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#1 Edited by Trieu987 (167 posts) - - Show Bio

White Lantern (Kyle Rayner)

VS

King Thor

Location: The moon

Both are Bloodlusted

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#3 Posted by ValBr111 (475 posts) - - Show Bio

Team 2. White lantern Kyle is the only threat on team 1. Superboy prime really has no business here.

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#4 Posted by Cull_Obsidian (4003 posts) - - Show Bio
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#6 Posted by Trieu987 (167 posts) - - Show Bio
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#7 Posted by Cull_Obsidian (4003 posts) - - Show Bio

@trieu987: ah ok that's kool, welcome to the vine

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#8 Posted by Spambot (9439 posts) - - Show Bio

I could be wrong but I don't think too many people are that familiar with Knull. It would prob be better to just make it King Thor(which is the version in the picture) rather than RKT who is above Odin.

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#9 Posted by Trieu987 (167 posts) - - Show Bio
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#10 Posted by FireStarLord73194 (5322 posts) - - Show Bio

Team 1 due to kyle

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#11 Edited by ValBr111 (475 posts) - - Show Bio

Eh, it's pretty close now. I'd say toss up but probably 6/10 to team 1 cause of Kyle. If it was RKT though then definitely him.

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#12 Edited by destinyman75 (14781 posts) - - Show Bio

King Thor took over the earth and Stomped all the heroes. As good as Kyle is don't see him countering death.. Jonn just dies flat out

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#13 Posted by Supermanthor (20466 posts) - - Show Bio

T1

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#14 Posted by Risk0608 (234 posts) - - Show Bio
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#15 Edited by Rajjar (1970 posts) - - Show Bio

@risk0608 said:

@destinyman75: Cap's shield still hurt him though lol

Depowered by Zeus, Shiva, Vishnu, Brahma, and Osiris by that amulet on his neck. And he still killed Hulk and Thing even though he was missing an arm. They aren't beating a skyfather without PIS.

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#16 Edited by Majestros2233 (52 posts) - - Show Bio

Team 1....dies.

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#17 Posted by EmmaFrostXmen (2650 posts) - - Show Bio

I think team one can pull a slight majority due to lantern

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#18 Edited by Risk0608 (234 posts) - - Show Bio

@rajjar: Cool, that obviously wasn't an actual argument.

Scans?

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#19 Posted by Rajjar (1970 posts) - - Show Bio
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#20 Posted by Risk0608 (234 posts) - - Show Bio

@rajjar: I meant about the amulet, i've seen the fight numerous times before

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#21 Posted by Zane240 (568 posts) - - Show Bio

White lantern Kyle has done insane things

I'll give him the win solo

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#22 Edited by Rajjar (1970 posts) - - Show Bio

@risk0608 said:

@rajjar: I meant about the amulet, i've seen the fight numerous times before

The amulet is on his neck. Dr. Strange tells that the Odinpower is no longer his right when he puts the amulet on Thor. Strange reveals that the Council Elite is responsible. Given that Vishnu and Zeus have been on par with Odin since they blasted Arishem with their combined power. They are equals here, and Zeus and Odin came to blows back in Fear Itself. Independently, Dormammu confirms that they are equals in power. Then there is this cosmic hierarchy scan -

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As for the Council themselves.

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#23 Posted by Risk0608 (234 posts) - - Show Bio

@rajjar: Okay good, doesn't say anything about the amulet but still, are his best feats soloing the Avengers? Parallax Hal Jordan soloed the JL not to mention retconned DC and stalemated Spectre, and White Lantern Kyle controls the entire Emotional Spectrum.

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#24 Posted by Spambot (9439 posts) - - Show Bio

@risk0608 said:

@rajjar: Okay good, doesn't say anything about the amulet but still, are his best feats soloing the Avengers? Parallax Hal Jordan soloed the JL not to mention retconned DC and stalemated Spectre, and White Lantern Kyle controls the entire Emotional Spectrum.

King Thor has quite a few high level feats. More so if the Reigning is included. Even in that fight that was shown above he melts Wolverine's claws with his eye beams and then also melts Cap's shield after that which is true Skyfather level stuff. He also could manipulate matter on a molecular level such as when he put the moon back together.

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#25 Edited by Rajjar (1970 posts) - - Show Bio

@risk0608 said:

@rajjar: Okay good, doesn't say anything about the amulet but still,

Dr. Strange summoned it on him, and Thor agrees that he does not have the OF. The moment Loki lifted it off him, Thor one-shotted Cap and obliterated a big chunk of the shield. Regardless, the amulet doesn't matter - the statements do, and Dr. Strange reveals that the gods took the OF away.

are his best feats soloing the Avengers? Parallax Hal Jordan soloed the JL not to mention retconned DC and stalemated Spectre, and White Lantern Kyle controls the entire Emotional Spectrum.

No. But we were talking about anti-feats, not high-end feats.

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#26 Posted by Rajjar (1970 posts) - - Show Bio

@spambot said:
@risk0608 said:

@rajjar: Okay good, doesn't say anything about the amulet but still, are his best feats soloing the Avengers? Parallax Hal Jordan soloed the JL not to mention retconned DC and stalemated Spectre, and White Lantern Kyle controls the entire Emotional Spectrum.

King Thor has quite a few high level feats. More so if the Reigning is included. Even in that fight that was shown above he melts Wolverine's claws with his eye beams and then also melts Cap's shield after that which is true Skyfather level stuff. He also could manipulate matter on a molecular level such as when he put the moon back together.

There is also these

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And then there is this nice headshot.

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The same Destroyer that

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Who can tank

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Which also did

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#27 Posted by Rajjar (1970 posts) - - Show Bio
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#28 Edited by Spambot (9439 posts) - - Show Bio

@rajjar: Right those are some of the Reigning feats I was referring to.

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#29 Posted by Trieu987 (167 posts) - - Show Bio
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#30 Posted by Risk0608 (234 posts) - - Show Bio

@spambot: If we're scaling from Nekron and the other entities then those feats are truly abysmal.

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#31 Posted by Risk0608 (234 posts) - - Show Bio

@rajjar: You're comparing a worthy Thor to an Unworthy Thor and Jarnbjorn has been entirely inconsistent, and Jarnbjorn was blessed to work against Celestial armor back in the old days when Thor first fought Apocalypse. Also, Odin in the Destroyer Armor is entirely different to the Destroyer Armor itself.

When we saw Thor, donned with special Asgardian Armor and seemingly amped, his attacks do almost nothing to Arishem The Judge Celestial.

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Also, the battle between Odin and the Celestials was hilarious and he never stood a chance. Whereas, guys like Nekron have been able to slap aside Spectre and absorb and command Anti-Monitor (although he had just been beaten up by Superboy Prime)

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He's also an abstract conceptual being that exist in between the spaces of atoms and in the darkness between the planets

https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-SH4dvuJWAuc/WVR2fJ_XybI/AAAAAAAAhF4/amQqTP16DJg1WKJ7SWNYn2rzMjYKdEEZgCJoC/w530-h384-n-rw/Blackest%2BNight-215.jpg

Now The Life Entity which empowers Kyle as The White Lantern, once empowered the White Lantern Corps to destroy Nekron though

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In saying that, Kyle Rayner has mastered the White Lantern Ring as the sole wielder and all across the Emotional Spectrum. So in theory he should be capable of taking on King Thor with utter ease. This is far beyond Skyfather Level.

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#32 Edited by Spambot (9439 posts) - - Show Bio

@risk0608: Nekron's slapping aside Spectre has context seeing as Spectre said he had no power over him since he has no soul. The feat for WL destroying Nekron also relies on scaling off of him. I wasn't arguing on behalf of King Thor here either but just replying to what you wrote. The armor Thor had on in those scans didn't really amp him either. It was armor he forged to protect his brittle bones. The only amp he had there was from wearing his belt of strength.

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#33 Posted by Risk0608 (234 posts) - - Show Bio

@spambot: Nekron literally out-ranks Spectre in terms of the Cosmic Power Hierarchy. It's even further supported when Spectre becomes a Black Lantern.

Also, yes that indeed counts as an amp in terms of AP and durability for classic Thor.

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#34 Edited by Rajjar (1970 posts) - - Show Bio

@risk0608 said:

@rajjar: You're comparing a worthy Thor to an Unworthy Thor

I think that is irrelevant, considering that the Apocalypse twins did it too, and multiple times at that.

Proof Thor had a stat decrease when unworthy?

and Jarnbjorn has been entirely inconsistent

Never against the normal Celestials.

, and Jarnbjorn was blessed to work against Celestial armor back in the old days when Thor first fought Apocalypse.

And it never failed against healthy Celestial armor. The Horde was so much of an issue that Shem himself made a deal with Old Man Phoenix to help out.

Also, Odin in the Destroyer Armor is entirely different to the Destroyer Armor itself.

Any durability difference on the armor itself is headcanon. The feat stands uncontested till you explain what the difference is.

When we saw Thor, donned with special Asgardian Armor and seemingly amped, his attacks do almost nothing to Arishem The Judge Celestial.

I don't see how that matters.

First, Jarnbjorn is enchanted to work against Celestials, as the enchantment itself bypasses the durability that the uru by itself could not accomplish, as seen with Nur.

On actual durability feats, Shem > Odin + Zeus + Vishnu and can cut off entire realms. That Thor you used isn't a match for any of them.

Also, the battle between Odin and the Celestials was hilarious and he never stood a chance.

Fair, but the Destroyer melted to slag at a combined blast.

Whereas, guys like Nekron have been able to slap aside Spectre

The Spectre who jobbed to Nekron because he had no soul?

He's also an abstract conceptual being that exist in between the spaces of atoms and in the darkness between the planets

Doesn't apply to combat much.

Nekron isn't an abstract. He has never been one. Lady Death and Death of the Endless are abstracts. By that definition provided by Hal in the scan you posted, Amatsu-Mikaboshi counts as an abstract. He's way closer to a high-tier Hell-Lord/elder god who rules over the Land of the Unliving than an actual abstract.

In saying that, Kyle Rayner has mastered the White Lantern Ring as the sole wielder and all across the Emotional Spectrum. So in theory he should be capable of taking on King Thor with utter ease. This is far beyond Skyfather Level.

So you are scaling the WL powers over an "abstract." Seems legit. And you're putting said "abstract" over the Spectre. Especially when Corrigan's Spectre bypassed that PIS already for the King of Tears, even though Jordan failed abysmally. Independently, the Life Entity isn't here.

OF is the highest of the high for skyfathers - it's where all the good feats come from on this vine. Were I to use any feats from Odin's OF manipulation, this would be a spitestomp. However, these feats increase Thor's chance to win

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Now since the OP has specified the terms of the thread.

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#35 Posted by CarmineDcMarvel (327 posts) - - Show Bio

White Lantern KR solos

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#36 Posted by ChosenOne1222 (353 posts) - - Show Bio

King thor

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#37 Posted by mrtrickster (2986 posts) - - Show Bio

kyle solos

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#38 Posted by Risk0608 (234 posts) - - Show Bio

Unworthy Thor's first issue alone is about how weak Thor is without Mjolnir. He literally gets beaten up by folks everywhere. a He has some notable feats, such as beating up Beta ray Bill, despite BRB clearly not fighting to his fullest capability. He has also fought Ultimate Thor though that's actually an indicator that Unworthy Thor is weaker without Mjolnir since 616 Thor outclasses Ultimate Thor in feats.

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Is Jarnbjorn consistent?

No not at all. In fact the two scans you showed, of Jarnbjorn doing nothing to The Destroyer Armour and then the other of it actually cutting through Celestial Armour is proving my point. If you want to redact using Celestial feats for Jarnbjorn I suggest you do since it's been unfairly enchanted to cut through Celestial Armour ONLY so that doesn't mean it will work on other beings on that same level. It did not damage Gorr either.

Is the Destroyer Armor as durable without Odin?

No, Odin himself imbues it with magic when he goes to wear it. Hence why it's best feat today is fighting Celestials and cutting the arm off one (albeit clearly out of his range fighting Celestials - (see the bottom left of the second scan)

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Did Nekron actually overpower Spectre and is he Abstract Level?

Yes very much so. I actually uploaded the scan above of Spectre actually becoming one of the Black Lantern's showing that Nekron had control over him. From this link, we can see that it's believed that Nekron is the Void which existed prior to the Universe. He was the black which fought with the light prior to the universe existing. That is clearly Cosmic Abstract Level. If Mikaboshi is the same being as Eternity then a Primordial like Nekron who preceded Creation should be equal standing : https://plus.google.com/108621545055685115881/posts/eTMHDrDreHS

Oh and here Parallax overpowers Spectre for Hal Jordan's body and soul:

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And Parallax Hal beats the crap out of Spectre:

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Does the Life Entity have a role here?

Yes, by taking away the Entity, the White Lantern literally has no power. During his time as the sole White Lantern, he was powered by the Entity itself. Without the Entity there is no White Lantern.

White Lantern Kyle Scaling:

Why does White Lantern Kyle scale from Zero Hour Parallax Hal Jordan? Well at the time, Hal Jordan was possessed by ONE entity of the Emotional Spectrum. Here White Lantern Kyle is possessed by SIX including the Life Entity itself:

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Sorry these weren't uploading but these are the scans of Kyle being possessed by Six of the Emotional Entities:

https://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/11113/111131195/3380973-kyle.png

https://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/11113/111131195/3380974-kyle1.png

How Impressive is White Lantern's Scaling?

He literally re-made his own universe without much effort and implies he can make more:

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Here even The Sky-father Level New Gods are powerless towards Parallax's reality warping powers:

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A cosmic being like Time Trapper was able to warp his own universe and all the timelines in existence:

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Yet Parallax Hal Jordan one-shots him:

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Here Parallax Hal Jordan creates numerous universes, restoring the multiverse to what it was like prior to Crisis on Infinite on Earth's and it took all of the Earth's Heroes AS WELL AS Spectre to stop him which resulted in Big Bang which reset the Time-stream AKA all the alternate Timelines. Despite that, his work could not have been reversed and as read at the end of the scan "the seeds of a new crisis were planted":

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His most notable feat is perhaps walking on the Source Wall which lies at the edge of the Multiverse and has absorbed many many Cosmic Entities: https://dc.fandom.com/wiki/The_Source

Sorry the images were not uploading for Hal walking on the Source Wall:

https://plus.google.com/101124735523530334149/posts/5WpW35ez9wC

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All in all if we're scaling from Hal Jordan Parallax then this is a utter stomp. Seeing as Odin himself at his absolute max struggles with universal entities like the Celestials, I don't see this being much of a match considering Entity Powered characters in DC are way above Sky-Father Level beings like Odin and Zeus and were capable of creating their own retcons on DC's multiverse.

Also to refute the Old King Thor feats. That was an else-world battle, and his battle was against a starved Galactus which is not the Galactus from the 616 Universe so it makes it less impressive. We have seen Odin fully powered in the 616 attempt to fight Galactus. He did manage to damage Galactus a bit but ultimate both fell. However, Galactus got up right away and Odin had to recuperate.

In our first scan we see that Odin was fighting a Hungry Galactus (meaning he was in need of eating in order to regain his full strength). In our next few scans they have a mental struggle with Galactus slightly edging out. After that Odin charges at Galactus with his full power which actually KO'es the both of them. Both fall to Earth. Yet Odin immediately falls in the Odin Sleep, meaning he had exhausted all of his powers. On the other hand, Galactus immediately gets up and says that "Asgardians bore him". So regardless, it is null. Odin could not even beat 616 Galactus:

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Let's not forget that Parallax Hal effortlessly slapped the Justice League before he even fully absorbed Parallax out of the Power battery on Oa. Phoenix Force's best feat was universal at best as well. And Kyle scaling from Parallax Jordan should be far superior either way.

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#39 Posted by Risk0608 (234 posts) - - Show Bio
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#40 Posted by Rajjar (1970 posts) - - Show Bio

Gulp.

Well, that's a lot of scans. How long did it take you to assemble that?

@risk0608

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#41 Posted by Risk0608 (234 posts) - - Show Bio

@rajjar: I wrote it twice actually because the screen refreshed last night and I didn't even send it lol. Maybe a few hours but many of the feats I have are from G+ which is where I used to debate. Moving here because the place is shutting down sadly.

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#43 Edited by BreakOfDawn (2365 posts) - - Show Bio

Just going to say, there's a massive misconception with the Odin vs Galactus fight. Odin actually transferred his soul to the Destroyer as the fight between him and Galactus was all but a stalemate. The whole point of the mental fight was to show that neither could overpower the other, which forced Odin to take more drastic measures by summoning the Destroyer and Mjolnir.

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Right to left (sorry for the weird format). Anyway, this could go either way but definitely leaning more towards King Thor, though I admit I'm not as knowledgeable about the White Lanterns as I'd like.

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#44 Posted by Rajjar (1970 posts) - - Show Bio
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#45 Posted by Helloman (30115 posts) - - Show Bio

Thor wins.

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#46 Posted by Aqualion0 (2147 posts) - - Show Bio

OKT.

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#47 Posted by god_of_butchers (79 posts) - - Show Bio

OKT for the win. White Lantern doesn’t stand a chance against powerful Phoenix avatar of all time, with a heart of lightning and a fist of burning Uru

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#48 Posted by rhistr (434 posts) - - Show Bio

Based on scans posted by Risk (and apparent scaling), Kyle shouldn't have any trouble winning with ease.

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#49 Posted by the_real_seamAn (2127 posts) - - Show Bio

@rajjar: Wolverine became the Phoenix force in that scan?

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#50 Posted by Soratoumiga (3254 posts) - - Show Bio

Kyle wins in a near-stomp.