that doesn't bode super well to their chances of closing this one as if we take true peak Chaos, it'd be at that moment, when it was opening and before half the Slann sacrificed themselves from it overwhelming everything, ergo, the exact same thing would happen here.

Yes, the Lizardmen bore the brunt, I'm not sure where you are implying I ever said otherwise. The Lizardmen ruled the planet, the only other power at the time were the Dwarfs who were not as great and far less spread out. The Lizardmen bore the brunt, they fought well, and they lost. They were pushed back to the point they had to throw up forcefields and stay in their temple cities. They did a hell of a job, they were, by far, the strongest mortal empire to ever exist in Warhammer Fantasy, but they did lose. The Daemons were winning and it was just a matter of time.

I wouldn't say that at all. The Dwarfs before the War of the Beard had lost much. Many relics of ages past had been lost, the magic that kept their greatest creations, such as their massive mountain golems, were gone. Their height was certainly when Grungi and Grimnir were around.

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#26 Posted by MErulezall (3784 posts) - - Show Bio

@wut: Ah okay, I just thought since the dawi won the war of the beard their troops were better, yet the elves brought monsters to help win their war.

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#27 Posted by Wut (7056 posts) - - Show Bio

@merulezall: I mean, they did win the war. Just different fighting styles and it is a note in the books about how both sides were so surprised and unprepared for the ways of the other. If I had to like.. pick an infantry, I'd take clansmen as they are far less likely to rout. High Elf Spearmen are much faster and mobile, so just depends on what you prefer.

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#28 Posted by MErulezall (3784 posts) - - Show Bio

@wut said:

@merulezall: I mean, they did win the war. Just different fighting styles and it is a note in the books about how both sides were so surprised and unprepared for the ways of the other. If I had to like.. pick an infantry, I'd take clansmen as they are far less likely to rout. High Elf Spearmen are much faster and mobile, so just depends on what you prefer.

Ah I see, I was just curious if you had to pick one to fight Chaos daemons which one you would pick. How would you place Saurus infantry against chaos daemons?

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#29 Posted by Killerwasp (17444 posts) - - Show Bio

@wut:

Lol which of the two had to hide in their cities via forcefields?

^ >:( Implying lizardmen saw daemons ran and hid in their cities!!! >:( Don't hurt my lizardmen ego scum! XD

I think it would differ here as that was a sudden catch by surprise, in case you didn't notice, both sides have 1 month of prep which means I doubt the Slann would be caught off guard and instantly blow their minds and so on, but that's possible I guess. when you said that grimnir can hold the line and the slann could work on closing the portal I was going with more along that idea, I mean with 1 month prep and the dwarfs at their most powerful along with lizardmen, you're taking a planetary empire basically along with some help and being put into one continent to fortify and put up daemonic warding to the max that it wouldn't even be funny. I mean would that not happen????

Did the lizardmen lose though, did they? Last I checked they were still standing and not dead, I mean the elves helped.... i guess hahahaahahahahahah

Ah okay well i wasn't sure as i said im no dawi expert, but I just remember that war brought the end of both empires

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#30 Edited by Wut (7056 posts) - - Show Bio

@killerwasp: They did had to hide in their cities via forcefields. :P They fought but they did eventually lose and have to hide. So.. what I said was correct.

They blew their minds controlling the massive warp rifts from spreading too far and too many daemons pouring out at once, at best, they'd do their best to loss less members stopping it a second time but it should still decimate most of them and I don't see them winning that protracted fight just like last time.

Last I checked, Daemons were also still around and did, eventually, succeed in killing the WHF universe, so game, set match.

Yeah, after the war, the Dawi were weakened and then Maza decided to rearrange some stuff which hurt the Dawi even more and allowed the Greenskins and Skaven to rise to power. The dwarfs were really in their prime back then tho. Lot of cool stuff thanks to Grungi.

EDIT:

@merulezall: I'd take dwarfs over elves against daemons. Dwarfs are less likely to break and very resistant to corruption and magic.

Saurus are great. Strength of an Orc in a armored skin that can live for stupidly long time and are bred for war.

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#31 Posted by MErulezall (3784 posts) - - Show Bio

@wut:

I'd take dwarfs over elves against daemons. Dwarfs are less likely to break and very resistant to corruption and magic.

If you had a choice between them and orc boyz who would you choose then?

Saurus are great. Strength of an Orc in a armored skin that can live for stupidly long time and are bred for war.

Did the Saurus spank the lesser daemons?

As KW pointed out wouldn't prep help the dawi and lizardmen out via anti warding?

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#32 Posted by Wut (7056 posts) - - Show Bio

@merulezall: As an Orc and Goblins player, I'm required by loyalty to say the Boyz.

Depends on the Saurus.

A month is not enough to ward anything but major population centers that are already warded.

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#33 Posted by MErulezall (3784 posts) - - Show Bio

@wut: Do you think a little warband of gobos then could kill some daemons? :)

Just avg the joe ones I mean.

Say what, they got the Green muscle to lift stuff up and slap it onto some bushes and bam you got anti-warding Lol.

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#34 Posted by Wut (7056 posts) - - Show Bio

@merulezall: Daemons suffer from the same thing they do in Fantasy as they do in 40k. They aren't stable, so.. the goblins, if you throw enough at a daemon, could just outlast it. [Although there is a really fun duel in.. one of the O&G armybooks where a goblin duels a high elf prince... and kills him by using a bound ring to light him on fire. XD Pretty much pulled a Indiana Jones.]

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#35 Posted by MErulezall (3784 posts) - - Show Bio

@wut said:

@merulezall: Daemons suffer from the same thing they do in Fantasy as they do in 40k. They aren't stable, so.. the goblins, if you throw enough at a daemon, could just outlast it. [Although there is a really fun duel in.. one of the O&G armybooks where a goblin duels a high elf prince... and kills him by using a bound ring to light him on fire. XD Pretty much pulled a Indiana Jones.]

I just think it'd be funny to see a gobo one shot a bloodletter Lol. Is that when the gobos invaded the High Elf land?

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#36 Posted by Killerwasp (17444 posts) - - Show Bio

@wut said:

@killerwasp: They did had to hide in their cities via forcefields. :P They fought but they did eventually lose and have to hide. So.. what I said was correct.

They blew their minds controlling the massive warp rifts from spreading too far and too many daemons pouring out at once, at best, they'd do their best to loss less members stopping it a second time but it should still decimate most of them and I don't see them winning that protracted fight just like last time.

Last I checked, Daemons were also still around and did, eventually, succeed in killing the WHF universe, so game, set match.

Yeah, after the war, the Dawi were weakened and then Maza decided to rearrange some stuff which hurt the Dawi even more and allowed the Greenskins and Skaven to rise to power. The dwarfs were really in their prime back then tho. Lot of cool stuff thanks to Grungi.

EDIT:

No, they were making a tactical retreat to their cities and they didn't start off hiding their cities, they just stopped carrying after the same saurus warrior spanked the same damn bloodletter for the 100th time XD Fight me bruh! XD

Yeah ofc, im just saying this time they wouldn't suffer this due to the fact the gate already starts out open and didn't burst the world as soon as the gates fell XD

Only cause everyone felt bad that Chaos kept losing, remind me again who dropped the ball the first million times??? Yeah daemons, the greedy bastards lolololol

Ah okay, well shoot Grungi brings the cool rune stuff then haha

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#37 Edited by Wut (7056 posts) - - Show Bio

@killerwasp: A gate strong enough to pour enough daemons as there was in t he peak moment of the polar gates collapse [when Daemons were at their strongest] would require it to be controlled. :P So... yes. Else the Slann get to fight all the Daemons that they managed to stop by closing the gates enough to prevent the flooding which means the Daemons win again.

Chaos Daemons never tried as hard in fantasy. There isn't 13 failed crusades. There have been three everchosen and.. well.. third time was the charm.

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#38 Posted by Killerwasp (17444 posts) - - Show Bio
@wut said:

@killerwasp: A gate strong enough to pour enough daemons as there was in t he peak moment of the polar gates collapse [when Daemons were at their strongest] would require it to be controlled. :P So... yes. Else the Slann get to fight all the Daemons that they managed to stop by closing the gates enough to prevent the flooding which means the Daemons win again.

Chaos Daemons never tried as hard in fantasy. There isn't 13 failed crusades. There have been three everchosen and.. well.. third time was the charm.

*thinks to himself for a master plan...* *moves the goal post* WELL YOU SEE HERE, those Daemons never really got powerful with or without the warp, because we know a lizard has managed to troll them forever and has yet to die, and hes possibly as broken if not even more broken then Lord Kroak, SO HA! Also All Slann weren't focused on it, only part of them because the rest were... asleep

Yeah yeah that will teach you wut! Bow down to my logic!

Sure they did, they just got cocky and lost, otherwise they wouldn't be so angry/happy to be in the real world! Also Chaos never won, or AoS would of never happened, the Lizardmen went into their spaceships, so again... they never lost, they just decided not to play the game

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#39 Posted by Wut (7056 posts) - - Show Bio

@killerwasp: Slann are still 'conscious' to the warp and magic so would still feel that even when sleeping which is why the Skinks can still take orders from them even when they have hit the snooze button. Case in point: When they stopped the chunks of Morrslieb from destroying the planet when the Skaven blew it up.

Nada, AoS was meant to happen. Per 8e BRB, there is never a final victory [as such a thing would be against Tzeentch's desire]. It is, instead, a cycle. Races build up. Chaos comes. They fight. Chaos wins. The survivors of the last world become the gods of the next. Exactly what has happened in AoS. Its just another cycle.

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#40 Posted by Killerwasp (17444 posts) - - Show Bio

@wut said:

@killerwasp: Slann are still 'conscious' to the warp and magic so would still feel that even when sleeping which is why the Skinks can still take orders from them even when they have hit the snooze button. Case in point: When they stopped the chunks of Morrslieb from destroying the planet when the Skaven blew it up.

Nada, AoS was meant to happen. Per 8e BRB, there is never a final victory [as such a thing would be against Tzeentch's desire]. It is, instead, a cycle. Races build up. Chaos comes. They fight. Chaos wins. The survivors of the last world become the gods of the next. Exactly what has happened in AoS. Its just another cycle.

true, but im just saying.... the fat toads will be united and form the 5 gems of the world's gauntlet and give Chaos the big F.U XD

Additionally the Slann would prolly have easier time this time around as they are not fighting on a global scale, but on a continent scale this time with them at their height, mixed with dwarfs and greenskins also greenskins can match daemons in bringing people back with all them spores XD hueheuehuhehueehuehee

I've never heard of this AoS, what is it? XD hueheuhe

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#41 Posted by Helloman (30115 posts) - - Show Bio

Stalemate.

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#42 Posted by SWA2point0 (189 posts) - - Show Bio
@wut said:

@mindingmuffin: High Elves have never had comparable magic to First Gen. Even Teclis, one of the strongest, touched the mind of a lower Slann once and went, 'Nope, never want to meet that thing.'

But Daemons, in their prime, are what broke the Lizardmen empire.

@merulezall: :P Cause Daemons of Chaos don't tend to die, they just go home and come back for round 2. Warriors of Chaos tend to die and stay dead.

Nah, the Dwarfs dropped a mountain on the.. Nurgle daemon [Cause, IIRC, Tzeentch's daemons were the main ones against Lizardmen, Slaanesh against Elves and Nurgle against Dwarfs], and then just hid in their holds behind their wards. They are more, or less, at their peak as this was the time they had their gods walking around.

@killerwasp:Lol which of the two had to hide in their cities via forcefields? Forcefields that didn't work perfectly as Tzeentch figured out a way around them for awhile causing a bunch of cities to fall.

Wouldn't orc spores counter the daemons unlimited rounds so to speak? I mean Waaagh force Grimgor and his pals were super amped up to wipe half the world's daemons and warriors of chaos with utter ease didn't they?

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#43 Posted by Wut (7056 posts) - - Show Bio

@swa2point0: End Times Chaos =/= Polar Gates Chaos. Chaos Vortex was poof, Daemons everywhere. End times was mostly mortal warriors supported by some daemons.

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#44 Posted by SWA2point0 (189 posts) - - Show Bio

@wut: Gotcha, what about orc spores though?